[rob80b]

Hi Guys

I’m a late adopter of using a HT processor but have an Emotive UMC-1 (latest FW) on the way and curious how others have incorporated an AVP into their stereo setup.

My current setup to watch movies
Video set-up
Blu-ray and Apple TV2 separate HDMIs to Plasma TV
Audio Set-up
Sony Blu-ray (7.1 anolgue outputs), LR/LF Full-range to BP25P output to Velodyne SMS-1 to 4bSST/Dyaudio Special 25s and Velodyne 1500R sub.
Sony Blu-ray LS/RS direct to 2BLP pro (has level controls for left and right)/Dynaudio Contour 1.3MKIIs and adjust levels accordingly (although I always watch films at the same level so not a big deal).
Also Rega P3 to phono in, Apple TV2 with basic Geffen DAC to video in.

The UMC-1 will allow getting 5.1 from some Netflix films and also take advantage of the LF channel.
•  7.1 (RCA)
•  1 stereo or 2 channel analog multi channel mix down output for fixed level monitoring (RCA)
•  1 stereo analog variable and independent Zone 2 output (RCA)
•  1 stereo analog fixed level record output (RCA)


If I understand correctly the direct out on the UMC-1 does not include sub out although full-range out could be routed to the SMS-1 for music, stereo out does but then my sources, BCD-1, Rega P3 would go through the processor on the AVP.
I guess the tricky part is how to configure the sub (have your cake and eat it too) for HT and stereo.

One way I can see, is utilizing the balanced inputs on the 4BSST from the BP25P so I retain my current stereo set-up and run the UMC-1 config for HT and surrounds into the unbalanced inputs of the 4B and just use the input switches on the back of the 4B but then I do not take and vantage of the LF channel to the sub for movies
The best-case scenario would be that I cannot tell the difference between the BP25P and UMC-1, take the out SMS-1 out of the set-up and just use the BP25P as a pre for vinyl but I’ve got my doubts.

I guess it all comes down on how or what I want to use for the Sub EQ, and room correction (if any), Velodyne SMS-1 or the Emotiva UMC-1 on board DSP.

Sorry if this can all sound a bit complicated and in the end I'll be the one to decide which permutations sounds best to me but as I try to figure it all out any input would be fun.

Thanks

Robert
Toronto, Ontario

[Phil A]

I have a preamp with HT Bypass and use (old) Rel subs in the main system.  The Rels have high and low level inputs and their own crossover when not using the HT set-up so it allows one to set it to where the main speakers drop off to fill in the bottom end.  I have my 2 Rel Storm IIIs crossed over at 22Hz in my room with my speakers.

[rob80b]

Hi Phil

It'll probably come down to whether or not I hear a difference between the BP25P and the UMC-1, I hope so but my ears are turning 60 this year, if not  I'll just keep the BP25P as the source input for vinyl.

[rob80b]

Hi Phil

It'll probably come down to whether or not I hear a difference between the BP25P and the UMC-1, I hope so but my ears are turning 60 this year, if not  I'll just keep the BP25P as the source input for vinyl.

That is of course until I can afford a SP3.0.

[Phil A]

Hi Phil

It'll probably come down to whether or not I hear a difference between the BP25P and the UMC-1, I hope so but my ears are turning 60 this year, if not  I'll just keep the BP25P as the source input for vinyl.

Robert, I turned 60 earlier this year.  But my ears are 39   I've had the Rels with various set-ups including my old Bryston SP1.7.  I actually have a Rel Q150 on the center and a Rel Strata III on the rears.  I used to listen to multi-channel music a bit more and that was my bass management solution.  Probably in just under 2 years I'll be moving so audio stuff is probably on hold.  I'll be taking most of my current main and secondary systems and putting components in different rooms after the move.  My current room is treated and adjust where the bass is great and balanced for 2-channel (I have a one third octave RTA) and after the move I'll have to start that again.

[rob80b]

Hi Phil

If I had room for a dedicated home theatre which I don’t I’d probably follow by youngest brother’s setup: Seaton Catalyst 8C's (LCR), Sparks (S,R), Dual Seaton Submersives JVC RS25 , 125" 2.35 screen, Integra DHC-80.3, Oppo BDP-83, Audyssey Pro Kit, and all this is installed in a black velvet draped dedicated 15 x 25’ HT room, really is a totally immersive theatre experience.
The Submersive subs are totally inert but with amazing room lock and power, the best subs I’ve yet to experience and I’d replace my 15” Velodyne with one but again lack of space.

As for the ears, I’m sure I’m deaf above 15khz, but as they say it’s the mid-range that matters, but then again maybe they weren’t referring to audio.

[Phil A]

For my age, I can still hear decently.  Here's one site - http://www.audiocheck.net/audiotests_frequencycheckhigh.php

There are others too.  Probably had it tested a few years back and was OK then.

