ROON Survey

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. Read 7966 times.

jtwrace

  • Full Member
  • Posts: 11415
  • www.theintellectualpeoplepodcast.com
    • TIPP YouTube Channel
Re: ROON Survey
« Reply #20 on: 24 Jun 2016, 06:54 pm »
The new Salkstream gen 3 has it built in.
That's correct but it's also $1600 and my Synology is obviously paid for.  The µRendu is only $640

Krutsch

  • Full Member
  • Posts: 568
Re: ROON Survey
« Reply #21 on: 25 Jun 2016, 12:33 am »
For what it's worth, I bought a 1-year subscription, which runs out in July, but I decided to remove RoonServer from my Mac Mini. Not having support for Roon on the BDP-1 did play a part in that decision, but there were other reasons.

I think Roon is on the right path; what they bring to music discovery and integration of streaming services (today, only TIDAL) is visionary and the way forward.

But for me, it became too frustrating and was taking the fun out of listening to music for me.

Roon has a destructive queue model that forces you to play-back everything using a playlist paradigm. So, for example, finding an album you want to hear and then skipping around to different tracks you like, out of order, within that album is very tedious. It's literally multiple clicks each time you choose another track. For example, I select an album and then want to hear track #5, #7, #3 and then maybe #7 again, because it's my favorite. On any other media app (even Manic Moose), you just click on track #7 and it immediately starts playback from that point forward. With Roon: select, tap-and-hold for pop-up menu, tap "Play From Here", tap the giant play button on a full-screen confirmation pop-over they call the "Paw Masher". Not making this up... tons of posts on their community forum on this issue.

And, it's not just the queue model, it's also the need to "double-curate" my library (I feel like I've had to "fix-up" too many albums in my collection and it's time consuming).

In the meantime, I am back to MPD, which works with the simplicity and reliability of a CD player.

bjski

Re: ROON Survey
« Reply #22 on: 26 Jun 2016, 03:33 am »
MPD works fine with my BDP-1 18.21 and 19.21 beta version with my BDP-2. Don't really fine that I missing anything other than a live bootleg recording cover. Some of my earlier Nuggs LiveDownloads don't have any cover art. I'm OK with that. I list the tracks I would like to hear and listen to the music not worrying about cover art.
MPD of recent has everything I require.

CanadianMaestro

  • Restricted
  • Posts: 1760
  • Skepticism is the engine of progress
    • Hearing Everything That Nothing Can Measure
Re: ROON Survey
« Reply #23 on: 26 Jun 2016, 12:57 pm »

Roon has a destructive queue model that forces you to play-back everything using a playlist paradigm. .....

And, it's not just the queue model, it's also the need to "double-curate" my library (I feel like I've had to "fix-up" too many albums in my collection and it's time consuming).

In the meantime, I am back to MPD, which works with the simplicity and reliability of a CD player.

I'm with you on that. That Roon queueing "glitch" is a deal-breaker for me. Somebody must have had a sadistic streak or brain cramp when they designed that feature.

guf

Re: ROON Survey
« Reply #24 on: 26 Jun 2016, 11:55 pm »
I argued forever that I don't need library management and pretty art work to enjoy my music. That being said Roon has helped me listen to music I forgot I had and made it ALL so accessible. I love the art work and their biased write ups and reviews. I loved it the first 2 weeks then realized the real potential of the server/core separation by not having to screenshare into my headless Mac mini running HQplayer. I agree that its the best software i have ever used for music.

Krutsch

  • Full Member
  • Posts: 568
Re: ROON Survey
« Reply #25 on: 27 Jun 2016, 05:42 am »
... realized the real potential of the server/core separation by not having to screenshare into my headless Mac mini running HQplayer. I agree that its the best software i have ever used for music.

I played around with this, quite a bit. With cheaper DACs (e.g. Schiit Audio Modi 2 Uber) it was eye opening how much better things sounded with HQPlayer. With my primary DAC, it was harder to perceive the difference.

It would be interesting to see Bryston integration HQ Player Network Audio Adapter (renderer piece, only) into the BDP software stack. If they did that, I would consider returning to Roon.

