AudioCircle
Industry Circles => ModWright Instruments (MWI) => Topic started by: modwright on 9 Sep 2018, 05:35 pm
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https://www.whathifi.com/news/pioneer-previews-udp-lx500-4k-blu-ray-player (https://www.whathifi.com/news/pioneer-previews-udp-lx500-4k-blu-ray-player)
New Pioneer UDP-LX500 4K Blu Ray Player with Stereo analog outs!
I am watching this one closely! It features full UHD 4K blue ray video playback and an exceptional 2CH AKM 32-bit DAC and analog out.
There is enough room inside the unit, to ideally build the power supply and tube stage inside the player!
Let me know if this interests you! More to come as I learn more about the player.
Thanks,
Dan W.
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Dan,
The LX800 just got released too. It has dual ESS 9026 DACs, balanced outs and SACD playback (don't think the 500 will play SACDs)......more money, however.
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It indeed looks interesting. Not sure why they didn't use the 9032 DACs, but it IS more in line with the Oppo! Does it also have digital inputs via USB for Hi-Rez streaming?
Dan
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I would be interested in the LX800 mod.
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Thanks! We will have to wait for its release.
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It indeed looks interesting. Not sure why they didn't use the 9032 DACs, but it IS more in line with the Oppo! Does it also have digital inputs via USB for Hi-Rez streaming?
Dan
It has USB for use with a hard drive - https://www.pioneerelectronics.com/ephox/StaticFiles/PUSA/Files/Home/Elite_UDP-LX500@180815_HR.pdf
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That is a good sign!
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OK, I have a Pioneer LX-500 in house and it has a lot of room inside!
What I can tell so far:
Shielding and rigid non-resonant treatment of the drive is the same as the LX-800 and this is great!
The bottom plate of the enclosure is also a heavy steel plate, adding to chassis rigidity and reducing vibration.
Video circuitry is fully shielded.
The stock analog stage is RCA only, but there is potential for us to offer XLR outputs.
The stock AKM DAC has a very nice sound, albeit a weak power supply.
There is A LOT of room inside the unit for us to install a power transformer, power supply, and our own analog stage which will elevate the performance of this unit SIGNIFICANTLY!
I am looking at a tube mod for the LX-500 that will be much less costly than that for the LX-800 and Oppo UDP-205. The main reason for this is that we do not need to provide an umbilical or external power supply.
Those interested, please let me know. I will be proceeding with a design for this first article and will post details, listening impressions and cost when complete.
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Dan, do you plan to develop a LX800 mod as well? We can purchase the LX800 from abroad and ship it to you for the mod?
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NAD C 546BEE Compact Disc Player
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I can mod the LX-800, but I cannot convert to 120V.
I’ll check out the NAD. Thanks.
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Hi Dan,
The Pioneer looks like a good platform for mods. Would the tubes fit in the enclosure without protruding through the top? Do you feel confident with how players are phasing out that your return on investment is there if production is halted for this product?
Greg
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Hi Greg and good questions.
First of all, the tubes will be exposed in any mod we do simply to reject heat. These players generate enough of their own heat and do not benefit from added heat from a pair of vacuum tubes.
The LX-800 has already proven to sound fantastic with the same mod circuit as the UDP-205, because the DACs are still SABRE and the implementation is similar.
The LX-500 will be something different. The AKM DAC is voltage output, rather than current out. This means that our mod can be a bit simpler. Also, there is a lot more room inside the enclosure of the LX-500 to allow us to design our own internal power supply for DAC and analog stage circuits, leaving only the Video circuitry and basic controls being supplied by the stock switcher. For the record, this is also what the LX-800 does, with its own internal transformer for audio and DAC circuitry. I believe the switcher that supplies the video circuitry is the same or very similar in the LX-500 and 800 models.
This simplification of our mod for the '500' model means that the mod cost will be lower.
