[jriggy]

Hi all,

My 90+ y.o. house is not grounded very well. First of all, I have just learned I have illegal plumbing connections going on. I have copper and galvanized coupled together. So we will be removing most of that and going with pex for the plumbing...

My electrical box is grounded to a section of galvanized water pipe and it is a good 15 feet or more from the water main in the house. I have been told if you are grounded via a water pipe it should only be 5 feet from the water main...

So, since most of the water pipes are coming out, I need a new grounding system... An electrician working next-door at my neighbors house just told me two ground rods 8 feet deep well apart from each other and we'll be good to go...

I do have my nice audio system, so i am wanting to sure this grounding is done well. I do not know if I am interested in getting the dedicated system outlet separately grounded, as we will be selling this house next year and the added expense of that might not be worth it at this time...

Thanks and I hope someone is here soon to help wit some dos and don'ts I should ask for or watch for...

Jason

[zapper7]

Your electrician guy is correct, 2 rods minimum 6' apart per the NEC. With the older homes that is what folks are doing. If you are going to keep your metal water as it enters your home you can ground there too. Just make sure both grounding electrode conductors come back and land right next to each other in your panel. #6 copper is code for both locations.

You can run a separate circuit to your system location but will end up grounding it right next to the ground rod conductor anyway. Lots of folks have separate circuits running back to the main panel.

[WGH]

An electrician working next-door at my neighbors house just told me two ground rods 8 feet deep well apart from each other and we'll be good to go...

...as we will be selling this house next year...

Follow your electrician's advise and do everything by code. If your house still uses fuses then upgrade your service and panel.
A new run from the panel to your stereo is all you need.

[jea48]

Hi all,

My 90+ y.o. house is not grounded very well. First of all, I have just learned I have illegal plumbing connections going on. I have copper and galvanized coupled together. So we will be removing most of that and going with pex for the plumbing...

My electrical box is grounded to a section of galvanized water pipe and it is a good 15 feet or more from the water main in the house. I have been told if you are grounded via a water pipe it should only be 5 feet from the water main...

So, since most of the water pipes are coming out, I need a new grounding system... An electrician working next-door at my neighbors house just told me two ground rods 8 feet deep well apart from each other and we'll be good to go...

I do have my nice audio system, so i am wanting to sure this grounding is done well. I do not know if I am interested in getting the dedicated system outlet separately grounded, as we will be selling this house next year and the added expense of that might not be worth it at this time...

Thanks and I hope someone is here soon to help wit some dos and don'ts I should ask for or watch for...

Jason

First I would suggest you hire an electrician to update the main grounding system of the electrical service of your house. Local Code may require more than just bare minimum NEC code requirements.

I have just learned I have illegal plumbing connections going on. I have copper and galvanized coupled together.

Did the plumber tell you he can install a coupling/union that insulates/isolates the metals from one another? A grounding bonding jumper is then installed around the coupling/union. 

My electrical box is grounded to a section of galvanized water pipe and it is a good 15 feet or more from the water main in the house. I have been told if you are grounded via a water pipe it should only be 5 feet from the water main...

Yes, per NEC (National Electrical Code) the connection to the incoming water pipe must be made within the first 5ft where the pipe enters the house. (The water pipe must be in direct contact with the earth a minimum of 10ft) The water meter must have a bonding jumper installed around it. Per current NEC the above is still required.
2014 NEC 250.50 Grounding Electrode System.
http://lightning.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/Bonding-2013-ULPA-LPI-rev1.pdf

So, since most of the water pipes are coming out, I need a new grounding system... An electrician working next-door at my neighbors house just told me two ground rods 8 feet deep well apart from each other and we'll be good to go...

The minimum number of earth driven ground rods can be determined by local city electrical codes. Bare Minimum length of the rod per NEC Code is 8ft. Bare Minimum distance the rods are apart from one another per NEC is 6ft. Bare Minimum.... Going from memory IEEE recommends the minimum distance be the length of the ground rod used.  For 8ft rods the distance would 8ft.

