AudioCircle
Industry Circles => NuPrime Audio => Topic started by: Btrmousetrap on 3 Sep 2019, 12:19 pm
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Rusty, you recently referenced the upcoming AMG amps due in Q4. Can you give a more detailed description and the goals the amps are targeted to meet? Where will they land in the current range of amplifiers NuPrime currently has available? Thanks and looking forward to hearing your response.
Have a great day,
Btrmousetrap
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Sure, the AMG series are expected to be launched around late October. Please don't ask your dealers or distributors for availability, otherwise they will get "upset" and start chasing me for it :).
We have updated the Amp Comparison and Characteristic article: https://nuprimeaudio.com/guides/amp-comparison/ (https://nuprimeaudio.com/guides/amp-comparison/)
AMG is not included in there but it is good to review this guide if anyone is not familiar with NuPrime.
NuPrime is well recognised as the best value and performance for the money. The entry level amps such as IDA-8 and STA-9 are designed to work with entry to mid range components and speakers. The higher end amps such as ST-10* and Evo One are very detailed, highly resolved, dynamic with extended bass and all that.
It seems that there is no room for AMG series, but obviously there are people who prefer some other brands than NuPrime. So the AMG series have several objectives:
1. High end performance above the 9 series and in parallel with the 10 series.
2. Sonic characteristic appeal to people who currently don't choose NuPrime because they want to have all the good stuff, but a little more relax and warm (but not like STA-9 warm).
3. Luxurious but not opulent style.
Coincidentally a long time Nuprime customer who owns NuForce Ref 9**, ST-10, Evo One etc just posted a topic saying that his taste has changed and wanted something more relax. I think AMG is exactly what he wants, at 1/3 the price of what he has to pay.
To put it in another way, ST-10* and Evo One excite you, AMG relaxes you. If money is no object, you would buy both types of amps. So AMG is an alternate component for 10 or Evo one customers (just get the AMG amp only to suit your mood) and a natural upgrade path for 9 series customers. It will take us 6 to 9 months to completely fill up the entire AMG series and we are in no rush, since they are not designed to replace any existing series.
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Thanks for the info on the AMG line, Jason. I look forward to seeing what NuPrime has come up with. Is there an Integrated planned for the AMG line?
I have the IDA-16 and have been pleased with it for nearly three years. You mentioned the updated amp comparison chart in your post.
I have a question that seems obvious by looking at the chart. Would it be fair to say that Nuprime believes that the stereo MCX amplifier would be a solid upgrade over the 200 watt amplifier of the IDA-16? Also, Is there an integrated being considered for the MCX line of amps? Thank you.
Cheers,
Scott
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MCX has more power and dynamic than IDA-16 but not necessary a clear cut preferrable sound than IDA-16.
Obviously if budget allow, Evo series would be the ultimate upgrade for IDA-16 customer.
We are still undecided about the integrated for AMG series. It is against the design philosophy of the AMG where each component is unique (for example, jaw dropping sound quality for the standalone preamp + headphone amp, I have heard it).
So unless you want to go with separate components, wait for the IDA-32.
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Thanks for the reply and the advice, Jason. That is good news that there will be an IDA-32; Really looking forward to what it will offer.
Cheers,
Scott
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When will you have more information about the dedicated pre amp?
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The objective for preamp is to do more than just volume control and channel selection. What do most audiophiles want ? Change the sound characteristic in a subtle way to suite the mood or for component matching. Pro audio preamps have EQ setting but they are done using DSP and affected the sound in a different way (something will be lost). Furthermore, changing sound characteristic doesn't necessary mean changing EQ. How do you add warmth for example.
We will explain how it is done soon. Yes, I heard the amazing preamp.
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Is there any more info about these? Specs, price, availability?
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They will be up on the website in a week's time.
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Perfect. I am most interested in a power amp to match up with my Evo DAC (currently MCX-4). Hoping it's got an "introductory" price. :D
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Is there any update? Definitely interested......
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Well, Rusty had never slot on in any of the dates he'd posted so far. Only thing he's spot on is a good and reasonably priced product. Hope he keep it that way. Better late than a half cooked product.
