AudioCircle

Industry Circles => Daedalus Audio => Topic started by: Daedalus Audio on 3 Jun 2014, 02:30 am

Title: New Trim rings!
Post by: Daedalus Audio on 3 Jun 2014, 02:30 am

(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=100449)

New Trim Ring, looks great and improves the sound! More info soon.

Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: vinyl_lady on 3 Jun 2014, 02:52 am
No teasing allowed. Tell us more, please.
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: Daedalus Audio on 3 Jun 2014, 02:37 pm
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=100460)


these are prototypes with paint instead of the nice anodized finish they will have.
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: vinyl_lady on 3 Jun 2014, 05:17 pm
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=100460)


these are prototypes with paint instead of the nice anodized finish they will have.

Very nice and another upgrade path.  8)
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: jriggy on 3 Jun 2014, 06:43 pm
What a coincidence!

Apart from my bad joke about a Marshall stack look for the 'man cave' in your cabinetry aesthetics thread...THIS is exactly what I was thinking! Great minds think alike! 

I was thinking of brass beauty rings around the drivers. Brass and your exceptional woodwork could look like a finely restored antique ship or sailboat --for lack of a better parallel.

These are going to look incredible!

Jason
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: fwinston on 3 Jun 2014, 07:25 pm
Hi Lou,

The new trim rings look phenomenal.  And, the speakers to which they're attached look, um, quite familiar! 
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: dodgealum on 3 Jun 2014, 08:11 pm
Lou:

Nice touch! Will these be retrofittable by the end user?
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: gregfisk on 3 Jun 2014, 08:12 pm
[quote these are prototypes with paint instead of the mice anodized finish they will have.
[/quote]

How much does it cost to have mice anodize the finish?  :lol:
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: Scottdazzle on 3 Jun 2014, 11:06 pm
They're beautiful! I want two.
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: Daedalus Audio on 4 Jun 2014, 12:21 am
[quote these are prototypes with paint instead of the mice anodized finish they will have.


How much does it cost to have mice anodize the finish?  :lol:
ahh, the temptation to start a pun contest.... I will resist as that would be cheesy. :wink:
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: Daedalus Audio on 4 Jun 2014, 12:23 am
Lou:

Nice touch! Will these be retrofittable by the end user?

Yes, as you know I always try to provide an upgrade path. We are making a version that is sized to fit older models.  More details soon.

thanks,
Lou
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: dodgealum on 4 Jun 2014, 04:10 pm
Lou:

That's great--glad they will be available for my DA-1.1's. Will we be able to put these on at home or do I have to box em' and ship em' back to you?
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: Daedalus Audio on 4 Jun 2014, 05:08 pm
Lou:

That's great--glad they will be available for my DA-1.1's. Will we be able to put these on at home or do I have to box em' and ship em' back to you?

We are making some that are slightly larger to fit older model drivers and the slightly larger recess on the older (pre 2012) cabinets. They will ship with extra gaskets and new screws, so that they can be fitted at home. I'll have pricing soon, these are a bit spendy but more than worthwhile even for just the sonic benefit!

likely be in the $50-$70 each range.

thanks,
lou

 
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: audiogoober on 4 Jun 2014, 10:45 pm
Very Nice.
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: vinyl_lady on 4 Jun 2014, 10:48 pm
I'll take four to fit my DA-1.1s :thumb:
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: jonbee on 4 Jun 2014, 10:57 pm
Sign me up for a couple for my DA-RMas.
I'd like them in pink to match my Hello Kitty inspired equipment cabinet, if possible.  :cyclops:
Seriously, add my name to the order list.
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: fado on 5 Jun 2014, 12:13 am
What are the sonic benefits?
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: roadkingraw on 5 Jun 2014, 03:41 am
Lou,
Am definitely interested in acquiring a pair for the Athenas.  Those look fantastic and dress the speaker up nicely.
Randy
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: audiotom on 5 Jun 2014, 10:01 pm
Lou

They look great

Do they come in black too?


can I have them done to the Ulysses you are doing the V2 upgrade on while they are there?

A Ulysses pick with the trim rings would be helpful

such perfect timing!

Thanks

Tom
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: audiotom on 5 Jun 2014, 10:22 pm
Lou

They look great

Do they come in black too?


can I have them done to the Ulysses you are doing the V2 upgrade on while they are there?

such perfect timing!

A Ulysses photo or something in Cherry with the trim rings would be helpful, evn if it's just laid on it's side and the ring resting on it



Thanks

Tom
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: audiotom on 6 Jun 2014, 03:06 pm

Lou

will there be trim rings on the mid range drivers too?
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: vinyl_lady on 6 Jun 2014, 03:10 pm
Lou

will there be trim rings on the mid range drivers too?