As to whether there is still a market for disc players, look at the outcry over Oppo going out of business? The Oppo Sonica DAC, even though having the EXACT same DAC and stock audio circuitry as the 205 player was NEVER the seller that the 205 was. So, while yes, DACs seem to be a thing of the present, many people still want a disc player and units that can serve both audio and video function.
In terms of capital investment and return for this mod, their is not a huge capital outlay in the design of a circuit, PCBs and selection of suitable transformer. A much bigger capital investment is for any MWI product with our own enclosures, custom packing, etc. The mod business model does allow me to move fast and nimbly in this regard, responding to market changes.
Thanks,
Dan Wright
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The NAD looks like a great CDP, but it lacks digital inputs and does not appear to support SACD, DSD or MQA. For these reasons, I feel that the market for a mod to this player would be very limited, despite it being a great player I am certain!
Thanks,
Dan
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Hi Dan,
Thanks for answering my question regarding the tubes being exposed for technical reasons like heat dissipation. Also good to know you can leverage your prior designs in modding the units. Based on your positive impressions of the UDP-LX800 I am curious how close the UDP-LX500 stacks up.
Greg
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ld be interested in the LX500 mod.
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Thanks, I will have details and pricing for the mod soon. Please email kristin.modwright@yahoo.com and she will add you to our list!
I am very excited about this. It will be less expensive than the Oppo 205 mods and will be a one box solution.
Dan
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Any chance the LX500 mod can be ordered with the following:
1. Furutech Fi-06 NCF outlet
2. Audio Magic Pulse Gen ZX Premier
3. Bybee rails
Have you tried the "Zero Signal" grounding terminal on the LX? Does it improve sound in any way?
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We can offer the Furutech IEC, Audio Magic and I will have to see about the Bybee rail.
I have not tried the "Zero Signal" grounding terminal.
Thanks,
Dan
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New MOD PCB in the house and built. Ready for install and testing today!
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Looking forward to your assessment!!!
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I have it playing music with the tube circuit today and it sounds good! I am a ways from done, but I do have it playing music through our mod stage at this point and it sounds wonderful! I am going to let things burn in today and re-visit it tomorrow. Still more controls logistics and other issues to address.
Thanks,
Dan
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I have it playing music with the tube circuit today and it sounds good! I am a ways from done, but I do have it playing music through our mod stage at this point and it sounds wonderful! I am going to let things burn in today and re-visit it tomorrow. Still more controls logistics and other issues to address.
Thanks,
Dan
Do you have your input power supply in the circuit?
P.G.
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Quick listening test: 205 tube mod vs. Pioneer LX-500 tube mod:
Same:
Both players use a pair of 6dj8/6922/7308 driver tubes.
Both mods use Lundahl transformers for signal coupling to analog stage from DAC.
Different:
205 uses outboard tube rectified PS 9.0 supply.
Pioneer uses inboard SS rectified supply.
205 uses SABRE DAC.
Pioneer uses AKM chip.
Tube circuits are different: 205 uses fully balanced circuit; Pioneer uses SE circuit.
So how do they sound?
The answer is VERY CLOSE! My VP Kristin just listened with me to a great recording and I asked her just for her gut first impression. The Pioneer has been burning in since last night and the 205 has been burning in for weeks.
Kristin replied that they were VERY close and that she would have to hear more music that she was familiar with to really tell the differences. We both agreed that bass response and soundstage are excellent on both. Tube rectification makes the Oppo a bit different tonally. The Pioneer sounds perhaps a bit more resolving with SS rectification.
The SABRE DAC is also more forward sounding, while the AKM DAC is smoother and richer in its presentation. To be honest, I would be hard pressed to declare a winner, and I am not finished with the Pioneer yet!
Price Difference?
Pioneer mod will be about $1K cheaper! Also, the new Pioneer is about $1K stock!
No outboard supply, umbilical and less labor with everything installed inside the Pioneer.
I am very excited about this!
I am taking two of these to Axpona that will be discounted further as fully modified units. I have one sold already and two others waiting to hear my impressions.
