AudioCircle
Industry Circles => GR Research => Topic started by: Hobbsmeerkat on 17 Jun 2020, 04:36 pm
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Ordered an X-LS encore kit & some Norez this morning.
Funds are still a lil tight so I've kept with the stock crossover, which should still be head and shoulders above anything else I've currently ever heard or owned. (It wont be difficult, tbh)
I also picked up a pair of the spare cabinets from Killian since I don't currently have the tools for any wood working.
But the basic plan is to coat the cabinets in smooth black Duratex, and get brass/gold hardware to help accent the black.
Hopefully by next week I'll have everything here so I can get started!
I'll be sure to share plenty of pictures as things progress! :thumb:
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Ordered an X-LS encore kit & some Norez this morning.
Funds are still a lil tight so I've kept with the stock crossover, which should still be head and shoulders above anything else I've currently ever heard or owned. (It wont be difficult, tbh)
I also picked up a pair of the spare cabinets from Killian since I don't currently have the tools for any wood working.
But the basic plan is to coat the cabinets in smooth black Duratex, and get brass/gold hardware to help accent the black.
Hopefully by next week I'll have everything here so I can get started!
I'll be sure to share plenty of pictures as things progress! :thumb:
One thing to keep in mind - if you don't want black, you can use different paint on top of Duratex, after it dries.
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One thing to keep in mind - if you don't want black, you can use different paint on top of Duratex, after it dries.
That's good to know! I'm sure black will be fine since most everything on my desk is already black.
I'm assuming a quart of duratex is enough to coat both speakers?
Are the stock binding posts compatible with banana plugs?
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My kit and cabinets just arrived this afternoon! And the painting has begun! :D
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=210822)
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Gave them a good sanding to soften any height differences after the first coat. Ill give them another coat of duratex in the morning and sand them down again after work. Then, for the last couple coats add a little water to make for a smoother texture/finish.
I'll begin working on the crossovers tomorrow night.
Really happy with how they're looking already! :thumb:
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Looking good so far! I think we both will be listening to new x-series speakers this weekend.
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Looking good so far! I think we both will be listening to new x-series speakers this weekend.
Thanks! Thats the plan! My next day off is Sunday so hopefully I can manage to get them assembled & ready to enjoy before the end of the day!
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Does anyone have any tips for how to best thin out Duratex? Most of the time I've tried, its ended up foamy mess at best. Should i mix it ahead of time in a separate container and stir it slowly?
Going directly from a foam roller, its got a tight texture, but shows roll edges too readily..
Thanks!
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I put the first coat on kinda thick then keep going back over it very lightly in opposing directions as it dries. Subsequent coats can be thinned with water but not too much. To get a smoother texture I use a smooth foam roller normally used for epoxy at least on the second and/or third coat.
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It's water based so that's its solvent as well. I haven't used it all that much so I'm drawing on my knowledge of acrylic paint. There are some foam rollers that have rounded ends...that may help. Does it have a thinning percentage max? Typically says on the can.
If it's hot and drying too fast to flow out, FloeTrol might help. It's designed to keep a wet edge with acrylic paints and I suspect would have similar effect, but again no experience with putting it in Duratex.
As Mike suggests, I suspect the absorptive nature of raw MDF is part of what's happening. It would tend to pull moisture out quickly. Ideally moisture would evaporate rather than be absorbed into substrate.
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Thanks for the tip! I'll see if I can find a way to get thicker coats on.
I've been trying to use a foam roller, but subsequent coats have had issues with lots of surface bubbles, or the roller streaks instead of rolling. But ill see what i can manage. :thumb:
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It's water based so that's its solvent as well. I haven't used it all that much so I'm drawing on my knowledge of acrylic paint. There are some foam rollers that have rounded ends...that may help. Does it have a thinning percentage max? Typically says on the can.
If it's hot and drying too fast to flow out, FloeTrol might help. It's designed to keep a wet edge with acrylic paints and I suspect would have similar effect, but again no experience with putting it in Duratex.
As Mike suggests, I suspect the absorptive nature of raw MDF is part of what's happening. It would tend to pull moisture out quickly. Ideally moisture would evaporate rather than be absorbed into substrate.
Thinning max is about 10% some have mentioned 10-20% but that seems to be those using spray guns.