Marius

Re: ROON Survey
« Reply #26 on: 27 Jun 2016, 07:49 am »
Tried Roon with Tidal.
Bottomline for me: looking very nice at first glance, but very quickly got very overwhelmed, not to say grew tired with all unnecessary visual bling. Interface mostly suited for popular music (especially the combo with Tidal). Complete lack of adequate support for Classical music, as goes for Tidal.

Chatted with Roon about this, and they invited me to come back when they have Classical in order. Don't know when this will be.

All in all, I found it way too much an interface to browse the rest of the world, instead of being a great interface to browse my own library. Which Plex does beautifully, along with showing related artist and album info, available from the web. Plex allows the user to select several services to get that info from.

Roon is a black box, one has to trust Roon to be careful with ones privacy. I don't, until proven otherwise. The crawling might go far and deep.

Also, i disliked the experience of being tempted to try and buy other recordings. Might be the combo with Tidal. Still, i want to browse my own library.
MPD sonically does that best. For me, preferably in default file view, if possible with added related background and graphical extras, concentrated on my own library. For that i turn to Plex now.

Wil try Roon again, when a Bryston Endpoint is ready, and Classical has matured.

Cheers,
Marius



Wim J

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 119
Re: ROON Survey
« Reply #27 on: 27 Jun 2016, 12:13 pm »
I'm using ROON on my BDP-1 with beta release. (2.22 if I remember correctly)
I stopped updating the BDP-1. I will lose ROON-RAAT if I perform an update. MPD might be slightly better sounding, but ROON has all functionality MPD will never have. I can't hear any difference between MPD and ROON (uncompressed files)
I use a Dell 9020 micro desktop PC as headless server,... I'm sure I will never go back to MPD. I really started using my BDP-1 from the moment I could use it with ROON. MPD was never capable to handle a larger music collection. This is no problem using Roon.

So YES. I use ROON. I got to know ROON just in time, because the BDP-1 was on it's way out. SQ is top-notch on the BDP but it's software is highly questionable. I still have to run into my first problem with the BDP since it's running RAAT. I can't count the reboots and frustrations I got with MPD.

CanadianMaestro

  • Restricted
  • Posts: 1760
  • Skepticism is the engine of progress
    • Hearing Everything That Nothing Can Measure
Re: ROON Survey
« Reply #28 on: 27 Jun 2016, 12:52 pm »
^  Strange, I've had no issues with MPD/MPad on my BDP-1 (Loony Loon). Cover Art is spotty, but I don't care about that. Updates from attached drives are smooth.

Gotta love diversity.   8)

Wim J

  • Jr. Member
  • Posts: 119
Re: ROON Survey
« Reply #29 on: 27 Jun 2016, 01:03 pm »
^  Strange, I've had no issues with MPD/MPad on my BDP-1 (Loony Loon). Cover Art is spotty, but I don't care about that. Updates from attached drives are smooth.

Gotta love diversity.   8)

 Everybody has his own definitions or problems, but  "... cover art is spotty" is definitely one of the issues that fall in my definition of problem. If you pay full price for a device like BDP-1 I think you can have some expectations,...



sdolezalek

Re: ROON Survey
« Reply #30 on: 27 Jun 2016, 05:06 pm »
I have been a very happy Roon user from early on.  These days I have combined Roon, HQPlayer and tidal for my best ever sound results.  I currently upsample everything to DSD128 in HQPlayer.  Getting this to work smoothly was not without some effort, however.  I did need to upgrade my computer (now Intel i7 with 32 GB RAM and fast graphics card), I switched all my cabling from 5e to 6a and added a fiber bridge for isolation.  I store my music files on a synology NAS and i use a Sonicorbiter as a Network Audio Appliance so that my computer is in one room, the NAS in another and the sound system in yet another.  I control everything through either my laptop or my ipad. 

Previously I have extensively used Amarra, JRiver and Audirvana, but none of them gave me the library management (Roon), library content (Tidal) and sound quality (HQPlayer) that I now have.  But it does take real dedication to set everything up, including fine tuning your choice of upsampling and filters in HQPlayer.  In order of ease of learning to fully exploit the software its probably in the reverse order of my ultimate listening pleasure 1) Amarra, 2) Audirvana, 3) JRiver and 4) Tidal/Roon/HQPlayer.

