[JohnR]

I bought one of these on eBay for the princely sum of $22. Including postage and a wallwart... Mostly, I was just curious, but also I was wondering if I might use it with this (since I would need to buy 4 of them in that case). It's quite tiny. In extensive listening tests (about 10 minutes) I preferred it over the Muse TDA1543 DAC. The treble is not quite right but I prefer that to the mids not being right. There's not a lot to see inside, a board with SMD components, inc the DAC chip, an 8414 and some other chip which I assume is for the optical in.

I need to set up a little Apple TV system to try out stuff like this.

[wushuliu]

I bought one of these on eBay for the princely sum of $22. Including postage and a wallwart... Mostly, I was just curious, but also I was wondering if I might use it with this (since I would need to buy 4 of them in that case). It's quite tiny. In extensive listening tests (about 10 minutes) I preferred it over the Muse TDA1543 DAC. The treble is not quite right but I prefer that to the mids not being right. There's not a lot to see inside, a board with SMD components, inc the DAC chip, an 8414 and some other chip which I assume is for the optical in.

I need to set up a little Apple TV system to try out stuff like this.

Not an expert but I think it helps that Muse went all smd's on that board. Looks like they're stepping things up!

[JohnR]

The CS4344 is so small I can hardly see it... but it looks like it wouldn't be too hard to tap off the output caps (on the DAC side). I might try that. Also got a better PSU on the way.

I was wondering if I could put an I2S signal into it but found a better option for that:

  http://www.digilentinc.com/Products/Detail.cfm?NavPath=2,401,529&Prod=PMOD-I2S

[JohnR]

Another cheap unit using the CS4344:

  http://hifiduino.wordpress.com/2011/06/23/inside-fiio-d3/

There's an opamp on the output here though. The Muse doesn't have one... I don't think, I better have another look.

[lacro]

I bought one of these on eBay for the princely sum of $22. Including postage and a wallwart... Mostly, I was just curious, but also I was wondering if I might use it with this (since I would need to buy 4 of them in that case). It's quite tiny. In extensive listening tests (about 10 minutes) I preferred it over the Muse TDA1543 DAC. The treble is not quite right but I prefer that to the mids not being right. There's not a lot to see inside, a board with SMD components, inc the DAC chip, an 8414 and some other chip which I assume is for the optical in.

I need to set up a little Apple TV system to try out stuff like this.

Hi John...
 Being new to Cheap and Cheerful HiFi. I wonder where this little unit fits in a system? Is it a suitable replacement DAC for a PC sound card? I am curious where you see it's best use?

Thanks,

Lacro

[JohnR]

Hi Lacro, anything that generates a coax or optical digital signal can be plugged in into it. I'm currently testing it with the optical out from my iMac. It doesn't have a USB input so for PC use you would need to have a digital out on the PC.

I'm mostly just curious, I'm interested in the "trickle down" effect and the CS 4344 is a low-cost version of the CS4398. I just find it hard to believe you can even buy a DAC for this little. However connecting it to an Apple TV (which has optical digital out, but no analog out) would be a good use for it. The other reason I mentioned above is that I might need four for an active crossover experiment.

Currently trying Auricaps on the outputs:

[lacro]

Thanks John...
 I am intrigued by all this cheap audio gear, especially T-amps. I have a couple of things I am wanting to try.

I recently put together a boom box to use in my basement, garage, outdoors, etc. I used a Sure amp with Tripath 2024, and a couple of 91 db 6x9 2 way car speakers. This thing is amazing to all that hear it. I have been mostly using it with an old Creative MP3 player which sounds very good, and can be driven loud enough. However, when I use my Dell Studio XPS desktop PC as the input, even though it only has motherboard sound, and no dedicated sound card, it sounds great, and plays much louder.

 I assume the integrated sound card on the PC has a much better DAC than the MP3 player.
 So that being the case, Is there any way to bypass the MP3 player DAC, and feed the Digital signal to an external (cheap) DAC? I know I am probably asking for the impossible, but it's worth asking. 

