[fido]

Amazing how things have evolved in home stereo! Quick background for those who care: I'm a former VMPS owner - used to live about 8 or 10 miles from Brian (going the back way from Oakland to El Sobrante). I saw  Brian's ad in the back of Audio / Stereo Review (?) can't remember for sure - around 1988. I was just reaching an income level that allowed me to consider raising my mid-fi stereo interest to a higher plain. I'd bought a top-of-the-line Denon (with the highly touted at the time 20 bit Burr Brown chip set) to go with my Denon integrated & was looking to retire my old Polk Audio 7's for some "serious" loudspeakers.

What caught my eye was the pencil drawing of Brian's then Supertower R with an impressive array of drivers! I'm a freelance illustrator & I figured any guy having his speakers drawn for his ads had to be an alright guy! My curiosity was piqued so I called & set up a time to drop by Brian's house to take a listen. I knew near zip about "real" stereo music reproduction at the time but I had a little $ and a lot of luck

At Brian's I got a demonstration of what a home speaker could do with well recorded music! After having been to several local S.F. Bay area stereo shops and listening to several like-priced models I realized how fortunate I was to have stumbled on Brian and in my own back yard and given him a chance to "save" me from purchasing some competing overpriced underperformers!

The Supertower R Brian was selling at the time was the older, sharp-edged box, 8 active drivers (with top-mounted recessed ambiance tweeter) , slot loaded passive radiator model with the black (vinyl?) face. I ordered a set in the very light oak finish (sides and top) and Brian came over to deliver & set up for me in my home. He stayed & moved furniture with me, tuned the radiator, & generally gave me a tutorial on sound that I remember to this day. Nothing even remotely close to this speaker's price range could do what that speaker did (and at the time with a 100watt Denon integrated)!

I went on to upgrade my electronics, cables, tweak those speakers, tweak the room (15'X24'X8' on concrete slab) with acoustical treatments, etc. After moving a friend of mine talked me into selling him the speakers around '95 and other $ interests (motorcycles/boats/kids) had me relying for a time on a set of Spica TC-50's and a set of Hsu Research subs from my bedroom setup for musical satisfaction.

Today I have a set of vintage Apogee Duetta Signatures in perfect working order. Driving them with a vintage dbx BX-1 amp (very high power & current) and pressing my almost forgotten (but still fully functional) Hsu subs into service I'm getting some nice sound and reinvigorating my dormant interest in stereo. Nice sound, yes, but the low end is sure lacking... wonder what Brian's been up to all these years?

Wha... what's this??? Multiple CES Best of Shows!?!? Planar midranges?!?! RM2, 30, 40, V60, Elixir... damn, I knew this guy had something special 20 years ago & I was right!!

I live in Redding now, 3 hrs north of Brian, but I'm trying to figure out when I can get down there & reintroduce myself to him and his listening room. I'm thinking RM40's would be nice with all the goodies!! Then it'll be off to Audiogon to sell a really nice pair of Duettas. Oh, here we go again! 

[Brian Cheney]

Do give us a call.  The RM40 would give you a nice step up, and the SDE controller lets you correct the room, the speaker, and your associated equipment to get exactly what you want.

[John Casler]

Hi Fido,

Welcome to the VMPS Circle.

The more things change the more they stay the same.

B, does not let any grass grow under his feet.  He is like the energizer bunny (always going. . and going. . . . . . and going. . .. . . . . .)

If you need a sub, take a look at the VSS.  It is nice and fast and as musical as the Duetta's, but still plumbs the depth with power and grace.

They are a perfect mate (of course) for the RM40s and the RM v60's.

The move to ribbons only made a great speaker even "better".  The detail, soundstage and imaging of the planar ribbons has to be heard to be believed.

[fido]

Do give us a call.  The RM40 would give you a nice step up, and the SDE controller lets you correct the room, the speaker, and your associated equipment to get exactly what you want.

Hi Fido,

Welcome to the VMPS Circle.

The more things change the more they stay the same.

B, does not let any grass grow under his feet.  He is like the energizer bunny (always going. . and going. . . . . . and going. . .. . . . . .)

If you need a sub, take a look at the VSS.  It is nice and fast and as musical as the Duetta's, but still plumbs the depth with power and grace.

They are a perfect mate (of course) for the RM40s and the RM v60's.

The move to ribbons only made a great speaker even "better".  The detail, soundstage and imaging of the planar ribbons has to be heard to be believed.

I intend to visit you, Brian, as soon as I can work out a schedule & give you a heads up. I'm anxious to hear what you've been up too! It seems you have continued living up to your long standing principle of giving the customer hands down the best sound for the $ that can be found! BTW, my brother still has his set of Towers he bought from you shortly after hearing mine. I think he's had a few of the drivers replaced over the years and says he'll never sell them. I just emailed him the other day with a link to your website... he may be changing his mind and looking to upgrade himself 

Thanks, John, for the suggestion - I've been contemplating how I can "move into" a nice full VMPS system again. If, as I suspect, they exceed my aging Duetta / Hsu setup I'll have to figure out what steps to take going forward. I don't doubt my ability to sell the Duettas - there seems to be a substantial following & an Australian firm making new Apogee replacement panels and complete speakers (at an outlandish prices!)

