[lmpine]

Steve—

My current set-up:

I am running a Media Center Mini Edition (http://http://www.s1digital.com/Media_Center_Mini_Edition_p/mcme.htm) with your original Off-Ramp Turbo USB to S/PDIF into my Bryston SP2.  I use Foobar 8.3 with SRC up sampling to 24/96 (ASIO as I could not seem to get Directsound working).  I control the Mini Edition from my laptop using Remote Desktop built into XP.  I run the Off-Ramp into my Bryston SP2 which for the time being will continue to serve as my DAC.  I have about 500 albums ripped to FLAC and stored on an NAS.

I am looking to upgrade and add in a Pace Car, but I am not sure I want to stay with the PC as my primary source.  I need to add multi-room capability and I would like a more user-friendly interface for my wife and for guests.  I have researched the Pace Car for the Squeezebox and the Sonos but I still have some questions.   

1.   From this forum, I gather that the best results will be achieved by my staying with the PC using Foobar and continuing to up-sample (or trans-coding my collection from FLAC to Apple Lossless and using Itunes off a Mac Mini which would give me the ability to use an iTouch as a remote).  In this scenario I would upgrade both my Off-Ramp and add in a Pace Car.  I need the Pace Car to be AES/EBU out for my SP2 – I am a bit confused as to what the ideal solution would be in this set-up to get the music to the Pace Car.  Is there still a significant advantage to using the Off-Ramp or Freeway I2S vs. the Off-Ramp Turbo 2 or the Freeway or for that matter my original Off-Ramp Turbo?  What is the solution that gives the best results?  Also, am I correct in stating that I would need to send you the PC or Mac for tuning in this scenario?
2.   Have you tested the Transporter with a Pace Car?  Do you think that the digital output of the Transporter into a Pace Car will come close to the sound quality achieved in Option 1?  To that end, is there an advantage to a Transporter in this scenario with a Pace Car or is it just as good to use a Squeezebox?  Have you seen the new Slim Devices Duet and do you know if you will be able to modify this for use with a Pace Car as you have done with the Squeezebox?   Any of these options are attractive to me because they give me the benefit of a hand held controller (about to be launched by Slim Devices), add in multi-room capability without having to add in additional PC’s, and eliminate the need to send you a PC fro tuning (which if my PC needs to be replaced at some point, could be a bit of a pain).

In the end, I guess I would prefer to have a Transporter/Duet set-up in multiple rooms and even add a Pace-Car to each one than to have to set-up individual PC’s or Mac’s but not if it means giving up a lot of ground in sound quality.  The Mac Mini with the iTouch is an interesting option, but I don’t really want to be stuck having to convert 500 Cd’s from FLAC to Apple Lossless and sticking with a proprietary format makes my nervous.  Thanks in advance for your help and guidance.

Best,
Lewis

[audioengr]

Lewis - see answers below:

1.   From this forum, I gather that the best results will be achieved by my staying with the PC using Foobar and continuing to up-sample (or trans-coding my collection from FLAC to Apple Lossless and using Itunes off a Mac Mini which would give me the ability to use an iTouch as a remote).  In this scenario I would upgrade both my Off-Ramp and add in a Pace Car.  I need the Pace Car to be AES/EBU out for my SP2 – I am a bit confused as to what the ideal solution would be in this set-up to get the music to the Pace Car.  Is there still a significant advantage to using the Off-Ramp or Freeway I2S vs. the Off-Ramp Turbo 2 or the Freeway or for that matter my original Off-Ramp Turbo?  What is the solution that gives the best results? 

The new Off-Ramp Turbo 2 is significantly better than the older Off-Ramp Turbo, and I have made recent improvements that bring it almost to the quality of the Pace-Car.  I would recommend this if you want to stay with USB.

Also, am I correct in stating that I would need to send you the PC or Mac for tuning in this scenario?

For USB to a Pace-Car, yes it must be tuned to a particular laptop.

2.   Have you tested the Transporter with a Pace Car? 

Nobody has sent me one yet, but I'm confident that it will work fine.  I've interfaced SB3, Sonos, AirPort Express and Olive to the Pace-Car with no problems.

Do you think that the digital output of the Transporter into a Pace Car will come close to the sound quality achieved in Option 1? 

The Transporter should be identical in quality to USB at 24/96.

To that end, is there an advantage to a Transporter in this scenario with a Pace Car or is it just as good to use a Squeezebox? 

Transporter gives you 24/96 wirelessly.  Not sure about reliability of this though.  Nobody is talking on the web much about this because most Transporter buyers use the internal DAC, which I dislike.

Have you seen the new Slim Devices Duet and do you know if you will be able to modify this for use with a Pace Car as you have done with the Squeezebox?   

No doubts that I can do a similar interface like the SB3.

Any of these options are attractive to me because they give me the benefit of a hand held controller (about to be launched by Slim Devices), add in multi-room capability without having to add in additional PC’s, and eliminate the need to send you a PC fro tuning (which if my PC needs to be replaced at some point, could be a bit of a pain).

If you decide on the Duet, then definitely get a Pace-Car to reclock it.  If you want to continue to have 24/96 capability, either get a Transporter and Pace-Car or upgrade your Off-Ramp Turbo to a Turbo 2.  I am currently doing a build of Turbo 2's and have a few extras.  No waiting.

Steve N.

[kbuzz3]

This thread raises some issues for me as ive been contemplating a switch to cpu via either a RWA olive or some type of modded SB. The new SB duet seems like a great way to go, given the remote. So if im correct steve, the pace car can be used with the new duet with only minor mods to the duet itself-like the SB3?