 I have another work around for better sound with my boombox that I will probably resort to, but I need a suggestion for a USB DAC. I just bought an 11.5" notebook with windows 7 and Intel I3 chip. It only has USB, HDMI, and headphones out, no optical on this unit. I tried it on my nearfield desktop audio system, which has a PE DT100A amp driving a pair of older Paradigm Atoms. The
on board sound from (headphone out) the Mini laptop is very good, but not as good as the desktop.
I did this to do an AB comparison of the 2 computers DACs

 After my long winded explanation, what I am looking for is a (cheap and cheerful) USB DAC that will improve the sound of my laptop so I can use it to input my boombox with good sound from stored media as well as streaming Pandora.

 Any suggestions are appreciated....

Larry

My "Cheap & Cheerful" Boombox:






 

[srb]

Does the boombox run on battery power or AC?  If it's powered by AC, you might also consider an Apple Airport Express.  The previous generation (A1264) used the CS4344 DAC chip and the new Airport Express (with Apple TV form factor) uses the very similar AKM4420.

If the boombox is run on AC and the outdoor use is within range of your wireless router, you can get pretty good sound from the analog out of the Airport Express without needing to have the laptop in proximity or physically connected and it could also be conveniently controlled from an iPhone or Android phone.

Steve

[lacro]

Does the boombox run on battery power or AC?  If it's powered by AC, you might also consider an Apple Airport Express.  The previous generation (A1264) used the CS4344 DAC chip and the new Airport Express (with Apple TV form factor) uses the very similar AKM4420.

If the boombox is run on AC and the outdoor use is within range of your wireless router, you can get pretty good sound from the analog out of the Airport Express without needing to have the laptop in proximity or physically connected and it could also be conveniently controlled from an iPhone or Android phone.

Steve

Steve,
 Thanks for the Airport Express suggestion. Currently I am using AC to power the Boombox amp, but 12V is my goal either from a LI battery pack or automobile power port. The reason I bought the little notebook was to use as a multi use computer that is not much bigger than a tablet, and has a keyboard.  I can use it while camping/traveling for everything from watching movies, TV, internet via WiMax or WiFi, plus a source for mobile music, etc.
 I like to listen to Pandora, and be able to "vote" on what I like/dislike, and change my stations which is another reason for the computer. Also, it's useable both AC or Battery. I don't have or need a smart phone. I use a prepaid phone that costs me $8 a month. I avoid fixed high $ monthly payments (cheap and cheerful)
 However, your recommendation would work great, especially if I had a smart phone to control the AE. I guess I am stuck in the dark ages of technology for the near future, but it's more by choice than necessity.
 Any suggestions for a USB DAC (cheap) that is powered by USB?

Again,
Thanks for your suggestion...
Larry

[srb]

Any suggestions for a USB DAC (cheap) that is powered by USB?

Not that I have personal experience with, but there are a number of DAC boards with a USB input on eBay from Muse as well as other companies.

Here is a Muse with CS4344 similar to the one JohnR is using, but also has a CM108AH USB receiver, This one is not powered by USB, but runs on 6 -30VDC (12V-18VDC recommended), so it could use the same power source as the amplifier board:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/MUSE-Mini-24Bit-192Khz-Coaxial-Optical-USB-Input-DAC-Headphone-Out-66-60mm-/221007958260?pt=US_Home_Audio_Amplifiers_Preamps&hash=item337519d0f4

Steve

[JohnR]

Nice find Steve Hadn't seen that one.

[lacro]

This does look interesting, sounds like what I am looking for, especially with 3 way input. I don't know anything about DAC chips. Does anyone have experience with a DAC that uses this chip?

 I don't see any mounting screw holes on this board. How do you mount this type board? I kind of wish it was in a box already, so it could be used with different sources. It seems a waste to mount it in my BB and not be able to use it elsewhere.

 Here's another dumb question: When outputting audio from the PC via USB, is the PC internal sound processing, and internal DAC bypassed? If so how do you control volume?

