[lcd54222]

All, thanks for the replies!  I'm not familiar with Octave products, will check 'em out.  Yes, the Merrill's are out of my price range - Merrill sent a pair of his Element 116s to our club (San Francisco Audiophile Society) to try out - they are amazing.  Two folks in our club bought pairs of the 116s.  (We also had Clayton on one of our Zoom events which was awesome).  The M5 Sapphires replaced and outclassed a much more expensive pair of speakers and I haven't looked back - they do most everything very well.  I have a bigger listening room now, so I kinda wish I had the M3s, but I have a nice sub that blends well, so it's not a priority.

[Audiosaurusrex]

All, thanks for the replies!  I'm not familiar with Octave products, will check 'em out.  Yes, the Merrill's are out of my price range - Merrill sent a pair of his Element 116s to our club (San Francisco Audiophile Society) to try out - they are amazing.  Two folks in our club bought pairs of the 116s.  (We also had Clayton on one of our Zoom events which was awesome).  The M5 Sapphires replaced and outclassed a much more expensive pair of speakers and I haven't looked back - they do most everything very well.  I have a bigger listening room now, so I kinda wish I had the M3s, but I have a nice sub that blends well, so it's not a priority.

lcd,
I was not familiar with Octave either. I was initally leaning towards the Raven line but was not enamoured with the return policy and not getting the feeling they would handle those big woofers. I had a dealer close to me that allowed me to demo the V40se which opened my eyes. I would of kept it because it was so good but wanted to see what a class A amp would do. This was pricy for me but I can say at least on the amp side I am done. The thing about the Octave line is that it does not have a really "tubey" sound if that is what your after. You get amazing clarity, dynamics, soundstage and depth. It has the "omph" to drive anything really and depending on your room and tube choices many options for sound tweaking.
Good Luck.

[DBT AUDIO]

I have tried a few First Watts and Pass Labs and posted my impressions in the Spatial and First Watt thread.  There is more feedback from others there as well.  That being said I am now using my M3S with a Gryphon Diablo 120 or Elekit TU-8600S and both thoroughly beat the the Class A amps mention below.

loki7177, Do you still have the Gryphon Diablo 120 paired with your M3S?  I have the Luxman L-509x paired with my X5s.  I like it, but was curious if the Diablo 120 would outperform the Luxman?

[Mr. Big]

loki7177, Do you still have the Gryphon Diablo 120 paired with your M3S?  I have the Luxman L-509x paired with my X5s.  I like it, but was curious if the Diablo 120 would outperform the Luxman?

How can anyone tell you if one amp can beat your current one? You have to have them both in your room and in your system. I think with Audiophiles what we own will beat anything until we buy something newer...LOL! The curse of Audio hobby. But to be serious in 40 years I have learned one thing when you own something that is really good you hit the home run, after that, you change the spice and flavor of your system. If you want to change the sound of your system and much cheaper way is by changing the power cords. Sometimes it is good to stop worrying about something being better and just enjoy the wonderful system you have put together and all of us for that matter, it is very easy to kill the enjoyment of this hobby and burn out. I've known many who have and sold everything and are not out of the hobby, and few it was good for their health, they were obsessive over every little thing and always if something was better than what they owned. Then there were my tube roller friends, they lost it also had more tubes with the cost more than the amps and preamps combined. Then they never liked any of them 100%, they always wanted something that one set could do compared to the other set, told them you need to go to solid-state and be done with this insanity. LOL!

[Tyson]

How can anyone tell you if one amp can beat your current one? You have to have them both in your room and in your system. I think with Audiophiles what we own will beat anything until we buy something newer...LOL! The curse of Audio hobby. But to be serious in 40 years I have learned one thing when you own something that is really good you hit the home run, after that, you change the spice and flavor of your system. If you want to change the sound of your system and much cheaper way is by changing the power cords. Sometimes it is good to stop worrying about something being better and just enjoy the wonderful system you have put together and all of us for that matter, it is very easy to kill the enjoyment of this hobby and burn out. I've known many who have and sold everything and are not out of the hobby, and few it was good for their health, they were obsessive over every little thing and always if something was better than what they owned. Then there were my tube roller friends, they lost it also had more tubes with the cost more than the amps and preamps combined. Then they never liked any of them 100%, they always wanted something that one set could do compared to the other set, told them you need to go to solid-state and be done with this insanity. LOL!

You are so right.  This is why I stopped selling my current amp to fund new purchases.  I just save up a bit longer to buy a new amp and still keep my old amp(s).  This lets me 'amp roll' to my heart's content.  I've got a bunch of different tube amps and even a couple different SS amps and I just put in whatever I am feeling like that week.  It's more expensive up front, but it saves me money in the long run....

