AudioCircle
Audio/Video Gear and Systems => Cheap and Cheerful HiFi => Topic started by: MCM_Fan on 23 Aug 2014, 05:41 am
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Introduction (Credit where Credit is Due):
The Pioneer SP-BS22-LR bookshelf speakers (http://"http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Home/Speakers/Home+Theater+Speakers/SP-BS22-LR"), designed by Andrew Jones, have been very well received, with many positive reviews:
Stereophile – Pioneer SP-BS22-LR Loudspeaker by Robert J. Reina (http://"http://www.stereophile.com/content/pioneer-sp-bs22-lr-loudspeaker")
The Absolute Sound – Pioneer SP-BS22-LR Loudspeaker by Neil Gader (http://"http://www.theabsolutesound.com/articles/pioneer-sp-bs22-lr-loudspeaker/")
The Wirecutter – A Great Bookshelf Speaker by Geoff Morrison (http://"http://thewirecutter.com/reviews/a-great-bookshelf-speaker/")
Digital Audio Review – Pioneer SP-BS22-LR Standmount Loudspeaker by John H. Darko (http://"http://www.digitalaudioreview.net/2013/11/pioneer-sp-bs22lr-standmount-loudspeaker-review/")
They have also received much attention and many favorable comments in the various audio forums:
Audiokarma.org – Speakers – Pioneer SP-BS22-LR, the real deal or hype? (http://"http://audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=525297")
Audio Circle – Cheap and Cheerful HiFi – Pioneer SP-BS2-LR are really nice (http://"http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=113182.0")
With an MSRP of $129.99, Andrew Jones has succeeded in bringing an excellent sounding set of speakers to the masses at a very affordable price. Better still, these speakers are carried by many major retailers, both online (Amazon, Newegg, etc.) and brick and mortar stores (Best Buy, Frye’s, etc.) and are often on sale for less than $100. I have two sets. I purchased the first pair in August, 2013 for $79.99 and then a second pair in June, 2014 for $65.00. In both cases, they were on sale at amazon.com and I purchased them at my local Best Buy through their price matching program. There is a Best Buy less than 3 miles from my house. So, I went for the instant gratification of picking them up locally over ordering them through Amazon. These speakers go on sale often, usually on weekends, but the sales don’t last long. The $65.00 price at Amazon was only listed on their web site for about 24 hours. To get the best price, you need to check the online retailers regularly and act quickly when the price drops. At $130, these speakers are a great value. At $65 - $80, they are an absolute steal.
Note: After I completed this article, in August 2014, the Pioneer SP-BS22-LR speakers went on sale at Amazon for a new low price of $59.90/pair. Again, they were only offered at this special low price for less than 24 hours. What a tremendous value for anyone who was able to take advantage of this sale.
The complete manufacturer’s data sheet, in PDF format can be found here (http://"http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/ephox/StaticFiles/PUSA/Files/Home/Andrew SP-BS22-LRSingle Sheet.pdf"). And here’s the relevant specs:
Specifications:
• Enclosure.............................. .......Bass-reflex Bookshelf
• Configuration.......................... .....2-way
• Frequency Range.........................55Hz-20kHz
• Nominal Impedance.....................6 Ohms
• Sensitivity (2.83V).......................85dB
• Maximum Input Power.................80W
• Cross-Over Frequency.................3kHz
• Magnetically Shielded..................No
• Dimensions(WxHxD)....................7-1/8”x12-9/16”x8-7/16”
• Weight(each)..............................9lbs 2oz
• Woofer................................. .......4”
• Tweeter................................ .......1”
• UPC.................................... ..........012562906119
Budget audiophiles owe Pioneer and Andrew Jones a great debt of gratitude for producing a speaker that sounds so good at a price anyone can afford. Mr. Jones did an amazing job of designing an excellent sounding speaker within a very tight budget. The little 4” woofer is an amazing driver that produces surprising bass for such a small driver. The curved cabinet is also excellent quality, especially in this price range. To use a popular metaphor, these two elements allow the SP-BS22-LR speakers to punch way above their class. The SP-BS22-LR speakers also have a better, more complex, crossover network than most other speakers in this price range. Of course, when working within a very tight budget, compromises must be made. The stock tweeter is decent, but not great. I’m sure it’s the best Mr. Jones could do and still stay within his allocated budget. In any design, there are cost/performance trade-offs. Andrew Jones did an amazing job within his budget and made the right trade-offs to get the best possible sound for the least amount of money. The popularity of these speakers and the countless positive reviews are a testimony to the outstanding work Mr. Jones did designing these speakers.
However, because cost/performance trade-offs were necessary to get these speakers to market at a very affordable price, it leaves the door open for improvements. Enter Dennis Murphy of Philharmonic Audio (http://"http://philharmonicaudio.com/"). Dennis is another highly talented designer who has always been a big supporter of the DIY community. Dennis replaced the stock tweeter of the Pioneer SP-BS22-LR speakers with a much nicer Vifa 1” silk dome tweeter from Parts Express and then designed a new crossover to match this improved tweeter to the stock 4” woofer. Dennis offers speakers with these modifications installed and tested. He sells them, in limited production quantities, as his Affordable Accuracy Monitors at the bargain price of $165.00/pair (http://"http://philharmonicaudio.com/folio-me/html/Phil Pages/AALS.html").
Dennis graciously shared his design with me. Due to the complexity, and risk of damage, he was reluctant to share these modifications with the general public. In an effort to make these mods more accessible to those with the necessary skills and tools, I further refined the implementation of Dennis’ design. The mods can be accomplished by an experienced Do-It-Yourselfer, but there is some risk of irreparable damage. So, if you are not 100% confident in your abilities, do not attempt these mods. If you do decide to proceed, you do so at you own risk. As soon as you open up your speakers, you void the manufacturer’s warranty. If you screw up and ruin your speakers, no one else is responsible for your actions.
