[Theronbo]

So, after playing with it for a couple days…

It’s not a dramatic difference…  but it is…

I mean the X-Statics did some pretty musical ‘fast’ bass already… in fact I have more respect for those speakers.

I listened to quite a few bass heavy pieces & some straight up bass test compilations.

Currently I have the plate amp configured to default… except crossover is set to 120 hz. I set the amp that feeds it the same.

Aside: I had stereo as only front Left & right speakers.

I changed to include subwoofer in 2 channel mode.

The Denon X4700H I have let’s me configure subwoofer on in 2-channel mode & set cross over frequency.

First impressions:
1. It makes the X-Statics sound better… not having to render frequencies below 120hz it seems to do a better job with those above 120… essentially I have a 4 way speaker system now.

I used Audessy to rebalance my speaker levels. It set the subwoofer at -7.0 db

That’s after adjusting the volume on the plate amp to 75db on a given test tone… as a starting point.

I’m enjoying listening to a lot of music that didn’t thrill me before… when listening the difference seems subtle… ie not a lot more bass - but listening is significantly more enjoyable for music with a preponderance of  bass.

Overall I’m very pleased… but not for the reasons I thought I’d be.

[dallaire1]

Subs came out nice, you get them all dialed in and rattling the windows?

[Vince in TX]

They way I have mine connected eliminates the need to set the stereo mode in my Marantz SR8015.   I'm using the high-level inputs.   Everything from stereo to multi-channel movies sounds fantastic.   I may switch to LFE again out of sheer curiosity since I've had a good year of listening to them like this.

Also note that you will probably need some break-in time.   I think mine opened up quite a bit after about four months worth of movie time.   Perhaps it was my personal perception because friends and family thought it was awesome from day one.

[Theronbo]

Re: ‘high level’ mode

As this device is built for music listening… primarily… this is likely the better implementation…

Except that I only have one…

I still could wire it as you would a passive sub…

That should be on the checklist… of things to try.

Now I have the device:
1. Want to spend some time listening so I’m better prepared to actually hear the differences as I alter things.

2. It doesn’t pressurize the room as my conventional ported subs do.
You don’t feel the room pressure change… or windows rattlie… you do hear some amazing bass. Which I didn’t realize I wasn’t hearing…

Have a Japanese Drum piece that really lets you hear bass.

https://music.apple.com/us/album/kannabi/327785000?i=327785005
 Could not find on YouTube.

[Vince in TX]

Re: ‘high level’ mode

As this device is built for music listening… primarily… this is likely the better implementation…

Except that I only have one…
...

If you notice, I only have the left channel connected to that particular amp since I have a pair of them.   If I only had one, I could wire the right speaker into the right channel.  I'd be curious if it makes a difference rather than letting the amp decide what to send to them over the LFE channel.   

Of course, Danny recommends LFE, so perhaps I'm doing it wrong.   

[Theronbo]

I researched it more…

The manufacturer says LFE as well… unless it’s unavailable.

I was thinking of running L+R through it… like a passive sub… but you can’t….  So I could have my old HT sub (vented) as LFE & this sub would always be on 2 channels…. Without HT sub…  Right now I manually engage old sub for movie watching…

Then the thinking more… the thought  of using amplified signals to an amp… just seems crazy.

[Vince in TX]

...

Then the thinking more… the thought  of using amplified signals to an amp… just seems crazy.

Well, that's precisely what the high-level inputs are for.   In my case, it was more of a problem with trying to get LFE from the back of my 22' long room room to the front where the speakers are placed.   I do have another sealed sub at the back of the room on the LFE channel.   To get to the front, I ran RG-11 through the walls/ceiling, and I was having a hard time with the connectors.  When I finally threw up my hands and just used the high-level inputs using the same speaker wires going to the L/R channel, everything just started working.  I ran those front channels through conduit, so perhaps it's time to pull those old wires and fish some new ones.

The other thing I was missing (or couldn't find) was a setting in my Marantz where LFE worked in stereo (what you did), and I wasn't getting any bass listening to stereo music.   And when stuff "just worked" on the high-levels, I abandoned that research.   I've been running it this way for over a year now with exceptional results, so it hasn't been a priority.  Besides, this was recommended to me over and over as "the best of both worlds" (high-level inputs) for movies and music.  Perhaps the one thing I'm missing out on is being able to route the open-baffle LFE to the surrounds, center and ceiling speakers with the crossover settings.   Those may not have near the depth they're capable of considering the one sealed sub on LFE at the back.

Anyway, just thinking out loud.   I'll stop rambling now.   My problems are not your problems.   

[Theronbo]

1. The manual says that the ‘high input’ lines are for exactly your application.

2. Many AVR s if you configure the front speakers as ‘small’ it will drive the subwoofer in 2 channel (stereo) mode.

I have the servo disabled at this point…. Using as a simple sub in  2 channel.

Read the theory of operation manual… & it made my head hurt… so for now… I’m simply going to listen so my ears get trained on what bass sounds like… I’ll try again in a couple weeks when I can take the time to play with it.

