AudioCircle

Audio/Video Gear and Systems => Owner's Circles => Digital Amplifier Company Owners => Topic started by: AmpDesigner333 on 28 Jul 2020, 12:38 am

Title: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 28 Jul 2020, 12:38 am
....driven by Cherry MEGA MK2 Stereo Amplifier and 130dB+ Cherry DAC DAC 2HS !!
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=212448)

Just getting started, but these sound really nice.  More to follow....
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house 😎
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 28 Jul 2020, 12:40 am
....by the way, these speakers require bi-wire, or a workaround, and bananas are necessary due to the connector type, although that’s what I like to use anyway.

(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=212453)

(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=212454)



Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house 😎
Post by: Doublej on 28 Jul 2020, 12:51 am
What's with the banana inputs on them? I thought all Vandersteens shipped with barrier strips.
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house 😎
Post by: mr_bill on 28 Jul 2020, 02:01 am
I see Dynaudio Sapphires along with the Vandies
Are the Maggie’s 1.6 or 1.7s?
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house 😎
Post by: opnly bafld on 28 Jul 2020, 02:09 am
Are the Maggie’s 1.6 or 1.7s?

1.7i
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house 😎
Post by: Audiofreak71 on 28 Jul 2020, 07:42 am
Congratulations on the vandys. Do you have the bases for them? It’s very important you get the tilt correct in relation to your seating position. They also need very little toe in. You can go on vandersteens website go under 2ce signatures and you can find the chart that will show you how to set them up correctly. Yours may be older but will still apply to yours. I’ve owned the 2ce signature ii’s and now own 3a Signatures , vandys are excellent speakers and even better when setup correctly. One more thing , the more clean watts you give them the better they respond, they love power .

Audiofreak71
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 7 Aug 2020, 03:17 am
Unfortunately, one of the woofers seems to have an issue....

It’s only noticeable when loud and when there’s lots of bass.

Anyone out there ever fix one of these?

Thanks.
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house 😎
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 7 Aug 2020, 03:20 am
Congratulations on the vandys. Do you have the bases for them? It’s very important you get the tilt correct in relation to your seating position. They also need very little toe in. You can go on vandersteens website go under 2ce signatures and you can find the chart that will show you how to set them up correctly. Yours may be older but will still apply to yours. I’ve owned the 2ce signature ii’s and now own 3a Signatures , vandys are excellent speakers and even better when setup correctly. One more thing , the more clean watts you give them the better they respond, they love power .

Audiofreak71

Thanks for the feedback.  I’m really enjoying them, despite a small issue (see above).  Lots of power to drive them here (Cherry MEGA MK2 Stereo currently).

Strangely, mine say just “2” on the back (see photo above), not 2Ce, but the boxes say 2Ce and so does the manual....
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: WGH on 7 Aug 2020, 05:51 am
Unfortunately, one of the woofers seems to have an issue....

It’s only noticeable when loud and when there’s lots of bass.

Is it a rattle or a broken connection? One of the leads from the woofer coil to the post may have an intermittent break which can sound like a rattle when it cuts out. One way to tell is to use a continuity tester and manually move the cone. If the tone stops and starts then you will have to find the break because it will only get worse. Depending on the location the break may be repairable with MG Chemicals 8331 Silver Conductive Epoxy Adhesive. Usually the death rattle means you need a replacement woofer.

Or it could be loose screws somewhere.
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 7 Aug 2020, 06:50 am
Is it a rattle or a broken connection? One of the leads from the woofer coil to the post may have an intermittent break which can sound like a rattle when it cuts out. One way to tell is to use a continuity tester and manually move the cone. If the tone stops and starts then you will have to find the break because it will only get worse. Depending on the location the break may be repairable with MG Chemicals 8331 Silver Conductive Epoxy Adhesive. Usually the death rattle means you need a replacement woofer.

Or it could be loose screws somewhere.
Thanks for the info. I’ll probably solder the voice coil connection if it’s that. Good idea for something to check!

The real issue is getting the damn grill cloth off to take a look.  They should have made the grills removable, at least from the front!  Plus, the connector arrangement creates an additional issue with wiring, so I’m using two pairs of 8’ Cherry MEGA Snakes (9-gauge equivalent), but that’s another story.

These sound way too good for the “problem woofer” to have a rubbing coil.  Sadly, I’m all too familiar with that.  It might be a loose mounting screw like you said, or the surround might be unglued in a small area (how to fix that?).

