Suppo Audio -- New Chinese EL84 PP amp for CHEAP.

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bigjppop

Suppo Audio -- New Chinese EL84 PP amp for CHEAP.
« on: 17 Dec 2009, 08:37 am »
I've found a great little amp that I think is mostly definitely worth checking out for those that are interested in cheap and cheerful HiFi.  I've posted my initial impressions over at diyaudio.com but I'll cut and paste them here for those that are interested. 

From DIYAUDIO.COM:

--Well I've finally had a chance to sit down and do some listening to this little baby and I'm very impressed. I've had it running into my Omega 3's (93 db) and so far this little amp is helping these full-range/single-driver speakers do exactly what there supposed to do. Vocals and midrange really just jump out of the soundstage and are presented with clarity and sharpness (more on that later). With these particular speakers and in my room I don't find that the Suppo has a warm/tubey sound; it has a very accurate sound.

I'm using a Red Wine Audio iMod as my source and it was a pretty low output voltage (less than 1 V as compared to most CD players putting out 2V) and this has often been a problem for me depending on the amp I'm using. This source most definitely did not have a problem with this amp. My speakers are pretty efficient (93 db) and even on low voltage from the source, I couldn't get past 12 o'clock on the volume dial in my medium sized room. I have no worries on getting the power I need from the Suppo.

I listened mostly to single acoustic instruments (love my Yo-Yo Ma CDs!) as well as some small group stuff (also mostly acoustic). Everything was bright, clear, and accurate. Like I said above, great performance with both male and female vocals (James Taylor was great, as was Norah Jones). I know these are all strong points of single-driver speakers and I think if this kind of stuff is your cup of tea (like me) you won't be disappointed.

I love a slightly warmer sound in my setup so I'm looking forward to seeing how things go when everything breaks in a little more. Everyone has told me the Omega's need 100 hrs of break in and I'm not anywhere near there yet.

One thing that troubles me ever so slightly with this setup is the amount of base I'm getting; its pretty non-existent below about 55 Hz. Now, I can't blame the amp because my speakers are only rated to go about that low so I need to try it with another pair of speakers. In addition, I was listening in a far from optimal setup as my new speakers stands are still under construction (Bubinga and Curly Maple and with luck they should look pretty awesome when there done!). As such, I have to set everything up on a kitchen table and listen that way.

I'm planning on testing the amp tonight with my Quad 12L2's to see what happens. These speakers are much less efficient (only 87 db I believe) but they have much deeper base. I'm interested to see how 8 ish watts sounds into these little guys. The Quads are probably my most favorite monitor and are the main reason I'm interested in the new EL34 offering from Suppo. 35 wpc goes a lot better with 87 db speakers.

Anyway, so far this is a GREAT little amp, especially considering the KILLER price. I've received a great big box of Russian tubes that I plan to roll into this thing soon and hopefully see how it responds to some changes. I've also got some really nice NOS Westinghouse 6922's that I love and I'm hoping to try them in here as well. Also, just won 10 6CG7 RCA blackplates on ebay for almost nothing so those should be fun to try too. I know everyone loves the cleartops but we'll see how things go with these. As an aside, pretty much all the tubes I've purchased recently have come in lots of 8 or 10 so if anyone is interested in doing a little trading please PM me. I've got several Russian driver options (and soon those 6CG7's) as well as a couple of different Russian tubes for the output side.

Anyway, more to come.

P.S. I have discovered one more quirky thing with this amp; its impossible to turn off without unplugging it. I've got to open it up again (maybe tomorrow) and see if the switch is wired incorrectly. "Always on" is not a good feature for a tube amp!  So, one more small strike when it comes to build quality. Couple loose screws, slightly bent/scratched chassis plates, and something wrong with the switch. Overall, nothing too serious. This is one of th first amps to come out of Suppo and I'm sure QC will improve down the road.

P.P.S. When I stupidly turned my amp on without speakers connected I was lucky and did not blow anything up. Thanks for the heads up!

P.P.P.S. Everything is still stock, mods are probably a couple months off for me. Too many projects on the table at the moment to mess with something that sounds good as is (except for the switch, got to fix that!).


If you made it through all that and are still interested in more you can find more info throughout these two threads:

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/tubes-valves/155057-suppo-audio-new-chinese-el84-pp-amp-cheap.html

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/tubes-valves/155238-review-suppo-audios-first-offering-el84-push-pull.html

skite30

Re: Suppo Audio -- New Chinese EL84 PP amp for CHEAP.
« Reply #1 on: 17 Dec 2009, 06:12 pm »
The 6p1 amp looks interesting. I have an old Voice of Music amp that uses that tube and I have all ways loved it. How much was the shipping I couldn't find it on the website?

bigjppop

Re: Suppo Audio -- New Chinese EL84 PP amp for CHEAP.
« Reply #2 on: 17 Dec 2009, 09:57 pm »
75 bucks to the US.  All shipping prices are listed on their website (just below the pictures of the amp) and are different depending on where in the world you find yourself.

rhing

Re: Suppo Audio -- New Chinese EL84 PP amp for CHEAP.
« Reply #3 on: 4 Jan 2010, 04:15 pm »
I also purchased the Suppo Golden Voice EL84. With some tube rolling and replacing the wiring, RCA connectors and stock volume pot, this amp is a great value. Compared to comparably priced amps like the Trends TA-10.X T-amp and Mini-Watt, this amp is capable of providing a huge, deep soundstage and more dynamic slam. I purchased a matched quad of Genelex Gold Lion EL84 reissues and a pair of matched OS RCA clear top 6FQ7 (6CG7) tubes, and this amp beat out my Virtue Two Class T amp with 130W/30V PSU and my Onix SP3. Needless to say, I sold those two amps via Audiogon. In fact, I used some of the leftover cash to purchase a pair of good condition Klipsch Forte IIs. I upgraded the crossover and tweeter diaphragms with upgrade kits from Bob Crites.



