Does the Decware SE84 Super Zen work well with the 93dB Super Alnico 6.5" Hemp?

Canada Rob · « **on:** 12 Nov 2014, 08:58 pm »

Answer: YES, and with gusto. The little Zen amp plays my Super Alnico Monitors with ease. The sound is huge, deep, spacey, rich, textured, refined, effortless, focused, fast. The top to bottom frequency extension is amazing, and IMO there is no need for a sub. I've not heard a better stereo system....at any price.

For years I have been hesitant to put this pairing (SE84 and Alnico 6.5" Hemp) together and mostly concentrated on the incredible synergy between the Zen amp and the RS5. What made me hesitant is, in the past, when I paired the SE84 with the 93dB 4.5" HempCone I found it to be a sublime pairing when a sub was in the picture for room listening, or playing on the desktop without sub. Things, however, got marginal when I ran the pairing in a room without sub. Being the Super Alnico Monitor and XRS are "rated" at 93dB efficient, I stupidly steered clear, all the while missing an utterly incredible aural experience from this pairing. Personally, I think the Super Alnico Monitor and XRS are more efficient than 93dB.

I can now unequivocally say the Decware Zen amp will run any current production Omega speaker with ease.

seikosha · « **Reply #1 on:** 12 Nov 2014, 09:31 pm »

Are there things that the RS5 does better than the Alnico or is the Alnico better in every respect? Also, what size room are you running this combo in?

Like you, I run a Zen with RS5's and while it'd be great to get just a little more bass out of the combo, I like everything else that I hear so much that I'd be disappointed to lose one aspect of my sound just to get a little more bottom end and that's why I've been so hesitant in making a change.

beowulf · « **Reply #2 on:** 13 Nov 2014, 01:45 am »

I just have to hear these AlNiCo's one day. I've been told by Louis that they do certain things really well such as Jazz, Vocals and Acoustic stuff. But I don't listen to those types of genres all that often though (maybe 10-15 % of my entire library has that type of music). The other 85% is Rock and their sub genres and out of that 85% Rock probably 40% is Hard , Metal and Prog (Steven Wilson type stuff), so I think the Ferrites are for me, but I can't stop wondering "what if?"

RDavidson · « **Reply #3 on:** 13 Nov 2014, 02:33 am »

Quote from: seikosha on 12 Nov 2014, 09:31 pm

Are there things that the RS5 does better than the Alnico or is the Alnico better in every respect? Also, what size room are you running this combo in?

Like you, I run a Zen with RS5's and while it'd be great to get just a little more bass out of the combo, I like everything else that I hear so much that I'd be disappointed to lose one aspect of my sound just to get a little more bottom end and that's why I've been so hesitant in making a change.

I'm a bit in the same boat. LOVE my 3xrs and sub combo, but am curious about the 7xrs. Omegas are addictive and I can't help but want more. If the 7xrs does everything the 3xrs does, plus adds just that extra oomph to the lower mids / upper bass I'd have to get a pair. It would only be a matter of time.

Canada Rob · « **Reply #4 on:** 13 Nov 2014, 05:12 am »

I hope to do a mini review of the Super Alnico Monitor on Skylan 4 post stands, with pictures. That's when I hope to elaborate more on the sound differences between the different Omega models. The main reason for my post is to confirm the superb synergy between the Zen amp and the Super Alnico 6.5" driver. Just think, for a little over 4 grand (with Zen amp and DAC) one can have a world class system. No need to buy $20,000 mono blocks.

On the thread that Moot started where he relates his experience with his Alnico Monitors is good reading, especially when he pairs them up with a good SET.

I realize how tough it can be choosing such a subjective item as speakers going by written descriptions online. That's where progress has gotten us, I suppose - buying online by written description. Nothing is easier than to have a customer walk in, sit down, listen, and choose. He really does all the work - I just facilitate it. Online, it is way more work as I have a much weightier responsibility because I'm the one who has to sit down, listen, choose, AND facilitate, not to mention verbally describe what I hear in a clear easily understood manner.

pstrisik · « **Reply #5 on:** 13 Nov 2014, 06:06 am »

I've pretty much given up trying to evaluate equipment, soundwise, in showrooms. Everything sounds different. Too many variables. Can only check on sound quality in a gross way. IMO, in-home is the only way.