Not Lou, but I asked him that question on the phone and he said woofers only.
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: Daedalus Audio on 27 Jun 2014, 08:46 pm
 The trim rings should be done in about two weeks!  Looks like the cost will be $70 ea.

There is a limited run of 'retrofit' rings in this first batch. They are easily installed at home so no shipping is needed  :)
The trim rings allow us to suspend the woofer on the baffle between gaskets with an even pressure and more than twice the torque.
This is a vastly superior method than simple mechanical fastening as before, and significantly reduces distortion. Bass is more detailed and extended, midrange is fuller and more natural. To be honest I was surprised at the level of improvement and of course the look is perfect. The speaker now looks and sounds, "finished".
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: roboss38 on 27 Jun 2014, 09:38 pm
I can't wait for my Cherry Argos V.2 with new trim rings to arrive in July. They should make some sweet music with Reference 5 SE and Stereo 100.
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: minotaur on 3 Jul 2014, 10:21 pm
Which models will these trim rings be available for?
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: roadkingraw on 31 Jul 2014, 08:35 pm
Lou,
Any more word on the release of the trim rings?  I know you have a lot of irons in the fire and trying to take august off as well.
Randy
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: Daedalus Audio on 2 Aug 2014, 11:14 pm
The trim rings are in stock, but the first run of retorfit rings are spoken for, I'll be sending out invoices and shipping this coming week. It will be a couple of months before the next batch is available and I would suggest anyone interested please put in your order asap.

These are for the 8" driver which is central to ALL our models with the sole exception of the BOW subwoofer.

So far the customers have installed these report the same benefits I noticed, lower distortion tighter bass and richer, clean vocals.

thanks,
lou


Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: vinyl_lady on 2 Aug 2014, 11:28 pm
Looking forward to receiving mine.

Great seeing you in DC. I thought both rooms really sounded great. Congrats!

Laura
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: Daedalus Audio on 13 Aug 2014, 08:51 pm
We just p[ut up a video on Youtube to help with the trim ring install.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M38TFPpYoPY&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M38TFPpYoPY&feature=youtu.be)
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: Scottdazzle on 13 Aug 2014, 09:38 pm
We just p[ut up a video on Youtube to help with the trim ring install.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M38TFPpYoPY&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M38TFPpYoPY&feature=youtu.be)

PLEASE everybody, watch the video before installing the trim rings!
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: jtwrace on 13 Aug 2014, 09:45 pm
At least Lou will get some driver sales.  :lol:
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: Daedalus Audio on 14 Aug 2014, 01:48 am
At least Lou will get some driver sales.  :lol:

I sell most parts at near cost and it is a pain in the butt for me.... I do NOT want to sell drivers etc.   hopefully no one will have any problems, and if anyone has concerns beforehand PLEASE call me!!!!

thanks,
lou

Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: fwinston on 14 Aug 2014, 04:16 pm
Hi Lou,

Thanks for putting the trim ring installation video on YouTube.  It's very informative, especially the tip about where to place your hand to protect the drivers.

Warmest regards,
Frank
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: audiogoober on 14 Aug 2014, 10:46 pm
Hi Lou,

Thanks for putting the trim ring installation video on YouTube.  It's very informative, especially the tip about where to place your hand to protect the drivers.

Warmest regards,
Frank

 +1 :thumb:

Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: figcon on 15 Aug 2014, 01:47 am
A good friend of mine would say, and I agree, use a manual screw driver to install these. Better exercise anyway.
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: Daedalus Audio on 15 Aug 2014, 03:56 am
A good friend of mine would say, and I agree, use a manual screw driver to install these. Better exercise anyway.

agreed! but still guard the driver, you can slip almost as easily with a screwdriver as a screwgun
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: audiogoober on 20 Aug 2014, 02:40 am
agreed! but still guard the driver, you can slip almost as easily with a screwdriver as a screwgun