[rob80b]

Well finally getting a hold on all of this (only had it for a day mind you), the Emotiva UMC-1 arrived and as most users reported it is indeed a buggy little unit with a mind of it’s own, believe it comes down to the HDMI handshaking, prior to resetting the UMC-1 and Sony BDPS550 to factory settings the surrounds refused to play and it took a little digging to get the centre channel mixed with the fronts, also the Cirrus chipset is known for a few seconds audio delay (audio dropout) when fast forwarding or pausing etc, but when it’s behaving it does a stellar job with HT.
Using the Apple TV2 I now have 5.1 audio and picture quality looks very good up-scaled to 1080 from the UMC-1, Blu-ray was also great, sound was excellent , the ghost centre was clear and the surrounds are a big step up from running the LR surrounds direct from the Blu-ray player, also finally have proper low frequency impact now that I can access the .1 on the soundtrack, currently I’m using PCM as I’m not too sure my Sony supports DTSHD Master Audio (learning curb?) but I'll get there.
I’ve left the Velodyne SMS-1 in the chain as I have it already configured for my room and just set the crossovers in the UMC-1, sounds fine by me and I am not planning to use the UMC-1’s auto or manual EQ.

Now music, looks like using Direct is still an issue with most AVPs, and not just Emotiva as I’ve read a few posts from Denon, and Integra users with the same dilemma where Direct defeats the sub so it’s impossible to get a feel as stereo mode (which does use the sub) IMO is not as good as the BP25P
For now I’ll just use the balance outputs of BP25P to the 4BSST for critical listening by the Dynaudio Special 25s full range without a sub, not a big deal to flip a few switches on the back of the 4B as long as I do not forget to switch them back and have family members watching a movie wondering why there is no dialogue or sound up front.

[Phil A]

Yes it is tough having multiple users (I don't).  Before I went to the current set-up, I had a set of cables from the pre/pro for the left and right channel and a set of cables from the preamp for the left and right channel.  I'd hook one up for music and when I went to watch a movie, I would swap them.  Was a bit of a pain crawling back there.  With the current set-up and HT bypass no issue.

[rob80b]

Hi Phil

I’ve no qualms (yet), taking the Velodyne SMS-1/SPL1500R out of the loop (no extra crossover and electronics) for "critcal music listening", having just the BCD-1/BP25P/4BSST (all balanced connections) and running the Dynaudio Special 25s full range was actually a treat to listen to even without the sub, IMHO opinion much better than direct or stereo through the AVP, Bryston just does it that much better.
That last octave will be missed on large orchestral works, and Mickey Hart’s “Planet Drum” track 7 didn’t shake the foundations this morning but other than that I should be ok for at least 75% of my music listening.

Robert
Toronto, Ontario

[Phil A]

The Rel subs mean I don't have a problem with the bass no matter which source I'm playing as I have both connections going to them.  I do like the solution that Marantz has with their receivers and processors.  It lets one chose a 'mixed' setting for music and movies where it plays the sub for movies and not for music.  I have it that way in the bedroom system.  The secondary basement system I just leave the sub on with the Onkyo and however it defines the speakers doing the set-up.  That's primarily the reason I went to Rels in the first place.  For pure HT, there are subs that can get you more output for the money but don't blend in as well for music.  At first I didn't want to move away from an all in one processor but the way HT technology changes, I decided that a 2-channel preamp with HT Bypass is best for me.  While I don't expect to be in my current house more than a couple of years, if I had to do it all over again, I'd just have a 2-channel main system upstairs and a dedicated HT in the secondary basement system.  I just did not have a finished basement to start with and started with the all in one concept and then finished the basement as more of a recreation area with a big (88 inch screen) than a distinct HT space.

[rob80b]

Finally got around to a simple solution incorporating my sub for critical music listening, as I’m using a Velodyne SMS-1 to manage room correction for the lower frequencies it was just a matter of using the unbalanced outs from the BP25P to the SMS-1 while running the mains full range from the balanced connections on the 4BSST, I just created a different preset on SMS-1 with a lower crossover and new EQ.
For HT and casual music listening the balanced sub out from the AVP goes to the balanced input on the SMS-1 with the mains run unbalanced to the Bryston 4BSST.
Still need to physically do the switching at the back of the 4B for the inputs but it’s worth the compromise for better sound and I now have the use of my sub when using the BP25.
Having connections from two different sources connected simultaneously does not appear to cause any apparent electrical problems, although I do take to only have only one pre powered on at a time.

Also I did give the Emotiva UMC-1 its fair chance at possibly replacing the BP25 or even adding a pre-amp which incorporated HT direct with sub, but just when I thought the sound was acceptable, switching back to the BP25 showed that you get what you pay for, while the Emotiva comes across fine for HT and casual listening the Bryston returns a naturalism and sophistication to the overall sound.

So another idea for James and Bryston, maybe a standalone HT direct with sub “switch box” to accommodate the BP20/25 and 26s and the next generation pre-amp BP27 to include one.

Robert

[SHV]

"That is of course until I can afford a SP3.0."
******
The SP3 was my solution.

Steve