[JLM]

As a single driver advocate I find this whole conversation "interesting".  Decades ago the design goal of speaker manufacturers was 80 - 8,000 Hz.  The speakers in my main rig are rated 27 - 20,000 Hz but due to having 8 inch cones with no whizzer/super tweeter they start "beaming" around 4,000 Hz.  So in a way oldtimers and I've been living like you werd for years.  And I'm 56, so have lost some high frequency hearing. 

OTOH I feel like you need an audio intervention (and we all need to meet your librarian  ).

[rollo]

  May I suggest using one super tweeter facing to the rear wall and connected out of phase. If one has single driver speakers this may change your mind about tweeters. Mount the tweeter on a stand in the center of your main speakers.
   If you have two subs then by all means use one for the mains and one about 4ft. minimum. Set the polarity to out of phase grab a cold drink and be amazed at the room fill. Have fun.


charles

[rollo]

YES yes and yes for the mono cart for mono LPs. Better than you think and you do not need an expensive cart. Should have bought ones years ago, who knew  ??


charles

[werd]

As a single driver advocate I find this whole conversation "interesting".  Decades ago the design goal of speaker manufacturers was 80 - 8,000 Hz.  The speakers in my main rig are rated 27 - 20,000 Hz but due to having 8 inch cones with no whizzer/super tweeter they start "beaming" around 4,000 Hz.  So in a way oldtimers and I've been living like you werd for years.  And I'm 56, so have lost some high frequency hearing. 

OTOH I feel like you need an audio intervention (and we all need to meet your librarian  ).

I can always use an audio intervention.  .

And as far as my librarian, i need to meet her first...lol.

P.S.

I don't share.

[werd]

  May I suggest using one super tweeter facing to the rear wall and connected out of phase. If one has single driver speakers this may change your mind about tweeters. Mount the tweeter on a stand in the center of your main speakers.
   If you have two subs then by all means use one for the mains and one about 4ft. minimum. Set the polarity to out of phase grab a cold drink and be amazed at the room fill. Have fun.


charles

You know, a super tweeter might work for what I am doing too. It might just add the right amount of ambience for those that still want more high freq? 

[werd]

Update here


Been listening to Hendrix's - Valley of Neptune

This recording uses a lot of guitar and cymbal work to form out the melody. This happened to change the way it sounds on my system. Where I was getting the image from on the tweeter less side it now formed on the tweeter side with the mids coming off from the side. I tried to work it out and couldn't figure out what was going on.

I wasnt use to it, but really nothing was wrong it was working perfectly. There is a learning curve that results in just letting it go and not worrying about it.

[Telstar]

Hmmm... first when I read the title I thought you were talking about a single speaker setup.
Your actual experiment is weird, and i think something is flawed in your own speakers to feel improvements with such messed up stereo image.
FYI one should use 2 subs unless they are <50hz only.

What is also true is that mid-fi speakers have a HF bump/raising response that causes the thin, tiring, "hifi" sound that is most common nowadays, and that you dont like.
Moreover, the directivity of any tweeter suffers a lot above 8-10khz. We absolutely DONT need a stronger power response below this frequency. Instead I have liked properly (+way above 10k) crossed supertweeters with good source equipment.

[werd]

Hmmm... first when I read the title I thought you were talking about a single speaker setup.
Your actual experiment is weird, and i think something is flawed in your own speakers to feel improvements with such messed up stereo image.
FYI one should use 2 subs unless they are <50hz only.

What is also true is that mid-fi speakers have a HF bump/raising response that causes the thin, tiring, "hifi" sound that is most common nowadays, and that you dont like.
Moreover, the directivity of any tweeter suffers a lot above 8-10khz. We absolutely DONT need a stronger power response below this frequency. Instead I have liked properly (+way above 10k) crossed supertweeters with good source equipment.

Hello

No I am not talking about a single speaker. Yes I know my experiment is weird. No there is nothing wrong with my stereo image that i am not talking about anymore. I am more interested in this new mono image I am experiencing.

Two subs I would like to try but I cant even use one due to my mono preamp ATM. Even if I could use two I am more interested in using one since I want to break up the symmetry of two Channel. Breaking up the symmetry helps in hearing each individual channel and not focusing on the center image.

Using a super tweeter sounds interesting also but again I would only use one. Or maybe i would use two I would have to check it out. But I have found great success individualizing each channel to its designated purpose. One side is more tweeter and one side is more mid.


Merry xmas

[Napalm]

Werd why don't you throw away that underpowered junk and get some decent speakers instead.

[werd]

You guys gotta hear the The White Stripes like this. Got my carver back on since i can sub it up. Have my sub on the left and tweeter on the right but in mono. You look for the image close to the tweeterless channel while making sure you can hear the tweeter on its own.

This Stripes sounds really good like this. Its made for this. 

[Napalm]

Dunno Werd, this is one of those bands I prefer to listen to with the "mute" control engaged.... the number of working tweeters is irrelevant in this context....

[JBLMVBC]

I think this also comes from having manufacturers emphasize the scintillating tweeters, from preamps to speakers. This often creates an artifical image field and a flat wall of sound instead of letting air between instruments and "above" speakers. However in a fully active system, one can adjust tweeters -crossover frequency and volume- so they become a natural extension of the fundamentals, almost disappearing.

[werd]

I think this also comes from having manufacturers emphasize the scintillating tweeters, from preamps to speakers. This often creates an artifical image field and a flat wall of sound instead of letting air between instruments and "above" speakers. However in a fully active system, one can adjust tweeters -crossover frequency and volume- so they become a natural extension of the fundamentals, almost disappearing.

I agree but the active lean to more distortion. But yes a great avenue. I am coming at from a purist approach.

[JBLMVBC]

I agree but the active lean to more distortion. But yes a great avenue. I am coming at from a purist approach.

More distortion? Not in intermodulation...

[werd]

Yah ok, not any more distortion.