I personally would use 5/8" x 10ft ground rods driven a minimum of 10ft apart. For my electrical service I drove 3 steel copper clad 5/8" x 10ft ground rods 12ft apart from one another. Though NEC Code says the bare minimum copper wire size that can be used to connect the rods together then to the electrical service neutral bar in the electrical panel is #6awg copper, I used #4awg bare solid copper wire. Remember, NEC is bare minimum.

As for the size of ground wire (Grounding Electrode Conductor) that will be installed from the neutral bar on the main service electrical panel to the incoming domestic water pipe the size is determined by NEC Table 250.66.

Per NEC if the domestic incoming water pipe is metallic the electrical service grounding system must connect to the water pipe within the first 5ft where it enters the house. Where a metallic water pipe exists at least one 5/8" x 8ft ground rod must be driven outside the house. Local code may require two or more. 

Local code, AHJ, (Authority Having Jurisdiction) has the final say as to what is required. The electrician, from your area, will know the bare minimum requirements.
You can exceed the bare requirements if you like for added lightning protection.
It all comes down to time and money.

The main grounding system for the electrical service of your home should be updated and installed by a qualified State Licensed Electrician. Ask to see his current up to date license. While working he should have it with him at all times.

[jriggy]

Thanks for all this guys. I understand some of it.

The electrical working next-door right now is licensed, bonded and insured. Seems knowledgeable.

Do I have to do a ground to the main water in, AS WELL as the two ground rods outside???

We will be removing most of the galvanized and some of the copper some time soon and replacing it with pex. Since I do not have the details on the yet, I would rather skip grounding to a water line that may end up coming out and just do the two ground rods outside.
Is that ok? I know nothing here. lol.

I do like the idea of 10ft rather than 8 and going over sized.

[Speedskater]

Do whatever makes the electrician and the inspector happy.
DO NOT connect your dedicated circuits to a different ground rod system!!!
Your dedicated circuit Safety Ground (Protective Earth) should connect to the Neutral at the main breaker box.
The connection to Planet Earth has little to do with AC power quality on a day-to-day basis.

[jriggy]

Thanks Speedster! Good to know...

[Speedskater]

You have to connect to all accessible ground types. So if the main water pipe is metal and the in the dirt part is 10 foot long and is accessible, then you have to connect to it. The distance inside the house doesn't matter.

[jea48]

Thanks for all this guys. I understand some of it.

The electrical working next-door right now is licensed, bonded and insured. Seems knowledgeable.

Do I have to do a ground to the main water in, AS WELL as the two ground rods outside???

We will be removing most of the galvanized and some of the copper some time soon and replacing it with pex. Since I do not have the details on the yet, I would rather skip grounding to a water line that may end up coming out and just do the two ground rods outside.
Is that ok? I know nothing here. lol.

I do like the idea of 10ft rather than 8 and going over sized.

Depends on the AHJ of your area. As for NEC the incoming water pipe is a grounding electrode. (IF it is buried in the earth at least 10ft.) As per NEC 250.50 it must be bonded, connected, to the main service neutral conductor bar.

I have Pex in my house and the incoming 1" copper water line is still bonded to the main electrical service neutral conductor bus bar per AHJ and NEC. I have two water meters. One for the house and the other for outdoor hose bibs and lawn irrigation. Both meters have a jumper ground wire around them so the copper piping on the metered side is also bonded connected to the main line and thus the main grounding system of the electrical service.

I suggest you ask the electrician working next door what is required where you live.

[macrojack]

Since you said you intend to sell this house within a year, it seems foolhardy to exceed compliance. You may need the extra cash to appease your buyer's inspector. In a 90 year old house, he is sure to find numerous things that he feels need to be done.

[jea48]

Since you said you intend to sell this house within a year, it seems foolhardy to exceed compliance. You may need the extra cash to appease your buyer's inspector. In a 90 year old house, he is sure to find numerous things that he feels need to be done.

Thanks for pointing that out. I missed that sentence in my first read.

I do not know if I am interested in getting the dedicated system outlet separately grounded, as we will be selling this house next year and the added expense of that might not be worth it at this time...

I also missed the separately grounded dedicated circuit part.
.