........Peter

kmcelyea · « **Reply #6 on:** 14 Nov 2014, 06:31 pm »

Hi Canada Rob,
I'm investigating a new pair of speakers and I have two Decware amps a Zen Select and SE34I.4. My decision will be based on WAF factor. I'm looking at four models the Super 3s/CustomShop Tower and the Super 7 monitors/Alinco Monitors.

What height stands do the monitors need and what do you suggest for stands (brand)? Also if I end up the either the 3s/Customshop Tower what am I giving up when compared to the monitors?

Looking forward to hearing from you.

Thanks,
Kevin in Oklahoma City

Canada Rob · « **Reply #7 on:** 21 Nov 2014, 04:22 am »

Quote from: kmcelyea on 14 Nov 2014, 06:31 pm

Hi Canada Rob,
I'm investigating a new pair of speakers and I have two Decware amps a Zen Select and SE34I.4. My decision will be based on WAF factor. I'm looking at four models the Super 3s/CustomShop Tower and the Super 7 monitors/Alinco Monitors.

What height stands do the monitors need and what do you suggest for stands (brand)? Also if I end up the either the 3s/Customshop Tower what am I giving up when compared to the monitors?

Looking forward to hearing from you.

Thanks,
Kevin in Oklahoma City

Hello Kevin,
My humblest apologies - I never saw this post until just now (and I check every day).
Of all the Omega and Hoyt-Bedford speakers I have heard, the Super Alnico Monitor is my personal favourite thus far. To me they need nothing but a good amp and source, and you appear covered on that point.

Stands: I personally love the Skylans - they give the whole package a very solid and weighty look. First impressions are; they sound great, and I don't even have ballast in them yet and may never will. Great company (been going for a long time), and a well packaged, beautifully made and designed product. My stands are 20" high including the floor pads or spikes.

Other suitable brands of stands are: Sound Anchors, Something Solid, and Foundations. A speaker of this caliber deserves the best so I would not skimp on the stands.

guillaume bougard · « **Reply #8 on:** 14 Dec 2014, 11:24 pm »

I just got a message from the folks at Decware that my SE84CKC was going to be shipped. I want to use it at the office with my Super 3 Desktop speakers.

But I might bring it home to see how it's doing with my 7xrs', and if it is as badass as Canadarob says, I might order the bigger one (the 25wpc zen torii). I exchanged with Steve Deckert and he advised I should take that one for home. He says it's going to blow my beloved Eico HF81 out of the water. For some (probably sentimental) reason, I'm still hesitant. I mean the Eico is a wicked amp...

DaveC113 · « **Reply #9 on:** 14 Dec 2014, 11:38 pm »

Decware is big on hyperbole. Every good amp will sound good, its just a question of proper match with your speakers.

Wind Chaser · « **Reply #10 on:** 15 Dec 2014, 04:56 pm »

Quote from: DaveC113 on 14 Dec 2014, 11:38 pm

Decware is big on hyperbole...

1. Could you elaborate?

2. Dollar for dollar, what amplifiers do you consider to sound as good as Decware?

3. And dollar for dollar, what amplifiers do you think sound better than Decware?

DaveC113 · « **Reply #11 on:** 15 Dec 2014, 05:10 pm »

beowulf · « **Reply #12 on:** 15 Dec 2014, 09:18 pm »

The 2 watt issue has always been a problem with me as well. Even though it is said to be his best amp IMO you are serioulsy limited to the speakers you can use. I use my Decware Taboo @ 6 watts with my Omega RS7's @ 95dB and still when watching movies I would like just a few more watts of power for volume. Music however is not a problem and I can get it loud enough that the neighbors will complain.

Decware will be coming out with a pair of S.E.T. mono blocks amps based on the 6C33C tube that will be in the teens wattage wise. I'm thinking this may be the amp for me and open up a few more choices for speakers.

guillaume bougard · « **Reply #13 on:** 15 Dec 2014, 10:17 pm »

beowulf: where have you seen the announcement that "...Decware will be coming out with a pair of S.E.T. mono blocks amps based on the 6C33C tube ..."

I'm looking at the Zen TOrii which is 25 watts, which I know will be more than enough for my needs, listening room, and limitations (you know, the usual dreadful combo of wife + female neighbor)... Right now the Eico is 14wpc and is already very sufficient.

But it's not volume I'm after, I know I'll have that. What I'm looking for is definition, detail, soundstage, bass heaviness and tightness (I play dub and reggae from the 70's, as well as funk from 75-85, and some classic rock)...

I have omega 7XRS and love them so far and have no intention of changing those.

