AudioCircle
The Marketplace => Trading Post => For Sale: Source Components => Topic started by: buckeyefanandy on 6 Apr 2011, 11:33 pm
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Getting ready to add vinyl to the mix, and looking for a nice turntable. Anyone have one they dont use? Any suggetions?
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This one looks pretty righteous:
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=92529.0
(disclosure: STS9fan is a friend of mine but it's still a pretty righteous table!)
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I've got a VPI HW-19 MkIII that will probably go on the market soon. It's probably an 8.5 of 10. There is a small buffed area on the platter that is purely cosmetic. An arm comes with it, but one of the cart clips needs to be soldered back onto the lead. Black with a dust cover and an extra belt.
I'm not using it, but I don't think I have the original packing. Could probably pack it carefully enough to get it to most places in the lower 48 though local pickup (near St. Louis, MO) would be preferably.
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Well this one invokes as many rants as discussions of cables.
I've been quite happy w/ my P3-24 and there are lot's of reviews that state it's near the top of the heap on entry level decks. Rega seems to fall into that 'love it or hate it' camp. Some people just can't buy into Roy's low mass philosophy.
I jumped on because I found a brand new one for a steep discount on A'gon.
I've not compared to any other modern low priced decks, but I know it kicks the crap out of my first introduction to vinyl, a Thorens TD-165.
I personally think the stock feet are the weak point and it benefits from some nice brass points on a thick maple platform.
I'm running it w/ a Denon DL-160.
Strong points: very musical. gets the PRAT thing right. very low noise all around. In fact, I'm amazed at the lack of noise given my past experiences w/ vinyl. (and that includes both surface and motor noise)
Weak points: At least w/ my pre and cart.....somewhat small SS. Still getting some low end feedback if I crank the subs. Need to explore better iso.
I'm sure one can do better on the used market, but for new, this is a nice piece of kit.
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Do you need an entry level phono pre-amp???
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In the spirit of the original poster as I'm also looking, what's the difference between a Rega P-3 and a P3-24?
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Getting ready to add vinyl to the mix, and looking for a nice turntable. Anyone have one they dont use? Any suggetions?
Hi Buckeye: Your request is so entirely open ended, that you might generate more helpful responses if you could mention at least some specifics. For example: 1) What do you mean by "entry level." For that matter... what do you mean by "nice." 2) Budget? 3) Used / New? 4) Any other preferences or requirements: Size, DD, Belt, etc. 5) How much use? (As you stated you're just getting back into vinyl.) 6) The need for a phono stage? Budget?
Just trying to be helpful, and as another poster mentioned, without at least some specifics it leaves your request open to rants and raves and guys who have every kind of turntable imaginable for sale. :thumb: Best Regards.
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I think bside nailed it. What for me might be a 'nice piece of kit', might be a joke to some. It all depends on your expectations and more important, your wallet.
The Rega P3-24 seems to have gotten uniform praise from the press as a good 'entry level' deck. Now I know reviews are to be taken w/ a grain of salt, but in this case every write up I've seen appears to concur.
I'm not trying to sell anyone Rega tables. I mean Roy is not writing me any checks!
A number of very knowledgable people here like the Technics SL-1200. Sonically, it may kick the crap out of my deck, but I just didn't care for the DJ look. That might be a poor way to decide on audio gear, but that's just me. In fact, I wanted a classic Linn LP-12, but I realized that I didn't have the knowledge to wade through all the different varients, know how to set it up and plus....they're still really pricey.
As to Alex's question. As far as I can tell, the diff between the old P3 and P3-24 is mostly the new one adds a much better motor. (quieter and more stable) Plus the new motor can use an outboard speed controller. The plinth is supposed to be more rigid and the arm has gone from a thru plinth design to a surface mount. Some people claim it's better, some carp that it was just a cost cutting measure.
Honestly, I'm not sure it was all worth it. I love some of the things I hear from analog. I get a kick out of shopping for used vinyl. But I have a pretty killer digital front end, and I'm not sure if I'd been better served getting upgrading my speakers. (or just investing the money)
Hope you had core vinyl guys don't bring the hate down for me saying that. It's been fun, and I've appreciated all the advice I've gotten here while on my analog odyssey.
