[nzone]

I am looking to build some N3 for home theater use in the next few months.  So I have some questions...

1. What is the max spl for this bad boy?
    (From power handling number, I assume it's somewhere 102-105 dB?)
2. How do you describe the midbass?  Does it play "punchy" and "feel (hit the chest)" around 50-70 Hz?
3. Does the platinum bypass include in the Sonicaps upgrade?
4. How many No-Rez needed for 6 N3TL and 1 N3C?  What is the cut dimension in the drivers section?  The plan didn't call for all the way to the front baffle.
5. What is the efficient way to cut the brace B?  Does it have to be half-circle? 
6. I bugged you the other time about the center channel as W T/M W; and saw your response.  I thought N3C is not beastly enough  .  LS-C is tooooooooo wide.    Can there be something like this for N3 center e.g  (W M T M W) -- the W 6 1/2 bass reflex. 

 

[Danny Richie]

1. What is the max spl for this bad boy?
    (From power handling number, I assume it's somewhere 102-105 dB?)

That is as much a function of the room size and listening distance as another else. Max SPL can also be frequency dependent as there is a mechanical and a thermal limit. So there is no way saying that they will do this or that level as a max.

2. How do you describe the midbass?  Does it play "punchy" and "feel (hit the chest)" around 50-70 Hz?

I am pretty happy with it or I wouldn't release it. These small drivers are very fast and have a very clean bass response. I am sure my customers can give you some added impressions in this regard.

3. Does the platinum bypass include in the Sonicaps upgrade?

No, if you want to take them a step further with Platinum by-pass caps then that comes at an additional cost.

4. How many No-Rez needed for 6 N3TL and 1 N3C?  What is the cut dimension in the drivers section?  The plan didn't call for all the way to the front baffle.

Three sheets of No Rez are needed per pair of N3's. A N3S (center channel) only needs about a half of a sheet.

The plans show where the No Rez is to be placed and it does include areas of the front baffle.

5. What is the efficient way to cut the brace B?  Does it have to be half-circle? 

It is just as easy as cutting the driver through holes. Just drill an 1/8" hole for the guide pin of a circle jig and spin the router around it to cut out the half circle piece. It cuts quickly. 

6. I bugged you the other time about the center channel as W T/M W; and saw your response.  I thought N3C is not beastly enough  .  LS-C is tooooooooo wide.    Can there be something like this for N3 center e.g  (W M T M W) -- the W 6 1/2 bass reflex. 

If I could figure out a way to offer something like that to where it would offer any real performance increase over the standard N3S then I would have created it. The problem with going to a larger 6.5" driver is that it makes the baffle larger around the tweeter adding surface reflections. That's not a good thing.

[Captainhemo]

My N3TL's are front vented  so they are probably  lacking a bit  way down low.  However,   they are "punchy" and "crisp",  I just love them . They work grat with my sub.
When I cut the brace B's I cut them  both from  one long piece (21").   I drilled 3 1/8" holes  for my circle jig.  Once the holes were cut,   I trimmed 1/2" from each end  to give me the  first 2  half circles, then  cut the  remaining piece in half  to get the other 2.  That way I ended up  with  perfect half circles at each end of   the 2 resulting pieces.
I just got the sonicap  resistor upgrades (no platinum bypass) and  the top end is very clear and defined.  It you  don't have the highest quality  components its  probably best to stay away from  the  platinum bypass's (someone correct me if I'm wrong here )

-jay

[Captainhemo]

Also, I left the dampening material (no rez) 1 1/2" back from the front baffle behind the drivers

-jay

[nzone]

Danny,

- I don't listen at reference level so it's really a non-factor for me.   

- What is the cost for the platinum bypass cap?  Says for a pair of N3.

- So 3 sheets of no-rez is not enough for 2 N3TLs and N3S?   The reason I ask for the cut dimensions for the drivers section is because I notice the yellow marker (side view) is not all the way to the front baffle.

