AudioCircle
Audio/Video Gear and Systems => Critic's Circle (Equipment Reviews) => Reviews of Accessories => Topic started by: blizzard on 28 Sep 2004, 10:07 pm
-
WOW!
As far as I am concerned, Sonic Craft's new capacitor is simply amazing.
I bypassed the 2 Sonicaps in each of my tweeter's crossovers with 0.1uF values of Jeff's new cap. I have never had a mod yield such a gigantic improvement in sound. There is no question that this is the best tweak that I have ever done to my system -- EVER!
Every other successful mod that I have either done myself or had done for me has yielded improvements. But, nothing like this.
Anyone who knows me, knows that when it comes to audio I am a "Resolution" and "Sibilance" freak (obviously I love resolution and hate sibilance). Harshness really gets to me. I can't stand it with a passion. And, I 've been trying to rid my system of it since the beginning of time. And since the beginning of time, I have been making good strides. But this is one huge leap. The detail is now just out of this world. And if there is any sibilance, I can't hear it. I think that any improvement that I can make after this will have to be relatively small. It's just that good.
I always thought that my Dynaudios characteristically had a bit of an edge to them. The edge is gone. I have finally gotten my Dyns to sound silky sweet.
My sincerest thanks to Jeff Glowacki for recommending this cap.
Thanks a million,
Steve
-
I hate your posts...because they make me want to spend money! Hope you are doing well. I'll have to give ol' Jeff a call and try some of those new caps. Are they on the website? I'm assuming these are the new high end caps he was working on, not the Sonicaps which I already have in my speakers.
Thanks for the information.
Jack
PS-just kidding, I like your posts.
-
Hey Jack,
They're not on his site yet. I had to go deep underground to get mine. There is a guy I know who knows a guy......... Kidding.
I guess until he gets his site updated, you have to call him direct. Based on what they did for my Dyns, I can't imagine what these caps would do for your 1801's (being that they were so sweet to begin with). My guess is that they would stay sweet. But, that they would add significantly more detail, which would enhance your already large soundstage. Again, those would be my expectations based on my experience. You never really know until you try.
Good luck Jack. I think you are going to like this one.
Steve
-
Okay, which new caps are we talking about here. The new SoniCap Gen2 or the Platinum Teflon units. I have just installed the new Gen2 SoniCaps in one of our Signature 502 amplifiers that will be debuting at the Rocky Mountain Audio Show. These are noticably a bit warmer than the originals. I have not yet tried them in any of my speakers as their values only go to 1.0uF.
As far as the Platinum Teflon caps, I am currently installing these in a pair of our new Statement Jolida 200 watt mono bloc amps. I will post me findings and opinions after I get a good number of hours on them. At least 400+ hours are required on Teflon units so it may be a while.
-
Hi Bill,
We're talking about the Platinum/Teflon caps. And, I don't know what these guys will sound like after 400 hours. But, after 400 seconds they were spectacular.
Steve
-
Gotchya,
Being Teflon, if you like them out of the gate, just wait till the 150 hour plus mark. You will spend more time picking your jaw off the floor than listening to music.
Keep us posted on your progress and happy listening.
-
I will say this. The music is so non-fatiguing now, 150 hours will probably fly by without realizing it.
Steve
-
Okay, keep something in mind. Teflon caps sound good fresh from the start. BUT...... after a few hours they start taking a few steps backwards. Do not be allarmed some morning when you turn the system on and it sounds awful cause it will happen. You will find periods when it takes two steps forwards then a step backwards. Just ride the storm out.
After 100-150 hours, the improvements become more consistant and all steps are are forward.
I should have our amps up and running next week and will keep you posted on my impressions also. WIth modding and testing costumer's systems on a daily basis, it will take me some time to gather up 150 hours, not to mention 400+. Then when you figure in the 1000V+ plate current of these 211 tubes, my electric bill will be soaring, I'm sure.
-
I'm almost completely helpless when it comes to DIY. I have a pair of Soliloquy 5.3 floorstanders, and based on some posts I've read, suspect that bipassing my tweeter crossovers with these new caps would make a nice improvement. Would my local electonics guy be able to install the caps or does it require a PHD in electrical engineering? The last thing I want to do is damage my beloved 5.3s.
Thanks for any feedback
Matt
-
that would be a question for your local tech. DIY'ers and obviously most dealers would say it's simple but if it's something one has not yet done, it could be a bit indemidating. The other thing to consider is warranty. Most likely if the speaker is opened and capacitors changed or altered in any way, you may be voiding the warranty. I am not familiar with their warranty.
-
Thanks for the quick reponse Bill. I think my warranty ran out a couple of years ago anyway, so I may look into having it done. Thanks again.