The foam roller im using has rounded edges, but leaves streaks at the edge, even with light texture
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My kit and cabinets just arrived this afternoon! And the painting has begun! :D
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=210822)
Looking good.
Interested in knowing how well Duartex hides seams. Post some close ups if you get a chance.
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After to add [&size=huge] in the link
https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=210822&size=huge
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=210822&size=huge) (https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=210822&size=huge)
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Hey Hobbs, glad to see you are finally getting some GR speakers. They should be a good match for the PS Audio Sprout and probably fit on your desk better than the NX-Studio's.
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Hey Hobbs, glad to see you are finally getting some GR speakers. They should be a good match for the PS Audio Sprout and probably fit on your desk better than the NX-Studio's.
Thanks! Im still struggling to get the texture the way Id like it, but might not be a bad idea to sand it down smooth and use spray paint to finish them off. With a more consistent texture, using the duratex as a protective under coating.
I have a feeling the current 90°+ weather is curing the duratex before it gets a good chance to settle down to a smoother finish..
That issue aside, i have no doubt that these will be killer speakers. They're roughly the same size as my current active monitors, but should smoke them in every way! :thumb:
I plan to start working on the crossovers tonight
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Thanks! Im still struggling to get the texture the way Id like it, but might not be a bad idea to sand it down smooth and use spray paint to finish them off. With a more consistent texture, using the duratex as a protective under coating.
I have a feeling the current 90°+ weather is curing the duratex before it gets a good chance to settle down to a smoother finish..
That issue aside, i have no doubt that these will be killer speakers. They're roughly the same size as my current active monitors, but should smoke them in every way! :thumb:
I plan to start working on the crossovers tonight
Having recently attempted to get a smooth and consistent flat black finish using a rattle can, I can say it's no easy task either. Make sure you have a very consistent surface from your sanding, and are spraying thin coats in a calm, wind free environment.
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Here's another thing to consider about Duratex or any other water based product. It will swell wood fibers and likely kinda lock those fibers in their swelled state. It's the nature of all finishes to some extent, but water is especially so. Duratex doesn't sand well because it's sorta rubbery in nature.
One way to deal with the issue is to seal the surface before applying the D-Tex. Mike suggested epoxy, but other things could work also. Shellac is a favorite of mine because it's easy, inexpensive and dries fast. I rarely use it as a finish topcoat, but rather a sealer and barrier coat. Another single component sealer I use is Zinsser oil based Cover Stain. Dries fast, powders when sanded and can be had in spray cans.
Any of these base coats should make Duratex move even in sheen, easier to apply and require fewer coats.
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Here's another thing to consider about Duratex or any other water based product. It will swell wood fibers and likely kinda lock those fibers in their swelled state. It's the nature of all finishes to some extent, but water is especially so. Duratex doesn't sand well because it's sorta rubbery in nature.
One way to deal with the issue is to seal the surface before applying the D-Tex. Mike suggested epoxy, but other things could work also. Shellac is a favorite of mine because it's easy, inexpensive and dries fast. I rarely use it as a finish topcoat, but rather a sealer and barrier coat. Another single component sealer I use is Zinsser oil based Cover Stain. Dries fast, powders when sanded and can be had in spray cans.
Any of these base coats should make Duratex move even in sheen, easier to apply and require fewer coats.
Peter's points about shellac are good ones. Just be sure you use a dewaxed shellac. If you buy it off the shelf it usually comes in a 2 pound cut. Dilute it 50% with denatured alcohol. It is a lot easier to apply two thin coats than one thick one.
Mike
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Hobbs,
I recently decided im gonna return my XLS kit,
I found that theres not enough good info on the Xovers,no detailed illustrations and Ive been hounding Danny to do a vid
on just a step by step on one crossover.
Can you clearly document your step by step,you can exclude the wire tie part and stuff,just
the way its connected .It might save me from abandoning this project.
Steve
not sure if they allow contact info
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I will add my endorsement for shellac as a sanding sealer. I will go further and express my preference as a top coat as well. It is not as tough as other finishes, but it is incredibly repairable. It also will not interfere with any subsequent finishes. Either apply in thin coats and sand between or French Polish (not as hard as it sounds). I like to finish with Briwax applied with 0000 steel wool with the grain and buffed out.