I'm excited for mine to arrive!
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: jonbee on 22 Aug 2014, 12:15 am
Just got mine today. They went on just fine. it took about 45 minutes, I used a manual screwdriver for safety. Watch the video first, follow Lou and it is pretty simple.
They look great- neatly finished.
Here's a before and after of one.  Lou provides new anodized countersunk screws that are a nice touch.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=104201)
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=104222)
As to the sound- yes, indeed, the bass through the lower mid range, which already was the best of any speaker I've owned, is quite noticeably tighter and better focused, with improved dynamic speed. I had been thinking my system was still a bit woolly in that difficult room dependent range, but the rings improved it to a welcome degree.
This does shift the tonality - just a bit less warmth, and the top end seems slightly more forward in the mix. After listening a couple more days, I consider it a very worthwhile improvement. I'm very pleased.
I can speculate this may be because of stiffening the structure in the area of the woofer mounting, or providing a harder, smoother surface for the wave launch, or both, but it seems to work.
Kudos to Lou for continuing to improve his existing models.
I've been playing around a lot with cables the last few months to fine tune the sound and am very gratified that the sound of this system just keeps getting better. Just when I think I've gotten the full measure of these speakers I find there is more that I uncover.
These V2 speakers are a joy in every way. They make listening to music a rich, delicious experience, without distractions, and take me out of audiophile mode and deeply into the pure music at every turn. Even having heard my share of speakers many times the price of these, none get me closer to the musical heart. The heirloom cabinets complete the circle.
As Lou keeps racking up "best sound" kudos, I'm very glad I ran across his work a few years ago. It is likely that after 46 years in the hobby these are the final speakers for my big system, based on their moderate size, amazing workmanship and the level of sheer pleasure that listening to music through them offers.
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: vinyl_lady on 24 Aug 2014, 03:49 pm
I installed the Trim Rings yesterday after watching the video. Nice job on the video. I needed to add a gasket to each woofer on my DA-1.1v2s to give the gap clearance recommended in the video. Installation was simple and straight forward thanks to the video. I started the new screws with a 1/8 Allen wrench and finished using a Black & Decker drill. Including the hex head bit was a nice touch. :thumb:

I agree with jonbee that the lower midrange and bass is somewhat cleaner, tightened and more focused. I think the most noticeable improvement is in the lower midrange. That may be because I have a pair of Lou's BOWs, but even with the BOWs I noticed a tightening of the bass. The Trim Rings take the sound of a great speaker to a higher level, subtle but definitely noticeable. I listened to side one of the Rhino remastered 180g vinyl of Chicago Transit Authority and the soundstage seemed wider, deeper and more focused. The percussion end to Beginnings was spectacular. (BTW, if you like CTA, the Rhino remaster is the one to have).

For the price of the Trim Rings this is a no-brainer upgrade. Plus, they look great.

(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=104319)


Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: jonbee on 24 Aug 2014, 04:03 pm
I listened to side one of the Rhino remastered 180g vinyl of Chicago Transit Authority and the soundstage seemed wider, deeper and more focused. The percussion end to Beginnings was spectacular. (BTW, if you like CTA, the Rhino remaster is the one to have).

For the price of the Trim Rings this is a no-brainer upgrade. Plus, they look great.
Thanks for the heads up on the CTA album. I've loved that since it was released. I'll look around for it.
The tightening of the lower mids adds to the overall transparency, and as you say, at a very reasonable price.
+1 on the no-brainer. :thumb:
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: audiogoober on 27 Aug 2014, 10:22 pm
Mine arrived yesterday and all went on with ease. Wow. As several other members have already mentioned.... there is a noticeable improvement in the lower end and midrange with the new rings installed. This is the case in both systems here, and not by small margins.

+1 on the no-brainer. :thumb:
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: rawhit on 1 Sep 2014, 08:54 pm
I just finished installing mine on Athena. So far my  reaction is a bit mixed :?
After installing these the grills don't fit well. They don't fall off as such but are mostly hanging from top magnetic attachment. The bottom two magnetic contacts don't directly connect because of the extra few mm added by trim ring.
Sound wise, its probably better (moved a new place and the system is in a state of flux) so will have to continue listening to form an opinion on that.
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: Scottdazzle on 1 Sep 2014, 09:08 pm
I just finished installing mine on Athena. So far my  reaction is a bit mixed :?
After installing these the grills don't fit well. They don't fall off as such but are mostly hanging from top magnetic attachment. The bottom two magnetic contacts don't directly connect because of the extra few mm added by trim ring.
Sound wise, its probably better (moved a new place and the system is in a state of flux) so will have to continue listening to form an opinion on that.

It sounds like you need to use the gaskets under the trim ring to ensure a better, tighter fit.  I'm not sure what you mean by "magnetic attachment" as these screw on mechanically.
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: vinyl_lady on 1 Sep 2014, 10:03 pm
It sounds like you need to use the gaskets under the trim ring to ensure a better, tighter fit.  I'm not sure what you mean by "magnetic attachment" as these screw on mechanically.