Of course, these improvements are not free. As you will see below, with a BOM cost of over $82, the cost of materials alone doubled my investment in these speakers. Since Dennis sells these speakers professionally modified and tested at only $165.00, it only makes sense to attempt these mods if:
• You already have these speakers and are a competent, experienced DIYer
or
• You get lucky and snag a pair at $65.00, are a competent, experienced DIYer and place little or no value on your time
or
• Dennis stops selling his modified speakers[/INDENT]
The Details:
You will need the following materials to perform these modifications to your stock Pioneer SP-BS2-LR speakers:
Bill of Materials: Dennis Murphy Modifications for Pioneer SP-BS22-LR
(https://s6.postimg.org/hi8181o0x/SP-_BS22-_LR_Mod_BOM.jpg)
(https://s6.postimg.org/5zmc0wvkx/SP-_BS22-_LR_Mod6.jpg)
Photo 1. The BOM Components
As shown in the table, most of the parts are available from Parts Express. The prices shown are current as of July, 2014 and are subject to change. These are single quantity pricing and do not represent any discounts (in other words, the most you will pay at the time of this article). I actually paid less as I bought my items when Parts Express was having a 20% off sale, and I also purchased enough materials to modify four speakers. So, I got additional quantity discounts on some items. The cost of the Jantzen 0.5mH air core inductor has also gone up since I made my purchase. One sheet of Sonic Barrier was enough for four speakers and the 100 pack of #6x3/4” pan head screws is enough to modify eight speakers. So, after all discounts and free shipping my total materials cost came out to $115.97 for the parts required to modify four speakers. That’s $57.99 per pair. Since I paid $79.99 and $65.00 for my two pair of speakers, that makes my total net cost $260.96 for four speakers, or $130.48 per pair after modifications. That’s only $0.49/pair more than the $129.99 MSRP for the stock speakers.
Tools:
• 2.5mm Hex Key
• #2 Phillips Screw Driver
• Electric Drill or Drill Press
• 1/8” Drill Bit
• 7/64” Drill Bit
• Wire Stripper/Cutter
• Solder Iron
• Desoldering Wick/Braid
• Glue Gun
• Scissors
• Dremel Tool with small sanding drum (optional: could also use a file or small handsaw)
Miscellaneous Supplies:
• Solder
• Hot Glue Sticks
• 22 AWG Hook Up Wire
• Small Zip Ties
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Note: Performing the following modifications voids your manufacturer’s warranty. Proceed at your own risk. If you screw up, you could potentially damage your speakers beyond repair. If you damage your speakers, no one else, not Pioneer Electronics, not Andrew Jones, not Dennis Murphy and not me (who shall remain nameless) is responsible for your loss.
Step 1 – Disassembly:
(https://s6.postimg.org/hh7qphhwh/SP-_BS22-_LR_Mod1.jpg)
Photo 2. 2.5mm Hex Key for Removing Driver Mounting Screws
Using a 2.5mm hex key, remove the screws holding the tweeter and woofer in the cabinet. You MUST use the correct 2.5mm hex key. If you don’t, you will strip out the hex sockets in the head of the screws. As simple as this step sounds, it is susceptible to risk. The stock mounting screws are very low quality made from very soft metal. They were intended to be screwed in once, for the life of the product, not repeatedly removed and re-installed by an ambitious Do-It-Yourselfer. For this reason, I recommend throwing these screws away and not attempting to reuse them. Use the #6 x ¾” Phillips pan head screws instead. Remove the drivers from the cabinet. Unhook the wires from the back of the drivers (to do so, slide the clear plastic insulators back from the terminals and press down on the small retention tabs with your fingernail). Set aside the woofer for later use.
Carefully remove the gasket from the back of the tweeter. It will be reused on the new Vifa tweeter. Use a single sided razor blade, Exacto knife or small pocket knife to get under the gasket material and gently pull it away from the tweeter. Once the gasket is removed, set the original tweeter aside. It is no longer needed. Install the gasket on the new Vifa tweeter. Make sure there is no gasket material extending beyond the edge of the tweeter plastic frame. The new tweeter is a very tight fit in the opening in the cabinet. If there is any gasket material extending beyond the edge of the tweeter, trim it back with the razor blade or knife. Set the new tweeter aside for future use.
Using the #2 Phillips screw driver, remove the four screws that hold the terminal cup in the cabinet. Set the screws aside for later reuse. Remove the terminal cup, with the attached crossover, from the cabinet. Again, using the #2 Phillips screwdriver, remove the four screws that mount the crossover PCB onto the terminal cup. You can toss these screws. They will not be needed for reassembly. When it comes time, you’ll use four of the longer #6 x ¾” pan head screws instead. Set the terminal cup aside for now.
Step 2 – Preparing the Cabinet:
The new Vifa tweeter has terminals on opposite sides, 180 degrees apart. This is different than the original tweeter, which has both terminals on the bottom, side-by-side. You will need to cut a small notch in the top, center of the tweeter opening to accommodate the TW- lead. You can use a file or a small hand saw to cut this notch. I used a Dremel tool with a small sanding drum to make this notch in my speaker cabinets (see Photo 3).
(https://s6.postimg.org/885kfd90h/SP-_BS22-_LR_Mod2.jpg)
Photo 3. Notch in Tweeter Opening for TW- Lead
The stock speaker has a sheet of white acoustic batting glued to the inside of the cabinet behind the woofer opening. This next step is optional, but highly recommended. Gently remove the acoustic batting from the inside of the cabinet. Try not to tear it as it will be reinstalled in the top half of the cabinet, behind the tweeter opening. Set it aside for now.
Cut four pieces of the Sonic Barrier acoustic foam to install in the bottom half of the cabinet. The two side pieces are 6 ½” x 4 ½”. I recommend making a template for the bottom piece. If you plan your cuts carefully, you will actually have enough for four speakers.
(https://s6.postimg.org/8weeyb7q9/SP-_BS22-_LR_Mod3.jpg)
Photo 4. Sonic Barrier for Sides and Bottom of Cabinet
Install the Sonic Barrier in the cabinet.
(https://s6.postimg.org/vwl2an5k1/SP-_BS22-_LR_Mod4.jpg)
Photo 5. The Sonic Barrier Installed in the Cabinet
Using the glue gun and hot glue sticks, install the original batting in the top half of the cabinet behind the tweeter opening. Position the batting so that the notch that originally wrapped around the crossover now wraps around the port tube. Note: if you don’t already have a glue gun, the cheap little one from Michael’s ($2.79) works great for this. It is small enough to get inside the cabinet and maneuver into place. That’s it for the cabinets, for now.
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Step 3 – The Crossover:
(https://s6.postimg.org/59ucx2g9t/SP-_BS22-_LR_Mod_Schematic.jpg)
Figure 1. The New Crossover Circuit – Dennis Murphy Design
Building the new crossover is the heart of this DIY project. Using desoldering wick/braid, you will need to remove some parts from the existing crossover. You will install some of those parts, as well as the new crossover parts, onto the Radio Shack 276-168 PC Board. Finally, you will sandwich the old crossover board and the new PC Board together and mount them back on the terminal cup.
Notes on the schematic:
[INDENT]• Components without Parts Express part numbers are part of the original crossover. Where possible these components are reused to keep the cost of the new crossover as low as possible.
