AudioCircle
Industry Circles => GR Research => Topic started by: Hobbsmeerkat on 17 Aug 2022, 05:35 am
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The first pair of LGK 2.1s are up and playing!
(a little too late to crank them though..) :P
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=243839&size=xlarge)
Here's the crossover layout which takes up the entire bottom of the speaker, with Just enough clearance for the woofer :thumb:
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=243840)
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=243841&size=large)
More info to follow shortly! :thumb:
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First impressions?
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I finished them at 11:30 last night, so I couldn't turn them up to really hear them without getting nuisance calls.
Soon as I have a chance, I'll compare them directly to the smaller 2.0s.
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And how did they do? I liked that woofer in the desktop mini (which played well above its weight.)
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They've turned out great!
Taking the bass frequencies off of the LGK driver really helped to open up the midrange performance. So vocals and strings sound fantastic.
It also allows you to push the speaker a lot further/louder than the LGK 2.0 alone, so they're better suited for larger rooms, even without a sub.
The bass on the 2.1 isn't quite as detailed, but being able to push it further and having a more gradual roll off is a fair trade-off, plus it also allows for near-wall placement and easy integration with a subwoofer without the need for a high-pass filter.
Here's the On-Axis response.
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=244321)
If you find the very top end to be a little bright, towing them out to roughly 10° will help to soften it quite a bit. I personally didn't have a problem with it.
Addressing it with a notch filter, like on the 2.0, would have required a larger cabinet, or using two separate boards, as it's already a tight fit as it is.
Danny plans to film a video on it this week, likely to go live after the Klipsch RC-64 III upgrade video.
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Well thankfully it's more than a sneak peek now! Great job!
The center channel LGK 2.1 and a tower version - wow
Bob
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I just had to order a pair of these. Can’t wait.
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Well thankfully it's more than a sneak peek now! Great job!
The center channel LGK 2.1 and a tower version - wow
Bob
The 2.2 & 2.4 cabinets are finished, i just need to pick them up so we can get started on the crossover design work.
We're also considering a version of the 2.4 towers with a 2nd LGK on the back to make them into a di-pole, very similar to what we did with the old "Skinny 6" but we're not there yet.
They'll need some extra space behind them, but should make for a more open, spacious sound.
We're hoping to have more info on the next versions soon! :thumb:
I just had to order a pair of these. Can’t wait.
Your order just went out today so it should arrive pretty soon!
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Wow that's fast. now to look up Skinny 6...
Is that sort of like open baffle without the open?
Bob
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Very much so the rear driver would be playing from 3000Hz up.
Danny currently has the Skinny6 and Flat5 in his living room.
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I was just looking at the horizontal off-axis response for the 2.1 and am curious why it falls off so abruptly at 6-7khz. Is that where a 3" driver starts beaming?
How would you compare the tonality of the LGK to the X series? I have some old Paradigm Atoms as my surround channels and the LGK cabinet would be workable in their place, but im not sure how well they would blend with my Encore/Voce LCR setup.
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I was just looking at the horizontal off-axis response for the 2.1 and am curious why it falls off so abruptly at 6-7khz. Is that where a 3" driver starts beaming?
How would you compare the tonality of the LGK to the X series? I have some old Paradigm Atoms as my surround channels and the LGK cabinet would be workable in their place, but im not sure how well they would blend with my Encore/Voce LCR setup.
You are correct about the beaming, that's the limitation of a 3" wide-band driver. You see the same things with 8" & 12" wide-band drivers as well, but they're beaming point is much lower, especially as the driver gets bigger. A secondary, inner-cone can help, but only so much.
The 2.1s have a more natural sounding midrange and lower treble thanks to the lighter moving mass. They're not quite as detailed up top or below 350Hz, but using a single driver over a larger frequency range makes for a really smooth and coherent presentation that is difficult to get with most typical 2-way speakers.
Overall though, they should be fairly similar, but there will be some differences, likely less than your Paradigm Atoms. And they are output limited to 30-50W peaks, but should be fine as surrounds, since they don't often see the same needs in volume/power as the main drivers, with bass being taken over by the subs.
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I was just looking at the horizontal off-axis response for the 2.1 and am curious why it falls off so abruptly at 6-7khz. Is that where a 3" driver starts beaming?
How would you compare the tonality of the LGK to the X series? I have some old Paradigm Atoms as my surround channels and the LGK cabinet would be workable in their place, but im not sure how well they would blend with my Encore/Voce LCR setup.
I address that comparison in our latest video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aWDPieaILIg
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Question on the 2.1 finished cabinets, are the sides rounded off or straight-edged?
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Question on the 2.1 finished cabinets, are the sides rounded off or straight-edged?
They are rounded over.
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They are rounded over.
Thanks, thinking about purchasing these so I can replace the LGK drivers I have been using at my computer in tandom with a pair of tb mini subs... I want to try something else with them. But i dont really like the color difference between the white woofer with the copper LGK. Would a foam ring with fabric glued around for a woofer cover impact the sound that much?
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Thanks, thinking about purchasing these so I can replace the LGK drivers I have been using at my computer in tandom with a pair of tb mini subs... I want to try something else with them. But i dont really like the color difference between the white woofer with the copper LGK. Would a foam ring with fabric glued around for a woofer cover impact the sound that much?
If done properly a grill could be added.
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First, right out of the blocks, I'm ducking. So why am I ducking?
