changed the preamp from Tact back to Jolida....

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Florian

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changed the preamp from Tact back to Jolida....
« on: 25 Apr 2005, 01:52 pm »
I changed my Preamp back to the Jolida. It made a big difference, especially in transparency and bass. I also ordered some "real" bass traps and absorbers. The designer is also comming to my home next week to measure the room, since i have some funky stuff going in here  :mrgreen:

Anyways, i checked the RM30 and everything works great which is a big relief. I am still battling the shipping insurence, because i want my 210$ replaced but they seem to take a awfully looong time.

It all looks like, i will be happy soon. Once the room is done, and the Rm30's are placed correclty to make them shine.

-Flo

zybar

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Re: changed the preamp from Tact back to Jolida....
« Reply #1 on: 25 Apr 2005, 02:22 pm »
Quote from: Florian
I changed my Preamp back to the Jolida. It made a big difference, especially in transparency and bass. I also ordered some "real" bass traps and absorbers. The designer is also comming to my home next week to measure the room, since i have some funky stuff going in here  :mrgreen:

Anyways, i checked the RM30 and everything works great which is a big relief. I am still battling the shipping insurence, because i want my 210$ replaced but they seem to take a awfully looong time.

It all looks like, i wil ...


Florian,

I don't think you should give up so easily on the TacT.

There are quite a few of us who use the TacT with VMPS speakers and it has made quite an improvement - certainly not subtle...

I have a very hard time believing the Jolida would be better than a properly setup TacT.

That being said, do whatever makes you happy.

George

Florian

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changed the preamp from Tact back to Jolida....
« Reply #2 on: 25 Apr 2005, 02:49 pm »
Dont mussunderstand me please, the tact is awsome. I do all my listening in bypass mode to compare the jolida and the tact.

I have them hooked up like this.

CDP-Tact-Jolida-Krell

I still use the tact as a room corrector and volume controll, but not as a preamp. I will try out more later, but i am tired now and will stop untill the treatments are in.

-Flo

ekovalsky

changed the preamp from Tact back to Jolida....
« Reply #3 on: 25 Apr 2005, 03:54 pm »
Quote from: Florian
Dont mussunderstand me please, the tact is awsome. I do all my listening in bypass mode to compare the jolida and the tact.

I have them hooked up like this.

CDP-Tact-Jolida-Krell

I still use the tact as a room corrector and volume controll, but not as a preamp. I will try out more later, but i am tired now and will stop untill the treatments are in.

-Flo


If you prefer the sound in bypass mode to correction you don't have it set up properly.  Trust me, I did the same thing at first.  In bypass mode, the RCS will lose out to most other good preamps unless you use a digital source and the TacT digital amps with it.

Here are tsome steps to getting a good correction.

1.  Spend lots of time moving the speakers and measuring, trying to get the dips minimized.  This took me about a week!  Sometimes 1/4" makes a difference.  I did generally find that positions that measured good sounded good too.  And in positions where there was a big node or suckout, it was audible if I listened carefully for it.  My critical listening skills improved dramatically during that very long week.

2.  Don't try to lift the suck outs much, if at all, with the correction curve.  If the measurement curve falls below the target, lower it either in the area of the dip or overall.  With sensitive speakers like VMPS driven by powerful amps you can drop the target curve so that hits the bottoms of the peaks.  So what you are doing is attenuating other frequencies to some degree while maintaing full output where the suckouts are, thus achieving a smooth target response.  With VMPS and solid state (or big tube) amps this seems to work fine in normal sized rooms.  Downside is you give up some maximum SPL, but really who needs a system that can play at 120dB anyway ?  Better off droping max SPL to 105-110 dB and achieving a flat response.  This is not compression, unless you normally are listening at 120dB and if so you'll fry your ears so none of this matters.

3.  SPL will be lower with correction than bypass, since correction works by attenuation frequencies.  When you compare bypass with correction, don't forget to be very careful about level matching  -- you will be turning up the volume with correction enabled.  You may need change levels to -6dB or less in the bypass to make up for the difference.  I thought correction sounded like crap until I realized this.

4.  You may notice an apparent reduction in bass with correction on.  This is because the bass reinforcement nodes are gone.  What you are left with is the true bass in the recording.  Gone is the "one note bass" at 50hz which is your room adding 10dB or more to the output in that range.   Classical piano sounds great with correction as all the lower register fundamentals are correct -- makes the piano sound like it is in the room!


I strongly believe that ANY speaker can benefit greatly from room correction.  It is very unlikely that any system I have in the future will be without it.

Florian

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changed the preamp from Tact back to Jolida....
« Reply #4 on: 25 Apr 2005, 10:57 pm »
I will just wait paitently untill the room treatments come. I became a dealer for a well known acoustic material company here in germany. I will get the bass traps and panels at the end of this or beginning of next week. I will finish furnishing the room and then give it all another go as you desribed.

Thanks

-Flo

ScottMayo

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changed the preamp from Tact back to Jolida....
« Reply #5 on: 27 Apr 2005, 02:03 am »
Quote from: ekovalsky
SPL will be lower with correction than bypass, since correction works by attenuation frequencies. When you compare bypass with correction, don't forget to be very careful about level matching -- you will be turning up the volume with correction enabled. You may need change levels to -6dB or less in the bypass to make up for the difference. I thought correction sounded like crap until I realized this.


The one summer (long ages ago) I worked in an electronics store, the best salesman there taught me how to sell stereos. His secrets were to try to find out someone's favorite band and play it for the customer, and, to play the most expensive stereo in the store just a few dB louder than all the others, if the customer seemed to have money. Louder (up to a point) always sounds better. Since everything in the store was junk and it all sounded largely identical, this was his best ploy.

SPL meters are your friend. Always use an SPL meter. Anything you can't measure is your imagination; and down that path, the golden-plated power cords lie. :-)

meilankev

changed the preamp from Tact back to Jolida....
« Reply #6 on: 27 Apr 2005, 01:31 pm »
Scott,

You state:
Quote
Anything you can't measure is your imagination;


While this is true, my imagination is the only thing that matters.  :P

Kevin

ctviggen

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changed the preamp from Tact back to Jolida....
« Reply #7 on: 27 Apr 2005, 01:59 pm »
I do think that spl is important when comparing items.  Any test where you don't try to make the SPL the same is pretty much meaningless.