• The design of the woofer circuit calls for a 1.5mH inductor. To keep the cost low, 0.5mH air core inductor L2 is placed in series with existing 1.0 mH iron core inductor L1.[/INDENT]
Start by removing the following components from the original crossover PCB:
[INDENT]• C1 - 10uF NP – Top Side, Retain for Reuse
• C2 – 2.2 uF – Top Side, Retain for Reuse
• L2 – 0.4mH Air Core – Top Side - Discard
• R2 – 6.8 Ohm, 10W – Bottom Side, Retain for Reuse
[/INDENT]
Use the soldering iron and desoldering braid to unsolder the components from the board. The components are also adhered to the board using some type of hot glue or rubber cement. I recommend removing this glue residue from the board with your fingernail and then cleaning the board with something like Goo Gone. You don’t want to get that stuff on your soldering iron. It will gum up the tip. Same for the black silicon adhesive that was globbed over the mounting screws at the corners of the board.
Inductor L2, the 0.4mH air core is the hardest to get off the board. You can use a screw driver in the center hole to help pry it off the board. Take your time and make sure you get all the solder off the component leads before trying to remove them. Other than the 0.4mH air core inductor, you will be reusing all the other components. So, you don’t want to damage them.
Remove the tweeter wires (TW+ and TW-) from the stock crossover. Remove the adhesive over the solder connections BEFORE attempting to unsolder these wires. Set the wires aside for reuse. You will also need to remove the IN+ lead (red wire) from the PCB and pull it apart from the IN- lead. Set it aside for reuse.
At this point, the only items remaining attached to the original crossover PCB are L1, R1 the W+/W- leads and the IN- lead.
(https://s6.postimg.org/m6smgz2ld/SP-_BS22-_LR_Mod9.jpg)
Photo 6. The Stock Crossover PCB, Top Side View, after Removing Components and Wires
(https://s6.postimg.org/ilwqxqy1t/SP-_BS22-_LR_Mod10.jpg)
Photo 7. The Stock Crossover PCB, Bottom Side View, after Removing Components and Wires
Install 10uF NP electrolytic cap C1 on the bottom side of the original crossover PCB. Moving this large capacitor to the bottom side of the PCB is necessary to allow the new Radio Shack PC board to be sandwiched on top of the original PCB. Don’t worry about the cap polarity, this is a non-polarized electrolytic capacitor (unlike the polarized electrolytics used as decoupling caps in DC power supply circuits).
Note: When mounting this, and all other components on the original crossover PCB and the new Radio Shack PC Board, use the glue gun and hot glue to firmly adhere the components on the circuit board. This provides a solid mechanical connection between the component and circuit board.
(https://s6.postimg.org/6601404pt/SP-_BS22-_LR_Mod11.jpg)
Photo 8. 10uF Non-Polarized Electrolytic Capacitor L1 Installed on the Bottom Side of the Original Crossover PCB
It’s now time to drill the mounting holes in the new Radio Shack PC Board. This PC Board is laid out in a grid with the x-axis numbered A1 – A5, B1 - B5, C1 – C5, D1 – D5, E1 – E5, F1 and the y-axis numbered 1 – 30. There are silk screened lines located at five hole intervals in both the horizontal and vertical axes. There are two types of mounting holes: 1/8” holes for attaching the new Radio Shack PC Board to the original crossover PCB and the terminal cup standoffs; 7/64” for the wire ties that will be used to mechanically restrain the two 0.5mH air core inductors. You will use the two of the factory drilled mounting holes at the bottom left and bottom right corners of the PC Board. So, only two new 1/8’ mounting holes are required. There will be a total of six 7/64” mounting holes, four for inductor L2 and two for inductor L3.
(https://s6.postimg.org/msczzc89t/SP-_BS22-_LR_Mod_Table1.jpg)
Table 1. Mounting Hole Locations
I used 7/64” mounting holes for the small wire ties I used to attach the inductors to the PC Board. If you have different size wire ties, or don’t have a 7/64” drill bit, you can use a 1/8” drill bit for all mounting holes.
Be careful when drilling the 1/8” mounting hole at location A1.5, 15.5. You don’t want to completely sever the copper trace on the back side of the PC Board at location A1. This is the GND trace. If you do completely sever this trace, you can install a jumper wire to bridge the gap.
(https://s6.postimg.org/ox1ye5za9/SP-_BS22-_LR_Mod12.jpg)
Photo 9. The New Radio Shack PC Board with all Mounting Holes Drilled
Install 22 AWG jumper wires between the following locations:
(https://s6.postimg.org/t4s596bc1/SP-_BS22-_LR_Mod_Table2.jpg)
Table 2. Jumper Wire Locations
Solder all wires in place on the back side of the PC Board. After soldering, trim all leads as short as possible on the back side of the PCB. There will only be a 1/8” gap between the new PC Board and the original crossover PCB. The leads should be clipped short enough to prevent creating a short circuit between the two PCBs.
(https://s6.postimg.org/8krwofkyp/SP-_BS22-_LR_Mod13.jpg)
Photo 10. The New Radio Shack PC Board with Jumper Wires Installed
Install crossover components L2, L3, C2, C3, C5 and R2 on the PC Board at the following locations:
(https://s6.postimg.org/fzcn32hgh/SP-_BS22-_LR_Mod_Table3.jpg)
Table 3. Crossover Component Locations
Use a generous amount of hot glue to attach these components to the PC Board. Install wire ties to help mechanically restrain the inductors and cut off the excess length of the wire ties. Solder all leads to the back side of the PCB and trim all leads, except L2, Pin1 as short as possible. Leave the L2, Pin1 lead longer (See Photo12: anything between ½: and 1” is fine for now). This lead will also be soldered to the original crossover PCB when sandwiching the two boards together.
Solder the tweeter lead wires and input lead wire IN+ at the following locations:
(https://s6.postimg.org/k72ty2ti9/SP-_BS22-_LR_Mod_Table4.jpg)
Table 4. Lead Wire Locations
(https://s6.postimg.org/6exltxhi9/SP-_BS22-_LR_Mod14.jpg)
Photo 11. The New Radio Shack PC Board with All Components Installed
(https://s6.postimg.org/mbrscwkip/SP-_BS22-_LR_Mod15.jpg)
Photo 12. The New Radio Shack PC Board with all Leads Trimmed – Except for L2 Lead at Location A2, 20
It’s now time to sandwich the old, original crossover board and the new Radio Shack PC Board together. You will need to install one short jumper wire to connect the GND signals of the two boards. This wire connects to the IN- location on the original crossover and the ground trace on the Radio Shack PC Board. I connected this wired to location A1, 27 on my boards, but it can be connected to any A1 location. I looped this wire around the bottom of the boards, rather than the side, to make it easier to get the new crossover through the terminal cup opening when reinstalling it into the cabinet. This is the black wire shown near the bottom left of the board in Photos 13, 14 and 15.