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https://nuprimeaudio.com/product/amg-sta/ (https://nuprimeaudio.com/product/amg-sta/)
AMG STA and AMG PRE shipping December 5. AMG PRE product page will be publish later this week, waiting for spec.
And both pages are still missing internal photos to sprinkle around the text.
I can assure you that AMG PRE is something that you need to hear. The product page explains the innovation in this state of the art preamp that we are very proud of. It is a "must have" component, even more so than an amp in any system.
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Wow, that looks like an impressive combo. Fill me in if I miss it. There seems to be not a DAC in the amg pre. What would be a good match for the amg combo? How would Series 10 owners partner these? Would the amg sta plus dac10 be a good match?
Contemplating if I should go with st10m or otherwise. Oh, if the ida32 is on par/exceed the current 10 combo, I would have another option on hand. Hope to hear some thoughts from you or forum members.
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Hi Rusty, Will there be a AMG DAC later?
Fenek
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Hi Jason
Will the AMG amps like the STA9 be better in mono configuration ?
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What would be a good match for the amg combo? How would Series 10 owners partner these? Would the amg sta plus dac10 be a good match?
Contemplating if I should go with st10m or otherwise. Oh, if the ida32 is on par/exceed the current 10 combo, I would have another option on hand. Hope to hear some thoughts from you or forum members.
A GREAT combination would be the CDP-9 and the AMG Pre.
Gives you a great DAC, CDP, and multiple Digital Inputs.
And there is a way to run the DAC-10 straight through as a DAC only. I would have to check for the procedure, but at one time it was mistakenly called Home Theater By-Pass, but was really a method of using the DAC only.
Some US Dealers will be bundling this combo.
If all you need is a USB DAC, you might even find the uDSD sufficient.
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I just updated AMG PRE and AMG STA product pages (they were up earlier but lacks design details) today.
You can see from the design details, these are entirely different class of amp and preamp (especially the preamp!).
I have heard the AMG STA, it is in the same class as ST-10* but sounded different. But the real surprise is the AMG PRE.
Sure, the ideal preamp is to act like a wire with gain adjustment and no signal degradation. Our chief engineer went all out to accomplish this. Read about it on the product page.
But, making the system sounds better? I have a jaw dropping reaction when I first heard it.
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Hi Rusty,
Could you update dimension/weight information on product pages of AMG-PRE/STA? Thanks in advance.
I just updated AMG PRE and AMG STA product pages (they were up earlier but lacks design details) today.
You can see from the design details, these are entirely different class of amp and preamp (especially the preamp!).
I have heard the AMG STA, it is in the same class as ST-10* but sounded different. But the real surprise is the AMG PRE.
Sure, the ideal preamp is to act like a wire with gain adjustment and no signal degradation. Our chief engineer went all out to accomplish this. Read about it on the product page.
But, making the system sounds better? I have a jaw dropping reaction when I first heard it.
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Hi Everyone,
I've just got the new AMG PRA's in and have one set up in a nice little all analogue system. We'll be doing a full write up over the next few weeks, but for the moment feel free to ask any questions. We've posted some initial pics on our insta page. Soundwise it's silky smooth straight out of the box and is warming up nicely - very transparent, relaxed and detailed. I've sussed out the front panel controls (the manual needs some additions) and the remote is almost a component in itself. Build quality is excellent. There's something pretty special going on with the power supply that NuPrime aren't saying anything about as yet - I've been inside and had a look and it's unusual to say the least. More soon.
John at www.totallywired.nz
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Do you think an association of the AMG PRE with the blocs ST10-M make sense ?
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Only if it is a better preamp than what you impliedly have....
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For the moment none...Directly feeding from a DAC
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I’d say keep the status quo unless you need inputs.
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Well...I was interested in Jason's statement that the pre makes the sytem sound better....
"But, making the system sounds better? I have a jaw dropping reaction when I first heard it."
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How can it sound better than directly from the source? Keep in mind I have an Evo dac, used as a preamp with a Rotel 1590 amp and Nord One Up amp on an alternating basis. The preamp section merely allows me to use my Innuous streamer.
