[diyman]

https://youtu.be/Y47t9qLc9I4

This video certainly confirms that the virus spreads by being airborne.  Still don't understand why Danny says it's not.

[Danny Richie]

If it is not airborne, then how is it spreading?

Person to person contact.

The reason I say it is not airborne.... Think about this.   The staff on the Covid floor figured out that it is NOT air born. They aren't wearing mask. They even stick their head into the room of a covid patient and ask them how they are doing, and they aren't wearing a mask. In the hall and in the break room right around the corner from rooms full of patients and no maks.

Two months there and not one single staff member catches anything and it's all around them.

They also learned that when they go in to touch or treat a patient that they suit up. They wear a face shield, a mask, gloves, and a gown of some type. The put a mask on the patient and they go in and treat the patient. And they wipe down everything. When they step out of the room they come out of everything and it all goes into a dirty bag that is sealed and disposed of.

If they go into another room they start over with everything fresh.

I think this treatment center is now nearly four months old, and still no staff have contracted it.

And if it wear airborne those little mask everyone is wearing would do nothing. 

[kmmd]

Danny, 

Four questions for you:
1.). Were they in negative pressure rooms?
2.) Were there air scrubbers in the room...air circulators with filtration much like a filtrete air furnace filter
3.) What is the distance from the patient to one sticking their heads in?
4.) Was the patient wearing a mask?

Thanks.

To the OP, I apologize for taking your topic and question way off course. 
I beg everyone to please think, be smart, have common sense and do the right thing.  People are unnecessarily suffering in more ways than contracting the virus and ultimately dying.  Please understand that we can not control the economy if we cannot control the virus. 

[Danny Richie]

Danny, 

Four questions for you:
1.). Were they in negative pressure rooms?
2.) Were there air scrubbers in the room...air circulators with filtration much like a filtrete air furnace filter
3.) What is the distance from the patient to one sticking their heads in?
4.) Was the patient wearing a mask?

Good questions. I think to really learn the answers we have to ask questions.

1 and 2 I don't know. I'd have to ask my son-in-law.

3. The patient is in the bed and the nurse is at the door. Standard sized hospital rooms. And I think (not certain) but when they have been in the room suited up, I think they come out of everything in the room at the door so as to not bring any contaminated material out of the room. 

4. They have the patient wear a mask or put on a mask only when they come in. They are concerned about any body fluids that the patient might expel.

To the OP, I apologize for taking your topic and question way off course. 
I beg everyone to please think, be smart, have common sense and do the right thing.  People are unnecessarily suffering in more ways than contracting the virus and ultimately dying.  Please understand that we can not control the economy if we cannot control the virus.

Yes we did go off course and I did let it go. The typic is tied to the original question that is having people over for a visit.

And I agree with what you just said. I think we don't know all the answers. Maybe one day we will and hopefully soon. We have to use caution and common sense, and I see a lot of things going on that defies common sense. I'll give and example.

I go to a local chinese buffet. They require wearing of mask when you come in and to and from the buffet. But then everyone is touching the same serving spoons and stuff. If someone did have it then they just touched their face to put on a mask and then touched everything up and down the line. The next person touches the same stuff then picks up their egg roll with their hands and eat it. And no one coming in washes their hands. There should be a sink at the door of every restraint. Everyone is worried about wearing a mask, but there are real ways that it can be spread that are not being considered.

And I don't have a lot of confidence in the media. It is hard to get real information. So I find the first hand successes and failures of the hospitals and how they are handling it very interesting. Some have really help spread it all over the covid floors and some have not at all. Some have high staff infection rates and some (like where my son-in-law was) have zero. To me those are good places to look.

You guys can continue to talk about this and share experiences so long as you can keep politics out of it.

This started with how it pertains to people allowing others in their homes.

And don't be too judgmental of one anothers views, thoughts, or experiences.  We are still figuring this all out.

[kmmd]

Thank you Danny for your answers.  My point to the questions were several fold.  There is much more than what one can observe.  As an emergency doc with 23 years of experience including my 3 years of emergency training, I’ve seen and been through a lot.