 When you buy from these China Direct suppliers, is there duty applied to the purchase? Also, how long does it normally take to receive?

Sorry for all the dumb nubee questions.....

Larry

[srb]

I don't see any mounting screw holes on this board. How do you mount this type board? I kind of wish it was in a box already, so it could be used with different sources. It seems a waste to mount it in my BB and not be able to use it elsewhere.

I just assumed you were looking for something to mount in the boombox, but you're right, I don't see any mounting holes either, so it looks like the board is meant to slide into a case with internal groove?  For $20 more, the unit is available in a black or silver case.
http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=m570.l2736&_nkw=MUSE+Mini+24Bit+192Khz+Coaxial+Optical+USB+Input+DAC+Headphone+Out

Here's another dumb question: When outputting audio from the PC via USB, is the PC internal sound processing, and internal DAC bypassed? If so how do you control volume?

Yes, the PC's internal DAC is bypassed.  If you're not using a volume control on a boombox, preamp or integrated amplifier, then the volume control within the music player software (iTunes, J.River, Media Player, etc.) will have to be used.

When you buy from these China Direct suppliers, is there duty applied to the purchase? Also, how long does it normally take to receive?

This vendor quotes 10 to 15 business days to the US.  I have only ordered some very small iPod accessories that were shipped in a padded envelope from a different vendor in China, which took about 3 weeks total and appeared in my mailbox and there were no duty charges.  I don't know if a larger package like this is subject to charges.  I'm sure there are a number of eBay purchasers on the forum who have purchased similar items shipped to the US that can comment.


There are some alternative DACs that can be sourced locally, such as the Audioengine D1 ($169) or the NuForce uDAC-2 ($119), but even though Cheap and Cheerful, are 2X+ to 3X+ the cost of the Muse.

They both have 2 inputs (Audioengine has USB and Optical, NuForce has USB and Coaxial) and volume controls.  Because power for either of these is via USB, if you are using the Audioengine's Optical input or the NuForce's Coaxial input, you must still provide USB power either from a computer or a small AC USB power adapter which is not included.

Steve

[lacro]

Steve, Thanks for taking the time to explain. I am in the process of upgrading my audio equipment, and "getting my feet wet" with the BB project will help me decide how far I want to take this hobby. I think I'm addicted already
 I didn't see the same unit in a box for $20 more (I did look for it). that's a no- brainer!
 When you say the music player software can control the volume, I guess I don't understand? Does that mean the volume controls on the keyboard still control volume? Is the music player using the onboard sound card, and acting like a preamp controlling volume but bypassing the cards Dac?
 My main desire using the laptop is streaming Pandora which is not controlled by a music player. How would I control volume in this situation?
 Do I need a USB preamp Dac?

Larry

[srb]

Larry,

The link I posted above returns 8 items, 6 of which are the Muse DAC in a case for $49.99 and 2 are the previously linked board-only for $29.99! (?).  Anyway, here is a direct link to one of them:  http://www.ebay.com/itm/MUSE-Mini-24Bit-192Khz-Coaxial-Optical-USB-Input-DAC-Headphone-Out-Black-/170868335061?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item27c88be1d5

The volume control on the keyboard controls the Master Volume of Windows' internal soundcard/DAC volume, but does not adjust the external USB DAC volume.  Therefore if you're not using a DAC or DAC/preamp with a physical volume control (like the Audioengine or NuForce models for example), then you will have to adjust the volume with application's volume slider and won't be able to utilize the keyboard volume keys.

If you were using a media player like iTunes, J.River or Windows Media Player you would use the volume slider in those applications.  If you are using Pandora you would need to use the volume slider within Pandora's web application.



Steve

[lacro]

Steve,
 I meant that I was looking for the finished box myself after you posted the board only, but I didn't see one when I looked. However, I did see it after you posted it. Sorry for my confusing post
 Ok I get how the software/web volume slider would work, thanks..

Larry