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You guys using shellac as a sanding sealer, does it work well for the end grain on MDF? I learned the hard way that a regular water based sanding sealer sucks and spent time using wood putty and sanding to fix my X-Voce. I used Kilz original on my X-Static boxes which worked pretty well but I'm not totally confident on how well the latex paint I sprayed on top of it is going to hold up. Sounds like maybe I should try shellac next time?
Hobbs, sorry for hijacking your thread.
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Haha its all good! As long as people wanna share their knowledge and experience, I'm all for it! :thumb:
Its all info I can use towards my next build :D
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I've had good luck with spray Kilz on end grain MDF. Good coat, light sanding, good coat, light sanding as much as needed. Light sanding is with fine 150 or so and usually by hand. Works for me.
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You guys using shellac as a sanding sealer, does it work well for the end grain on MDF? I learned the hard way that a regular water based sanding sealer sucks and spent time using wood putty and sanding to fix my X-Voce. I used Kilz original on my X-Static boxes which worked pretty well but I'm not totally confident on how well the latex paint I sprayed on top of it is going to hold up. Sounds like maybe I should try shellac next time?
Hobbs, sorry for hijacking your thread.
Sealers of any type will do just that...seal. What they won't do very well is fill without many coats. The porous core of MDF varies with the density, but all needs some filling to get flat. Body filler, epoxy, high build primer, and MDF specific primers will accomplish this better and faster.
I'm not keen on acrylic (latex) for speakers, better on walls IMHO, but I admit to being jaded by pro finishing stuff that's kinda hard to come by. Commercial stuff will typically be some kind of catalyzed urethanes (auto body) or tinted lacquer or conversion varnish.
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Okay so, I've finally started on the Crossovers, and i wanted some verification that everything is set up correctly before i start soldering and building the second crossover.
(I know the smaller air-core inductor still needs to be attached to the tweeter circuit, but the leads are a lot longer than i need, should i trim the ends down to a more reasonable length?)
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=210982)
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You can trim the leads so they work in your layout.. just remember to sand the varnish off after trimming so you get a good solid connection. The only part of the inductor that matters is the actual coil, that is what determines the frequency filtering
jay
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Okay! These speakers are 95% done!
Soldering is NOT my forte, but the crossovers came out pretty well and they both sound great! :D
Just awaiting my sheet of Norez, which should be here Tuesday. I'm sure will only make them sound better! And while I'm installing that, I'll be spraying the screw heads gold to contrast against the black.
Really happy with these so far! :thumb:
I want to hook up the subs to fill out the bottom end, but the housemate is asleep... even so, I'm really happy with how these sound!
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=211032&size=huge)
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=211035&size=huge)
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Hobbs! These turned out great! Glad to see the cabinets took to the paint well and that the crossover template board worked! Congrats and enjoy!
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Congrats! Glad your soldering was successful as well, it’s always a little nerve wracking to fire them up the first time.
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Hobbs,
I recently decided im gonna return my XLS kit,
I found that theres not enough good info on the Xovers,no detailed illustrations and Ive been hounding Danny to do a vid
on just a step by step on one crossover.
Can you clearly document your step by step,you can exclude the wire tie part and stuff,just
the way its connected .It might save me from abandoning this project.
Steve
not sure if they allow contact info
Don’t throw in the towel. This was the first crossover I’ve built, and it wasn’t bad at all. In hindsight it was fairly easy. The crossover sticky was really helpful, as were a couple of Danny’s videos in upgrading some of the Klipsch 600’s. I would also recommend a Kirby Meets Audio vid where he walks through the process of taking a crossover diagram and converting to the actual build. Here is a pic of one of my crossovers. I connected the woofer and tweeter negative together which is not in this pic.
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=211036)
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Hobbs! These turned out great! Glad to see the cabinets took to the paint well and that the crossover template board worked! Congrats and enjoy!
Yeah! Thanks again! They're not "perfect" but one it cures theyll be super durable, and I can always sand/paint them in the future.
Yeah! The picture you sent me really made it easy to figure out where everything needed to go!
Congrats! Glad your soldering was successful as well, it’s always a little nerve wracking to fire them up the first time.
Thanks! Yeah it was definitely a bit worrysome, but once i got the first speaker assembled and tested it in mono, i was happy to hear it sing!