Your answers to 3 and 4 were what I know and was expecting.  You actually validated the two basics as to how to not spread the virus, distancing and mask wearing by the sick patient / person who has the virus.  Now imagine if everyone wore a mask.  That video was very helpful, so thank you corn dog.

Yes your buffet analogy is a good one.  You may search my posts months ago using the famous Las Vegas Buffets.  How many people visited Vegas from all around the world from November to March?  They catch it during the months where they thought they had the flu or common cold only to go home and spread COVID.

Good day to all and please be safe so you may enjoy your tunes and enjoy Danny’s products.

[Danny Richie]

Thank you Danny for your answers.  My point to the questions were several fold.  There is much more than what one can observe.  As an emergency doc with 23 years of experience including my 3 years of emergency training, I’ve seen and been through a lot.

Your answers to 3 and 4 were what I know and was expecting.  You actually validated the two basics as to how to not spread the virus, distancing and mask wearing by the sick patient / person who has the virus.  Now imagine if everyone wore a mask.  That video was very helpful, so thank you corn dog.

Yes your buffet analogy is a good one.  You may search my posts months ago using the famous Las Vegas Buffets.  How many people visited Vegas from November to March?  They catch it during the months where they though they had the flu or common cold only to go home and spread COVID.

Good day to all and please be safe so you may enjoy your tunes and enjoy Danny’s products.

Thanks for contributing.  We really need feedback from the guys on the front lines.

[Tyson]

From what I understand, wearing a face mask is not to protect you from Covid.  It's to protect other people from you, in case you have it and are asymptomatic. 

The best thing to do to protect yourself is to wash hands frequently and not touching stuff like door handles or other high contact surfaces.  And don't go to large group gatherings. 

[SoCalWJS]

From what I understand, wearing a face mask is not to protect you from Covid.  It's to protect other people from you, in case you have it and are asymptomatic. 

The best thing to do to protect yourself is to wash hands frequently and not touching stuff like door handles or other high contact surfaces.  And don't go to large group gatherings.

Conversely, since there have apparently been MANY people with the Covid Virus who are/were asymptomatic....

If YOU wear a mask, it could be YOU preventing it from spreading to other by wearing a mask - you are just unaware that you have it.

[Tyson]

Conversely, since there have apparently been MANY people with the Covid Virus who are/were asymptomatic....

If YOU wear a mask, it could be YOU preventing it from spreading to other by wearing a mask - you are just unaware that you have it.

Right, that's exactly what I said.

[Early B.]

The root of the problem is that many of us are allowing our personal feelings, beliefs, and attitudes to cloud our judgment. I'm guilty of this myself. In fact, what each of us thinks is inconsequential. The virus doesn't care what you think. The prudent thing to do during a pandemic is to show an abundance of caution. There's danger in giving yourself excuses to do otherwise. What the experts are asking us to do is exceedingly simple, but few of us are eager to do it, and that's understandable. Not many people would choose to shelter-in-place for several months and wear masks in public. However, when people's suffering and lives can be at stake because of a single person's non-compliance, then you gotta set aside your own feelings and beliefs for the greater good.

 

[brother love]

There is a lot of misinformed comments in this thread. This is straight from the Centers for Disease Control & Prevention:

The virus is thought to spread mainly from person-to-person.
Between people who are in close contact with one another (within about 6 feet).
Through respiratory droplets produced when an infected person coughs, sneezes, or talks.
These droplets can land in the mouths or noses of people who are nearby or possibly be inhaled into the lungs.
COVID-19 may be spread by people who are not showing symptoms.

The virus may be spread in other ways
It may be possible that a person can get COVID-19 by touching a surface or object that has the virus on it and then touching their own mouth, nose, or possibly their eyes. This is not thought to be the main way the virus spreads, but we are still learning more about how this virus spreads.

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/how-covid-spreads.html

I am a retired ME that specialized in HVAC.  Hospitals have infectious isolation rooms that have negative pressure & HEPA filtration (99.97% efficiency @ 0.1 micron particle size ie. microscopic. Anything you can see, like dust is 25 micron range).