Ques for you or Big B (I like that name) - Would the RM40's need / benefit from a VSS sub? Make for better balancing in-room response? I'm thinking if I bought a VSS or NLS first then I could ease the wife a little later into the RM40's with a "Oh, honey, this new sub really deserves to be mated with its soul mate RM40's to truly be happy!"  aa

 

[Brian Cheney]

Yes, the RM40 does benefit from a sub, and the VSS is the best we have in a relatively compact size (the truly huge VLA does not fit that description).

[John Casler]

Ques for you or Big B (I like that name) - Would the RM40's need / benefit from a VSS sub? Make for better balancing in-room response? I'm thinking if I bought a VSS or NLS first then I could ease the wife a little later into the RM40's with a "Oh, honey, this new sub really deserves to be mated with its soul mate RM40's to truly be happy!"  aa

I like how you think.   

As B, said the RM40 is one special speaker (I have two pair myself)

I run FOUR (yes two pair) of LARGER subs with mine and roll them in around 30Hz (running the RM40 full range) In most rooms (and placements) the RM40 is good for 24Hz at -3db down.

 The VSS would be the better choice, but when I placed these the VSS wasn't yet available. (actually a pair of VLA is the best) but not everyone has room for "STONE HENGE" in their listening room.

[fido]

Ques for you or Big B (I like that name) - Would the RM40's need / benefit from a VSS sub? Make for better balancing in-room response? I'm thinking if I bought a VSS or NLS first then I could ease the wife a little later into the RM40's with a "Oh, honey, this new sub really deserves to be mated with its soul mate RM40's to truly be happy!"  aa

I like how you think.   

As B, said the RM40 is one special speaker (I have two pair myself)

I run FOUR (yes two pair) of LARGER subs with mine and roll them in around 30Hz (running the RM40 full range) In most rooms (and placements) the RM40 is good for 24Hz at -3db down.

 The VSS would be the better choice, but when I placed these the VSS wasn't yet available. (actually a pair of VLA is the best) but not everyone has room for "STONE HENGE" in their listening room.

Two pair of the larger subs... John, you must not have neighbors! Actually a pair of the VSS (or 215's?) would be nice in my new home's music/studio room - it's 27.5' X 14.5' X 8' with two 6' wide X 5' deep dormers half way down the long length. I would guess the two subs would make balancing modes much easier as I have found even with the smallish Hsu's (besides, my nearest neighbor is at least 50 - 60 yds away now). The VLA's... oh, my, V60's with a pair of VLA's... would that even work in my room or be just massive overkill?? Besides, I'd have to trade in my car to go that deep!

I'm presently driving the pair of Hsu Research 10's with an Adcom 555 II but, well, let's just say I miss the kind of power & well defined bass I got from those Supertowers 20 yrs ago! These 10's probably don't reach much lower than the Duettas alone - just take some of the stress off of the bass panels when the volume is up. I'm presently using a Rane active crossover with the subs taking over below 70hz. I'm not a boom-boom fanatic but a system without D-E-E-P, "tuneful", and powerful low frequency capability down to at least the low 20's is just an incomplete system IMHO. Big B obviously thinks so too as he has established himself as the King of Bass IMHO 

The Duettas are set up past the halfway point with about 2/3rds of the open dormers to the speakers outside looking back at the listening position. Very early wall reflections are avoided and the sound is pretty good sitting half way into the long end with the back radiation of the dipoles into about 12' of open room behind (with some counters, desk, etc for diffusion).

These Apogees were refurbished at the factory in the late 90's (must have been shortly before their folding). I'm driving them with a dbx BX1, just had it fully gone through at ADK HiFi in Vallejo. This late 80's transistor amp's 512 watts into 8-ohms, 1225 watts into 2-ohm loads handles the somewhat difficult Duettas with ease making them quite dynamic! The combination is quite liquid & lovely sounding and I've become quite a ribbon fan, but the speakers "push only" design of the base panel (not sure about the midrange/tweeter ribbon as its magnets are to the sides?) makes me think the "push-pull" design of B's midranges must be, simply, superior in accuracy, control and "power". I'm concerned a bit by the "closed box" design of their use in the RM40 as I think part of the allure of the Duettas has been their dipole radiation allowing an airy & open sound that can be controlled by varying amounts of room treatment. However the reviews and owner comments I've read about the RM40 (and RM30 for that matter) leave me trusting in their excellence (besides, a set of ambience tweeters might be just the ticket for those of us wanting a bit of that "airy" sound, eh?)

[John Casler]

Two pair of the larger subs... John, you must not have neighbors!