Sandwich the two boards together, with the 1/8” nylon spacers between them. Doing so will require the long inductor L2 lead to pass through the IN+ via on the original crossover board. Solder this lead to the bottom side of the via and then trim the excess lead as short as possible. Connect the IN+ and IN- leads to the appropriate terminals on the terminal cup.
That completes the electrical assembly of the new crossover. It’s now time to complete the mechanical assembly. Again with the 1/8” nylon spacers between the two boards, install #6 x ¾” mounting screws at the four 1/8” mounting hole locations. Using the #2 Phillips screwdriver, drive these screws into the four plastic mounting posts on the terminal cup. Once these screws are tightened the mechanical assembly of the crossover network is complete and your crossover should look similar to the one shown in Photos 13, 14 and 15.
(https://s6.postimg.org/j3nazuy8x/SP-_BS22-_LR_Mod16.jpg)
Photo 13. The Assembled Crossover – Top View
(https://s6.postimg.org/3tnfso2qp/SP-_BS22-_LR_Mod17.jpg)
Photo 14. The Assembled Crossover – Left ¾ View
(https://s6.postimg.org/5k6gu5k9t/SP-_BS22-_LR_Mod18.jpg)
Photo 15. The Assembled Crossover – Right ¾ View
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Step 4 – Reassembly:
Insert the crossover through the terminal cup opening in the rear of the speaker cabinet. Install the four original terminal cup mounting screws and tighten them with the #2 Phillips screwdriver.
(https://s6.postimg.org/x4zalf1sx/SP-_BS22-_LR_Mod20.jpg)
Photo 16. The New Crossover Mounted in the Speaker Cabinet
Connect the TW+ and TW- leads to the appropriate tabs on the new Vifa tweeter and install the tweeter in the cabinet. Before installing the tweeter mounting screws, reach in through the woofer opening and check to make sure the TW+ lead did not slide off its terminal. It’s a bit of a tight fit getting the new tweeter into the opening and that can cause the TW+ lead to become disconnected. If the TW+ lead did come off its terminal, reconnect it at this time. Install and tighten four #6 x ¾” screws to secure the tweeter to the cabinet.
Connect the W+ and W- leads to the appropriate terminals on the woofer and install the woofer in the cabinet using four of the #6 x ¾” mounting screws. Photo 17 shows the front view of an original, unmodified Pioneer SP-BS22-LR side-by-side with a modified speaker. The only outwardly visible differences are the new tweeter and the Phillips head driver mounting screws.
(https://s6.postimg.org/mw6tfldr5/SP-_BS22-_LR_Mod19.jpg)
Photo 17. Before (Left) and After (Right).
Congratulations, your modification is complete. Hook it up and give it a listen. If all sounds well, repeat the process for the second speaker. When both speakers are complete, hook them up to your electronics and enjoy them. If you completed all the steps successfully, you should now have a very awesome sounding set of speakers at a bargain price.
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hi
Thank you for Posting this Modification really helps taking this
speaker to next level !
Do you have similar Modification for Floorstanding Speaker SP-FS52?
Thanks again
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hi
Thank you for Posting this Modification really helps taking this
speaker to next level !
Do you have similar Modification for Floorstanding Speaker SP-FS52?
Thanks again
Whoa MCM Fan--that's a work of DIY art. And it must have taken you longer to prepare the documentation than to build the mods. I really appreciate your making the investment to draw all of that up. It makes what I sent you pretty low rent, but you were obviously able to figure everything out. Since I first started selling the mod, Pioneer has greatly improved the quality control on their stock tweeters. The first few runs were all over the map, and you never knew quite what the speaker would sound like. Now most measure consistently, with a smooth but drooping high end from 2 kHz to 10 kHz, and then a rise to a peak at 15k. The mod is intended to provide more baffle step compensation for a cleaner midrange, and a superior tweeter for more open mid-highs. The new crossover keeps the response within +/- 1.5 dB up to about 13 kHz, where there is a small rise in output. I could have done a little better than that, but wanted to retain as many of the stock crossover components as possible to keep costs down.
I also have modded versions of the center channel and the towers. Thanks again MCM Fan!
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I want to thank you both. Good music reproduction shouldn't just be a "rich man's hobby". The work you are doing is a good thing. For the audio hobby to thrive, it can't just be about $1000 power cables. I heard the modded Pioneers at CAF and they gave a very good account of themselves in a room full of substantially more expensive, world class offerings.
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Very impressive post. It deserves to be a sticky, and it will be, but sticky status seems to kill continued posting for some reason, maybe the placement on the page or something. So for the time being we'll let it ride on the regular section, when posting slows down it will get its well deserved sticky.
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Whoa MCM Fan--that's a work of DIY art. And it must have taken you longer to prepare the documentation than to build the mods. I really appreciate your making the investment to draw all of that up. It makes what I sent you pretty low rent, but you were obviously able to figure everything out. Since I first started selling the mod, Pioneer has greatly improved the quality control on their stock tweeters. The first few runs were all over the map, and you never knew quite what the speaker would sound like. Now most measure consistently, with a smooth but drooping high end from 2 kHz to 10 kHz, and then a rise to a peak at 15k. The mod is intended to provide more baffle step compensation for a cleaner midrange, and a superior tweeter for more open mid-highs. The new crossover keeps the response within +/- 1.5 dB up to about 13 kHz, where there is a small rise in output. I could have done a little better than that, but wanted to retain as many of the stock crossover components as possible to keep costs down.
I also have modded versions of the center channel and the towers. Thanks again MCM Fan!
Dennis,
Thanks you for sharing your schematic and design notes with me, and thanks for encouraging me to create this DIY and share it with the online community. I'm glad you're pleased with my little write up and hope others will give it a try.
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Very impressive post. It deserves to be a sticky, and it will be, but sticky status seems to kill continued posting for some reason, maybe the placement on the page or something. So for the time being we'll let it ride on the regular section, when posting slows down it will get its well deserved sticky.
Thanks, I think that would be great. Based on the response here every time these speakers go on sale, they are selling very well to the members of this community. Making this DIY a sticky will ensure that the owners of these amazing little speakers will be modding them an improving them for years to come.
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I want to thank you both. Good music reproduction shouldn't just be a "rich man's hobby". The work you are doing is a good thing. For the audio hobby to thrive, it can't just be about $1000 power cables. I heard the modded Pioneers at CAF and they gave a very good account of themselves in a room full of substantially more expensive, world class offerings.
