[Cheeseboy]

We still have some Xebra sedans.    We could help you become a wine wine enthusiest if you are so inclined.  We are working on bring the Alias to production soon.  That car appears to be more your speed. 

[Danny Richie]

We still have some Xebra sedans.    We could help you become a wine wine enthusiest if you are so inclined.  We are working on bring the Alias to production soon.  That car appears to be more your speed.

That Alias looks great. You guys will have to get the price down though for me to bite. That thing is nealy $40,000.

[Cheeseboy]

Perhaps we can work out a trade. 

I'll sell you the kit.  Just install the battery and the BMS.

The Sonocap upgrade is coming soon.

We are working on lower cost.  It is only a 3 seater.

[jtwrace]

How can I get in on this action? 

I about $hit when I went to the Zap website and quickly read the name of the President.   

http://www.zapworld.com/management

[nickd]

You might be suprised to find out that more than a few designers of great sounding gear are titans of other industrys.  Some extreemly high tech. They get their creative juices flowing by designing gear for music playback. However, making a living selling gear to audiophiles is not as easy as one would think

We're a thrifty lot

[Cheeseboy]

Nice grab.  But that is not the same Gary Dodd of Dodd Audio fame.  If it was I would have one awesome powered system at my house. 

However when it comes to building great cars he is in the same ballbark.  Gary is working to secure a manufacturing facility for ZAP here in the US. 

Wish him luck in creating some new US jobs.

[jtwrace]

Nice grab.  But that is not the same Gary Dodd of Dodd Audio fame.  If it was I would have one awesome powered system at my house. 

However when it comes to building great cars he is in the same ballbark.  Gary is working to secure a manufacturing facility for ZAP here in the US. 

Wish him luck in creating some new US jobs.

Yes, I know.  That's why I'm laughing above after I quickly read the name. 

[Danny Richie]

I like the Red one with the big beefy back tire on it.

And I like kits. 

[Danny Richie]

I decided to split the topic and give the electric car discussion its own thread.

Carry on... 

[HAL]

WOW!  Like the red one with the big rear tire a lot! 

If the price comes down and the range goes up slightly above the 100mile mark this is a possibility! 

[Cheeseboy]

She is a beauty!

The ZAP Alias with the big fat Cooper on the back is built to Nascar spec in terms of roll bar and safety.  It is full race.  The suspension is harder than Chinese Math. There is power nothin in it.  It was that car that got Al Unser Jr. interested in driving the car for us in the Progressive Automotive Insurance X-Prize competition.    I think we averaged 110 miles a charge in that competition. 
 

[Guy 13]

I decided to split the topic and give the electric car discussion its own thread.

Carry on... 

Hi Danny and all Audio Circle members.
When I go back to (Montreal, Quebec) Canada in the year 2020 to retire,
I hope by then, they will have electric cars with 500 miles autonomy (Cruzing range) with over night charging time from any standard 120V wall outlet and a sticker price of 20,000 USD.
I don't think I am dreaming.
I think this is possible, especially if the arabs keep rising their price of crude oil, that will motivate the american car industry to work harder and come up with something interesting.
The only thing that will motivate the consumers to buy electric cars is high price of oil and low purchase price for those cars.
My only concern is :
What happen when it -30F outside, this happen quite often in Montreal, Canada. I even saw one time -39F.
At those temperatures, all the batteries cannot give all their stored energy.
Guy 13
 

[Cheeseboy]

Guy, I hope your dream comes true.  In 2008 with gas at $4.00 per gallon people got out of thier SUVs.  I think someone needs to build the Volkwagon of electric cars.  I hope it is ZAP.

[jtwrace]

She is a beauty!

The ZAP Alias with the big fat Cooper on the back is built to Nascar spec in terms of roll bar and safety. 

What do you mean?

[Danny Richie]

I think someone needs to build the Volkwagon of electric cars.  I hope it is ZAP.

That is exactly true. That is exactly what is needed to change the industry. And let's face it, those really high oil prices are just a matter of time.

[HT cOz]

From a national energy standpoint it makes no sense to build electric cars until every car on the road is a hybrid. 