[SoCalWJS]

Right, that's exactly what I said.

 

Boy did I misread your post! Yikes!

[Tyson]

 

Boy did I misread your post! Yikes!

No worries, we got to understanding in the end

[kmmd]

Brother love, your post is absolutely spot on as to how this darn thing spreads.  Yes, it can live on surfaces up to 72 hours, but the main modalities of spread are the ones that you placed in bold.

Tyson and SoCal, you are both correct as well. 

Let’s take a deeper dive into masks.  All are not created equally.  You have people who wear cloth ones, 2 ply, 3 ply, surgical masks, N95 etc.  All have various porosity correct?  So when an infected person coughs, sneezes or speaks, the viral loaded respiratory droplets are expelled at varying velocities.  As they are dense droplets, they eventually drop to the ground.  (Hence they are not carried by air currents over longer distances - airborne.) When an infected  person who is not wearing a mask coughs, sneezes or talks, the droplets travel farther than one who wears a mask.  Depending on how porous the mask is, the droplets can still manage to escape through the mask.  The more porous the more droplets escape.  However they escape at a lower velocity and thus travel shorter distances.   If an uninfected person standing nearby is not wearing a mask, then they can have these escaped droplets land in their eyes, nose or mouth and can get infected.  They can also pick it up on their hands and rub their eyes, nose and mouth.  So wouldn’t it be a good idea to wear a mask even if you’re not infected?  Wouldn’t it also be a good idea and distance to allow the droplets fall before they get to you?  6 feet, 10 feet, 20 feet, who knows?  Frequent hand washing, definitely.  Personally I think that masks AND goggles / face shields should be worn to protect the mucous membranes of your eyes as well.

[Early B.]

In today's news....

This is an example of a country that's taking this virus very seriously:  https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/israel-to-shut-down-nation-for-three-weeks-to-contain-covid-spread/ar-BB18ZQFV?ocid=msedgntp

[kmmd]

Exactly Early B.  This very much in line with New Zealand, Singapore, Taiwan, etc.  Then you take their testing, contact tracing, tracking, quarantining and punishment for breaking quarantine and you have results that Taiwan has.  Their total population is 24 million people and less than 500 positive cases.  Total deaths so far, SEVEN.

[RichPark]

I would wear a mask based on the CDC. Be careful protect yourself and the ones you love. All the hospital in  Houston demand everyone wear a mask. 

httpss://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/cloth-face-cover-guidance.html

[kmmd]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vOClXAg9nQU

[Danny Richie]

Lots of conflicting stories and advice even from doctors: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYI6ngjDUBo

Interesting information: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YgP_Au5RZVw

This morning I am going to a funeral of a 90 year old woman. She was in a rest home. The patients there were tested often. She finally triggered a positive and was moved to a Covid facility. She was fine and had no symptoms. She then triggered a negative right away, but they wouldn't release her or let the family see her because the policy was she had to receive two negatives. She then got really bad care and was cedated. She triggered a second negative and was moved back to a regular hospital. She was dehydrated and had bed sores. She did not recover from the poor treatment that she received. And of course they want to count her as a Covid death. Doctors at the hospital here claim they think she never had it, but died from the poor treatment that she received.

How bad is that?

[Early B.]

Lots of conflicting stories and advice even from doctors: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYI6ngjDUBo

This video is from April 1st when experts weren't yet fully aware of asymptomatic spreaders.

Here's the deal -- even if you believe the experts got it all wrong, what's the harm in wearing a mask in the off-chance that they're even partially correct? At the very least, wearing a mask may make some people around you feel more comfortable. Isn't that worth it?

With regard to your story about the 90-year old woman -- sure, some people may be falsely labeled as dying due to COVID-19 and shouldn't be. On the other hand, lots of people may have died from COVID-19 and weren't counted as such. Your story also conflates four separate issues -- COVID-19, nosocomial infections, poor  treatment, and the inevitability of death. That's a lot to unpack.