Grit

  • Full Member
  • Posts: 693
  • - Garrett
Re: ROON Survey
« Reply #31 on: 27 Jun 2016, 05:18 pm »
Whether it's Roon or some other solution, I'd love to have a solution that provides a graphical interface, is easy to use from a phone, tablet, or computer, can access a personal digital library as well as streaming services, and is simple to use. While Bryston has managed a functional web-based interface, that solution will never be as refined as a dedicated application.

I'd consider the ability to edit/modify metadata and cover art a welcome secondary priority or better suited to dedicated software.

I hate to bang this drum again, but the interface on Sonos is spectacular. It's not meant to be a high-end component, but it's so easy and versatile!

CanadianMaestro

  • Restricted
  • Posts: 1760
  • Skepticism is the engine of progress
    • Hearing Everything That Nothing Can Measure
Re: ROON Survey
« Reply #32 on: 27 Jun 2016, 11:04 pm »
Everybody has his own definitions or problems, but  "... cover art is spotty" is definitely one of the issues that fall in my definition of problem. If you pay full price for a device like BDP-1 I think you can have some expectations,...

Since I listen to music with eyes wide shut, cover art ain't a priority for me.   8)

Grit

  • Full Member
  • Posts: 693
  • - Garrett
Re: ROON Survey
« Reply #33 on: 27 Jun 2016, 11:40 pm »
I do too, but it's nice to have when you're selecting what to listen to.

vonnie123

  • Full Member
  • Posts: 354
Re: ROON Survey
« Reply #34 on: 28 Jun 2016, 03:03 am »
Since I listen to music with eyes wide shut, cover art ain't a priority for me.   8)

Sonos' interface is excellent.   They are also striving to improve their product.  Hopefully, Sonos will introduce a high res unit at some point.

You can almost operate it with your eyes closed.

sdolezalek

Re: ROON Survey
« Reply #35 on: 28 Jun 2016, 05:21 am »
One of the things that I think the music industry is still learning from the software world is that highly specialized, best-in-class apps that partner well with others tend to win big.  Even companies the scale of Apple and Microsoft have had to admit that they can no longer dominate a user's hardware/software landscape.  We are choosing one manufacturer's desktop, another's laptop, another's ipad, another's phone and yet another's watch.  Of course we are then demanding that the software we use works across all of those hardware platforms.  It's a delicate dance because you'd like to maximize the number of products you sell, but if you force people onto your platform and then fail not only to have a best-in-class device but a "not-good-enough" one, you can run the risk that they drop you altogether.  So you have to work with the software platforms, even when they both take away sales revenue, market share and ability to lock others out. 

Most of us aren't replacing our audio hardware anywhere as quickly as our handheld computing devices, but the world of software, as it migrates from ownership of LPs and CDs, to downloads and increasingly to streaming, is forcing hardware manufacturers to move ever more quickly to keep up.  Doing that AND staying best of class in software is a tall order for even the biggest hardware manufacturers.  That makes the right software partnerships that much more important. 

What Roon has done in that partnership arena, not only in partnering with Tidal and HQPlayer, but in working with hardware manufacturers to make devices "Roon Ready" is exemplary.  You might have preferred a Roon/Qobuz or roon/Spotify partnership over the Roon/Tidal one, but what Roon is learning through that partnership will make the next one that much easier (if Tidal turns out to have been a poor choice).  Similarly, rather than turn out its own inferior PCM-to-DSD and vice versa, upsampling, filtering and room correction software, Roon decided it was better to work closely with products like HQPlayer and Dirac. 

Those are smart choices by a sophisticated team that also goes out of its way to communicate closely with its customers and listen to their needs.  So even if you prefer this or that aspect of an Audirvana, JRiver, or other player, the likelihood is that Roon will continue to pull in both users and partners and dominate this segment, but not by forcing us to go "all Roon" but, instead by partnering closely with others who together want to deliver the best overall user experience.