AudioCircle
Audio/Video Gear and Systems => Open Baffle Speakers => Topic started by: Vasubandu on 17 Feb 2018, 09:16 pm
-
I have an established Alibaba commercial account from a few past projects that gets me in with Chinese suppliers. The other day I was goofing off on Alibaba, and I noticed that a company was offering a 8000 watt RMS 32-inch subwoofer driver. The cost is$850 to $950 which would be plus shipping, and at 100 pounds, I am guessing that would mean something around $1,100 delivered. So I sent an inquiry about an evaluation pair, and they offered to send me 2 for $900 including shipping. Suddenly I had the potential for 2 32-inch drivers for $450 apiece.
This is the driver: https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/16000-Watt-32-Inch-Subwoofer-PD32150B_60589689045.html (https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/16000-Watt-32-Inch-Subwoofer-PD32150B_60589689045.html)
The company makes an extensive line of speaker products. Its profile is here https://nbfante.en.alibaba.com/ (https://nbfante.en.alibaba.com/)
My questions are first whether anyone has an opinion whether it would make any sense to buy these, and second whether they could be used to make an open baffle subwoofer. I am not sure what driver size would be required, so why not just do without a driver? Based on my reading, people really like the sound of open baffle subwoofers, but they drop off too much at low frequencies. My thought was that perhaps a really large driver would drop off less. And if it worked, maybe that would lead to a full range open baffle speaker with a subwoofer.
If I did this, my preference would be to use some kind of wood slab. I am a fan of exotic tropical wood slabs, and the idea of a beautiful finished slab of wood around 3-4 feet wide, 5-6 feet tall and 2-4 inches thick is attractive as long as would not interfere with acoustics. It would have to be flat, but could be cut and shaped withing reason.
I have no experience with open baffle or full range speakers, but both appeal to me. Any thoughts of any kind would be welcome. :scratch:
-
Wow. Electro-Voice used to make a 30" woofer (before the term 'subwoofer' was invented) but I think they are long gone. 16KW sounds like fiction though.
-
If you really want OB bass that will plumb the depths, get one of Danny Ritchies servo sub kits. Since you are still going to need a baffle and an amp for the 32" sub, this would probably not cost much more.
Shakey
-
16KW sounds like fiction though.
I don't know db, it's got a 6" voice coil! I'd like to hear this driver, especially in OB. It would help if they published the T&S.
-
Looks like a bargain compared to the Fostex equivalent at $4000.
The Fostex is half the weight.
The specifications for the Chinese woofer are pretty skimpy—and what could they mean by listing a range of sensitivities from 96 - 101 dB? And what does the "Voltage DC 12V" refer to?
Pretty expensive experiment on your part, but could be worth it as a novelty.
-
In the 1970s Tangerine Dream was the first band to use 30 inches woofers live, it was impressive for the time.
On Alibaba since 2006 I try to buy in this shop but his site have an error in the credit card fill that results rejecting my card, in lasts december I try again and these incompetent yet dont solve this fail.
There is no way to contact the Alibaba custumer service by the site, which not a good sign. There is a smaller 24 inches woofer also 12VDC.
https://nbfante.en.alibaba.com/product/60716703780-802784293/12000_Watt_24_Inch_Subwoofer_PD24127A.html?spm=a2700.8304367.prewdfa4cf.34.6b4b69ec0Jie1E
-
Yes, without T/S parameters it's just a guess if best suited for a sealed, ported, or open cabinet. Yeah, what's that 91-100 dB/w/m efficiency all about? Probably intended for use in arenas. Isn't a 15 inch driver big enough for your room? Besides Floyd Toole, et. al. have shown that multiple subs provide better in-room results than one big subwoofer. Years ago I over-bought woofers and they were constrained by any room I'd ever be able to afford, but sounded glorious in a 20,000 cubic foot chapel.
If Qts is high enough would a better candidate for infinite baffle versus huge open baffle(s). Drivers that massive would need a correspondingly massive baffle to offset it's moving mass. Infinite baffles are mounted to a wall (with at least 10 times the Vas of open space behind). Care must be taken to avoid hinged doors in those spaces that could blow the drivers out. Thought about using (4) 15 inch woofers in my dedicated room, but in the end decided to maintain flexibility.