If you are interested, please let us know!
We do have a list of people to contact once the mod is finalized and in production! This will be soon!
Thanks,
Dan
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I assume the comparison is using the analog outputs? Is there a difference or improvement using HDMI or coax digital outputs? I'm thinking specifically for multi-channel surround SACD's and DVD-Audio.
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I have not compared via digital out and would have no idea. You have to understand that our mods are only intended to improve the analog outs for 2CH use.
Dan
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OK, have completed three now and I am very pleased!
Price for LX-500 mods = $1500
Mods include:
Add two power transformers and linear supplies: High Voltage and filament for tubes; Separate supply for DAC and digital circuits.
Upgrade key capacitors in DAC circuit.
Upgrade IEC to Furutech.
Damp chassis and drive.
Replace stock analog stage with our own Class A tube Stage (RCA only), with internal power supply as one box solution. Zero feedback. 6922/6dj8/7308 tube.
I have compared it to the Oppo 205 and while it has its own sound, I can say that they are at the same level of performance. Also, the Pioneer is a one-box solution and is $1K cheaper!
Thanks and I look forward to hearing from you.
Dan W.
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Dan,
Do you have pictures of the modded LX500? I'm interested in the LX500 mods as I currently have a stock Oppo 205. Is the Pioneer warranty still in effect after the mods are done? I'm also looking at the Marantz SA-KI Ruby CD/SACD player. More expensive than the modded LX500 though. Have you heard any of Marantz' reference CD/SACD players? Thanks!
Bill
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(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=196272)
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Dan,
Do you have pictures of the modded LX500? I'm interested in the LX500 mods as I currently have a stock Oppo 205. Is the Pioneer warranty still in effect after the mods are done? I'm also looking at the Marantz SA-KI Ruby CD/SACD player. More expensive than the modded LX500 though. Have you heard any of Marantz' reference CD/SACD players? Thanks!
Bill
Bill, the manufacturer's warranty is void. Dan's mods are considerable and the manufacturer cannot be liable for that. The only instances (I've seen) where mods don't void a warranty is when the manufacturer approves of the mods or the mods are so minor that they don't really change the original equipment specs.
With that said, I'm certain Dan stands by his work and the machines he mods.
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Hi and thanks for the interest in our work. The LX-500 is an amazing sounding player! I would recommend having us modify this over the Marantz Ruby. First of all, you are going to pay A LOT more for the Marantz and it would require an outboard supply. The LX-500 is ideal in that it provides all that we DO need and nothing that we don't! It has a great AKM DAC and excellent transport and non-resonant enclosure. We have room to build both analog and digital supplies of our own design internally and the sonic result is stunning! We also of course, replace the entire stock 2CH analog output stage with our own Class A tube output stage!
The Oppo 205 mod is also very good. It is $1K more and includes an external power supply. If you want to use it as a full DAC and player for streaming, then the Oppo is the way to go. If you plan to use it for 4K video and all audio/video disc playback, then the Pioneer gets my highest recommendation! It will play DSD files via static USB drive, but this requires a monitor to access file libraries and the USB input will not accept a server or computer USB input, only USB storage device.
Please feel free to call me with any more questions.
Thanks,
Dan Wright
360.247.6688
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Dealers have been told that the LX500 should begin shipping to the USA again in Feb 2021, and perhaps the LX800 in the summer!
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Dealers have been told that the LX500 should begin shipping to the USA again in Feb 2021, and perhaps the LX800 in the summer!
So worth it. Dan did an amazing mod on my LX500. The sonics of this unit are stellar!
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So worth it. Dan did an amazing mod on my LX500. The sonics of this unit are stellar!
Dan did do an amazing job!
But this unit is also very responsive to tweaks which further improves the sound:
1) Tube rolling
2) Internal dampening
3) ERS Paper
4) Bybees on the power lines
5) Mass loading
I imagine Dan has been eagerly awaiting production of this unit starting back up.....