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VPI would be high on my list... :green:
I've got a VPI HW-19 MkIII that will probably go on the market soon. It's probably an 8.5 of 10. There is a small buffed area on the platter that is purely cosmetic. An arm comes with it, but one of the cart clips needs to be soldered back onto the lead. Black with a dust cover and an extra belt.
I'm not using it, but I don't think I have the original packing. Could probably pack it carefully enough to get it to most places in the lower 48 though local pickup (near St. Louis, MO) would be preferably.
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VPI would be high on my list... :green:
If you want to, PM me and we can discuss. The arm is an FT-3. Good enough for beyond entry level cartridges. I might have an extra cart laying around to sweeten the deal.
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I am new to vinyl, but do have a preamp(s) with phono stage. One tubed audio mirror, and one ss ps audio.
I entered this arena about 5 years ago and have been piecing a rig together on a budget. Today, I am nearly finished with the rehab on a Victorian home where I have created a "man cave" out of a very large (now finished) attic. Now I plan to move slowly and modestly, but looking at this as an investment in my sanity.
I recently acquired a pair of speakers that will be the center of my room (Chapman T-8), and will be sticking with my Odyssey Stratos amp until I can make a move (way down the road) to Pass Aleph 0 monos or something similar.
I have only a cheap digital source after I downsized all my stuff when we started the rehab. I do have a great (small) collection of some blues and jazz albums from a friend that is all about vinyl. I would like to take this first step, but don't want to invest heavily in time or money until I test the vinyl market.
I am not sold on the lower end regas not big on MDF, but might consider a 3. But I have not hear any vinyl other than my friends Sota star, and a linn from another buddies place, but they were listening to music that i did not care for, so I did not take the time to listen close.
I am concerned that if I go too cheap, then I might miss out on the full experience. If I had a choice I would shoot for the $600 range, and would like to be under a grand.
I like vintage, but don't want to tweak or repair all the time.
In my experience there is a balance to strike between the best of the entry level, and the bottom of the next level where your trade off is either quality, performance, or brand. I like to maximize the quality and performance by finding the value rather than price point.
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Looking at a Oracle Alexandria, VPI Sout, among others, but with so many variables I makes me wish I could go back to a nice digital front end, but...
i like the hands on nature of the tt, and the ritual of vinyl. Also looking forward to the thrill of chasing down the music.
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Skip the Oracle alexandria unless you know it to be perfect. I've bought defective ones twice now....
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I have a Clearaudio Concept mounted with a Clearaudio Maestro MM cartridge that seems to be collecting more dust than spinning records. In my opinion, it's about as solid an entry level table as one could hope for. It would run a little more than what you said you wanted to spend but I'd be willing you make you a great deal on it if you were interested. It might be Clearaudio's entry level table but it's a real honey. Add their top MM cartridge and I think it's a table you could live with for a real long time.
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my first choice would be a used oracle delphi that is (or can be) updated to at least mkv spec. if you are willing to wait, you may get away w/spending $1k or even less, if updates have not been done. (which would give you an upgrade path.)
if you don't have $1k to spend (or even if you do), my second choice would be an empire. the earlier unsuspended iterations allow easier mounting of an aftermarket arm; these are killer decks. if you are relatively patient, you can find a nice empire, and mount something like an o-l rb250 on it, and be under your $600 figure. i would choose this over anything else near its price...
doug s.
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I have an Empire 598 table that I am thinking of selling for $375. It is in great shape. I would include an original(also in very good shape) Empire cartridge. If you wanted the Audio Technica MLA440 cartridge I was running on it, it would be another $100.
I also live in Northeast Ohio, so you could come and look at it and listen to it as well and if you like it take it home. BIG PLUS in not having to ship TT's. :thumb:
Thanks,
Randy
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Randy, I am always up for an audition.
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Skip the Oracle alexandria unless you know it to be perfect. I've bought defective ones twice now....
But if you do find one in great condition and fully functional they are sweet tables
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YOU LIKE ?
:D
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=45332)
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Looks great, what is it? How does it perform? Where do you get one, and what do they cost?