Batteries are obviosly in short supply and using so many for one car is not as wise as to spread them out in the fleet as hybrids. 

In this very simple model you can see that two hybrids offset the savings from 1 electric car.  I think that it is obvious that you could build many more hybrids than just 2 with the batteries from an electric car?




I guess we have to be honest this isn't about doing the right thing for the world or our country it's about creating a product for a niche market. 

The way this is going to play out is simple, the US is the consumer with ability to consume less and we will as the developing world consumes more.  Just think about it, what is your sensitivity to consuming 10 gallons less per month?  Now think about the guy in the developing world buying a scooter or Tata car for the first time.  Those 10 gallons are a life changer.  Like so many things for the US we won't do this the smart way we will be forced into change.

Cheers,
Robert

[HT cOz]

So what would a national policy look like that really addressed the problem (if there is one).  Think about this tax gasoline at $5/gallon and once a year return the money back to the people in the form of a check/tax return.  Let the car manufactures make whatever the market demands no CAFE.  People who use gas more efficiently will collect and people who don't will pay.  This will drive everyone who is sensitive to the price of gasoline (Non Rich) to use less.  But still alow the market to produce anything that is demanded (SUV, Sports Cars, whatever).

This model would work for reducing consumption of petro, carbon, whatever.

However, the fat cats in DC can't consume the money in the tax and therefore it will never happen.

[Danny Richie]

There are a lot of other advantages that most people don't see.

And for a trip that is several hundred miles there are gas and diesel burning vehicles that out perform the hybrids easily. For instance, my old 1990 model Honda CRX got 56 miles to the gallon. As soon as the starting and stopping are over with and you are just traveling down the highway then the hybrid is just burning fuel and lugging around a lot of extra dead weight.

If electrics are used for city driving then it gets a ton of pollution out of the cities and places where we live. It is much better for the people breathing that air that the fuels used to produce the electricity are burned far away from population. Plus electricity produced by burning coal (one of the more expensive means) that is then used to charge batteries is still a far more efficient way to travel verses burning gasoline.

Some of the same people driving electric cars also produce some of their own electricity with wind or solar right at their own house. That of course is the real solution. If each person produced even half of their own electricity needs right where they live then our energy crisis would be non-existing. It also makes more sense to produce it where it is needed rather then the added expense of moving it across the country via power lines.

Even if we are still on the grid, the cars can be charged at night when power demands are low so a large move to electric cars still does not tax the current system.

The advantages of all electric cars are way more than people realize...

[Danny Richie]

So what would a national policy look like that really addressed the problem (if there is one).  Think about this tax gasoline at $5/gallon and once a year return the money back to the people in the form of a check/tax return.  Let the car manufactures make whatever the market demands no CAFE.  People who use gas more efficiently will collect and people who don't will pay.  This will drive everyone who is sensitive to the price of gasoline (Non Rich) to use less.  But still alow the market to produce anything that is demanded (SUV, Sports Cars, whatever).

Sounds like a form of socialism to me. You can't punish people into going Green and at the same time start taking money out of the economy.

[mojave]

In 2008 with gas at $4.00 per gallon people got out of thier SUVs.

My response isn't direct at you, but your statement helps me illustrate something. I own a 1999 GMC Suburban, a 1986 Alfa Romeo Spider, and a 1999 Kawasaki KLR650. Which of these uses the least amount of fuel per person? In 2009 I drove the Suburban about 20,000 miles and averaged 6 passengers (including driver). I averaged about 16 mpg and used 208 gallons per person. The Spider gets 30 mpg. If it was used for 20,000 miles with two people it would average 333 gal per person. The KLR650 gets 48 mpg. However, for 20,000 miles it uses 417 gallons per person. If one saw these three driving down the road they would think the motorcycle is the most energy efficient. However, the Suburban with its six passengers and only 16 mpg is actually twice as efficient. 

What isn't often taken into consideration is the number of people that occupy a vehicle. Someone that drives a new 45 mpg hybrid car by himself uses more fuel per person than the retired couple that drive everywhere together in their old Buick that averages 24 mpg.

Here is a good question:  How many people do I have to average in my Suburban to be as efficient as the motorcycle?