Well actually I live in a condo.  But the reason for 4 subs is NOT to blow the walls down, but to have "stereo subs" in the front flanking the RM40's, and then another sub right "behind" the listening chair firing away from me toward the rear wall, and the 4th sub 30 feet away down a hallway to insure well formed "LONG" wavelengths.  aa

I value delicacy and rich harmonic overtones in the bass over "POWER" but can have all the power I need upon demand.

Actually a pair of the VSS (or 215's?) would be nice in my new home's music/studio room - it's 27.5' X 14.5' X 8' with two 6' wide X 5' deep dormers half way down the long length. I would guess the two subs would make balancing modes much easier as I have found even with the smallish Hsu's (besides, my nearest neighbor is at least 50 - 60 yds away now). The VLA's... oh, my, V60's with a pair of VLA's... would that even work in my room or be just massive overkill?? Besides, I'd have to trade in my car to go that deep!

Consider this, walking everywhere will improve your health, reduce your carbon footprint, and allow you to enjoy sonic pleasures you didn't know existed. . . . what good is a car?   

I'm presently driving the pair of Hsu Research 10's with an Adcom 555 II but, well, let's just say I miss the kind of power & well defined bass I got from those Supertowers 20 yrs ago! These 10's probably don't reach much lower than the Duettas alone - just take some of the stress off of the bass panels when the volume is up. I'm presently using a Rane active crossover with the subs taking over below 70hz. I'm not a boom-boom fanatic but a system without D-E-E-P, "tuneful", and powerful low frequency capability down to at least the low 20's is just an incomplete system IMHO. Big B obviously thinks so too as he has established himself as the King of Bass IMHO 

Well with the award winning RM40s, and the RM v60's he has also annexed a few of the upper registers.

The Duettas are set up past the halfway point with about 2/3rds of the open dormers to the speakers outside looking back at the listening position. Very early wall reflections are avoided and the sound is pretty good sitting half way into the long end with the back radiation of the dipoles into about 12' of open room behind (with some counters, desk, etc for diffusion).

These Apogees were refurbished at the factory in the late 90's (must have been shortly before their folding). I'm driving them with a dbx BX1, just had it fully gone through at ADK HiFi in Vallejo. This late 80's transistor amp's 512 watts into 8-ohms, 1225 watts into 2-ohm loads handles the somewhat difficult Duettas with ease making them quite dynamic! The combination is quite liquid & lovely sounding and I've become quite a ribbon fan, but the speakers "push only" design of the base panel (not sure about the midrange/tweeter ribbon as its magnets are to the sides?) makes me think the "push-pull" design of B's midranges must be, simply, superior in accuracy, control and "power".

I'm concerned a bit by the "closed box" design of their use in the RM40 as I think part of the allure of the Duettas has been their dipole radiation allowing an airy & open sound that can be controlled by varying amounts of room treatment.

However the reviews and owner comments I've read about the RM40 (and RM30 for that matter) leave me trusting in their excellence (besides, a set of ambience tweeters might be just the ticket for those of us wanting a bit of that "airy" sound, eh?)

Every system/room set up has to be built or assembled to the listeners tastes.  If it is undistorted sonic accuracy you want and the goal is to transcend your room boundaries and be transported to the original recording venue, then the monopole versions (626R/RM2/RM30/RM40) are going to take you on the Sonic Carpet Ride.

If you want to personally tailor and shape your own "open and free" sonic, and bring the performance to "your" room, then the RM v60 is the ticket.  With the dipolar radiation of the planars and the ribbon tweeter, and the large foam wedge that you can adjust for the perfect amount of "radiation" you have a lot of "shaping" and "tailoring" to play with.

As Is and out of the box, they sound better than they ought to, but if you treat them like a new girlfriend and explore their seemingly limitless potential, you can reap some musical rewards that are not easily described, and are better experienced.

So buy some running shoes (or good walking shoes), hold your breath, and get ready for fun.   

[fido]

John, points well taken... and did anyone tell you you're a pretty good salesman?  Oh, and yes, I guess Big B has obviously "annexed" the upper scales as well... at least a bunch of owners here and visitors to the CES have thought so. I'm anxious to get down to El Sobrante and hear for myself!  Thanks for the input and thanks to you as well Brian!

[John Casler]

John, points well taken... and did anyone tell you you're a pretty good salesman? 

Salesman?  Not me.

Just kidding of course, but I taught sales for many years, and have studied all the great salemen of our time and have come to understand that SALES is not getting someone to BUY.

A good saleman does not sell at all, they offer their client enough information to make the best decision.

And the KEY to helping people get what they want (if it is what you sell) is understanding and "beleiving" in your product or service.

So I seldom "sell" anything, but I do enjoy helping people enjoy the things I personally have found to be valuable and worthwhile.

In fact you will find an even different "sales persona" in Big B.  When you visit, he will talk very little, sit in the chair while you listen and let his creations do the "sales job" for him.

You might in fact mistake his closed eyes as he listens with you as "catching a few", but in fact he is basking in the sonic sensations just as you are.