I base this on the sound when varying the volume while playing 40 Hz and other close frequency sine wave test tones.  It’s ok until excursion gets large, which is why your coil connection theory makes the most sense so far.
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: timind on 7 Aug 2020, 01:32 pm
Concerning the "CE" version, the version designation is in the serial number stamped on the plate. CE will follow the numbers if CE version. Prior version has C stamped at end of numbers.
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: S Clark on 7 Aug 2020, 01:52 pm
... , or the surround might be unglued in a small area (how to fix that?).
Surrounds are easily repaired.  If simply loose, use a bit of rubber cement to reattach.  More likely is a rip or deterioration.  Even then, a complete replacement isn't a difficult job.  I've done it more than a few times.
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: DZetye on 7 Aug 2020, 08:08 pm
make sure the screws on the bases are tight underneath.  I had a pair with the same problem
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 7 Aug 2020, 08:59 pm
Concerning the "CE" version, the version designation is in the serial number stamped on the plate. CE will follow the numbers if CE version. Prior version has C stamped at end of numbers.
Thanks very much for that information!  Yes, it has “Ce” after the serial number.  Whew!
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 7 Aug 2020, 09:01 pm
make sure the screws on the bases are tight underneath.  I had a pair with the same problem
The stand or the bottom “plate”?
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: DZetye on 7 Aug 2020, 09:07 pm
both
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: circleman on 8 Aug 2020, 01:06 pm
My guess would be surrounds separating but it could be something else.  Couple links below.  I think I would want to inspect them and if they need repair send the drivers to Vandersteen to do it.


https://audiokarma.org/forums/index.php?threads/vandersteen-2ce-mid-driver-problem.179759/

https://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/289655-woofer-surround-repair.html
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: Shear Bliss VMPS on 8 Aug 2020, 03:30 pm
Tommy,

Pull both woofers and send them up State to Mr. Bill LeGall and get them done better than new. He Da Master !

PS; Still hunting for my Multimeter ......
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 10 Aug 2020, 02:25 pm
Tommy,

Pull both woofers and send them up State to Mr. Bill LeGall and get them done better than new. He Da Master !

PS; Still hunting for my Multimeter ......
Is this his website?
http://www.millersound.net/
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: Shear Bliss VMPS on 10 Aug 2020, 08:25 pm
Tommy,

Yes you have it correct. He will make sure everything is good to go thru an thru.

Doug
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: RDavidson on 10 Aug 2020, 08:56 pm
Millersound is the real deal. They've been fixing old, worn out, speakers a very long time. I very highly recommend them.
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: Shear Bliss VMPS on 30 Aug 2020, 02:02 am
Tommy,

Like I mentioned, get it / them done correct. PS: If one is bad likely both need service. Miller Sound is the real deal period !

DW
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: whell on 30 Aug 2020, 03:32 am
Thanks for the info. I’ll probably solder the voice coil connection if it’s that. Good idea for something to check!

These sound way too good for the “problem woofer” to have a rubbing coil.  Sadly, I’m all too familiar with that.  It might be a loose mounting screw like you said, or the surround might be unglued in a small area (how to fix that?).

I base this on the sound when varying the volume while playing 40 Hz and other close frequency sine wave test tones.  It’s ok until excursion gets large, which is why your coil connection theory makes the most sense so far.

Might also check Whether the voice coil dust cap hasn’t worked a bit loose. 
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 17 Sep 2020, 05:30 pm
Tommy,

Yes you have it correct. He will make sure everything is good to go thru an thru.

Doug
Quick update: Millersound can repair the woofers but can’t refurbish the entire speaker.   :cry:
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: Maceo23 on 17 Sep 2020, 07:21 pm
Have you contacted Vandersteen directly?  They're great with service.  I had a pair of 3a's with a blow mid.  Sent the speaker in, they turned it around in a day and sent it back.  Shipping kinda hurt, but great service and they didn't charge much for the driver rebuild.  Also he tunes everything in his anachoic chamber, even after repairs.  I know on some speakers he will send out drivers and instructions for disassembly.
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 21 Sep 2020, 03:48 pm
Have you contacted Vandersteen directly?  They're great with service.  I had a pair of 3a's with a blow mid.  Sent the speaker in, they turned it around in a day and sent it back.  Shipping kinda hurt, but great service and they didn't charge much for the driver rebuild.  Also he tunes everything in his anachoic chamber, even after repairs.  I know on some speakers he will send out drivers and instructions for disassembly.
I haven't yet but sounds like a good idea.  I'll do that before taking the one speaker apart.  Thanks.
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 17 Oct 2020, 05:06 pm
Vandersteens in a 4-speaker comparison....