I think he means the magnets that hold the speaker grills in place. My recommendation is to ditch the speaker grills. His ears will thank me.
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: Daedalus Audio on 1 Sep 2014, 11:49 pm
I just finished installing mine on Athena. So far my  reaction is a bit mixed :?
After installing these the grills don't fit well. They don't fall off as such but are mostly hanging from top magnetic attachment. The bottom two magnetic contacts don't directly connect because of the extra few mm added by trim ring.
Sound wise, its probably better (moved a new place and the system is in a state of flux) so will have to continue listening to form an opinion on that.

We found that on some the grills need to be altered to fit tightly after the trim ring install.  Anyone is welcome to send them back and we will fix that at no charge.

thanks,
lou

Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: rawhit on 2 Sep 2014, 02:43 am
We found that on some the grills need to be altered to fit tightly after the trim ring install.  Anyone is welcome to send them back and we will fix that at no charge.

thanks,
lou

Thanks Lou!

Email coming your way :)
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: Roger on 3 Sep 2014, 04:39 am
The Trim rings work great! I don't know where lou comes up with these ideas. Every update he does is for the better. Thank You!
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: dodgealum on 4 Sep 2014, 07:31 pm
Picked up the trim rings at the CAF and finally got them installed on my DA-1.1 AP/V2s over Labor Day weekend. Like Laura, I needed to use one additional gasket to raise the driver a bit so that a proper seal could be formed. The video was helpful in showing how to put on the trim rings and the whole process took me about an hour or so. I decided to use a 1/8 hex wrench and do everything by hand--I didn't want to risk damage to the driver but I also found that I had a much better feel for the torque that was being applied and that I could tighten the screws more uniformly by hand. For me it was like the difference between walking a golf course and taking a cart--the cart gets you to the ball quicker but you miss seeing the nuances of how the hole lays out since you gain various perspectives as you approach your ball on foot. I was amazed at how much more securely the drivers were affixed using the trim ring as opposed to just the screws--it left me anticipating what sonic benefits might be in store. I was not disappointed, despite some initial skepticism. I am finding that the overall presentation is more focused, with cleaner vocals rising above a more controlled lower midrange/upper bass. I also hear slightly less "bloom" in the bass, leaving a slightly less romantic sound but still plenty of body. I think in my system/room, where the bass can be ever so slightly accentuated at certain frequencies, the trim rings have brought the lower registers into greater coherence with the overall sound. Overall, unlike for example the AP crossovers or V2 upgrades, the changes I am describing are pretty subtle--but they are noticeable and welcome refinements to what was already a phenomenal speaker system. Many thanks Lou for continuing to make design upgrades available to owners of your earlier loudspeaker designs. This is one of many ways in which your business model is both unique and estimable.
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: dodgealum on 6 Sep 2014, 01:53 am
Some pics with the trim rings.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=104898)

(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=104899)

(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=104900)
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: dodgealum on 11 Sep 2014, 08:47 pm
Lou: Really loving the ring thing! The more I listen the more I appreciate the benefits. I feel like the rings and the V2 upgrades offer a different set of virtues and work together to take the sound to a whole other level. I'm getting all this spatial information and extension on the top end from the V2 mods and this is being complemented by enhanced low frequency extension and clarity via the rings. I finally got a few hours to listen to some well known recordings the other day and was completely blown away. I want for nothing--thanks so much!
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: rawhit on 12 Sep 2014, 01:31 pm
I think he means the magnets that hold the speaker grills in place. My recommendation is to ditch the speaker grills. His ears will thank me.
Yup, I meant the magnets that hold the grill in place. I take off the grill while listening but otherwise leave it on. Protects the drivers from dust and I have a 1 year old who just learnt to walk and she seems less attracted towards the speakers with the grills on  :thumb:
It sounds like you need to use the gaskets under the trim ring to ensure a better, tighter fit.  I'm not sure what you mean by "magnetic attachment" as these screw on mechanically.
Hi Scott, I had to use both the gaskets (one behind the driver and one in between the driver and trim ring) to avoid the trim ring bottoming out. The driver attachment with trim does seem more secure as I was able to use a lot more torque just as Lou mentioned.
Title: Re: New Trim rings!
Post by: jonbee on 5 Oct 2014, 06:07 pm
I thought I'd give follow up on the ring installation, with a heads up.
After 6 weeks and probably 150 hours running time I went back to the speakers to re-tighten the woofer screws, and discovered that they all had "loosened" a bit. I suspect the new gaskets were gradually compressing.
I re-tightened them and the mid-bass focus seemed to improved a bit.
I guess I'll check them again in a few weeks.