I agree 100%. If good music reproduction was strictly a "rich man's hobby" I would be excluded. Thanks goodness it's not! And, thank goodness for people like Andrew Jones and Dennis Murphy that make it possible for folks like me, with modest budgets, to enjoy great sounding music reproduction.
He's some quotes from a couple posts I made in another forum earlier today that summarize my feelings about these mods and the resulting sound of the modded speakers:
Now that I finally got around to posting this, I'm anxious for others to perform these mods. I know it takes a while to order and receive the parts, but once you have everything it doesn't take that long to perform the mods - an evening, or perhaps two if you're a slow, meticulous worker.
I'm looking forward to feedback on the instructions and I also want to hear how others think the speakers sound after the modifications. I've been listening to my modded pair for over two months and love them. I picked up another set back in early July when they were on sale for $65.00. I've done quite a bit of direct A/B comparison listening of the modded versus unmodded speakers. I could immediately hear the improvement. The modded speakers have much smoother highs and upper midrange, just an overall smoother, more refined, more detailed sound. The imaging is fantastic, and the bass that little 4" woofer puts out continues to impress. I prefer running these speakers with a subwoofer to fill out the very bottom end (I'm using a Definitive Technology ProSub 800), but for the A/B comparisons, I ran them subless.
I really liked these speakers before the mods, and was amazed by how good they sounded given the price. I absolutely love the modded version. In my opinion these mods turn a very good sounding speaker into a great sounding speaker that even budget conscious audiophiles can afford. I like the modded version so much, I'm going to mod my second pair this week.
So please, anyone who attempts these mods, share your experiences, both performing the mods and post-mod listening experience, with others in this thread. These speakers are so popular, and have gotten so much attention in this forum, I hope many, many Cheap and Cheerful DIYers will give this mod a try.
The goal of sharing these modifications is to make these improvements available to the widest possible audience. Dennis has always been an enthusiastic supporter of the DIY community. This is just his latest contribution. I urge anyone who has these speakers, and the skills and tools to complete these modifications, to give it a try.
Based on my experience, you won't be disappointed with the results. I love my modded speakers and listen to them every morning and every evening Combined with good electronics and excellent source material, I continue to be amazed at how good these little, inexpensive speakers sound.
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I don't even have the speakers but I wanted to tell you MCM_Fan that I was so impressed by your generosity and graciousness for taking the incredible amount of your valuable time to share this with everyone. What an endeavor and very well done. We are quite fortunate that you would do this. Thank you so much.
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I have 3 Pioneer SP-C22 centers that I want to use as fronts and center in a home theater system. Mr. Murphy seemed to indicate that these used a different Vifa tweeter and that there wasn't any need to modify the crossover. Can he or someone supply the Part#'s and confirm or deny about not needing mods? Thanks.
P.S. I also posted this request on the Pioneer......are nice thread. I realized after this was the better place for it. Thanks.
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:bowdown: :drums: :guitar: :rock: :bounce: :hyper:
Off the hook! Wow! Fantastic post. My brother - in - law owns a pair of Dennis Murphy's modified Pioneer units and he is very happy. Perhaps, he'll let me play a little to add on a few of these tweaks.
A treatise to DIY journalism MCM_Fan! :beer: :dance:
Best,
Anand.
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I have 3 Pioneer SP-C22 centers that I want to use as fronts and center in a home theater system. Mr. Murphy seemed to indicate that these used a different Vifa tweeter and that there wasn't any need to modify the crossover. Can he or someone supply the Part#'s and confirm or deny about not needing mods? Thanks.
P.S. I also posted this request on the Pioneer......are nice thread. I realized after this was the better place for it. Thanks.
I'm not sure whether someone pointed this out to you on the other site, but if not, I think you must have misinterpreted something I said. None of the Pioneer stock speakers uses a vifa tweeter. They all use the same house tweeter, or at least close variants on that. The center benefits from a switch to the Vifa tweeter just as much as the monitor or tower. I don't have DIY documentation drawn up for that mod, however. The center is listed for sale on my site.
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Hello,
Parts on order at Parts Express.
I started the process and removed all the parts from one speaker cross-over...and did the C1 10uf NP on the back side of the board
One question I have so far is the R1 .33 ohm 10w resistor. On the schematic you have one side is connected to W+ and the other connected to C1.
Looking at your picture and the board it looks like the side closest to the W wires for the R1 .33 ohm resistor is connected to the W- wire?
Am I missing something here? The schematic doenst show one side of the R1 going to ground? Just one to W+ and the other to C1?
Help!
Thanks
ALex
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Could you post a picture of the back side of the PC board from Rat Shack, it would be nice to see the holes etc from the back side.
If that's possible great but if their in the speakers, well.... :D
Alex
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Hello,
Parts on order at Parts Express.
I started the process and removed all the parts from one speaker cross-over...and did the C1 10uf NP on the back side of the board
One question I have so far is the R1 .33 ohm 10w resistor. On the schematic you have one side is connected to W+ and the other connected to C1.
Looking at your picture and the board it looks like the side closest to the W wires for the R1 .33 ohm resistor is connected to the W- wire?
Am I missing something here? The schematic doenst show one side of the R1 going to ground? Just one to W+ and the other to C1?
Help!
Thanks
ALex
Alex,
Electrically, the schematic is correct. However, the schematic, as it was originally drawn, does not match the implementation. R1 and C1 are in series. So, electrically, it doesn't matter which one is connected to W+ and which one is connected to GND. However, since the original PCB has C1 connected to W+ and R1 connected to GND, I can see how this might be confusing. I will edit and re-upload the schematic to reverse the order of these components to eliminate any confusion.
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Could you post a picture of the back side of the PC board from Rat Shack, it would be nice to see the holes etc from the back side.
If that's possible great but if their in the speakers, well.... :D
Alex
I'm listening to the speakers as I type this and don't really want to disassemble them to take more photos. Perhaps when I get around to modifying my second set, I'll add the photo you requested.
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It'll cost you a bit more $, but I'd use No-Rez from Danny at GR-Research (http://gr-research.com/norez24x27sheet.aspx). It always seems to make a significant difference. You'll probably have enough left over to do another pair or something, given how much you need. I like to put it on the binding posts cup backside.
What about bypassing C3 and C4 with some cheap and cheerful .1uf caps? (http://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/sa-cap-630vdc/claritycap-0.10-mfd-sa-range-polypropylene-caps/)
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I had a pair of Dennis Murphy's affordable accuracy monitors delivered to me on Friday. I am currently using a Job 225 power amp and a Job Pre2 preamp in my system . Dennis's modifications make a decent speaker designed to meet a set price point sound fantastic.
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Hey thanks for the quick response!
Ok I understand now....I always check and double check when I do DIY stuff.
My parts should be on early next week and I hope to have them back up and running late next week.
Thanks again so much for putting this together, the Radio Shack pert board is a great way to do this!!
Np on the backside photo, I wanted to see how close you got to the gnd lands...
All the best
Alex
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Np on the backside photo, I wanted to see how close you got to the gnd lands...
OK, that I can do. When I drilled the Radio Shack perf boards, I did all four at once. So, I still have two that have been drilled and had the red wires installed. Here you go:
(https://s6.postimg.org/d1b2vmkf5/SP-_BS22-_LR_Mod21.jpg)
Notice, I shifted the two mounting holes to favor the A column over the F column. Other than inductor L3, that is connected to F1,1, nothing else is connected to the F column. So it doesn't matter if you completely sever this trace when drilling the mounting hole at E5.5,15.5. As you can see in the photo, I barely nicked the trace when drilling the hole at A1.5,15.5. This is the important trace to preserve. And, as I said in the text, if you do accidentally sever this trace, you can always install a jumper wire around the mounting hole.
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Thanks for the picture of the back side of the perf board.
I see the schematic has been updated as well... great!
I got a email from parts express and all the parts, tweeters etc have shipped!!!
Both speakers have been opened up, the 2.5 mm T-handle wrench worked easily to remove the speaker screws.
Just need to run up and get some of the #6 1/8" nylon spacers.
Can't wait to listen to these with Dennis' Crossover!
Alex
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I had a pair of Dennis Murphy's affordable accuracy monitors delivered to me on Friday. I am currently using a Job 225 power amp and a Job Pre2 preamp in my system . Dennis's modifications make a decent speaker designed to meet a set price point sound fantastic.
Agreed! I have been listening to my self-modified SP-BS22-LR speakers for almost 3 months now and absolutely love the sound. I am very grateful to Dennis Murphy, Andrew Jones and Pioneer for providing me so much listening pleasure without significantly draining my bank account. Fabulous bang for the buck!
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Thanks for the picture of the back side of the perf board.
I see the schematic has been updated as well... great!
I got a email from parts express and all the parts, tweeters etc have shipped!!!
Both speakers have been opened up, the 2.5 mm T-handle wrench worked easily to remove the speaker screws.
Just need to run up and get some of the #6 1/8" nylon spacers.
Can't wait to listen to these with Dennis' Crossover!
Alex
No problem. Thanks for the feedback on the schematic. Anything that makes this mod easier to understand is welcome. That was the motivation behind posting this DIY - to make these great sounding speakers available to as many people as possible.
Please keep us posted on your build progress and when you're done, let us know what you think of your new speakers.
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It'll cost you a bit more $, but I'd use No-Rez from Danny at GR-Research (http://gr-research.com/norez24x27sheet.aspx). It always seems to make a significant difference. You'll probably have enough left over to do another pair or something, given how much you need. I like to put it on the binding posts cup backside.
What about bypassing C3 and C4 with some cheap and cheerful .1uf caps? (http://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/sa-cap-630vdc/claritycap-0.10-mfd-sa-range-polypropylene-caps/)
The No-Rez looks very similar to (only thicker than) the Sonic Barrier I used, but at about twice the cost. 1" thick would be pretty bulky in these small cabinets. But, if you have the material and like it, give it a try and let us know what you think. The one sheet of 1/2" Sonic Barrier I got from Parts Express for $9.95 gave me enough for two sets of speakers. So, I'm all set.
Oh boy, bypassing caps are a subject of some controversy. I don't really want to go down that rat hole in this thread (there are MANY, very long threads on this topic in other forums). I did not design the crossover, so I'll refrain from commenting on this topic. If Dennis wants to chime in, I'll leave that to him. Again, I urge you to experiment. Try the mods with and without the bypassing caps and let us know if you hear any differences.
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The No-Rez looks very similar to (only thicker than) the Sonic Barrier I used, but at about twice the cost. 1" thick would be pretty bulky in these small cabinets. But, if you have the material and like it, give it a try and let us know what you think. The one sheet of 1/2" Sonic Barrier I got from Parts Express for $9.95 gave me enough for two sets of speakers. So, I'm all set.
Oh boy, bypassing caps are a subject of some controversy. I don't really want to go down that rat hole in this thread (there are MANY, very long threads on this topic in other forums). I did not design the crossover, so I'll refrain from commenting on this topic. If Dennis wants to chime in, I'll leave that to him. Again, I urge you to experiment. Try the mods with and without the bypassing caps and let us know if you hear any differences.
With and without, love it! (capacitors, always fun)
Read up on people's implementation of the No-Rez. While it's not all together different looking, the results are pretty intensely different. Size is no concern "With No Rez the damping layer does take up air space. However, the foam layer slows down the air flow in the box making the woofer act as if it is in a larger air space. Usually the net effect is about a wash. " - Danny Richie
People report much improved midrange by removing other products like PE's!
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Wow I just got the parts in from parets Express and was astounded at the size of the package!!
All this for 2 tweeters, a sheet of foam, screws, caps and inductors!!!
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=104882)
I chose the lowest cost shipping and it came in three days from Ohio to NC.
Should have the crossovers done by tomorrow afternoon, have company today...will post and let you know how it goes and how they sound to me!
Alex
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Good luck with the build. Once it's done, give them a good listen and let us know what you think
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Well I just spent an three hours of listening and typing up my review and thoughts!!!
But I hit a delete key and lost it all!!!
&^%(^%(%(&^%
So here we go again!!
Well the project is completed and working very well.
My hats off to Dennis and MCM_Fan for all the great design and web work to allow is DIY'ers to do the upgrades to the Pioneer 22's!
I was emailing Dennis back in the beginning and was tempted to install them a few months back but never got around to it.
I listened to the speakers and thought they were indeed good for the price, but nothing I would want to listen to for any serious listening etc. I did post in the original 22 thread that mine were boomy on the bass end in my listening room and location.
So they were hung up behind one of my pcs I use for aircraft simulator stuff and gaming.
It wasn't until I saw your recent thread and your pictures, parts list etc...seemed easy enough to do I couldn't refuse doing the upgrade! My listening environment is a HT PC I built with all my ripped flacs to a HRT Music Streamer + DAC to a AVA Insight + preamp to a AVA UltraValve tube amp.
I really like Frank's stuff and his no-nonsense attitude, we are two peas in a pod there....my love for that old Dynaco stuff drove me to buying one of Franks UltraValves. I use it mainly with a pair of Jim Salks SongTowersa. Its a marriage made in audio heaven.
So I sat the little 22's on top of my SongTowers for listening....good stands!! LOL.
Before my listening results and review, the modding of the speakers deserves some attention! It took me about 8 hours of time all toll, 2 hrs here, and hr there etc...not all that bad. The instructions and pix on the site are very, very helpful and made it easy...just read the whole set to get and understanding of how MCM_Fan did the mod....you don't have to, but you should it will save you some time to get it right the first time.
The perf board is a great way to easily add the components Dennis has identified for the new tweeter etc....to be integrated with the 4" woofer. The holes in the original crossover PC boards did not match the perf board holed exactly and I had to do some "futzing" and enlarging to get to line up etc.
I did not use the 1/8" nylon spacers, I had a bunch of hard rubberized washers and used them....worked well etc. I made patterns for the new foam padding for the lower half and hot glued the original white insulation to the top half around the exhaust port.
I did burn my thumb with a hot drip of hot glue...gosh that was fun!! LOL.
It was easy to install the new crossover and the new tweeter...I did use a dremel tool as well with a round sanding disk, made this part quick and easy but "dusty". LOL. The hardest part to me was removing the rubberized foam gasket from the old tweeter to be used with the new tweeter...you have to be careful and work slowly, I used a #11 xacto Knife.
All in all this is really a simple DIY project, but its labor intensive, just have to slow down and think.....check and re-check. I almost put a scewdriver threw a woofer installing one back in!! That would have really ruined my day!!
When you start putting the speakers back in you get a little excited knowing that that they fruits of you labor are close to being "reaped"!! good or bad! I did attach the speakers to the completed crossover assembly and test to make sure sound came out both speakers and I didn't do anything really incorrect. I might say the new crossovers really look great and well layed out...if you like working with this stuff its "pretty"!!! LOL.
Ok so how do they sound now?
Well I listened for three solid hours....its that good to me now....
At the end of the three hours I hooked up my Salk SongTowers to see what I was missing..well the 22's are no SongTowers for sure.
The SongTowers provide more of everything...more presence, larger wall of sound, filling the listening room effortlessly etc....
But...
That said I could listen to the new re-vamped Pioneers for hours and really enjoy them....they are really nice compared to what I listened to before. I don'tt know what fixed the "boominness" I had before....but its totally tamed or gone....all during the three hours of listening I was constantly surprised at how well these 4 inch woofers were presenting bass. Now I wished I had done this mod earlier!!LOL.
Ok here is what I listened to:
Joshua Bell's At Home with Friends, Porgy and Bess. Trumpet, and violins...absolutely superb...5 Stars here.
Very realistic trumpet and violin sounds. like the real thing...well..close anyhow.
Larry Carlton...I have of his music, all sound fantastic, great details, easily discerned and well imaged. 4 Stars.
Also Known as Mary by Quincy, female voice..."I'm Crying" is A+ for imaging and clarity...5 Stars.
Johnny Cash American IV, Male Voice and plain old guitar...really really nice..5 Stars.
Natalie Cole/Diana Krall...."Ask A Woman Who Knows".....again excellent....imaging, separation, 4 Stars.
Blue by Double, 'Woman of the World"....Percussion shines 4 Stars.
Four Play.....This is one of Dennis demo cuts!!! LOL....Song is called "Chant". Great opening drum whacks. Usually play this over and over for sound accuracy and
attack...bite etc...but I found myself listening to the entire track for once, it was that great...5 Stars.
Acoustic Alchemy, "Blue Chip Bop"....This is a really "tight cut with "bite"....Very well articulated...5 Stars.
I forget where this one came from but its a female jazz singer singing "All that Jazz"....from one of my many demo cs....5+ Stars.
Jack McGuffey, Bringing it Home...."After Hours"...piano is 5 Stars.
Joni Mitchell's Don Juan's Reckless Daughter...."Overture- Cotten" 6 Stars! Wonderful details, imaging etc.
Jimmy Smiths Dot Com Blues...."Tuition Blues: one of the demo standards....this is indeed 6 Stars to me...
Eva Casasidy Songbird from Eva by Heart.....Very 3 dimensional....really really good, like a well done live concert well recorded.
Kirk Whalum.....For You, "Anytime"5 Stars...Great Sax..
there were many others, like Dave Grusin stuff, Famous Blue Raincoat etc...
The net of it is the mod to me has mad a HUGE difference to me and is well, well worth it. I don't see how you can do better at this price point...if your on a budget this is a sure winner! The huge part for me is that the boomy stuff is gone and it makes these speakers listenable to me, the bass is now better and the new tweeter and the crossover makes these a really nice set of bookshelf speakers at a modest price.
I am now tempted to get a Pioneer center channel speaker and mod for my HT!! The longerI listened to them the more I liked what I was hearing. They are not perfect by any means...I played some deep organ music...well it is a 4 inch woofer.....LOL. I think their small size....that they have harder time filling up the room towards a more real presentation, but in their "size" they do a wonderful job at almost getting there!! (at least in my small listening room).
Thanks again for the help with this thread to getting me to do the upgrade!!
Dennis your truly a "rocket scientist"!!
All the best
Alex
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Well I just spent an three hours of listening and typing up my review and thoughts!!!
But I hit a delete key and lost it all!!!
Just hit Ctrl-Z. It comes back.
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Ha!
I wish it did, tried that....oh well....its done....I have a new tablet "surface" and the portable keyboard isn't exactly the same size...I type too fast and am sloppy!!
Hey did I tell you the boomy side of the 22's has been tamed...
Don't know if the extra foam padding in the lower woofer half helped with this and or Dennis's low end part of the crossover update or the combination of the two....most likely that.
The bass that is there is done very well now....(that is the bass freq's these can actually reproduce..)
Great percussion etc...
When you have something for a long time it seems after awhile it becomes "standard" or "normal" then when something new like this speaker and mod...its once again "new" and you get to re-discover your music collection...
That alone is enough to do this upgrade!!!
Alex
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Alex,
Congrats on completing the mods and thanks for posting your impressions of the modified speakers. I love, love, love mine. I've tried not to be too much of a cheerleader for these mods. A great many people are quite happy with these speakers in their unmodified state, but I heard the difference immediately, and after 3 months of daily listening, I am still enjoying these inexpensive, modified Pioneer SP-BS22-LR speakers very, very much. They sound so smooth and are so easy to listen to I could, and do, listen to them all day long.
Welcome to the club! One of these weekends, I need to finish modifying my second pair.
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Cool.... yes I understand not being a cheer leader, but in this case its one of those really neat things that really does make a real world difference... so cheer on my friend!!
I could not listen to them very much at all, and thought hey they will make good external gaming pc speakers!! Ha!!
Not now...
I have a set of polkas I will now use for that duty!!..