And now that both are complete, I'm absolutely loving how they sound, but now i really need a good sub to pair with them... lol
All in due time, of course!
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Got the sub hooked up late last night and it really helped fill in the bottom end, esp in more modern songs.
Listened to a fair bit of classic rock and some jazz and I'm really impressed with the clarity on the the top end. Some of the more ambient stuff I first listened to sounded truly incredible. :thumb:
But while I'm awaiting the Norez tomorrow, i have them buried under a pile of blankets and pillows playing pink noise to help break them in while I'm at work/asleep. They've probably got about 9 hours on them already. By tonight, should have another 9.
Should be able to get a good 30 hours on them by then.
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My X-LS Encore are finally complete! Got my sheet of Norez today & installed it while also spraying the tops of the screws gold, since I couldn't find any usable brass screws, but I'm digging the look!
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=211166&size=large)
I haven't had a chance to fire them up again, but Norez is not joke. I thought the stock cabinets were already pretty dead, but Norez does an amazing job taking that even further.. I'm excited to get them hooked up again! :thumb:
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Looking good! The norez is definitely a worthwhile upgrade.
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Looking good! The norez is definitely a worthwhile upgrade.
Absolutely! Now that I've got them hooked up on my desktop, the midbass & bass definitely feel tighter, and more controlled.
I wasnt sure if having them close to the walls would be an issue for the Bass bloat, but, they seem a bit lacking. Thankfully my tiny/cheap 8" sub is doing a good job of filling out the low end!
Im a very happy camper right now! :thumb:
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Hi Hobbs,
Looks great, thanks for the walk-through.
Cheers,
Stephen
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Those look great Hobbs! Glad you are happy. One thing that can help is to elevate them off the desk top as much as possible while keeping them at ear level. That will help with floor/desk bounce reflection.
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Yeah! they're sitting about 5 inches above the desk with the tweeter at ear height, just like my old monitors.
I'm so glad to be rid of the eternal hiss from those active monitors. Its non existent at room scale but near-field it's unavoidable.
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My X-LS Encore are finally complete! Got my sheet of Norez today & installed it while also spraying the tops of the screws gold, since I couldn't find any usable brass screws, but I'm digging the look!
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=211166&size=large)
I haven't had a chance to fire them up again, but Norez is not joke. I thought the stock cabinets were already pretty dead, but Norez does an amazing job taking that even further.. I'm excited to get them hooked up again! :thumb:
Gold screws is a cool look! Was it easy to achieve?
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Gold screws is a cool look! Was it easy to achieve?
Yeah! The idea came from Geddy Lee's Wal bass guitar from the mid-late 80's that was black with gold hardware.
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=211242&size=large)
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=211243&size=large)
It was surprisingly easy, I just used some tape over the threads to keep them suspended, and just sprayed a couple thin coats of gold spray paint over the screw heads. Its probably not super durable since i didn't use any primer, but it held up to being screwed in, so I'm pretty happy with it!
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When I get the chance to build another pair of speakers for myself, i want to build a pair that's themed after Geddy's 2nd Wal, a candy-red MkII with quilted maple top & a dark ebony strip down the middle, black neck & gold hardware. It would make for a gorgeous pair of X-Statik or NX-Otica
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=211253&size=large)
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Finally had a chance to really push the XLS in a more classic 2 channel set-up. And damn, they really rock when you push them!
I wanted to use a sub, but my Velodyne doesn't like the Sprout 100 & won't come out of standby. So I tried to use the one I have at my desk, but it is woefully inadequate at loud volumes, & just makes "noise" that i couldn't even be blended to meet the XLS woofers
so i gave up and just used the bass boost on the Sprout & while it still lacked in the lowest registers, it did a great job with most forms of music, really bringing a lot of detail and power.
There was still some muddiness that was caused from the bass boost smothering some details in the mids.
Really just shows i need to invest in a proper subwoofer.
But all in all, im super impressed with these speakers! :thumb:
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Finally had a chance to really push the XLS in a more classic 2 channel set-up. And damn, they really rock when you push them!