Matt
-
As far as I am concerned, Sonic Craft's new capacitor is simply amazing.
I have to agree.
(http://www.gr-research.com/images/caps2.jpg)
Pictured is a 1uF Axon cap, a 1uF Sonicap, and the new 1uF Sonicap Platium.
I was allowed to be part of a beta test group while these were being developed.
I have not seen or heard better.
-
Why is that new cap so big? :o
-
Why is that new cap so big? :o
Higher voltage rating? (thicker dielectric)
-
For one, it is a film and foil cap.
Secondly it is rated at 800 VDC.
The standard Sonicap is 220 VDC for values of 1.0 and larger, and some larger values are available in 425 VDC and 630 VDC.
In the smaller values (below 1.0uF) the standard Sonicap is rated at 630 VDC.
-
Yes, Film and Foil caps will have a larger physical size and with the 800v rating, well you get the idea.
I probably will not get the oppurtunity to hear these caps in x-overs so I'll be interested in hearing what others say.
I should have the big 200 watt Jolidas that are using the Platinums in the coupling positions fired up next week so I can start dealing with the "forever and a day break-in" of Teflon. I will try to post my initial impressions before they take their two steps backwards.
By the way, anybody here have any experience with the new SoniCap Gen2 capacitors? I have already had time to do my evaluation but will not post my findings till I see what others have heard. For those who will be at the Rocky Mountain show, there will be a custom built Jolida amp in the Daedalus Speaker room (Suite 920) that will be debuting these new Gen2 caps. The amp will be easy to spot as it has a solid Cherry face plate and transformer cover side plates.
I can say that the new Gen2 SoniCaps are different from the originals. In some applications I would prefer the originals while in others, the Gen2 provided better results. It will be interesting to hear other's findings.
-
For one, it is a film and foil cap.
Secondly it is rated at 800 VDC.
The standard Sonicap is 220 VDC for values of 1.0 and larger, and some larger values are available in 425 VDC and 630 VDC.
In the smaller values (below 1.0uF) the standard Sonicap is rated at 630 VDC.
Newbie question: what are the benefits of higher voltage caps for speaker crossover?
Bruno
-
Danny, will you be selling the new caps and if so, when will they be available? Perhaps you could pm me to keep the moderators off your back. :wink:
-
I'm almost completely helpless when it comes to DIY. I have a pair of Soliloquy 5.3 floorstanders, and based on some posts I've read, suspect that bipassing my tweeter crossovers with these new caps would make a nice improvement. Would my local electonics guy be able to install the caps or does it require a PHD in electrical engineering? The last thing I want to do is damage my beloved 5.3s.
Thanks for any feedback
Matt
I also have 5.3's and I swapped out all the caps with the standard Sonicaps. Outstanding improvement in clarity. It was a pain in the ass to do, because one of the 2 seperate x-over boards, (I think the low pass if I remember correctly is glued to the bass of the cabinet. The other one is easy to get at, it's mounted right on the back plate where the binding posts and port are. The plate is easy to remove. I left the original caps in place and just disconnected them as they were glued down with gobs of glue. The caps are not marked, but I measured them and have the values if you want them.
-
I probably will not get the oppurtunity to hear these caps in x-overs so I'll be interested in hearing what others say.
I got to test a pair of 6.8 uF Sonicap Platinums in the development stage.
One was a little larger in size than the other but the smaller one was a little heavier. Both were about the size of a soup can in diameter and just a little shorter in length.
Probably the best 6.8 uF cap I ever heard in a tweeter circuit, but I don't think this application is the best one for these caps.
Greater gains can be obtained when using them in electronics. Small values are not that expensive and the well worth the improvements.
Plus, there is the fact that a single 6.8 uF cap would retail for more than I sell any of our A/V series speaker kits for.
By the way, anybody here have any experience with the new SoniCap Gen2 capacitors? I have already had time to do my evaluation but will not post my findings till I see what others have heard.
Yea, I got to try some of those too. I don't have any in stock yet though.
I did A/B them with the regular Sonicaps as well.
The regular Sonicap seamed to have a bit more body and weight to it by comparison. The new version clearly had a greater sense or air about it. High level detail was better in the new cap too.
I really liked them. Using them as a by-pass cap on a standard Sonicap will make a perfect combo.
Newbie question: what are the benefits of higher voltage caps for speaker crossover?
There is not a big advantage in using the higher voltage caps in a speaker. Many applications in electronics require the higher voltage rating though.
Danny, will you be selling the new caps and if so, when will they be available?
I will be selling them and do currently have a small inventory of them. I have .01, .022, .1, .22, .33, .47, and 1.0's in stock.