- It's not a knock on the N3S.  I'm sure you designed it to match the N3TL sonically.  What I described 'not beastly enough' was referring to extension.  I'm just worried that when the AVR's room correction runs, it may or may not find the -3 dB point at 'low to mid 60'.  I would prefer the center channel to go low enough that I don't need a subwoofer's help.  The LS-C is perfect (-3 dB @ 36) but it's one driver each end too long.  If I want an LS-C, will it be a match for the N3TL? Is the kit available and how much?

[nzone]

Jay,

- It's punchy (awesome), but do you feel it?   Let's say something like a  heart beat sound (signal), do you feel it?  I guess I have to build one to find out whether 50-70 Hz, the N3TL is good by itself or a subwoofer is better.

- So from what you said, the platinum bypass offers no benefit  since I am going to drive the speakers with a home theater AVR. Great!

- thanks for the no-rez cut dimension and how to cut the half-circle.  By the way, if you cut in the middle, wouldn't the length for each brace a little shorter than the 10" (due to the saw blade width) ?


 
 

[Danny Richie]

- What is the cost for the platinum bypass cap?  Says for a pair of N3.

$156

- So 3 sheets of no-rez is not enough for 2 N3TLs and N3S?   The reason I ask for the cut dimensions for the drivers section is because I notice the yellow marker (side view) is not all the way to the front baffle.

If the No Rez covered the entire side panel all the way to the front baffle then the 1" thick foam on the No Rez would be right up into the woofer and force the woofer to play through it. It needs to be about an inch back off of the woofer.

- It's not a knock on the N3S.  I'm sure you designed it to match the N3TL sonically.  What I described 'not beastly enough' was referring to extension.  I'm just worried that when the AVR's room correction runs, it may or may not find the -3 dB point at 'low to mid 60'.

In room response could be much lower. I also avise caution when using room correction devices. These can work well in ranges below 200Hz. But above 200Hz they really don't work.

I would prefer the center channel to go low enough that I don't need a subwoofer's help.

If you have the space then you can build a ported box for it to increase low end extension. You can even add a port to each side exiting on the front of the baffle on the outside of each woofer.

The LS-C is perfect (-3 dB @ 36) but it's one driver each end too long.  If I want an LS-C, will it be a match for the N3TL? Is the kit available and how much?

The LS-C will match the N3's just fine. The LS-C kit is $550.

[Danny Richie]

- It's punchy (awesome), but do you feel it?   Let's say something like a  heart beat sound (signal), do you feel it?  I guess I have to build one to find out whether 50-70 Hz, the N3TL is good by itself or a subwoofer is better.

The bass response of the N3S is nice and tight. The N3 is the same but plays much lower and with really good control. They can be used with or without a sub.

- So from what you said, the platinum bypass offers no benefit  since I am going to drive the speakers with a home theater AVR. Great!

I'd say that it is likely that the Platinum by-pass caps would make some noticeable difference even with the receiver, but it will be very subtle and for the cost I would not recommend it. 

- thanks for the no-rez cut dimension and how to cut the half-circle.  By the way, if you cut in the middle, wouldn't the length for each brace a little shorter than the 10" (due to the saw blade width) ?

Personally, I cut the brace to size first, then come in about 1/8" with the through hole guide for the circle jig and cut the half circle out. So the center of the circle is 1/8" in rather then in line with the edge, big deal... It's easy to make that way.

[Captainhemo]

Cut it in half first, then trim the ends to make each brace 10".  Guess I wrote it backwards
I'd say yes,  you do feel the bass.  I had  a friend come by a while back, he is a DJ   and has some pretty decent equipment.  We cranked up some Dire Straits and he was very impressed  at how tight and controlled the bass was.  Now I am running a sub but the N3's have definitely  tightened things up .  If I had the space  behind the speakers, I would have rear vented them   and would have had a better bottom end and might not need the sub to fill  in the very bottom.
.