The image of the cabinet, it's tempting to look at that, as an open baffle (ala NX Studio monitors) option with no lid.
(https://i0.wp.com/gr-research.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/08/ss2022-05-04at11.38.23-1.png?fit=1073%2C1101&ssl=1)
There I said it, duck, duck duck...
:popcorn:
Bob
And just because I love the look
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=243839&size=xlarge)
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We may try some open baffle versions of it next.
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Finally was able to finish up my LGK 2.1s last weekend. Kudos to Killian for sending me beautifully veneered cabinets in Walnut. After a week of break in, these speakers have a midrange to die for. One of the most natural sounding speakers I’ve heard. I love them. They are perfect for a bedroom speaker. The only thing I did differently from how it comes is I added Duelund JDM pure copper foil bypass caps on the 2 caps in the signal path. There is still much more break in needed and i can tell these are probably never coming out of my bedroom system.
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=245630)
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They've turned out great!
Taking the bass frequencies off of the LGK driver really helped to open up the midrange performance. So vocals and strings sound fantastic.
It also allows you to push the speaker a lot further/louder than the LGK 2.0 alone, so they're better suited for larger rooms, even without a sub.
The bass on the 2.1 isn't quite as detailed, but being able to push it further and having a more gradual roll off is a fair trade-off, plus it also allows for near-wall placement and easy integration with a subwoofer without the need for a high-pass filter.
Here's the On-Axis response.
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=244321)
If you find the very top end to be a little bright, towing them out to roughly 10° will help to soften it quite a bit. I personally didn't have a problem with it.
Addressing it with a notch filter, like on the 2.0, would have required a larger cabinet, or using two separate boards, as it's already a tight fit as it is.
Danny plans to film a video on it this week, likely to go live after the Klipsch RC-64 III upgrade video.
The 5 db at 11khz suits me fine. At my age I need it. The distortion there, not so much.
Can you stop calling these LGKs? These are no relation to the originals.
Let's see the untruncated Low FR measurement.
Are these ported? Can you optimize for a stuffed port alignment at 80hz for use with subs?
thanks
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They're a sealed box, so there's no worries about port tuning, and they naturally begin to roll off around 70Hz.
Danny is the one that came up with the LGK line so that's up to him.
The only way we can get non-truncated measurements below 200Hz is more difficult as we dont have an anechoic chamber to get accurate results. Best we can do would be to take nearfield measurements. Also dont forget that below 200Hz, the room is far more likely to dominate the response far more than the speaker does.
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They're a sealed box, so there's no worries about port tuning, and they naturally begin to roll off around 70Hz.
Danny is the one that came up with the LGK line so that's up to him.
The only way we can get non-truncated measurements below 200Hz is more difficult as we dont have an anechoic chamber to get accurate results. Best we can do would be to take nearfield measurements. Also dont forget that below 200Hz, the room is far more likely to dominate the response far more than the speaker does.
Thanks, I doubt that I want to see nearfield measurements even at higher frquencies. At low frquencies the room is the whole enchilada. Even so, if you have a mic you can take them outside to measure, just for my and/or your amusement.
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I finished them at 11:30 last night, so I couldn't turn them up to really hear them without getting nuisance calls.
Soon as I have a chance, I'll compare them directly to the smaller 2.0s.
Let us know once you get a chance to really open them up! Are you using inline high pass filters to knock off some low end and push them a little harder, or does the crossover to that 5inch cone do a good enough job?
Also, how are the dynamics?
Maybe I'm asking silly questions for a "desktop" speaker, but I actually want to use these for music and movies in my 18x18 theater. I don't like movie theater volume, but I do like movie theater dynamic range, and I like music with a high dynamic range as well.
Thanks,
Tucker ( new here :wave: )
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When I was listening to them after I finished putting them together, they really sounded great, even pushing them fairly hard, easily beyond where the smaller 2.0s would struggle without a 125Hz high-pass filter.
When we put them in Danny's system, we did have an in-line filter taking off the bottom octave, since his room is a lot bigger, where the bass would easily get swallowed up, allowing the subs to take over and We were able to push them quite hard without ever really making them struggle, even on dynamic drum tracks.
They may struggle a little with dynamics down low as mains in a HT setup, especially without subs, but we are working on a tower version using 4 woofers down low to allow for better bass control and dynamics as L&R mains, and we are also just about finished with the network center channel-version as well.
If you set the speakers to "small" on your receiver and use a sub to take over the bottom end, you may be just fine with regards to dynamics.
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Can you stop calling these LGKs? These are no relation to the originals.
They are very similar and even better than the originals.
Have you heard the audio clips played through these speakers?
Downloads:
👉 LGK 2.1 Sound Clips Downloads: https://bit.ly/3RJeMK9
👉 Original Music Files (for comparison): https://bit.ly/3ROjUwQ
Artist Support:
Jack Johnson: https://jackjohnsonmusic.com/
Allison Krauss: https://www.plantkrauss.com/
Vienna Teng: https://stores.portmerch.com/viennateng/
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Though it'd share some feedback from a customer who just finished building a pair of 2.1s:
Awesome.
That’s the word.
I got the speakers all set up. My first diy speaker set up I’ve ever done, in sure they’re not done perfect as it’s my first but they sound incredible. They truly do. They’re on my desktop with my computer and they are BY FAR the most well balanced speakers I have heard on the computer. It’s insane. All the issues I have had with my other desktop speakers are gone and they just play the music and videos as intended. Perfect.