-
If you watch the video on the linked page, it appears they have taken detailed measurements, unless it’s just a page of something else being used as a prop? :dunno:
-
It also says, "4 piece minimum order". :o
-
That's because that multiple subs provide better in-room results than one woofer. :thumb:
-
I don't know db, it's got a 6" voice coil! I'd like to hear this driver, especially in OB. It would help if they published the T&S.
Visualize the amount of heat produced by a 1000W space heater. This would be multiples of that. There's no way. Maybe for a millisecond...
-
That's because that multiple subs provide better in-room results than one woofer. :thumb:
Yes, I get that, but now it's a $4000 OB sub! :lol:
....And is that whole "swarm" theology still correct for OB?
-
Amazon has a 32” with free delivery but only one left!
https://www.amazon.com/DS18-TM-SN32-Troublemaker-Neodymium-Subwoofer/dp/B01HS8QJOM
-
1 ohm sub suited for automotive sound competition.
-
1 ohm sub suited for automotive sound competition.
Not necessarily. Multiple drivers driven by the same amp.. .bla bla bla....
If this were an IB configuration, a single ohm amp would work.
If memory serves, were some of the Crown amps good down to one ohm?
-
It also says, "4 piece minimum order"
The OP can mount the 4 subs in the basement or crawlspace (if he has one) in an infinite baffle design, hopefully the house is bolted down.
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_gP442Tb2JeA/SiWcQUFbWxI/AAAAAAAAAIw/qCATQ7nJqgM/s1600/1.JPG)
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_gP442Tb2JeA/SiPjY8i1owI/AAAAAAAAAIo/1l9BiPA4q18/s1600/Sub1.JPG)
-
Not necessarily. Multiple drivers driven by the same amp.. .bla bla bla....
If this were an IB configuration, a single ohm amp would work.
If memory serves, were some of the Crown amps good down to one ohm?
These monsters automotive and stage woofers are too powerful to home audio appliance, they will need about 100W or more to starting emit any sound, it not suited to a regular audio amp.
-
These monsters automotive and stage woofers are too powerful to home audio appliance, they will need about 100W or more to starting emit any sound, it not suited to a regular audio amp.
Why would they need 100W if their sensitivity is 97 dB/W? If that were true, with 100W they would be producing 117 dB.
-
Why would they need 100W if their sensitivity is 97 dB/W? If that were true, with 100W they would be producing 117 dB.
All speakers need a minimum power to made sound(below it there is no sound) varying according the electric afficiency in %(know as n0 % or η0 % or ETA ZERO in TS) and max power rms, the formula is:
Max W RMS x no %=minimum power rms
So 20.000WRMS x the n0% from these drivers is a lot of Wrms
-
All speakers need a minimum power to made sound(below it there is no sound) varying according the electric afficiency in %(know as n0 % or η0 % or ETA ZERO in TS) and max power rms, the formula is:
Max W RMS x no %=minimum power rms
So 20.000WRMS x the n0% from these drivers is a lot of Wrms
I don't follow your reasoning at all, sorry.
-
The OP can mount the 4 subs in the basement or crawlspace (if he has one) in an infinite baffle design, hopefully the house is bolted down.
Indeed!!!!!! :thumb:
As I mentioned "IB" above, with the correct amp, and some 32" drivers mounted in IB would be fantastic.
Doesn't matter if you want to play "Toccata and Fugue in D minor" (brown note?), or the latest and greatest "blow 'em up movie", this would give a tactile visceral experience like no other speaker/driver could.
-
I don't follow your reasoning at all, sorry.
Check the TS parameter η0 or ETA ZERO (reference electrical efficiency of the system expressed as %), note the full % 100 per cent is the max W rms.
-
These monsters automotive and stage woofers are too powerful to home audio appliance, they will need about 100W or more to starting emit any sound, it not suited to a regular audio amp. and......All speakers need a minimum power to made sound(below it there is no sound)
Both statements are false and misleading. Even a watt or two makes most speakers play at somewhere between 80-90dB. You call this "no sound"?