Canada Rob · « **Reply #14 on:** 15 Dec 2014, 10:44 pm »

As far as tube amps go I have heard SET, SEP, and PP, and of all of them my greatest experience lies with the Decware SE84c+, SE84CCE Select with V-Caps and stepped attenuator, and Super Zen Select (CKC) with V-Caps and stepped attenuator. They all filled the room with listening volume for anyone except those who love it loud. I have always fed the Zen with a 2 volt input, and generally had the volume control at 11-12 o'clock.

I had mentioned in opening this thread that I felt the Alnico 6.5" Hemp is underrated as far as it's sensitivity rating. Being at only 2 watts, the Zen Amp gives me a pretty accurate indicator as to what a speaker's real world sensitivity is. The Zen will run the original Hoyt-Bedford Type 1 (97dB rating) with ease, and I find it runs the Alnico with that same ease.

Even though amp to speaker synergy is critical, it's all a waste of time if you don't have a good source, whether it be DAC, vinyl, or CD player.
I have been using the same DAC for years which I have been unable to improve upon. It has a large impact on anything I put in front of it.

seikosha · « **Reply #15 on:** 15 Dec 2014, 11:12 pm »

Quote from: guillaume bougard on Today at 05:17 pm
beowulf: where have you seen the announcement that "...Decware will be coming out with a pair of S.E.T. mono blocks amps based on the 6C33C tube ..."

Last I heard this was definitely not a sure thing and it almost sounded like Decware was not going to produce the 6c33 OTL amps. When he was talking about it, it sounded like they'd be very expensive. If I remember correctly, the price was going to be near 5 figures.

opnly bafld · « **Reply #16 on:** 15 Dec 2014, 11:28 pm »

Quote from: seikosha on 15 Dec 2014, 11:12 pm

Quote from: guillaume bougard on Today at 05:17 pm
beowulf: where have you seen the announcement that "...Decware will be coming out with a pair of S.E.T. mono blocks amps based on the 6C33C tube ..."

Last I heard this was definitely not a sure thing and it almost sounded like Decware was not going to produce the 6c33 OTL amps. When he was talking about it, it sounded like they'd be very expensive. If I remember correctly, the price was going to be near 5 figures.

Read the entire first post (reply #60) by Steve here:
http://www.decware.com/cgi-bin/yabb22/YaBB.pl?num=1408725911/60

beowulf · « **Reply #17 on:** 16 Dec 2014, 01:34 am »

Quote from: opnly bafld on 15 Dec 2014, 11:28 pm

Read the entire first post (reply #60) by Steve here:
http://www.decware.com/cgi-bin/yabb22/YaBB.pl?num=1408725911/60

Thanks opnly bafld ...

Quote from: seikosha on 15 Dec 2014, 11:12 pm

Quote from: guillaume bougard on Today at 05:17 pm
beowulf: where have you seen the announcement that "...Decware will be coming out with a pair of S.E.T. mono blocks amps based on the 6C33C tube ..."

Last I heard this was definitely not a sure thing and it almost sounded like Decware was not going to produce the 6c33 OTL amps. When he was talking about it, it sounded like they'd be very expensive. If I remember correctly, the price was going to be near 5 figures.

The OTL was scrapped due to cost and that it will melt paint off your walls in the summertime

... he instead said he was turning his attention towards a set of mono blocks based on the same tube as the OTL. There is supposedly a "proper" preamp coming down the pipeline too with multiple inputs and possibly a volume remote.

seikosha · « **Reply #18 on:** 16 Dec 2014, 05:39 pm »

Thanks beowulf and opnly bfld for the 6C33 info. The non OTL SET monoblocks could be interesting. I think you can get about 15 watts out of a 6C33 so that amp would slot in nicely into their lineup. I'd be very interested in one if the price wasn't too high.

jorgen · « **Reply #19 on:** 17 Dec 2014, 05:33 am »

Beowolf/opnly bfld/seikosha

As you guys I'm one of those Decware forum readers who have noticed the (early) hints about a new SET amp with a little more power than the Zen. It would fit my speakers and room very well. Its my believe though that it would not be priced in the five figure price range. I'm not sure when it will be ready though, probably not for a while. I'm hoping +-3k, and maybe a preamp will be needed, that will add a +-2k extra ..
I don't actually need the extra watts, I'm getting full joy with the 4 I get from the MT, but I'm building/planning on a system #2 and with Omega speakers in that room I will have the option to swap speakers and amps back and forth..

It will be interesting to learn when and to price Steve will launch this amp.