The overall sound quality and resolving power is really outstanding now with these speakers. While listening to some Larry Carlton music I was amazed at the sound and timbre of the wire brushes and the percussion instruments.... amazing.
I need to look into the center channel is the schematic any where around for it??
Alex
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Hello - new member here.
This project looks like far too much fun to pass up. However, the Vifa BC25TG15 tweeters are out of stock. I don't mind the extra $$ for the XT25BG60's, but not sure if these would work with the crossover as designed. The specs are close, I'm just worried about the sensitivity.
http://www.parts-express.com/vifa-xt25bg60-04-1-shielded-dual-ring-radiator-tweeter--264-1012 (http://www.parts-express.com/vifa-xt25bg60-04-1-shielded-dual-ring-radiator-tweeter--264-1012)
Thanks!
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Has anyone compared these to the GR Research-modded Insignia NS-B2111? I have a stock set of the Insignias I was considering modding, but if the modded Pioneer SP-BS22-LR sounds way better, maybe I'll buy some of those pre-modded.
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Has anyone compared these to the GR Research-modded Insignia NS-B2111? I have a stock set of the Insignias I was considering modding, but if the modded Pioneer SP-BS22-LR sounds way better, maybe I'll buy some of those pre-modded.
Anybody? :o
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Hello Steveturner, I don't have the Insignias but I did mod the sp-bs22 and they sound incredible, they're outstanding jaw dropping cheap speakers. I read someone in this same forum tested the Insignias and he said they sound better than the pioneers.
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I have some Insignia's with better caps and resistors from PE and a pair of stock Pioneer's. IMHO the Pioneer's sound better and are very easy and enjoyable to listen to. I have used the Insignia's in a near field application and the image very well. A friend of mine has done the Dennis Murphy mods with Sonicaps, Mills resistors and other minor mods, We want to compare the two before I do the same mods to my Pioneer's. My friend said the results are very promising, they are still burning in as of the last time I talked to him.
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Sorry my comment was toward pinkfloy4ever post not steveturner.
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ummm pardon my ignorance here ..but does the red+ jumper wire and the in+ connect at the original spot on the stock board ?
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So nobody out there has any advice? i just don't want to short My amplifier.
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ummm pardon my ignorance here ..but does the red+ jumper wire and the in+ connect at the original spot on the stock board ?
There is no red+ jumper wire. As shown in the schematic and described in the text, that is the original lead that connects directly to the + input terminal on the speaker cup. It does not connect to the original crossover PCB at any location. It connects directly from the + input terminal on the speaker cup to location D3,29 on the Radio Shack perf board, as shown in Table 4.
As shown in Photos 6 and 7, there is no wire connected to the IN+ via on the original crossover PCB. Here is the text that accompanies those photos:
"You will also need to remove the IN+ lead (red wire) from the PCB and pull it apart from the IN- lead. Set it aside for reuse.
At this point, the only items remaining attached to the original crossover PCB are L1, R1 the W+/W- leads and the IN- lead."
Just so you are 100% clear on where that wire attaches, I opened up one of my speakers and took a photo:
(https://s6.postimg.org/ei86ub3hd/SP-_BS22-_LR_Mod22.jpg)
So nobody out there has any advice? i just don't want to short My amplifier.
Please do not blame anyone else if you damage your gear. The warnings were made very clear at the beginning of the article that if you are uncomfortable doing this DIY you should not attempt it. At this point, I'd strongly recommend you have someone qualified review your work before connecting the modified speakers to an amp and applying power. It should have been very clear to you, from the schematic, where this lead is connected.
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Thanks ... yeah wasn't sure if a jumper was needed ..I tested it and its working...thanks :wink:
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Thanks ... yeah wasn't sure if a jumper was needed ..I tested it and its working...thanks :wink:
You're welcome. I hope you enjoy them. I had mine out of the rotation for a couple months, in favor of a pair of Klipsch KG4s I picked up at Goodwill for $24.99, but I missed the little Pioneers. I swapped them back into my main system about a week ago and am loving listening to them once again. They are amazing little speakers, especially with these modifications.
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Here's my experience. I started out with a pair stock BS22's. They sounded ok and I listened to them quite a bit while the Vifa tweeters and cap were on the way. I made the DIY mods and there was quite a difference. About two weeks ago I ordered a pair of Dennis's modded BS22s. WOW! I'm set for speakers for quite a while. At the price Dennis is selling it's a no brainer. The signal chain is pretty important of course, as is room treatment. I'm using AVA (a few generations old) eqpt with my desktop computer as the source, and so far only with mp3s. I'm getting ready to fire up some flacs.
If your looking for some inexpensive speakers that 'punch way above their weight class', these are the ones.
Thanks, Dennis!
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About two weeks ago I ordered a pair of Dennis's modded BS22s. WOW! I'm set for speakers for quite a while. At the price Dennis is selling it's a no brainer.
If your looking for some inexpensive speakers that 'punch way above their weight class', these are the ones.
Continue to enjoy the adventure - they are really nice.
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Hi All, hoping someone can weigh in on a couple of questions:
I have a 5.1.2 full set of these speakers (recently ditched the sub for an SVS PB-12 NSD) and am using the BS22s as surrounds with a C22 up front and FS52s as my LR. I recently replaced the crossover components (same values) and added the Vifa tweeter to the C22 along with a 3.9uF and 2r before the positive terminal on the Vifa as suggested in other threads. After all that, I'm finding that the new tweeter is a bit muffled to my ears, which is obviously disappointing. Any tips would be greatly appreciated.
Additionally, I like tinkering and so decided that even though they're my surrounds I wanted to do the upgrade described in this thread to my BS22s. My question is this: Given the fact that I have a great sub, would I be better off using the upgraded BS22s as my LR and getting new surrounds (hopefully I could find another set of BS22s). Will the upgraded BS22s outperform the FS52s despite their size and extra woofers since I have a dedicated, powerful sub? It's hard to imagine that being the case, and I'm somewhat attached to the way the towers look, but of course I'd rather have the best sound possible.
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The reason that the C22 may not sound good is that the mod with the 3.9uF/2.2ohm parts is designed as a mod to the original crossover and tweeter. Go ahead and swap out the vifa for the original tweeter and see what you think.
Since you have the vifa tweeter, I personally would opt for the Dennis redesigned crossover for the C22. Again, note the vifa tweeter should be the 4 ohm version.
A good rule of thumb in audio is that if it is associated with Dennis Murphy, whether it be a mod or one of his designs, the end result is always satisfying. If you end up with a speaker that is quite not that great, then your ears have basically determined that YOU have made some kind of error in assembly and you need to go back and check your work :wink:.