If this is true, then, i guess my only decision is whether the duet/pace car's jitter elimnation plus dac would be a better sonic solution then say a bolder modded SB3 with upgraded PS.

Can I also assume that a pace car with new duet would cost in the same general ball park as an SB3 version?

Sorry for the anal audiophile type questions.....i had my heart on an olive until i started doing reasearch and realizing the depth of the 'love" for the slim devices products

[lmpine]

Steve—

Thanks for the response.  A few more questions for clarification…in the PC/Mac scenario, I’m still a bit confused.  What gives the best results – Option 1, 2, or 3?

1.  PC/Mac -> USB Off Ramp Turbo 2 -> Dac
2.  PC/Mac -> Pace Car -> Dac (tuning necessary)
3.  PC/Mac ->  USB Off Ramp -> Pace Car -> Dac

Does scenario 3 provide any benefit or do the Pace Car and USB Off-Ramp serve the same purpose?

Turning to the Transporter, it doesn’t seem like there is any advantage unless I have 24/96 files natively to stream.  Otherwise a modified Duet -> Pace Car-> Dac should be equivalent sound quality, correct?

Lastly given a choice between the best PC/Mac option above versus the Duet -> Pace Car option, which is the best for 16/44? 

Thanks again.
 

[audioengr]

This thread raises some issues for me as ive been contemplating a switch to cpu via either a RWA olive or some type of modded SB. The new SB duet seems like a great way to go, given the remote. So if im correct steve, the pace car can be used with the new duet with only minor mods to the duet itself-like the SB3?

Correct.

If this is true, then, i guess my only decision is whether the duet/pace car's jitter elimnation plus dac would be a better sonic solution then say a bolder modded SB3 with upgraded PS.

If I could make the jitter as low as the Pace-Car by modding the SB3, I would do it too.  The Pace-Car is just a superior solution, although maybe more expensive.

Can I also assume that a pace car with new duet would cost in the same general ball park as an SB3 version?

Yes, but until I mod one, I will not know if the difficulty warrants a slightly higher price.

Sorry for the anal audiophile type questions.....i had my heart on an olive until i started doing reasearch and realizing the depth of the 'love" for the slim devices products

I was not very impressed with the Olive user interface, at least on the Opus 5.  The sound quality is identical to SB3 through the Pace-Car.

Steve N.

[audioengr]

Steve—

Thanks for the response.  A few more questions for clarification…in the PC/Mac scenario, I’m still a bit confused.  What gives the best results – Option 1, 2, or 3?

1.  PC/Mac -> USB Off Ramp Turbo 2 -> Dac
2.  PC/Mac -> Pace Car -> Dac (tuning necessary)
3.  PC/Mac ->  USB Off Ramp -> Pace Car -> Dac (tuning necessary)

2 and 3 are identical and both a bit better than 1

Does scenario 3 provide any benefit or do the Pace Car and USB Off-Ramp serve the same purpose?

The USB allows a longer cable than S/PDIF or Toslink from the computer direct.

Turning to the Transporter, it doesn’t seem like there is any advantage unless I have 24/96 files natively to stream.  Otherwise a modified Duet -> Pace Car-> Dac should be equivalent sound quality, correct?

Correct, 24/96 is the only reason to spend extra for the Transporter.

Lastly given a choice between the best PC/Mac option above versus the Duet -> Pace Car option, which is the best for 16/44?

Anything piped through the Pace-Car at 16/44.1 will be the best solution.  It is just a matter of what human interface you like best, and whether you want it wired or wireless.

Steve N.

[wappinghigh]

Lewis..you mentioned you wanted to go to a multiroom system that was "friendly to wife and guests"...

Don't ignore this very important issue my friend.
No point in a system which never gets used!

I had a squeezbox in my bedroom once....wife NEVER used it.
I then replaced  it with a sonos...wife always uses it!

I've tried contolling itunes before with "adapted remotes"/mobile phone plug in's etc...they ended up in the "recycle bin"....admittently they were bluetooth  (which invariably fails) and I have never used the itouch control, but nothing beats the simplicity of the sonos remote imho

I'm assuming you dont want true high fi in every room (otherwise you could blow $20-30,000 on a LINN multiroom server system (they will do 24/96)..on the other hand...sorry for being presumtious....you should at least take a look at their gear/site....

I went down the sonos path...I have unmodded gear where I dont need "real hif".(kitchen/bath/dining etc etc.and I'm going to get modded gear where I want "real hifi" (family/study)

...BTW Mr Nugent also mods the zp80....and no doubt others will folllow.

AB

[lmpine]

Thanks for the advice, it is much appreciated.  I agree with your thinking.  I wouldn’t/couldn’t spend that kind of money on a Linn system, but I have had Linn gear before and while it was good, it never really blew me away.  I was very close to pulling the trigger on the Sonos, but I am now considering the Slim Devices Duet with the introduction of their new remote.  Either way, I would mod the unit with Steve and add a Pace Car.  I have a friend who has the Sonos and loves it and I have had a chance to see it in action.  I’m waiting to see the new Slim Controller before making a final decision.  It’s pretty much a given that I will add one of these devices for all secondary rooms.  My remaining hesitation is deciding whether the Duet/Sonos with Pace Car will achieve the results I am looking for in my main rig versus my current set-up with foobar + up-sampling.  I know from Steve that up-sampling achieves the best results, but I would love to hear from someone who has heard both how much of a difference there really is…