[ebag4]

My sister's B***301s are dying (yea!!). She has asked me to look into new speakers for her.  She listens to Zep, ACDC, Tom Petty, etc. at loud volumes in her smallish space (livingroom/kitchen 10x20 plus 5x10"L", listening space approximately 10x12).  The way her room is setup she cannot go OB.  I told her that there are some pretty good deals to be found on used and not so used AV123 X-LSs, some around $150.  I also told her that if she wanted to buy the parts I would build the speakers for her.  I am thinking the AV3s (with the new NEO??) or the floorstanding version of the NEO2X.  I told her she would be in the $400. range for parts.  Now coming from her current speakers either of these will be an improvement (duh ), my question is which is better for a rocker?  I am leaning to the AV3s because I feel that 2 midbass drivers would be preferable over the long haul at high volumes.  A little more info, she will be driving these with a Sherwood AVR @ 100wpc, they will be used for music primarily, occasionally be used for movies in 2 channel .  She is not looking at a sub at this point.

Thanks guys, if you have other recommendations please let me know.

[S Clark]

You have a PM... and the AV3 puts out significantly more bass than the Neo2... and the effeciency is quite a bit higher.

[ebag4]

Thanks Scott,
With her room size and the wattage available the efficiency is not a real concern.  The bass output is of course.  Have you heard the M-165x in a ported enclosure?  The numbers look similar but I also felt that the bass would be better with the AV3s or at the least a bit cleaner due to the use of 2 drivers instead of one.

Ed

[S Clark]

I have not heard the vented Neo, but it should get into the forties.  The AV3 is a true transmission line and will hit a true 40Hz F3.  Danny can give exact numbers.  The only time I use a sub with my AV3's is when listening to symphonic classical.  It does rock just fine without a sub.

[Hank]

Normally, I'd recommend the A/V-3's for larger spaces and nowadays, the NEO-2X for smaller spaces.  I've built and listened to both.  Even though your sister's listening space is smallish, since it opens into a bigger volume space, overall, it's a big enough total volume to really benefit from the A/V-3's.  You could also use my cabinet design (the RAV-6 in the NEO-2X thread) and build a tower version of the NEO-2X.  That M-165X is quite a nice mid-woof, and if your sister appreciates the best highs (cymbal shimmer, etc), the planar magnetic tweeter in the NEO is very nice.

[ebag4]

Thanks for the additional info Scott.

Hank,
Thanks for your input.  I have seen the design you posted in that thread, nice of you to post it.  I just happen to have 4 M-165Xs doing nothing at the moment and was considering your cabinet for my own use.  I have built a modified version of Danny's OB-5 and agree that th NEO is a special driver.

Thanks for your replies guys.

[Danny Richie]

Hank's advice is pretty solid.

If I had time to build a test box, I'd move forward with the A/V-3 with the Neo tweeter. I guess that would then be a Neo-3 kit. 

I guess I might have to offer someone a swap in cabinets for a kit or something so that I can get some cabinets over here to measure and test with. I drew up the plans a long time ago.

See plans: http://www.gr-research.com/pdf/Neo3box.pdf

All things considered, combining the best qualities of each of those would make for a really good speaker.

[laserman]

Hank,

I think Danny is dangling that carrot in front of you.   

Go for it. 

Lou

[Doublej]

I wouldn't be so sure that either speaker will be better for a rocker than Bose. But if the Sherwood has tone controls or an equalizer no matter which GR Research speaker you give her she'll have it sounding like a Bose (upward tilted midbass, reduced treble to tame brightness in poorly mastered recordings) in no time. She sounds like a musicophile (rockophile?), not an audiophile.

Personally I'd give her another pair of bookshelf speakers with a rectangular cabinet to maximize placement options. And I would make sure that they were efficient. I doubt that the 100 watt Sherwood is the same as 100 audiophile watts and an easy way to blow a driver is to send the amp into clipping because you want it louder.

Danny, any thoughts on creating a pair of speakers to compete with Cerwin Vega for our rocker friends?

[ebag4]

Hi Doublej,
Well, she certainly isn't an audiophile, but she does like the modded OB-5s I built.  She doesn't change equipment very often, she has had the Bose for about 20 years.  That is one reason I want her to get a decent set that will play whatever she wants to listen to in the next 20 years.

At 91dB efficient I don't think she will ever drive the amp she has into clipping by turning it up too loud.

I am pretty certain that Danny's designs are meant for "musicphiles" as much as they are for audiophiles.

Thanks for posting!

[Hank]

I wouldn't be so sure that either speaker will be better for a rocker than Bose.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! 
"Got no highs?  Got no lows?  Must be Bose!"
How 'bout some Tang Band "full range" 3" drivers in 6" cubes?  Out of sight, out of mind, out of fidelity.   Or, for SPL's, a 3-way with a 12" woofer with a half-pound magnet, a poly cone 3" mid and an aluminum dome 1/2" tweet with non-polarized electrolytics.  All in an impressive 16" wide cabinet with the baffle inset 1" to take a tweed flush mount grill.  (Sometimes I crack myself up.)

Laserman, my cab design is labor intensive since I agreed to do the slot port at Al's insistence.  I still think a double flared tube port would work as well, and be easier for guys to build.  If I had the time to spare, I'd just build a pair and send one to Danny to play with.  But, the day job prevails - I may need to do a biz trip to China and Taiwan in a few weeks.