AudioCircle
Industry Circles => Bryston Limited => Topic started by: zugisland on 21 Jul 2011, 10:52 pm
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James interested in the above but before I head I into a dealer wanted to know suggested msrp. Thx
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http://www.audioadvisor.com/prodinfo.asp?number=BY7BSST2
Audio advisor only sells items at MSRP. They are for those people who don't have a local retailer. That price is for ONE mono block.
Looks like 10,200 is the MSRP of the monos.
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Hmm...would the 14B be the better value?
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Hmm...would the 14B be the better value?
Not if you want monos.
D.D.
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Not if you want monos.
D.D.
Ok.
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Hmm...would the 14B be the better value?
You get what you pay for. The 7's are about $700.00 more but they have twice the power supply capacitance plus the placement benefits of the monos.
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http://www.audioadvisor.com/prodinfo.asp?number=BY7BSST2
Audio advisor only sells items at MSRP. They are for those people who don't have a local retailer. That price is for ONE mono block.
Looks like 10,200 is the MSRP of the monos.
Amazing. I bought my 7's in June of '09 for $6,750.00 for the pair from a very reputable authorized Bryston dealer. they are the exact same amps that Audio Advisor is selling for $10,200.00 2 years later.
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Amazing. I bought my 7's in June of '09 for $6,750.00 for the pair from a very reputable authorized Bryston dealer. they are the exact same amps that Audio Advisor is selling for $10,200.00 2 years later.
SST2s?
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You get what you pay for. The 7's are about $700.00 more but they have twice the power supply capacitance plus the placement benefits of the monos.
Twice the power supply capacitance...what does that mean exactly?
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Twice the power supply capacitance...what does that mean exactly?
Greater energy storage usually results in increased headroom for peak transients for most amplifiers. Increased capacitance can also further smooth the slight ripple on the power supply's DC output.
This extra capacitance might have less of an effect if one of the Torus power conditioners are used because they have transformers with energy storage technology.
Steve
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SST2s?
Yes, squared series S/N's 01850 and 01851 which means they have the latest power supply and capacitors making them identical to what is currently shipping from Bryston.
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This extra capacitance might have less of an effect if one of the Torus power conditioners are used because they have transformers with energy storage technology.
Steve
As do newer 7BSST 2, I believe.
D.D.
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Yes, squared series S/N's 01850 and 01851 which means they have the latest power supply and capacitors making them identical to what is currently shipping from Bryston.
Heh, you guys don't wanna know what I paid for my 4BSST 4 1/2 years ago...
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Greater energy storage usually results in increased headroom for peak transients for most amplifiers. Increased capacitance can also further smooth the slight ripple on the power supply's DC output.
This extra capacitance might have less of an effect if one of the Torus power conditioners are used because they have transformers with energy storage technology.
Steve
Thanks for the info. So does that mean the 14B is an inferior product?
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Let not forget that Bryston is a Canadian compnay and being such the currency translation along with the increase in copper prob chops up that cost difference !...The US dollar has dropped about 30% vs the Canadian currency in that time frame thus accounting for that price difference over the last few years.
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Thanks for the info. So does that mean the 14B is an inferior product?
The differences are very small, but if you can acommodate the space requirements of two amplifier chassis you might see a corresponding very small increase in sound quality when pushing it with demanding recordings.
But a lot also has to do with the power requirements of the speakers. With 600W @ 8 ohms and 900W @ 4 ohms, both amplifiers clearly have a lot of headroom with moderately efficient speakers.
I would be more than happy to own the 14BSST2 and if I had to choose, that would probably be my personal choice to keep the count of physical boxes a bit lower. I was just offering an explanation to the question of would there be anything to be gained going with a pair of 7BSST2 beyond being able to locate them closer to the speakers.
Sometimes a small technical improvement like this is not audible in some system combinations. But again, if you have the room for them, the price difference between these particular amplifiers is not a lot, so why not?
BTW, my personal dream is a 4BSST2. I figure if 300W/ch @ 8 ohms isn't enough, I probably have the wrong speakers.
Steve
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The differences are very small, but if you can acommodate the space requirements of two amplifier chassis you might see a corresponding very small increase in sound quality when pushing it with demanding recordings.
But a lot also has to do with the power requirements of the speakers. With 600W @ 8 ohms and 900W @ 4 ohms, both amplifiers clearly have a lot of headroom with moderately efficient speakers.
I would be more than happy to own the 14BSST2 and if I had to choose, that would probably be my personal choice to keep the count of physical boxes a bit lower. I was just offering an explanation to the question of would there be anything to be gained going with a pair of 7BSST2 beyond being able to locate them closer to the speakers.
Sometimes a small technical improvement like this is not audible in some system combinations. But again, if you have the room for them, the price difference between these particular amplifiers is not a lot, so why not?
BTW, my personal dream is a 4BSST2. I figure if 300W/ch @ 8 ohms isn't enough, I probably have the wrong speakers.
Steve
Cool. Thanks for pointing that out. I could go for either one, really. Well, I'll tell you, the 4B is a terrific amp, I'm proud to own one, even if it's just a plain SST. It's very reliable and sounds great. If and when I get either the 14 or 7B, I'm gonna probably keep the 4B as a back up amp, or for a secondary system...
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I agree with Steve that the extra capacitance will come in to play if you are playing demanding material into a difficult load. The latter is one of the reasons I went with 7's over a 14B. My Infinity 9 Kappas are notorious amp killers. Although 6-8 ohms nominal they dip to .8 in the low
30 hz range with some nasty phase angles. I was playing a dermanding piece from Steely Dan's "Two Against Nature" entitled "Janie Runaway" the other day. Cranked it up to about 2:00 and just marveled at how everything just stayed put in the sound stage. Those 7's are the audio counterpart of a big pair of brass balls (hiding behind a silver faceplate).
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Thanks for all the feedback I just bought my7bsst2's ..and have been riveted to my listening chair since..I traded a nice ayre v5xe and k1xe preamp for them ..so i did have good stuff but wanted to try the mono route since i had picked up a nother pre amp in a muisc first passive preamp ...anyway I almost got deterred from buying them cuz i read and reread MFremmer.s damning review in stereophile on them......and went ahead anyway with the deal...I guess I will always wonder what the parasound jc1's sound like in my system having not heard either one prioe to purchahce...so has aanyeone either heard the JC1's or owned them and gone the other way and bought the &bsst2's...or done what i did bought the 7Bssts despite his trashing...?
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Thanks for all the feedback I just bought my7bsst2's ..and have been riveted to my listening chair since..I traded a nice ayre v5xe and k1xe preamp for them ..so i did have good stuff but wanted to try the mono route since i had picked up a nother pre amp in a muisc first passive preamp ...anyway I almost got deterred from buying them cuz i read and reread MFremmer.s damning review in stereophile on them......and went ahead anyway with the deal...I guess I will always wonder what the parasound jc1's sound like in my system having not heard either one prioe to purchahce...so has aanyeone either heard the JC1's or owned them and gone the other way and bought the &bsst2's...or done what i did bought the 7Bssts despite his trashing...?
WOW - A BIG congrats to you on the 7B-SST/2 amps. I'm sure you won't be disappointed. They are the best thing in the Bryston amp line other than the 28B's and from all I've read there is only a limited difference there, which only shows itself with challenging speaker loads.
Here is a review from a Canadian audiophile magazine that speaks to the disappointing Stereophile review - and essentially dismisses it - a good and recommended read:
http://www.innerearmag.com/reviews/amplifiers/Bryston_7B_SST.shtml (http://www.innerearmag.com/reviews/amplifiers/Bryston_7B_SST.shtml)
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...anyway I almost got deterred from buying them cuz i read and reread MFremmer.s damning review in stereophile on them......and went ahead anyway with the deal...I guess I will always wonder what the parasound jc1's sound like in my system having not heard either one prioe to purchahce...so has aanyeone either heard the JC1's or owned them and gone the other way and bought the &bsst2's...or done what i did bought the 7Bssts despite his trashing...?
In response to your inquiry, I purchased my 7B SST2 after having read the Stereophile review, among others. My experience is that these things have to be taken as information but not as gospel. I have been quite pleased with my purchase in spite of the less-than-glowing review in that publication. Conversely, I recently purchased a piece of gear which I had heard and read many positive things about and it in turn has been a real disappointment.
I have heard the JC-1's and they are a very good amp - as is what you ( and I ) purchased. The edge on build quality/reliability would probably have to go to the Brystons and the respective warranties reflect that. As to which one sounds better, that would be up to the individual. Enjoy your 7's and don't second-guess yourself.
D.D.
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thanks i did see that review also...i have looked at theat inner ear sire and curiously they do not show a date for this review...nor for any of thier reviews...this is relevant when one loos for model numbers as in the &b sqaured there i think was a transformer upgrade after a certain date...which is relevant..alsoi prcing is important as the currency exchange movement has beeen wild over the last few yrs ...i did just email them and will report back if inner ear answers..
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Any 7B SST2 with serial number above 1826 has the upgraded transformer,etc.
D.D.
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D D thats why i was wonderign as to the date of that review i dont think they mentioned whihc squared they were using
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Hi
The Inner Ear review was with the new style transformers on the 7B's as were the pair that MF had.
Funny how the same amp gets completely different opinions AH! :duh:
james
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James , MF indicated in his 1st review that he did NOT have the new transformers but that you sent him the newer versions later and he did provide an update wihch did read a lil better then the 1st review on the original pair..BTW wonder what MF really means at Bryston..lol...J?k
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James , MF indicated in his 1st review that he did NOT have the new transformers but that you sent him the newer versions later and he did provide an update wihch did read a lil better then the 1st review on the original pair..BTW wonder what MF really means at Bryston..lol...J?k
Yes he did like the newer versions better but all in all it was a terrible review - it is just interesting to me that over the many years I have been doing this how divergent opinions can be given the same product :scratch:
james
PS - bottom line - linearity and physics do not change.
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James please dont take offense to what I am about to say...it is not intended towards Bryston in any way...My perception on reviews are very similiar towards my experinces on Wall St. Many Brokerage firms would put out glowing buy recomendations for companies for which they had a part in either raising money for them or attempting to do some other form of investment banking for them.. There was supposed to be a firewall between research and banking but in reality that was not the case. I learned the hard way to discount heavily the good reports and when i saw a negative report it woud catch my eye much more so. I think on balance that is how I interpret my hobby of Audio also... It is impossible to know the relatinship between every reviiwer and the manufacturer of the item they are reviewing. Will the maker cut a good deal for him to buy the review dample or even give him it for a glowing BUY? ... who ever knows I dont think there is an SEC equivalent to make sure each review is done above board. Thus i try to reach out to many sources. In this case I relied on the dealer who I bought my Brystons from in that he also carried the Parasound products too!.. In this way i didnt feel he had any axe to grind as to his opine on both amps since i was going to BUY one of them from him. He was very forthright in the pluses and minuses of both brands and in the end for better or worse gave me excellant input so I could make up my OWN mind...I encourage anyone who is considering the same 2 amps to talk to David at Weinhart Designs..He took much time with me on my questions and was always pleasnt to talk too..Cudos to Bryston for having such an excellant dealer!
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James please dont take offense to what I am about to say...it is not intended towards Bryston in any way...My perception on reviews are very similiar towards my experinces on Wall St. Many Brokerage firms would put out glowing buy recomendations for companies for which they had a part in either raising money for them or attempting to do some other form of investment banking for them.. There was supposed to be a firewall between research and banking but in reality that was not the case. I learned the hard way to discount heavily the good reports and when i saw a negative report it woud catch my eye much more so. I think on balance that is how I interpret my hobby of Audio also... It is impossible to know the relatinship between every reviiwer and the manufacturer of the item they are reviewing. Will the maker cut a good deal for him to buy the review dample or even give him it for a glowing BUY? ... who ever knows I dont think there is an SEC equivalent to make sure each review is done above board. Thus i try to reach out to many sources. In this case I relied on the dealer who I bought my Brystons from in that he also carried the Parasound products too!.. In this way i didnt feel he had any axe to grind as to his opine on both amps since i was going to BUY one of them from him. He was very forthright in the pluses and minuses of both brands and in the end for better or worse gave me excellant input so I could make up my OWN mind...I encourage anyone who is considering the same 2 amps to talk to David at Weinhart Designs..He took much time with me on my questions and was always pleasnt to talk too..Cudos to Bryston for having such an excellant dealer!
I hear ya! David is a great guy. :thumb:
Most reviewers I know are just regular guys with bias's like everyone else. The advantage a reviewer has is his exposure to many more products than the average person has time for. That would be true of a dealer as well but the bias is still there.
james
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Hi
The Inner Ear review was with the new style transformers on the 7B's as were the pair that MF had.
Funny how the same amp gets completely different opinions AH! :duh:
james
Yes, that's very interesting. And it would be more interesting if the amps were the exact same ones that MF reviewed! But, I suppose it's the same thing more or less
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Yes he did like the newer versions better but all in all it was a terrible review - it is just interesting to me that over the many years I have been doing this how divergent opinions can be given the same product :scratch:
james
PS - bottom line - linearity and physics do not change.
Terrible review, of course. Read the measurements section where it is revealed that there was an impedance mismatch between MFs preamp and the 7Bs! Maybe you guys should have sent him a preamp too? Just a thought...however, I do understand that it's not Bryston's job to inform reviewers regarding basic stuff like impedance matching!
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Thanks for all the feedback I just bought my7bsst2's ..and have been riveted to my listening chair since..I traded a nice ayre v5xe and k1xe preamp for them ..so i did have good stuff but wanted to try the mono route since i had picked up a nother pre amp in a muisc first passive preamp ...anyway I almost got deterred from buying them cuz i read and reread MFremmer.s damning review in stereophile on them......and went ahead anyway with the deal...I guess I will always wonder what the parasound jc1's sound like in my system having not heard either one prioe to purchahce...so has aanyeone either heard the JC1's or owned them and gone the other way and bought the &bsst2's...or done what i did bought the 7Bssts despite his trashing...?
It sounds like you like the 7Bs, so who cares what a reviewer says!?
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James , MF indicated in his 1st review that he did NOT have the new transformers but that you sent him the newer versions later and he did provide an update wihch did read a lil better then the 1st review on the original pair..BTW wonder what MF really means at Bryston..lol...J?k
I have owned several pieces of equipment that have been given glowing reviews and sounded disappointing in my system, and other pieces of equipment which have received modest reviews but sounded great. Ultimately it is your ears and system synergy that are the real judges. Btw, if I recall correctly, the 7B's were reviewed by S/phile using a single pair of speakers...
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I have owned several pieces of equipment that have been given glowing reviews and sounded disappointing in my system, and other pieces of equipment which have received modest reviews but sounded great. Ultimately it is your ears and system synergy that are the real judges. Btw, if I recall correctly, the 7B's were reviewed by S/phile using a single pair of speakers...
I have too, and that's correct, it's up to the individual to be the judge.