-jay

[nzone]

If you have the space then you can build a ported box for it to increase low end extension. You can even add a port to each side exiting on the front of the baffle on the outside of each woofer.

The LS-C is perfect (-3 dB @ 36) but it's one driver each end too long.  If I want an LS-C, will it be a match for the N3TL? Is the kit available and how much?

The LS-C will match the N3's just fine. The LS-C kit is $550.

Danny,

The crossover network is still the same when changing from sealed to ported enclosure?  Do the drivers share the air space or on their own chamber?  What is the tuning frequency do you recommend, 47 Hz?  And the port size (i assume 2 2" ports)?

As for the LS-C, the price includes the upgrade sonicaps or extra? 

[nzone]

Thank you Danny and Jay for taking the time to answer my questions.

Time to build some enclosures. 

[Danny Richie]

The crossover network is still the same when changing from sealed to ported enclosure?  Do the drivers share the air space or on their own chamber?  What is the tuning frequency do you recommend, 47 Hz?  And the port size (i assume 2 2" ports)?

The crossover remains the same so long as surface area is not added around the tweeter.

1.1 cubic feet of air space is needed and two 2" diameter ports and I can supply with the kit. And yes,it will hit a -3db of 47Hz.

As for the LS-C, the price includes the upgrade sonicaps or extra? 

It comes with Sonicaps and Mills resistors.

[SoCalWJS]

The crossover remains the same so long as surface area is not added around the tweeter.

1.1 cubic feet of air space is needed and two 2" diameter ports and I can supply with the kit. And yes,it will hit a -3db of 47Hz.

It comes with Sonicaps and Mills resistors.

OOC, is there a page on your website with the specifics on the LS-C? I can't seem to find it 

[Danny Richie]

OOC, is there a page on your website with the specifics on the LS-C? I can't seem to find it 

Yeah, there are a lot of things i need to get added to the web site.

Here is the original design thread with good info and pics: http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=91207.0

[nzone]

The N3S in ported configuration is pretty good -- theoretically.

With the box size 1.13-ft3, 2 2" dia. ports, 5.25" long w/100W RMS input yields 110-dB max SPL @ 60 Hz crossover without port noise.  Could even cross at 60 Hz with slight port noise at 200W RMS input that yields 113 max SPL...assume the driver voice coil can handle this much heat. 

[Captainhemo]

1.1 cubic feet of air space is needed and two 2" diameter ports and I can supply with the kit. And yes,it will hit a -3db of 47Hz.

So,  leaving the  height and depth the same as the  plans call for,  does 31.125"   long sound right ? Then just space the ports evenly between  each woofer  and the  ends of the  longer cabinet  ?
I'm thinking of  doing  this for my center channel as well

-jay

[nzone]

So,  leaving the  height and depth the same as the  plans call for,  does 31.125"   long sound right ? Then just space the ports evenly between  each woofer  and the  ends of the  longer cabinet  ?
I'm thinking of  doing  this for my center channel as well

-jay

That would be the external volume.  The LS-C minus one driver from each end.  The final dimension gets you 31.75 W x 8 H x 15 D.  The internal volume is about 1.42 ft3.  If you minus the braces, ports, and drive (about 0.25-0.30 ft3); you will get final volume to be around 1.15 ft3. 

[Captainhemo]

I calculated that  as the external dimension  (31.125 x 8 x 10.625 ,  that would give an internal volume of 1.1 cu ft   but I didn't allow for  bracing, parts etc.  Not sure if Danny meant 1.1  after everything was in, or  just 1.1 total  then  put everything in.

[Danny Richie]

I calculated that  as the external dimension  (31.125 x 8 x 10.625 ,  that would give an internal volume of 1.1 cu ft   but I didn't allow for  bracing, parts etc.  Not sure if Danny meant 1.1  after everything was in, or  just 1.1 total  then  put everything in.

Allow for your braces and you've got it.

[nzone]

Danny,

What is the first port resonance needs to be?

Edit: (above 1800 Hz?)