I’ll let you know when the video is done!!


(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=215913)
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 17 Oct 2020, 05:07 pm
So I finally got a good look....


(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=215915)
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 17 Oct 2020, 05:11 pm
I haven't yet but sounds like a good idea.  I'll do that before taking the one speaker apart.  Thanks.
I contacted them, and I’m waiting to hear back.  Hopefully they can do a complete refurb job on the pair!!
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: Manolo on 17 Oct 2020, 08:55 pm
You can use contact cement and glue it yourself. Get the cement bottle with the small brush.
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: WGH on 17 Oct 2020, 10:56 pm
A complete refurb is the way to go. Re-gluing the surround is hit and miss, it depends on the rubber. Usually the surround separates again when you invite the boys over to show off your new speakers.

Simply Speakers has 9 glues to choose from.
https://www.simplyspeakers.com/speaker-repair-adhesives.html (https://www.simplyspeakers.com/speaker-repair-adhesives.html)
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 19 Oct 2020, 05:22 pm
Update:

(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=216018)
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: Audiosaurusrex on 19 Oct 2020, 09:51 pm
Update:

(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=216018)
That’s great customer service. Nice to see Richard is still hands on. Had 2ces for years. Loved them but found a good home for them and got the M3Sapphires. Different but also soooo good!
Hope it works out for you!
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 20 Oct 2020, 04:35 pm
That’s great customer service. Nice to see Richard is still hands on. Had 2ces for years. Loved them but found a good home for them and got the M3Sapphires. Different but also soooo good!
Hope it works out for you!
Clayton has done a wonderful job with Spatial and many of our customers have (and love) his speakers!
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: NICKTENN on 20 Oct 2020, 07:21 pm
Clayton has done a wonderful job with Spatial and many of our customers have (and love) his speakers!

Plan on getting any of your own?
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 20 Oct 2020, 09:43 pm
Plan on getting any of your own?
Maybe  :D
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 20 Oct 2020, 09:44 pm
That’s great customer service. Nice to see Richard is still hands on. Had 2ces for years. Loved them but found a good home for them and got the M3Sapphires. Different but also soooo good!
Hope it works out for you!
I was hoping they could do a complete refurb, though.
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 21 Oct 2020, 11:12 am
Vandersteens in a 4-speaker comparison....

I’ll let you know when the video is done!!


(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=215913)
The video is up!  The link in this new thread:
https://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=172976.0
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 28 Oct 2020, 06:54 pm
Vandees REPAIRED AND AWESOME (:

  [ now on stands ]


(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=216320)
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: AmpDesigner333 on 2 Nov 2020, 07:02 pm
Really enjoying the sound from these Vandersteens today (:
Title: Re: Vandersteen 2Ce in the house — one woofer “rattles”??
Post by: Geworthomd on 24 Dec 2023, 02:20 am
Unfortunately, one of the woofers seems to have an issue....

It’s only noticeable when loud and when there’s lots of bass.

Anyone out there ever fix one of these?

Thanks.

I realize that this is an old post. Newer neodymium magnet speakers are a better replacement. My woofer went out and I put a JBL in place. For those that need an old paper one Philips and several others can be found on ebay. I want to get rid of my 2CE that I don’t use because I bought B&W Diamond II. There is no comparison but then the Vandersteins used were $400 and the B&W were $12k. Apples and oranges. I have a pair of B&W SCM?  That I also matched up before I changed over. These were $400 used. The mid range, tweeter and mid-base are miles apart with again the B&W in the lead. The V’s have better base but that is expected from the larger base driver. The V’s don’t handle that much power as compared to the new ones. I also have a pair of Maggies in the closet. Here the highs, mid and upper mid base are fantastic and blow everything away, well not blow bec they don’t have much power handling. I added a sub with a high band pass setting. It was ok but there is no substitute for a bigger base cabinet and driver. The 2CE were top line in their day. Like tube amplifiers, they cannot compare to the new stuff. The neodynium magnets produce such a faster response which translates into less distortion. I tried tilting my 2CE up but could not hear any difference. These are just my thoughts. If u own a pair you can do whatever you like. I own these and can make plant stands out of them bec I own them. Then again, my 1961 Corvette is far from original for similar reasons.