I would only recommend this amp to those who can safely work with tube amplifiers, since the stock pot had a problem with channel imbalance and required replacement. Also, I had to install a DPDT power switch and fuse holder and fuse for safety reasons. My plan is to install a set of Ampohm 0.1uF Tin foil/paper in oil coupling caps and a Mundorf M-Tube 20uF film cap in the power supply. This should take this little bargain amp over the top.

Mariusz

Re: Suppo Audio -- New Chinese EL84 PP amp for CHEAP.
« Reply #4 on: 4 Jan 2010, 05:12 pm »
Great to hear about another great little amp.
It might be worth to try it out but.....
Safty and other minor problems could stop this company from expension and flavor of the month club.

If you do not mind - can you tell us how much those changes/mods add to the original cost? And what is the skill level required to perform these mods?

Thanks for your input

Mariusz

rhing

Re: Suppo Audio -- New Chinese EL84 PP amp for CHEAP.
« Reply #5 on: 4 Jan 2010, 09:49 pm »
No problem. Here are the upgrades and costs:

Matched quad, Genelex Gold Lion EL84s.......................$80 (w/20% off Parts Connexion sale)
Matched pair, RCA clear top 6FQ7..............................$30
Pair, RCA connectors, gold plated brass, Teflon.............$10
2 ft. Mundorf Silver-Gold wire................................... ...$8 (w/20% off Parts Connexion sale)
4 Ampohm Tin foil/PIO 0.1uF coupling capacitors...........$75
1 Mundorf M-Tube film capacitor.............................. ..$20 (w/20% off Parts Connexion sale)
Acme IEC receptacle............................. .................. $6
Acme fuse holder................................. ....................$3
50k SMT stepped attenuator............................. ........$15 (eBay seller gigaworks)

Suppo Golden Voice EL84 tube amplifier.......................$130 (introductory price inc. shipping)

TOTAL.................................. ................................$377

Even before the mods/upgrades, this amp sounded better than the amps I mentioned before. These parts just make it a much better amp, especially the tubes.

As for skill level, you need to know how to work safely with tube amp circuits. If you have to ask, "How do I do this?," don't bother. If you know how to work safely with tube amp circuits, then you just need to know basic soldering. The stepped attenuator comes with connection instructions.

For the signal wiring from the RCA input jacks to the stepped attenuator, I twisted the pair of the Mundorf wires. For the ground wires from the RCA connectors to the stepped attenuatir, I twisted a pair of AWG 24 Teflon-insulated Silver-plated Copper solid core wires. This replaced the cheap stock shielded Copper stranded wires.

bigjppop

Re: Suppo Audio -- New Chinese EL84 PP amp for CHEAP.
« Reply #6 on: 4 Jan 2010, 10:08 pm »
Rich:

Thanks for the detailed parts breakdown!  Would you care to post some internal shots as well?  I'd love to see "your work."

rhing

Re: Suppo Audio -- New Chinese EL84 PP amp for CHEAP.
« Reply #7 on: 4 Jan 2010, 10:48 pm »
I'll snap photos once I install the Ampohm and Mundorf caps. The Tube Store accidentally sent me 1.0uF Amphom caps instead of 0.1uF caps. They should arrive today via UPS. I'll probably install them next weekend.

jkelly

Re: Suppo Audio -- New Chinese EL84 PP amp for CHEAP.
« Reply #8 on: 6 Jan 2010, 02:42 am »
I'm in - how long is delivery to NJ?

Jeff

Mariusz

Re: Suppo Audio -- New Chinese EL84 PP amp for CHEAP.
« Reply #9 on: 6 Jan 2010, 03:06 am »
Thanks for detail info Rich.
I would probably jump on it but spend it all on some
SD drivers and other toys.  So for now, I'll just follow this thread closely and see how it developes.

Cheers

Mariusz

jkelly

Re: Suppo Audio -- New Chinese EL84 PP amp for CHEAP.
« Reply #10 on: 20 Jan 2010, 12:44 am »
Just received mine.  Arrived 100% via DHL.
I didn't install the stock tubes - had Mullard EL84 and RCA 6CG7 Clear Tops on the shelve.
So $500 in tubes in a $200 amp!

With just a few hours I really like this amp.  Initially notice specific location of instruments
and has nice tone. Soundstage is more centered between the speakers as opposed to really wide.
Looking forward to break-in.

Just makes it on power for my speakers.

More to come.

Jeff

bigjppop

Re: Suppo Audio -- New Chinese EL84 PP amp for CHEAP.
« Reply #11 on: 20 Jan 2010, 07:03 am »
Just received mine.  Arrived 100% via DHL.
I didn't install the stock tubes - had Mullard EL84 and RCA 6CG7 Clear Tops on the shelve.
So $500 in tubes in a $200 amp!

With just a few hours I really like this amp.  Initially notice specific location of instruments
and has nice tone. Soundstage is more centered between the speakers as opposed to really wide.
Looking forward to break-in.

Just makes it on power for my speakers.

More to come.

Jeff

That's a lot of tubes to be sitting on the shelf!  I'm glad you're enjoying this amp.