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Well...I was interested in Jason's statement that the pre makes the sytem sound better....
"But, making the system sounds better? I have a jaw dropping reaction when I first heard it."
Over the years I’ve read numerous reviews and user comments from those who preferred a pre-amp in their system and would never go back to source direct. Personally, I believe you’re on the right track. A good pre-amp will often provide better tone/timbre, dynamics and sound staging than source direct. Good luck on your search.
Cheers,
Scott
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So much for the passive preamp crowd who seem to believe as I do, but reasonable people can and often do disagree.
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Do you think an association of the AMG PRE with the blocs ST10-M make sense ?
Hi Luculus,
Yes, it makes TOTAL sense, as does the AMG PRA used in ANY System.
One of the most unique qualities of the AMG PRA, is "a user-selectable 4 stage “Active Low Frequency and Harmonic Gain” control".
<<<<Users of smallish speakers would often detect a distinct drop in bass response with some audio tracks. Instead of a simple “Bass Boost” function that lifts a targeted low-frequency band, a user-selectable 4 stage “Active Low Frequency and Harmonic Gain” control compensates for the lack of bass presence. It achieves some bass extension and a more natural roll-off.>>>>
There has been some discussion here about the sonic value of somehow sending your signal "directly" from your DAC, and the accuracy of doing so.
It is 100% true that sending the signal direct can be the "most accurate" path to Signal Transfer. That said that is IMPOSSIBLE without running through a VOLUME CONTROL, or else your system would be running ON FULL Signal Strength.
While many, including me, opt for the most accurate signal transfer available, not always is that the BEST way to enjoy your system.
The AMG PRA, as I posted above, has "a user-selectable 4 stage “Active Low Frequency and Harmonic Gain” control".
What does that mean to you? Well, High Performance listening, is MORE than having the most accurate signal through your system to your speakers. The speakers ultimately send the sound out into your ROOM, and too your EARS, for your brain to assemble into MUSIC.
So, you need to address those two areas (ROOM and EARS) also.
And let me back up here a second. You ALSO need to address SPEAKER SIZE and Bass capabilities, and your preferred LISTENING Levels.
Those too will affect your ultimate and accurate enjoyment of the MUSIC.
When a Recording Engineer engineers and masters a recording, they do so at a "very specific SPL." So that means the SOUND they want is SPECIFIC to the SPL they are using to MASTER. They also have very specific room treatments, and monitoring distances.
So unless you use these exact same parameters you WILL NOT be hearing what they heard, or intended you to hear.
To further complicate this you're not using the same speakers with the same bass abilities.
We also have something called the Fletcher-Munson effect, which means your frequency perceptions are determined by the SPL you normally listen at. In the old days, there was often a switch for "loudness" which varied the High and Low Frequencies to accommodate the hearing losses at lower SPLs due to Fletcher-Munson.
So if you are listening through small speakers at a lower (than engineered) SPL, then you will not hear ALL the Music.
And finally, another issues is your room and your hearing ability. Imperfect room issues, and hearing losses or reductions, can also lead to a reduced accurate representation to the presentation.
Edit: (must be the coffee) Let me also mention that I have often wondered why Recording Engineering information, such as Monitor Brand and Type, Listening Distance and SPL were not included or mentioned for every recording. THAT would certainly allow you to at least attempt to duplicate the INTENDED SoundScape.
So, this "user-selectable 4 stage “Active Low Frequency and Harmonic Gain” control", can be a really incredible adjunct to achieving the SOUND and Sonic Imagery you are looking (hearing) for.
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Well explained. This design is not digital and not a simple EQ adjustment. it is difficult to explain until you hear it.
And the best way to understand how it makes the system "perfect" is to listen and compare. Start with the no adjustment setting and then compare with each level until your ears tell you "wow".
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Before you read the following description, I want to point out that AMG STA should be in about the same place as ST-10 on the comparison chart. We will update the chart soon. No other class-D manufacturers have ever created so many different sound characteristics as NuPrime simply because we design our own amps from the ground up. Our chief engineer is so proud of his creation that you can see his name on the AMG STA board (next to the transformer). This is a ground breaking achievement in Class D design (doesn't mean that you will like it, but you must hear it).