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(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=45333)
For more info
dantedin@twcny.rr.com
cheers
Hans
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Looks great, what is it? How does it perform? Where do you get one, and what do they cost?
thorens' 125 mkll's are nice decks; they seem to command similar prices to the wintage empires. no question for me, which one i'd be wanting to inwest in, tho, especially if you are wanting to tweak one... 8)
http://www.cognitivevent.com/av_empire.html
(http://www.cognitivevent.com/images/tt_empr_3qtr_aug02.jpg)
(http://www.cognitivevent.com/images/tt_nubase_3qtr_500.jpg)
(http://www.cognitivevent.com/images/tt_nubase_side_500.jpg)
another choice would be a wintage heavy-platter bogen/lenco; these are supposed to be superb, but i have no first-hand experience:
http://www.cognitivevent.com/av_lenco.html
(http://www.cognitivevent.com/images/lenco_3qtr_schickArm.jpg)
doug s.
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After doing a little more research, I have limited my Vintage search to these tables.
1) the Thorens TD-124,
2) Empire 208, a 298, 308/398,
3) the Garrard 301
Still looking at the modern decks to see if there is anything. Have a couple options I am considering from Oracle, Clearaudio, VPI, among a couple others. Want to see if I can demo some of the more common ones by having some friends over to listen when my speakers get here. Anyone in Ohio want to hear Chapman, Odyssey, and a preamp to be named shortly.... to your tt?
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Still looking at the modern decks to see if there is anything. Have a couple options I am considering from Oracle, Clearaudio, VPI, among a couple others.
You might as well add Nottingham and Well-Tempered to your list....
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Have not seem much from either in the budget category.
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You might as well add Nottingham and Well-Tempered to your list....
You can find good preowned offerings of some models from these manufacturers for around the $1,000 mark (give or take). It seems that some of the other decks that you are looking at are in that price range as well. :scratch:
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The Project tables look pretty good.
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Have you considered a Sota Sapphire or Star. Excellent tables and can be had used at a very reasonable price.
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Most of the tables i have seen by Nottingham are several thousand dollars. Had not seen a sub $1k from either. I will look a little further into it, thanks for the suggestion.
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Have a friend that loves his Sota star, but it was well out of the $1k price limit I am working with.
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There is a Sapphire on A'gon at $675 with a Sumiko arm.
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Hi Buckeye,
Here's an example of a sale 50% off sale on a new Nottingham for $1,000. In the preowned category you may find other models.
http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?anlgtabl&1305321055&/Nottingham-Analogue-Interspace
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Thanks for the heads up gentlemen, I will be checking those out.
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I'm in terrible need of money, would you be interested in my (dusty in picture)
Dual CS 5000 , sitting on my Jolida JD-9 phono section
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=38052)
also includes isoplatmat by SDS.
Contact me via PM here if interested
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I am listening to ideas on the analog front ends. Tell me about what you got and what you want.
Thanks
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Why is Technics not on your list? Is the Thorens TD-124 really superior too, say, a Technics 1200? Seems like some offerings from the Technics line, even with tweeks from TAD would fit in you price range. Just an observation. :D
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Andy,
Is a new deck preferred for you? If so, it leaves precious few choices....but, at least a couple decent ones.
What is your level of experience with turntables? Getting a pre-loved :inlove: table can be a financially rewarding endeavor, but a limitless pain as vintage tables come with vintage problems that need to be overcome a lot of the times.
Most issues, at least with fully manual decks, are of a mechanical variety (where fixing or swapping out is mostly straightforward), but it can get overwhelming if you are a new turntablist or not particularly handy.
If you are moderately handy and adventurous, and or have some experience with turntables, there's a vast market of good Japanese made turntables from the late 70's and early 80's that can be made into extremely capable decks with very ordinary and light tweeks. Most of these decks suffer from hollow, plastic cavities that store a lot of energy in listening frequency range and impart ugly coloration to the sonic.
6-8 lbs of non-hardening modeling clay in the interior, substitution of better feet and choice of a good, dedicated turntable stand will have you spinning great tunes at modest prices. Changing out the rubber platter mat for various other better sonic choices takes you that much further.