I wanted to use a sub, but my Velodyne doesn't like the Sprout 100 & won't come out of standby. So I tried to use the one I have at my desk, but it is woefully inadequate at loud volumes, & just makes "noise" that i couldn't even be blended to meet the XLS woofers
so i gave up and just used the bass boost on the Sprout & while it still lacked in the lowest registers, it did a great job with most forms of music, really bringing a lot of detail and power.
There was still some muddiness that was caused from the bass boost smothering some details in the mids.
Really just shows i need to invest in a proper subwoofer.
But all in all, im super impressed with these speakers! :thumb:
Looks like a servo sub kit 2 for your next build :thumb:
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Looks like a servo sub kit 2 for your next build :thumb:
Sure looks like it! Time to start saving up again & getting some tools to get the job done. :P
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Not quite in a position to build my own sub yet, so i ordered the Rythmik L12.
It's currently on back-order till early August, but should suit me just fine, and in the meantime I'll start saving up for the tools I need. (3D printer, track saw, router, clamps etc, over the next few months)
The 3D printer will be for prototyping some back-cup/mods for Danny's Neo3, to hopefully bring back some of the other models like the N1X, N2X & N3, along with any other fun ideas I come up with in the future. :P
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My Rythmik sub just arrived! Stuck at work for now, but I'm excited to take it for a test run here in the next couple days once I can have the house to myself again for a couple hours.
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Get ready to grin from ear to ear.
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Get ready to grin from ear to ear.
I cant wait! its going to be a massive step up over my HT Velodyne sub, and worlds better than my puny little Logitech sub! :thumb:
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Finally home, had some dinner, and got this beauty out of its box~
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=213072&size=large)
It's really well built on the outside and it looks great! Comes with nice rubber feat too which will be great for use in my room, but after giving it some knocks, I'm 100% going to be lining it with a sheet of Norez.. :P
Probably also upgrade the internal wiring to the driver/servo coil to some of Danny's 16 gague solid-core wire, while I'm already in there. Ill also spray down the driver bolts with my gold paint to better match my XLS Encores. :thumb:
It doesn't come with an RCA/interconnect tho, so I'll be looking into something decent enough for that tonight too. Maybe in the $25-$50 range? (I have tons of old ultra-cheap ones, but I want something a little nicer than that obviously.. lol)
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Glad to see the sub arrived.... didn't want to see a "bad day" story from using that bass boost at louder levels !! :LOL:
jay
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Glad to see the sub arrived.... didn't want to see a "bad day" story from using that bass boost at louder levels !! :LOL:
jay
You & me both! Luckily I've only driven them really hard in bass boost mode once for about 2-3 hours, now i wont have too! :D
The trick now will be to find the right balance of settings for the subwoofer. But for now it's here & I'm happy~ :P
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I wanted to use a sub, but my Velodyne doesn't like the Sprout 100 & won't come out of standby. So I tried to use the one I have at my desk, but it is
Do you think this is a Sprout 100 issue or a Velodyne issue. I am in the process of building X-SLS's and I was thinking of driving them with a Sprout 100 and adding Danny's Servo Sub Kit to it. I would be concerned if the Sprout 100 wouldn't wake up the Servo Sub. Do you think this would be an issue? Does anyone else have experience with running a Servo Sub Kit off of the Sprout 100?
-Russell
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It's definitely a Velodyne issue. The sprout 100 doesn't have enough output from that connector to bring it out of sleep mode. I can get it to work by using our receiver to wake it up, then it woks fine with the Sprout after that, but its a pain in the butt to do that every single time.
I've already connected my Rythmic Sub to my Sprout and it works great! It also has an "auto" and "on" option, so even if there is an issue waking it up, it'll work just fine.
Danny's base sealed servo sub kit is quite similar to the Rythmik L12 but with a more robust Rythmik plate amp, so I doubt you'll have any issues with the Sprout 100, if im already having better luck than with my velodyne. :thumb:
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Hobbs,
I recently decided im gonna return my XLS kit,
I found that theres not enough good info on the Xovers,no detailed illustrations and Ive been hounding Danny to do a vid
on just a step by step on one crossover.
Can you clearly document your step by step,you can exclude the wire tie part and stuff,just
the way its connected .It might save me from abandoning this project.
Steve
not sure if they allow contact info
There’s this:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=rIxig_9i-Iw&list=PLv9fK2dmpIVaX6DyufaKYNLBPT0ATvRH-&index=4&t=0s
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Aww man, i can't believe I missed that comment. :(
I definitely would have helped them sort out the how to put it together if I had caught it.