Greg
-
Both statements are false and misleading. Even a watt or two makes most speakers play at somewhere between 80-90dB. You call this "no sound"?
Greg
Pay attention to the topic Sir, that speaker max power are 20.000Wrms, it is not ''most speakers''. TS are calculated by mathematics, not by vague generalizations.
-
Pay attention to the topic Sir, that speaker max power are 20.000Wrms, it is not ''most speakers''. TS are calculated by mathematics, not by vague generalizations.
Not sure we are providing the vague generalizations.
-
I hav ebeen asked to make a few comments…
1/ with no T/S you have to be very well off to drop $4k on an unknown. That would buy something like 16 SDX10 whixh would make 4 quad push-push woofers and likely in a much more practical box (with no T/S we have no idea how big a box is needed)
2/ 12v probably means aimed at car applications… but it would need to be a pretty big car.
3/ on 1st view the magnet looks far too large, one would have to do some drawings to get an estimate — look at the magnet of a 24” Hartley or a 30” EV to get why.
4/ the high power rating is moot, the wall circuit in a 110V system starts clipping at about 1.6kW
5/ the sensitivity specification is not only strange, but hard to believe. A woofer this big, with this big a magnet (unless of the lowest quality) should be more sensitive.
There is likely more to say, but that should be enuff…
dave
-
Dave do you could comment the TS η0 % or ETA ZERO electric efficiency from this speaker in view they want drive it with a small hi-fi amp?
16000 Watt 32 Inch Subwoofer
RMS Power: 8000W
Voice Coil: 6"/152mm
https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/16000-Watt-32-Inch-Subwoofer-PD32150B_60589689045.html
-
Dave do you could comment the TS η0 % or ETA ZERO electric efficiency from this speaker in view they want drive it with a small hi-fi amp?
16000 Watt 32 Inch Subwoofer
RMS Power: 8000W
Voice Coil: 6"/152mm
https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/16000-Watt-32-Inch-Subwoofer-PD32150B_60589689045.html
Would you please stop with the math equations based on completely dubious claims of power handling and just use a little logic. It's a speaker driver. It's whole job it to make sound. If we choose to believe that it's sensitivity claim of 96dB is also dubious, let's be extra tough on them and say only 85dB, OK? What's that mean? It means we get 85dB of sound for one watt of input. That's hardly "no sound" as you've claimed. Simple as that.
Greg
-
FullRangeMan,
Given the sensitivity spec (dubious as it may be) a small amp should be fine.
dave
-
FullRangeMan,
Given the sensitivity spec (dubious as it may be) a small amp should be fine.
dave
Thanks anyway Dave.
So guys feel free to buy this sub and inform me the results.
-
Being able to drive it with a small amp does not make it much better than tossing the money into a black hole.
dave
-
Even with the lightest cone materials available, I think 32" is too much mass to expect good damped control, at least without some kind of servo controlled braking system!
Steve
-
Being able to drive it with a small amp does not make it much better than tossing the money into a black hole.
dave
+100.
That, and if you watch the video that's on the linked web page (which WindChaser pointed to), you will see that in their catalog of drivers that they have a "BNC" series. Looking closely it appears they are copying the famous pro sound Italian driver company B&C which makes amazing drivers. One look at the 1st link the OP referenced gave me the creeps!
Caveat Emptor folks!
Best,
Anand.
-
+100.
That, and if you watch the video that's on the linked web page (which WindChaser pointed to), you will see that in their catalog of drivers that they have a "BNC" series. Looking closely it appears they are copying the famous pro sound Italian driver company B&C which makes amazing drivers. One look at the 1st link the OP referenced gave me the creeps!
Caveat Emptor folks!
Best,
Anand.
Good catch re: B&C, and I'd imagine the sound track to the video repesents the sensibility behind the operation. It seems to incorporate Bronx cheers and farting sounds.
-
Rough calculations for cone area equivalency indicate that three 18inch woofers totaling approx 750 square inches would be roughly equal to one 32inch woofer and a lot easier to deal with.
Scotty
-
hello,
Woofer ( Infraflex ) 35,4" 105 db , price : 150 $ ;)
bye