After wallowing in audio hell for 5 years with CD-only front end (and sinking $4500 into it for it to merely sound mediocre), I bought a $50 JVC QL-A2 direct drive deck in 2005 on ebay. $550 in TOTAL upgrades later, it was back to vinyl as the highest resolution source for me and sonic bliss ever since. Here's my chronicle that may help you on your journey:
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=22938.0
The point is, $1000 (including modest cartridge) spent on a vintage Japanese direct drive deck can be hugely rewarding experience. Further, many of these decks have at least auto-return - which reduce the pain of vinyl spinning to a further minimum with the busy lives most of us now lead :)
Enjoy, John (welcoming you to post as needed if you have questions over in the Vinyl Circle here at Audio Circle)
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A fav list for classic TT by class IMO from working with them.
Idler table
-Garrard 301
-Thorens TD 124 MK I
-Lenco L78
Belt table
- Empire Troubador 598 mk II
- Thorens TD125
- AR ES-1
Yummie Direct drive
- Technic sp10 mk III
- Nakamichi tx 1000
- Pioneer PL 590
- Im forever in search of Infinity Air bearing table to play.
*** Guess what arm below ***
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=45421)
:roll:.............
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After much advice and reading the journey many others have made, i am looking at a two part plan. First I am going to be looking for an entry level solution that is in $500 to $700 range give or take. I want to find something that keeps the lps spinning and music flowing in my home.
Then I will begin to search for a couple vintage tables that are on the lists above. But rather than find them hear, I will enjoy the hunt of finding something at an auction, antique/vintage shop, or other treasure hunting option while looking for vinyl to spin. This way I can play with some of these options and learn along the way. I will look for both the vintage 50's 60's workhorses, and for the 70's and 80's as well. If I wreck a $50 table and learn something along the way, I can handle that.
Are there some tonearms that work well on several of those vintage tables? I finally have a use for that old growth curly maple sitting in the basement.
In the mean time, I am planning to head out to some of my northern Ohio audio friends for a listening session or two.
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(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=45423)
Suggest.....If I may....
Technics SP-15 / Audiocraft 300c
Denon DP 60L
Good luck with your search, I'm off to Bali
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If I wreck a $50 table and learn something along the way, I can handle that.
That's exactly the attititude I took coming back to vinyl in 2005.
I learned, and re-learned an IMMENSE amount about turntables for that measly investment.
In the end, I DID ruin that table - but it was the best $50 learning tool I could've imagined on my road back to sonic bliss :thumb:
I've spent more since - and gotten better sound - but in no way was that $50 spinner bad sounding, at all.
Ciao, John
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Hit up several shops today and was surprised by the number of vintage tables there were near me. Most of them were Gerard, Thorens, Luxman so far. Kinda fun. More fun was getting to talk about folks that also love vinyl. Met someone that has a Sota Saphire and Star for sale. The Star was vacuum and the saphire was belt, both were less than 1k.
Fun first day of hunting. Thanks for all the info, only time will tell..
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Do you need an entry level phono pre-amp???
Yes, My audio mirror pre does not have the phono my ps audio does. Thinking of selling both to get into a tubed pre w/ phono. Always wanted to try a sonic frontiers.
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Hello...
Here is a link to a great vintage turntable resource...
Dave is extremely helpful and knowledgeable...
Worth a visit to the website...
Peace...
Stuart
http://www.vinylnirvana.com/
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Looks like I will be holding off for now. After doing as much searching and reading as I can stand, there is just too much to try to process to make an informed decision.
No audio shops in the area that do vinyl, but will be going to listen as some friends houses as time permits. I can see why people are so On or Off with analog. There is a lot to commit to and a steep learning curve.
Too bad, I need to unwind at night, but that will have to wait.
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Take a look at that Dual CS5000 Larry is selling here.
Nice table in very nice shape too.
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=93517.msg932501;topicseen#new
D
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Oh, Crap.
I spent most of my morning auditioning a nice analog rig at a local shop. They had an empire 208 that I was going to buy, but it was on lay away.
Anyways, I was lured by the lush sound of the vinyl even with the mid level kenwood and pioneer tables that they had to listen to. I was afraid to listen to the top shelf sota and a couple other nice tables out of my range.
Did not matter, the "kind of blue" never sounded like this at my house. Even the way the lp moved in such a deliberate steady pace was relaxing.