In other news, I've already annoyed the housemate with my subwoofer. :thumb:
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Took a peak inside the L12 sub today to get a rough measurement of the cable length I needed, and to get a basic idea of the stuffing it had. One of the friction clips for the servo coil popped off, so definitely upgrading the wiring for direct soldering to the driver.
There's a couple sheets of poly-fill covering the main inside and one main brace in the center so I'm definitely going to be using some Norez on every inch I can. Then stuff the poly-fill back into the sub around the plate amp and center brace. Should really help clean up the box's resonance. It'll make for a fun afternoon project next week. :D
But now that I've got it re assembled I've been listening to it and making adjustments getting it to blend with my Encores & I think I've found the sweet spot for now. :thumb:
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Ordered a set of Tube Connectors to upgrade my XLS & do a direct comparison, esp after that tube connector thread went off the rails.
Ill do my own side-by-side & reporting back here.
Also ordered the upgrades for my L12 sub, including Norez & upgrading the internal wiring to Danny's copper wire.
It'll be a fun project to tackle next week! :thumb:
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Finally got a night without house mates to just chill and rock out with my X-LS & L12.. only took 2-3 weeks... :roll:
I'm absolutely floored! :o
The mids are far less muddied now, and the Rythmik L12 brings a lot of texture and authority to the bottom end.
The mods for my X-LS (tube connectors) and L12 (Norez+ upgraded wiring) should be here on the 2nd.
I'm excited to get started and test the results! :thumb:
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Cannot wait to hear what differences you perceive. That is the cool thing about upgrading in increments is that you have a better idea where each dollar went in terms of sound.
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Got my upgrade kit from Danny Yesterday, so I spent the afternoon upgrading my Rythmik L12 subwoofer.
A set of solid copper wire & a sheet of NoRez!
(I'll be getting to the tube connectors for my XLS this weekend after i get myself a crimping tool.)
Here's how the stock L12 looks inside:
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=214010&size=large)
Poly-fill sheets glued to the outer walls, & a single brace in the middle.
First step was to scrape off the poly-fill and any remnants/glue I can scrape off. Then cut the No-Rez sheets to fill every flat surface as best I can. It knocked down a large chunk of the cabinet resonance. I'm sure Danny's 3-brace design does an even better job than No-Rez alone, but this is pre assembled.
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=214012&size=large)
Next step was to disassemble the plate amp to get to the solder mounts for the driver and servo wires.
The hard part was removing enough solder & glue to pull out the stock wires so i could retin the thru-holes.
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=214013&size=large)
I made an error here I wasn't paying close enough attention, and wired the servo holes backwards. It should be W-R-R-W but I did it as W-R-W-R. (I basically wired the servos backwards) not major, but it was an easy fix to just swap the wires on the terminal side once I realized my error.
Once that was done, I replaced the thermal paste that attaches the chip-amp heatsinks to the plate side of the amp. I have lots on hand thanks to my time building gaming PCs in the past.
Then I twisted each pairs of wires together, then twisted the twitsted pairs together & wrapped the wires back up with the small strips of polyfill & some zip ties. Next was to solder the wires to the leads & cover them in heat shrink. I marked the driver cables with permanent marker to know which is which.
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=214014&size=large)
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=214015&size=large)
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=214016&size=large)
Last order of business was to stuff the polyfill back into the sub, which I put over the plate amp, then seal it all back up! (Then find out i wired the servo backwards, forcing it into a nonstop loop until i re-wired it.. lol)
I haven't had a chance to play it with music yet, but it's definitely heavier and sounds a lot less hollow now. Should help reduce sounds radiating off the sides. And it was only $70 at most? Plus i have a little extra wire to use for my Tube Connector upgrade this weekend! :thumb:
Enjoy!
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Yeah that's gonna be a lot cleaner sounding now.
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Nice to see Rythmik's entry-level L12 is built better than most manufacturers' TOTL subs! I know where I'm shopping next time I need one. :thumb:
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Nice to see Rythmik's entry-level L12 is built better than most manufacturers' TOTL subs! I know where I'm shopping next time I need one. :thumb:
I absolutely recommend the L12, for the money. They sound incredible, with plenty of texture & detail on the low end, esp for the $560 entry price. I also wouldn't be against adding some simple bracing but im happy with the job the No-Rez alone provided.