[DBT AUDIO]

How can anyone tell you if one amp can beat your current one? You have to have them both in your room and in your system. I think with Audiophiles what we own will beat anything until we buy something newer...LOL! The curse of Audio hobby. But to be serious in 40 years I have learned one thing when you own something that is really good you hit the home run, after that, you change the spice and flavor of your system.

I agree with you 100% concerning the latter part of the question I posed.  I should have phrased my question differently.  I really want to know if he ever compared my Luxman with his Gryphon.  I know I still would need to hear any component in my setup to compare for myself.  We all ask questions in forums because we want to get opinions because it’s hard to obtain a product for auditioning unless we buy it.  The two integrated amps I am most interested in is my current Luxman and Gryphon.  I would like to hear a Gryphon integrated and get impressions from a Gryphon owner who has paired it with Spatials.  I could live with the Luxman, for sure, but I would like to settle my curiosity between the two brands.

[Early B.]

You are so right.  This is why I stopped selling my current amp to fund new purchases.  I just save up a bit longer to buy a new amp and still keep my old amp(s).  This lets me 'amp roll' to my heart's content.  I've got a bunch of different tube amps and even a couple different SS amps and I just put in whatever I am feeling like that week.  It's more expensive up front, but it saves me money in the long run....

Amp rolling??? Geez, Tyson -- if audiophilia was a disease, you'd be one breath from death.

[Daryl Zero]

Amp rolling??? Geez, Tyson -- if audiophilia was a disease, you'd be one breath from death.

That's what I was thinking too. Plus he needs to build a new wing for his house, the vintage amp wing.
Tyson, I'm happy to work as your amp butler showing the guests around the amp wing and describing the age, type and sound of each amp.
I'll work for tubes.

[DBT AUDIO]

That's what I was thinking too. Plus he needs to build a new wing for his house, the vintage amp wing.
Tyson, I'm happy to work as your amp butler showing the guests around the amp wing and describing the age, type and sound of each amp.
I'll work for tubes.

Hilarious!!

[Tyson]

That's what I was thinking too. Plus he needs to build a new wing for his house, the vintage amp wing.
Tyson, I'm happy to work as your amp butler showing the guests around the amp wing and describing the age, type and sound of each amp.
I'll work for tubes.

You jest, but I do have all my extra amps on display in a spare room downstairs.... Hahaha.

[mkrawcz]

Amp rolling??? Geez, Tyson -- if audiophilia was a disease, you'd be one breath from death.

Why not? I have 10 different amps I cycle through? 

[TrapJaw]

morganc makes an interesting comment about something I've been thinking about.   I recently moved to SW Florida.  Obviously, the heat and an humidity are oppressive.  Is a class A amp practical given the heat the amp produces?  Don't think it would have an affect on sound just the electrical bill and comfort.  Or, is this a stupid question? 

Agreed, I am a tube lover but the heat here prohibits tubes at the moment, so I have been very happy with the Digital Audio Company 2 Cherry and now i have upgraded to the Megaschino and combined with a tube pre-amp is a wonderful combo.

[Mr. Big]

lcd,
I was not familiar with Octave either. I was initally leaning towards the Raven line but was not enamoured with the return policy and not getting the feeling they would handle those big woofers. I had a dealer close to me that allowed me to demo the V40se which opened my eyes. I would of kept it because it was so good but wanted to see what a class A amp would do. This was pricy for me but I can say at least on the amp side I am done. The thing about the Octave line is that it does not have a really "tubey" sound if that is what your after. You get amazing clarity, dynamics, soundstage and depth. It has the "omph" to drive anything really and depending on your room and tube choices many options for sound tweaking.
Good Luck.

I saw Ravens videos and I beware of them, any company that slams others and make claims not founded in fact is a company I stay away from, also, you have to look at the resale value on gear you buy, one day you will sell it, unless it is your last system.

[AllanS]

You are so right.  This is why I stopped selling my current amp to fund new purchases.  I just save up a bit longer to buy a new amp and still keep my old amp(s).  This lets me 'amp roll' to my heart's content.  I've got a bunch of different tube amps and even a couple different SS amps and I just put in whatever I am feeling like that week.  It's more expensive up front, but it saves me money in the long run....

Yeah.  Why not.  People collect all kinds of stuff.  I bought a motorcycle awhile back and immediately started fussing over selling the one I had, which I liked.  My wife told me to keep both  because she didn't want to listen to me B&M about wishing I still had the old one.  Over the next eighteen months, before selling both, I put almost exactly the same number of miles on each.  Different stuff for different moods.  I suppose audio isn't any different.

[Tyson]

One great SS amp and one great tube amp will cover most needs for most people, IMO. 

My amps got out of hand because I have 2 different speakers and they are both 97db efficient, which opened up the very cool world of single ended amps.