These are really most idea in electronics and most of our customers are speaker builders. All available values are small, and they are also on the expensive side for using them in loudspeakers. So I did not bring in large quantities of them like I do the regular Sonicaps.
-
The regular Sonicap seamed to have a bit more body and weight to it by comparison. The new version clearly had a greater sense or air about it. High level detail was better in the new cap too
Okay, here is a quick comparison between the original SoniCap and Gen2.
The original SoniCap sems to be the most neutral I have hear. Very articulate and unforgiven if used in an aggressive system or component. For someone looking for the utmost inner detail retrieval, this would be the cap to use. I found it to provide a good balance in such circuits as EL34 tube based amplifiers and also brought forth more air and resolution when used in circuits that were on the darker side to begin with.
The Gen2 has been designed to be on the warmer side of neutral. In the designs I experimented with, they offered a bit more fullness and body in comparison to the original. I found them to be a very good balance in designs such as 6550/KT88 based tube amps and offered exceptional musicallity and fullnes in some of the EL34, EL84 and even 805 based amplifiers. Unfortunately, we will not be able to hear what they would offer in crossover applications as they are not available in values above 1.0uF. Obviously, you can use the smaller values for bypassing or cascading to make lager values.
Keep in mind that all my experimentation has been with tube gear as I do not own a solid state product to even try them out in. I also did not have enough time to do a proper burn in of the caps to get a true sense but I feel I was able to get a good idea of their characteristics.
Do I think they are better than the originals? Absolutely not, just different. Do I like the Gen2's? Yes, very much. If it were up to me, I would like to see both versions remain available as the originals have their place. I think I will be good on the originals in the values I use most often for a while as I purchased a large number of the remaining inventory to continue having them available for my mods.
-
Could somebody post the web site these may soon be available at and mentioned on page 1 of this thread?
-
http://www.soniccraft.com/
Jeff is a great guy to deal with. I have been using his caps for years. Very helpful via phone or email.
-
After reading posts here about the improvement Sonicaps made in several members' speakers, I decided to give Jeff a call. He suggested that my Soliloquy 5.3s would particularly benefit by running his second gen 0.1uF sonicaps in parallel with replacements to my stock tweeter crossover caps. I followed his recommendation, received the caps in a few days, then had a local tech install them (took him about 90 minutes).
At first, I noticed a subtle improvement in my speakers at best... it wasn't until at least 50 hours that the new caps really began to show their stuff. Now, after almost 150 hours, I believe they are fully broken in, and the improvements are anything but subtle. The Soliloquys are fine speakers in stock form, but the Sonicaps have really improved their dynamics, providing deeper bass, increased detail (I can now clearly hear a marimba that I never knew existed on a familiar recording) and nice 3D soundstage expansion. I'm pretty amazed by how much these little caps have transformed my speakers. The total cost of parts including shipping was about $85, and the install about $60, so for a total of under $150 it is unquestionably the best upgrade for the money I've ever made.
Matt
-
I replaced the caps in my speakers with Sonicaps (from Axon's) about a year and a half ago. The change in dimensionality and inner detail was outstanding. Very musical too. I just ordered some of the Gen II's this week at .1uF to use as bypasses in the tweeter circuit.
One question, will adding the extra .1uF to the two caps in series alter the crossover in any meaningful way (i.e. perceptible)? Here's the tweeter circuit:
6uF 15uF
+ ---||--------||---nnnnn---- +
| Scanspeak 9305
B tweeter
B (B represents the inductor, n the resistor)
|
- ------------------------------ -
Thanks,
Bob
-
One question, will adding the extra .1uF to the two caps in series alter the crossover in any meaningful way (i.e. perceptible)?
Short answer, no.
Long answer, see link to measured responses.
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=11132
Glad to hear you guys are all liking those caps!
-
Thanks, interesting results in your referenced posts. Always good to see a professional performing tests and openly reporting results without the marketing hacks getting involved.
Sorry about my crossover schematic - clearly things didn't line up as intended.
Bob
-
The Sonicraft Platinum is simply amazing!!
I have rewired the crossover of my Revel F30 with Sonicap and mills resistors 8 months ago and had simply enjoyed the improvement since then. Jeff was great in helping to measure the crossover components and match them with new components. After learning that he has this new cap available from this post and exchange emails with him a couple of times, I ordered two 0.1uF and two 0.033 uF for bypassing the two caps of the tweeter section.
This is the best $70 I have ever spent in my experience. After 2 hours, the improvement was already jaw-dropping! The walls all of a sudden seems to disappear, the soundstage widens. New details emerge so naturally and everything sounds so effortless. I can't imagine how good this will get if Bill's comment is true that this teflon cap need 400hr to burn-in.
Thanks to Jeff for developing such an outstanding product!
Mike