I played an electronic "subwoofer test" song the other night, while it was still in it's stock form. Being able to tell it was just a simple sine-wave without any sort of tone, grit, or intentional distortion added, is a wild thing, and makes it seem pretty lame. Esp when bass guitars and pianos have specific tones & texture to their sound depending on the strings, pickups & wood used in their construction.
Even a lot of Synth-heavy 80s rock was more tonally interesting. :lol:
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Was going to work on upgrading my XLS to Tube connectors today, but I only just realized I only have 5/16" and 1/2" drill bits. So ill need to buy a 7/16" drill bit to move forward. Not a big setback, but I wish I had realized it sooner tho.. :P
Hopefully tomorrow after work i can go pick one up.
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Yay! Its tube connector upgrade time!
Poked & drilled some holes out, then removed the Woofer and binding post cup.
Added an extra 6" of wire to each lead & twitsted/soldered them together.
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=214345&size=large)
I then slid the tube connector over the twisted leads, & crimped/soldered the leads before sliding the heat shrink over and using a sealant to glue them in place.
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=214346&size=large)
Onto the 2nd speakers! :thumb:
(Its not gunna be as pretty since i misaligned the holes :P )
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2nd speaker is done, & I only have 2 words:
HOLY SH*T :o
Theres a massive jump in clarity, detail, & depth.
It sounds that much more "REAL" & "ALIVE" than i expected. And ive gone back and forth a few times.
Vocals have more presence & focus, you can more easily pick out smaller details, spacial cues, & you can hear everything with more precision. Drums sound more life-like and snares especially stand front & center.
I expected a small difference, but it's MUCH bigger jump than I expected.. its like I mentioned in the "tube connector" thread; it's like getting a new pair of glasses after going years without getting a new prescription. The "softness" you're used to gives way to that much more clarity and focus.
I've gone back and forth several times now, & yep it's definitely there.. but the upgrade itself even made a difference to the binding posts, I'm guessing its due to having a more surface area to connect to vs bare wire??
Mind you, I still only have the stock crossover, cheap 14-gauge zip cord... They're 6" away from the wall & I'm playing CD-quality music via bluetooth...
If you're still on the fence on upgrading, GET THEM.. i 100% recommend making the jump! :thumb:
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I just realized I never shared a picture of my setup..
Guess I better do that now. :P
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=214353&size=xlarge)
Sub is hiding below the desk.
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Small update,
With my recent purchase of the GRS Neo3 clone I also picked up some low-mass solder-type banana plugs to replace my stock 5-way banana plugs that came with my Sprout 100. Not the highest quality obviously, but at least they wont come loose every time i need to unplug them. :P
I also soldered the spring section to the connector as some of the reviews suggested. And picked up some heat shrink so i could property mark each end with the correct color. And I now have enough to last me thru a few different builds.
I cant say it made much of a difference compared to the change of the tube connectors, but I'll take their simplicity & reliability any day. :thumb:
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=215197&size=large)
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Going to the mail tube connector ends should step things up for you a little bit over those.
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Going to the mail tube connector ends should step things up for you a little bit over those.
For sure, and that's my plan when i order a pair of the new cables from ya for my NX-Studios. :thumb:
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Hobbs you are doing sound editing (semi-) professionally ? or just an enthusiasts system?
sorry if this was already answered.
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Hobbs you are doing sound editing (semi-) professionally ? or just an enthusiasts system?
sorry if this was already answered.
Just an enthusiast system, I want a killer desk setup I can continue to grow into. :thumb:
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Keep us posted, man! :thumb:
I'm just using headphones to edit out clicks/pops of my vinyl rips.
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I am getting close to the finish line with building my first XLS.
Was almost done by managed to butcher the Electra Cable Tube Connectors.
Danny's instructions were excellent and helpful in getting the crossover built and wired. I tried to follow the details for how to crimp the tube connectors...but was unsuccessful. Attached are pictures of what I have.
The red one just didn't catch the copper wire. so ended up the cutting them both off.
With all the solder in them not sure what I can recover. And given the Electra Cable Tube connector price - not sure I can afford to get a new pair.
