Welborne Labs discrete op-amp?

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NewBuyer

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Welborne Labs discrete op-amp?
« on: 12 May 2008, 03:28 am »
Just wondering if anybody has any experience with this Welborne Labs product.

It looks like a very nice discrete op-amp that could be used (anytime space allows) to replace any chip op-amps. It can run single-ended or balanced, unity gain (or higher), inverted or non-inverted, etc - and the specs look extremely good too.

Perhaps a worthy competitor to the Burson discrete op-amp?


jb

Re: Welborne Labs discrete op-amp?
« Reply #1 on: 12 May 2008, 12:37 pm »
Just wondering if anybody has any experience with this Welborne Labs product.

A word to the wise: Welborne has bad reputation in some circles. Search "Welborne" in AA. When a customer complains about missing items in a kit or unreasonably long order times his usual response is to cut off all communication with that customer. Sooner or later the customer stops trying to get satisfaction and writes off the loss. He did it to me. As far as I know, Welborne's business practices are currently under investigation by several state AGs and the Fed.

TomW16

Re: Welborne Labs discrete op-amp?
« Reply #2 on: 12 May 2008, 03:02 pm »
I can only comment for me but I have had good experiences with Ron Welborne.  I have experienced lack of communication and slow deliveries, however, he has always pulled through in the end.

I can't comment on the mini amp board but I just purchased two pair unity gain boards on the sale page.  I will be building a buffer experiment.

Cheers,
Tom

Update:  I received my Borbelli buffer boards without incident on May 15, 2008.
« Last Edit: 16 May 2008, 09:51 pm by TomW16 »

MarkM

Re: Welborne Labs discrete op-amp?
« Reply #3 on: 16 May 2008, 12:55 pm »
My last experience with Welborne Labs...I had a problem last year and Ron completely ignored my calls and emails on a $200 order for two months.  Was it a coincidence that I recieved an immediate response from Ron after posting on Audiocircle about my transaction problems/experience with Welborne Labs?  :dunno:   

Someone on the circle read my post and nudged him......thank you.
« Last Edit: 19 May 2008, 11:30 pm by MarkM »

doug s.

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Re: Welborne Labs discrete op-amp?
« Reply #4 on: 17 May 2008, 10:41 pm »
Just wondering if anybody has any experience with this Welborne Labs product.

It looks like a very nice discrete op-amp that could be used (anytime space allows) to replace any chip op-amps. It can run single-ended or balanced, unity gain (or higher), inverted or non-inverted, etc - and the specs look extremely good too.

Perhaps a worthy competitor to the Burson discrete op-amp?



that thing looks positively huge compared to the burson buffer.

and, on another note, while i understand everyone's frustrations in dealing with wendors who do not provide satisfaction, i was banned from this site for posting these types of comments, so i suggest everyone stop making any more negative comments.  this this of behaviour is presently not allowed, per audiocircle rules.  don't say you haven't been warned.  if you don't like it, i suggest taking it up w/the site moderators & the site's owner.  (i wouldn't be surprised if this thread ends up in the intergalactic wastebin.)

doug s.

NewBuyer

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Re: Welborne Labs discrete op-amp?
« Reply #5 on: 18 May 2008, 04:21 am »
that thing looks positively huge compared to the burson buffer...

According to the manufacturers specs, the Welborne product is 3 inches by 3 inches... and the Burson product is about 8.25 inches by 5.75 inches... (?)

doug s.

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Re: Welborne Labs discrete op-amp?
« Reply #6 on: 18 May 2008, 04:47 am »
that thing looks positively huge compared to the burson buffer...

According to the manufacturers specs, the Welborne product is 3 inches by 3 inches... and the Burson product is about 8.25 inches by 5.75 inches... (?)

sorry, i meant the burson discrete op-amp, which was what you were initially referring to - which is ~2"x1"x1" for the dual; 2"x1"x0.5" for the single.

http://www.bursonaudio.com/Burson_HDAM_Module.htm




doug s.

JoshK

Re: Welborne Labs discrete op-amp?
« Reply #7 on: 18 May 2008, 04:25 pm »
Doug is right about not dragging mud onto this board.  A caveat emptor warning is fine but let's not get sidetracked in a conversation about Welbourne's business practices.


Norman Tracy

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Re: Welborne Labs discrete op-amp?
« Reply #8 on: 18 May 2008, 06:59 pm »
A couple of comments on the Mini Amp and doing business servicing the DIY audio market.

1. Mini Amp

W O W. This thing is a Erno Borbely design. For the newbies be informed Borbely is one of the Godfathers of discrete solid state audio design for decades now specializing in FET based designs. He is based in Europe and sells his designs here:

http://www.borbelyaudio.com

Note that for N. America customers buying from Borbely Audio means paying in Euros (i.e. price is going up even as I type this) and calling Europe as he does not accept credit card numbers through his web site of via e-mail. Thus having Ron Welborne stock some of EB's kits and for at least a time absorb the dollar's plunge is a real service.

I have not heard the Mini Amp in question but the unit pictured looks very high end. Note the compact symmetrical layout and audio grade parts used.

2. Ron Welborne delays

For almost everyone servicing the North American DIY audio electronics market you will find the occasional complaint of slow service. The challenge is this type of business is aimed at a very narrow niche market. Technical education is not as prevalent in America as in Asia and Europe so there is a lower percentage of the populace who even know how to read a schematic, stuff a circuit board, and solder. We work more hours so there is less free time for hobbies but with a higher standard of living (or excessive consumption depending on your point of view) we have more hobbies and activities competing for that time. On the other hand parts and low cost circuit board fabrication is readily available so the more advanced hobbyist can bypass the Welbornes and complete projects using Mouser and Digi-Key parts. My understanding is in Europe electronic parts distributors will not fill small orders so this keeps the more technically advanced builders supporting DIY audio specialists.

All this conspires to keep operations like Ron's small often with the owner doing it all. Along comes a burst of business or a family emergency and one can get a backlog and unhappy clients. This never excuses taking money and not delivering but I have been there facing the dilemma of do I spend the time I have today getting orders out or communicating with customers why there is a delay? My point is you are not dealing with Dell or amazon.com where your order is processed through a 100,000 square foot automated warehouse with a staff of 500. Would that the market could support that!

peranders

Re: Welborne Labs discrete op-amp?
« Reply #9 on: 21 May 2008, 07:54 pm »
A good headphone amp can also be used as a line amp. I have a couple of different designs  :D but not component kits of the same reason as above. Way too much work for no pay, but of the things I actually sell I make sure to deliver the same day if possible. I take it as an obligation to inform the customer of things that he ought to know and what to expect. I help everybody and ignore nobody. This is my idea of doing business.