Big Heavy or Hand Held amps?

2bigears · « **on:** 1 Jun 2018, 05:33 pm »

jello everybody, cold as shit up here in Canada. Good lord this climate change is crazy. Need a new amp. If a spaceship landed today and read a few threads here. The dude would be totally confused. Little ice amps or big heavies of old design. I've had the largest heavies and the headroom was amazing. Power sucking Earth killing machines but great music. Have not heard the D's . Remote location and few stores here. Less all the time. Not sure left or right here. It's all about the sound. Are these D's that dam good ? The big old amps are Harley Davidson's with the new D's Nikola Tesla ..... this truly is confusing. Both sides state SOTA
Paradox of Choice

JerryM · « **Reply #1 on:** 1 Jun 2018, 05:40 pm »

What kind of power/current do you need, Pat?

It's a brisk 70 °F here in So Cal...

Tyson · « **Reply #2 on:** 1 Jun 2018, 05:43 pm »

I really like having efficient speakers, it opens up a lot of options re: amplification.

Wind Chaser · « **Reply #3 on:** 1 Jun 2018, 05:43 pm »

Quote from: 2bigears on 1 Jun 2018, 05:33 pm

Are these D's that dam good ?

Yes, if you buy the right one, they are of the charts bloody fantastic!

Wind Chaser · « **Reply #4 on:** 1 Jun 2018, 05:51 pm »

Hey Pascal, if you want to hear some serious Class D, come on down to the South Okanagan and you can hear my Maraschinos. Bring you favorite tube amp along and we'll do a Pepsi challenge.

2bigears · « **Reply #5 on:** 1 Jun 2018, 06:12 pm »

70 deg ,,,,,ha , you suck,,,,, that's so nice. Cali does get the good weather.
A big advan of the D's are of course size and pwr savings. But horsepower is a man thing and I like it. Who doesent. Gives you options for speakers. The D's are saying now they have 1000 hp. Is this the same hp as the old heavies have ? Chaser, would love to visit the Okie this summer. Miss that place. Better not be the smoke though. Ha.

Dieterle Tool · « **Reply #6 on:** 1 Jun 2018, 07:15 pm »

Just like a good ole V-8, there is no replacement for displacement. Big, iron core transformers sound the best to me. Not trying to start a war, just an opinion.

(we're reaching three digit temperatures here in Dallas this week)

-Dieter

Elizabeth · « **Reply #7 on:** 1 Jun 2018, 08:39 pm »

I would not buy a class D amp.
Looking at the test measurements of them gives me the willies.
Sure they are decent.
Just me.
I like big Solid State amps.
I own a Bryston 4B-SST²

I do not like tube amps. Tube preamp OK,

Nor big Class A. way too hot and too much electric bill for me.

JCarney · « **Reply #8 on:** 1 Jun 2018, 08:49 pm »

I had big heavy ss amps in my system for quite awhile. Then I was introduced to digital amps, specifically the Pascal modules. I got rid of the big heavy amps because the digital amps where a clear step up. No big iron core transformers in these things. You can carry two mono blocks under your arm like a couple of books and have 1500 watts per mono, with a power supply that exceeds the demands of the amp module. Kinda like having a reduction gear in turbo prop plane. For me it was an easy choice. The Pascal's have the best control of the drivers I have ever experienced. Small form factor, runs cool, does not make the lights dim on bass heavy passages, and uses considerably less juice than the big monsters out there. IMHO, digital amps are the real deal, and will continue to garner followers.

JCarney

Folsom · « **Reply #9 on:** 1 Jun 2018, 09:17 pm »

Quote from: 2bigears on 1 Jun 2018, 06:12 pm

70 deg ,,,,,ha , you suck,,,,, that's so nice. Cali does get the good weather.
A big advan of the D's are of course size and pwr savings. But horsepower is a man thing and I like it. Who doesent. Gives you options for speakers. The D's are saying now they have 1000 hp. Is this the same hp as the old heavies have ? Chaser, would love to visit the Okie this summer. Miss that place. Better not be the smoke though. Ha.

No. The classD ICE amps have rated outputs for given amounts of time. As in a long enough bass note can make them cut their power down by huge amounts. Some big class A/AB can do their power all day, other smaller ones cannot. In general you may not ever notice with classD, but it is a truth of it.

Questions...

Budget?

What speakers?

What are your favorite stereos, types of speakers and amps, that you've heard and wished you had?

Bob Stark · « **Reply #10 on:** 1 Jun 2018, 10:20 pm »

2BEs,

I had an Edge M6 and a Bryston 8B for many years between them. I bought a pair of Nuforce Ref 9 V3 SE monos about 2 years ago. I liked them a lot as they were very detailed, dynamic, with great bass. After reading about TDSS, the authorized repair for Nuforce and Nuprime electronics, I called Bob Smith, who does all the mods and repairs for them. Following a few calls, I took my amps to Bob for his Level 3 upgrades. In addition to the wonderful sound these upgrades allow, they also make the amps much more reliable in the future.

The amps now have a better, and more powerful power supply in addition to several other things that got replaced. Bob uses copper bus bars and other low noise additions that make the sound so real, dynamic, detailed, and with seemingly unlimited ability to scale volume. He doesn't change any of the original circuitry so the sound remains squarely in the Nuforce camp--which is good. BUT...it's like the amps are now on steroids , yet they sound beautiful and live even at low volume. These were 175 watts/ch at 8 ohms prior, but Bob says they now act like 250 watts/ch. I've brought them over to 5 different systems at friends houses, and all of them have reacted the same way--their systems have never sounded this good or even close. The speakers involved were Tekton Double Impacts, with a boat load of upgrades to the drivers, wires and crossovers by Bill Dion (grannyring on Audiogon), Sonus Faber $20,000 speakers, SP Tech, Aether Audio, and my own VMPS RM40s. All of them very different to drive speakers. All sounded magnificent. And yes, you can fit a pair of them under one arm like 2 books. Bob says the Level 3 upgrades make the amps better sounding than the top of the line Ref 20's from Nuprime.

2bigears · « **Reply #11 on:** 1 Jun 2018, 10:20 pm »

thanks guys. I will alway judge by the stereo I should have just kept. But it was big and 4 large
I had VAC Ren Sig pre with 750 KW Mus Fed amp. ProAc 3.6 I will be getting dif speakers too. Have the mini T's now.
Starting from scratch. I really amp a confused monkey .

Wind Chaser · « **Reply #12 on:** 1 Jun 2018, 10:22 pm »

Quote from: Dieterle Tool on 1 Jun 2018, 07:15 pm

Just like a good ole V-8, there is no replacement for displacement. Big, iron core transformers sound the best to me. Not trying to start a war, just an opinion.

What Class D amps have you heard?

2bigears · « **Reply #13 on:** 1 Jun 2018, 10:30 pm »

lately all the "game changer" talk with builders makes you wonder about pushing the BS button. ?

Wallacefl · « **Reply #14 on:** 1 Jun 2018, 10:34 pm »

I have a Bryston 14BSST (heavy) and a Benchmark (light)...resolve and sound about the same...heavy looks meaner...bothAB ...sorry not D.

2bigears · « **Reply #15 on:** 1 Jun 2018, 10:39 pm »

D's need to fill their case 1/2 full of lead and put big heat sinks all around ,,,,ha. It's a fact men dig big block motors ,,,,

in the old days. New days are here.

Rx8man · « **Reply #16 on:** 1 Jun 2018, 11:12 pm »

I did the same as Bob Stark, the NuForce amps with Level 3 by Bob Smith sound utterly amazing, I run a DHT Dac into a 6SN7 Preamp.

The amps step outta the way and let go in a most controlled, invisibly quiet way that's hard to describe, very highly recommended.

2bigears · « **Reply #17 on:** 2 Jun 2018, 12:07 am »

very interesting. D's are mostly in my mind. A tube pre is a wonderful thing .....
Need both. So much good gear. So little time.

*Scotty* · « **Reply #18 on:** 2 Jun 2018, 02:13 am »

I suspect the amp mentioned in this thread would be a real contender among the current ClassD amplifiers in the marketplace.
https://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=156237.0
Scotty

I.Greyhound Fan · « **Reply #19 on:** 2 Jun 2018, 02:44 am »

Go for a Pass X250.8 amp. 250wpc at 8 ohms, 500 at 4 ohms. The first 20-25 wpc is all Class A. Weighs 110 pounds and will keep you warm in the winter. I own the older X250 with similar specs and love it.

I have a friend that has NuForce Model 9se with the level 3 upgrade from Bob and I am not impressed. It sounds good but it does not come even close my Pass and I have heard much better. The Model 9se needed the upgrades because of a design flaw due to not enough shielding from the EMI and RF it generated and many went bad. My friend had to send his amps in 3 times for repairs and upgrades to deal with this issue due to failure.

You may want to consider the PSA Stellar 700 mono blocks if you want Class D. Also the PSA BHK Stereo 250 is a hybrid tube SS amp. It has brute force power and is supposed to sound excellent. It is their flagship cost no object amp for a reasonable price. So of the guys on the Audio Shark forum love this amp along with the Stellar 700's.

https://www.psaudio.com/products/bhk-signature-amplifier/#tab-specs