Any suggestions on what I can do here. Do i try get all the solder out? Any tips? Do I go with a banana connector.
Frustrating...came so close. Everything else is working just these connectors.
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=215497)
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Those should be salvageable. I think easiest would be compressed air if you have available or a solder sucker. You'll probably need three hands! Heat with soldering iron just to the point of melting solder and immediately blow air in from opposite side. Aim it somewhere other than you or the dog.
Once you've got most of the solder out, you can gently use something long and tapered, like an ice pick, to reform the barrel enough to get another go at it. If it's any comfort, I've done the same thing. Get the crimp good before solder and you should be golden...pardon the pun!
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I was lucky to avoid that issue by having both binding posts & tube connectors as usable options. The leads from the binding posts got twisted together with the wire heading to the crossover, so the crimping went pretty easy for me.
But it's good info to know since my NX-Studios will have tube connectors only. So I may give a little extra lead for the wire to be folded over & twisted together within the tube connector.
But maybe that will be something you can also do to prevent the issue happening again when you re-crimp the connecting wire?
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I just installed some more of these today too. They install really fast, but I have done a lot of them before.
Still, just follow the directions here: https://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=94014.0
And make sure you crimp them well.
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Everybody, thanks for the tips. I will make another go at it. Attached is the tool I plan to use. Its the same one I used previously. I have marked the notch I plan to use. Am I safe using the same notch (14 - 16) or should i use something else.
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=215522)
Danny,
I am a complete novice. My son and I did watch your video several times but still managed to mess things up. I know you mention the slit, notch etc verbally on the video. You also tried to show things on the video. But given focus it wasn't fully clear.
As a suggestion some focused closeups or a taking a video of a printed sheet or a sheet with a diagram of things might help. For example we were confused about directionally how to position the plug on the tool which way to face things. And confused about do we crimp the middle or do we crimp at the very end.
By the way we did manage to complete one speaker and are absolutely LOVING the sound.
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As they are thin walled by design maybe try 12-10 as the connectors look crunched to an inch of their lives. The solder should do the rest. You could always tweak them with a smaller setting if it doesn't look like holding :o
When crimping I also try to keep the wire centred as I figure the crimp needs to happen on top of the wire and encase around the wire with the connector.
I don't have a set but after Hobbs review I might save up my spare pennies for them. :lol: Freight to Australia is a killer at the moment.
What does the team think?
SC
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In the link I posted above it gives step by step, picture by picture instructions.
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Hey Hobbs
I just installed my tube connectors and they are great. I noticed improvements in clarity and the same types of things as you mentioned "Vocals have more presence & focus, you can more easily pick out smaller details, spacial cues". I now understand what Danny means by hearing the singers intake of breath before starting to sing.
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=216251)
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=216252)
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=216253)
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=216254)
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=216255)
2nd speaker is done, & I only have 2 words:
HOLY SH*T :o
Theres a massive jump in clarity, detail, & depth.
It sounds that much more "REAL" & "ALIVE" than i expected. And ive gone back and forth a few times.
Vocals have more presence & focus, you can more easily pick out smaller details, spacial cues, & you can hear everything with more precision. Drums sound more life-like and snares especially stand front & center.
I expected a small difference, but it's MUCH bigger jump than I expected.. its like I mentioned in the "tube connector" thread; it's like getting a new pair of glasses after going years without getting a new prescription. The "softness" you're used to gives way to that much more clarity and focus.
I've gone back and forth several times now, & yep it's definitely there.. but the upgrade itself even made a difference to the binding posts, I'm guessing its due to having a more surface area to connect to vs bare wire??
Mind you, I still only have the stock crossover, cheap 14-gauge zip cord... They're 6" away from the wall & I'm playing CD-quality music via bluetooth...
If you're still on the fence on upgrading, GET THEM.. i 100% recommend making the jump! :thumb:
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Hey Hobbs
I just installed my tube connectors and they are great. I noticed improvements in clarity and the same types of things as you mentioned "Vocals have more presence & focus, you can more easily pick out smaller details, spacial cues". I now understand what Danny means by hearing the singers intake of breath before starting to sing.
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=216251)
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=216252)
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=216253)
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=216254)
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=216255)
Very nice! Im glad you were able to experience the same things i have as well! :thumb: