[watercourse]

Hi all,
Have been listening to both the red and blue versions of Bob's Cinemag 3440 SUTs, both 1:9 and 1:16 versions based on Bob's rec. Using a Shelter 501 on a Rega P5 to a Heed Quasar MM/MC stage. Have heard from multiple sources that SUTs may work quite well with the Shelter carts, bringing a fuller sound and less propensity for prominent highs. As Bob himself is very familiar with the Shelters, running a 901, my understanding is that he voices his SUTs with Shelters in mind.

I put about 20 hours on the 3440A red before sending it back, because it was rolled off in both bass and treble, and was less coherent and convincing than the Heed's active stage. Both SUTs changed for the better after about 10 hours, but, funny thing is, although the 3440AH blue is much more refined, coherent, and dynamic than the red version, there is still a bit of rolloff and macrodynamics are somewhat squelched compared again to the active MC stage in the Heed. The positives are that it is much quieter than the active stage, and very smooth and refined in the extant frequency range.

Anyone have an idea if these SUTs will continue to open up, so that it has more of the "live" factor of the Heed? If the dynamics that I'm used to from my active stage is restored, this is a keeper.

Thanks!

[orientalexpress]

Have you try Bob peerless 4722 SUT?swing by,i let you borrow mine.i had a feeling you like the 4722 better.


lapsan

[watercourse]

What are the loadings on that one?

[orientalexpress]

all the inform is here http://www.bobsdevices.com/4722a.htm


bob is better at description



lapsan

[watercourse]

Currently trying out Bob's new 1131's. They restore the dynamics that I'm used to, and are very transparent, linear, and refined sounding - a bit more smooth and refined than my active stage. This was observed pretty much out of the box, only 4-5 hours on it. Getting better with time - I now have about 15 hours on it.

But, the Heed's active stage has a touch greater bass extension, a touch better dynamics, and better imaging, perhaps at the cost of greater noise....

At this point, I'm not sure it's worth the $1200 clams, although it is very nice.

[toxteth ogrady]

At this point, I'm not sure it's worth the $1200 clams, although it is very nice.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe it was only last year that the Bob's Devices sold for less than half of what they sell for now...specifically the red ones I'm talking 'bout. They are nice sounding, particularly with the Denon 103, but I had a similar reaction about the sound versus value equation. At the old price, definitely a good buy. Not so much with the newer prices.

In the end after auditioning a number of different SUT's I bought a vintage Partridge 938a step up off of ebay from a Merchant in the UK. $425 delivered and better in every way compared to the Cinemags and others I auditioned when paired with the Denon 103R. The only one I would want to audition again to compare with the Partridge would be the Hashimoto. The Hashimoto is superb but I balked at the price.

If I was going to drop $1200+ on an SUT no question it would be the Hashimoto models. The best value though in my opinion would be to find a vintage SUT that would be a good match with the Shelter 501.

[watercourse]

Thanks, Toxteth. Actually, it was only in March of this year that they sold for about half of what they sell now ($395 vs. $650, $650 vs. $850). Bad timing. Probably related to hooking up with The Cable Co. for online sales.

Also been looking at the Hashimoto SUTs from Choir... they have not been as responsive as Bob, however. My only concern with the Hashimoto is that I've heard from multiple sources that they tend to a more romantic sound, versus "just the facts". I guess I'll have to be the judge. Both the 1131 and the SUT-H are in the same price range. If only Choir would respond.

What I have confirmed is that the Shelter likes 200 ohms and lower. My typical 100 ohm loading is probably right in its sweet spot. Bob's 1131 loads at ~ 29 and 118 ohms, and while both sound excellent, I tend to like the lower loading better, as it is more full-bodied, and not any less quiet.

More thoughts later.

[J-Pak]

If anyone is interested in the premium 1131 and can solder, Cinemag will sell these direct to customers. They are significantly cheaper than Bob's price.

I am personally not a fan of the Cinemag transformers, they give up too much resolution vs just using my phono-stage alone.

[Berndt]

I'm with lapsang on the 4722 peerless/altec.
I've have heard many suts and headamps and for my airy3 it has been the most resolving, dynamic, and tonally correct.

[watercourse]

If anyone is interested in the premium 1131 and can solder, Cinemag will sell these direct to customers. They are significantly cheaper than Bob's price.

I am personally not a fan of the Cinemag transformers, they give up too much resolution vs just using my phono-stage alone.

Thanks for the input. I would say that the 3440s gave up resolution, I wouldn't say the same about the 1131s. What stage are you using?

[watercourse]

I'm with lapsang on the 4722 peerless/altec.
I've have heard many suts and headamps and for my airy3 it has been the most resolving, dynamic, and tonally correct.

Great! I am thinking that ultimately I will DIY a SUT with the Altecs. What other SUTs have you used, if you can recall?

I have to say that I'm impressed with the 1131's resolution, and after I have put on another 10 hours, it's sounding a lot better, pulling ahead of my active stage in resolution, refinement, imaging, and it is now neck and neck with the active stage in dynamics and bass. OK, I guess some of it was burn in.

Still the question of is it worth what my phono stage costs alone? More later...

[J-Pak]

Thanks for the input. I would say that the 3440s gave up resolution, I wouldn't say the same about the 1131s. What stage are you using?

Pass Labs Pearl and Pass Labs Ono. I mostly listen to jazz with a bit of prog rock here and there, so the loss of fine resolution and micro-detail was a deal breaker for me.

[watercourse]

Very nice! Would like to DIY an Ono one of these days too!

[J-Pak]

Very nice! Would like to DIY an Ono one of these days too!

I believe most of the input FETs that need to be closely matched are out of production and expensive to find. Used Pass built units sell for surprisingly little on the used market. Pass has plenty of the semiconductors to service them.