The difference is subtle (they don’t pressurize the room) yet dramatic..

I’m finding some music I didn’t previously enjoy, fun to listen to… what I would call ‘black’ romance … kinda updated Barry White.

[dryan01uk]

Hi Guys, 

I'm getting a bit of an education, reading the posts back and forward and I'm interested in your thoughts.   I've got two dual OB subs about to be shipped to marry with my X-Statiks. 

I have a DENON X4700H for HT use with front stereo L&R through pre-outs to an Audiolab 6000A.  I bypass the DENON when I want to listen to stereo music.  I also have a dedicated sealed sub that I route LFE signals to, from the DENON, although, during HT use, I suspect it also routes the bass there as well (bass is supposed to be non-directional).  I DO have the front L&R set as SMALL in the DENON for this reason.

It all works remarkably well.

Now, when the OB subs are built, I was going to take the pre-outs from the Audiolab 6000A to the L & R  OB sub 'Line In' connections, and set the L&R speakers in the DENON to LARGE.  This way, I hope to avoid using the DENON cross-over and can better use the various knobs on the plate amps to set the cross-over, phase etc.  It should (?) mean that the subs are always integrated with the X-Statiks, either during music or HT use.

I hadn't considered using either the LFE or High Level connections.

Thoughts?  I guess it will all depend on what sounds great to my ears in the end, but I'm ultimately very lazy so want to set something up that I can use without fumbling around with connectors and the like.

David

[Vince in TX]

Hi Guys, 

I'm getting a bit of an education, reading the posts back and forward and I'm interested in your thoughts.   I've got two dual OB subs about to be shipped to marry with my X-Statiks. 

I have a DENON X4700H for HT use with front stereo L&R through pre-outs to an Audiolab 6000A.  I bypass the DENON when I want to listen to stereo music.  I also have a dedicated sealed sub that I route LFE signals to, from the DENON, although, during HT use, I suspect it also routes the bass there as well (bass is supposed to be non-directional).  I DO have the front L&R set as SMALL in the DENON for this reason.

It all works remarkably well.

Now, when the OB subs are built, I was going to take the pre-outs from the Audiolab 6000A to the L & R  OB sub 'Line In' connections, and set the L&R speakers in the DENON to LARGE.  This way, I hope to avoid using the DENON cross-over and can better use the various knobs on the plate amps to set the cross-over, phase etc.  It should (?) mean that the subs are always integrated with the X-Statiks, either during music or HT use.

I hadn't considered using either the LFE or High Level connections.

Thoughts?  I guess it will all depend on what sounds great to my ears in the end, but I'm ultimately very lazy so want to set something up that I can use without fumbling around with connectors and the like.

David

This is exactly how I have mine setup.   I even have that third sealed sub at the back of the theater specifically for LFE and to provide depth into the surrounds and overhead speakers.   I may try to experiment again with mine at some point, but I didn't have much choice when I first installed it because the LFE cables I ran to my front channels weren't working correctly.

I would recommend you start a thread, though, so we don't clutter up Theranbo's build thread. 

[dallaire1]

Why the sealed sub ? These play into the teens. I'm confused?

[dallaire1]

Maybe to feel a little punch ? I know I've heard somewhere Danny implements a sealed sub at back of the room, I'm assuming for that reason..??

[NoahH]

The OBs don't pressurize the room. Best analogy is they sound better for upright bass but not for drums and vice versa. Combo of both is ideal

[Theronbo]

Interesting….

I have a Krell I run pre amp from Denon HT L&R to… so similar to both y’all.

I use LFE into Y connector into L&R line in.

Note: Y connector bumps the sensitivity by 6db, according to manual vs plugging LFE directly to L or R line in…

Yeah, I noticed it.

Have no pre outs on my Krell … so can’t connect as y’all have done.

I manually change from 1 to 2 subs if I want to enable my old vented subwoofer for watching Movies….

300 watt plate amp with 12” driver… definitely pressurizes the room for explosions & earthquakes…

[Theronbo]

Oh!

Click!

Run preamps from HT amp to Rythmik on sub…

THEN to the FRont speaker amp (Krell in my case)…

Configure as large speakers no sub on 2 channel…

Use old vented subwoofer on LFE as sub1… comes on in HT modes… but not stereo…

Yeah, that works.

[dryan01uk]

That seems to make sense.   Have you tried it out to see if it works?

It shouldn't make any difference if the sub is first or second on the feed.

David

[Theronbo]

That seems to make sense.   Have you tried it out to see if it works?

It shouldn't make any difference if the sub is first or second on the feed.

David

Well yes. Tried it b4 posting…. Works very well.

Might be ready to start playing with the Servo feature… been using as a simple subwoofer…

It’s nice having, what I call a Home Theater sub, only on in Surround modes.

Kept the increased db from when using LFE feed through Y connector… 

Seems obvious now… but appears this is the intended/preferred connection mechanism.  Fully integrates the sub. Making the front speakers now 4-way speaker. Understand now why people have both L & R instances of these subs.