Here's the subjective description from our audiophile product manager with a golden ear:
The AMG STA has a flavor of its own, so it is hard to compare it with the Evolution One, which derives some of its design from or the similarly priced ST-10. AMG STA sounded smooth and relaxing. Detail, resolution, dynamics, and speed are in the ST-10 ballpark, yet the sound is quite different.
Drawing comparison with the Evolution One, they shared trait of ease in reproducing the details of the recording comes afore. However, AMG STA does things differently. While the Evolution One has that inviting warmth, the AMG STA wants to allure the listener. Hence, instead of glitz and glamor, which pulls you in quickly into the performance, the AMG STA has a demeanor that slowly brings you into the music.
Tonal qualities of the AMG STA leans toward being full and rich, so instruments and vocals seem to gain extra body, weight, and harmonic richness. It may not be the most accurate reproduction but does make Jazz and Vocal pieces highly addictive. It may take away the raw edge of Rock and Electronic music and sounds less exciting for some.
The sound stage has an attractive characteristic. A linear presentation is like having floodlights shining on all the performers such that everyone can be seen equally well. The AMG STA, however, has more of a spotlighting effect, where performers are focused on getting your attention.
It is tough to put the sound of the AMG STA into measurable attributes as the presentation is quite different from the other series. You’ll need to try it and hear for yourself.
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I'm not sure if this review of the AMG-PRA has been noted yet. (My apologies if my quick skim of recent posts missed it.) I'm not currently in the market for a preamp myself, but this review suggests the AMG-PRA will be of serious interest to some frequenters of this circle.
https://totallywired.nz/nuprime-2/nuprime-amg-pra/ (https://totallywired.nz/nuprime-2/nuprime-amg-pra/)
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John Ransley is an exceptional reviewer and he explained a lot better than what we can do on the product description. One of the reason is that AMG PRA has 1M ohm input impedance design.
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Hi Everyone,
I've just got the new AMG PRA's in and have one set up in a nice little all analogue system. We'll be doing a full write up over the next few weeks, but for the moment feel free to ask any questions. We've posted some initial pics on our insta page. Soundwise it's silky smooth straight out of the box and is warming up nicely - very transparent, relaxed and detailed. I've sussed out the front panel controls (the manual needs some additions) and the remote is almost a component in itself. Build quality is excellent. There's something pretty special going on with the power supply that NuPrime aren't saying anything about as yet - I've been inside and had a look and it's unusual to say the least. More soon.
John at www.totallywired.nz
John,
in your review you mentioned that the AMG PRA needs a "warm up period from new". Do you have other impressions to share after few week?
Do you find that the sound changed in any noticeable direction?
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Hi all,
I've now had a full 8 weeks with the AMG PRA and am happier than ever with the performance. I've just posted Part Two of our review here - https://totallywired.nz/nuprime-2-nuprime-amg-pra-part-2/ I'll admit I got a bit hung up with unrelated issues when looking at the PRA in an all analogue system. The moment we jumped to digital front ends, the performance gain with the PRA was much more obvious and consistent. Although the PRA is by no means NuPrime's most costly model I think it is a real stand out and has applications in a surprisingly wide range of systems and brands.
The is a real improvement in detail and what I'd describe as the open character over time - it's been a little hard to pin down as I keep on changing systems. The worst thing is listening without it - everything goes flat and lifeless by comparison. Monochromatic. Slot it back in and there's an immediate bloom that I'm finding it difficult to live without. Happily we've still got NuPrime shipping so no problems there.
John Ransley.
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I have an Evo dac. I’m interested in your further opinions and bases for them viz use of this preamp with it.
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I have an Evo dac. I’m interested in your further opinions and bases for them viz use of this preamp with it.
I have a customer with the following: CDT-10 > Evolution ONE DAC > AMG PRA > Evolution ONE Monoblocs
He thinks he died and went to HEAVEN :thumb:
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So, send me your best price as I am old and want a ticket....
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Hi all,
I've now had a full 8 weeks with the AMG PRA and am happier than ever with the performance. I've just posted Part Two of our review here - https://totallywired.nz/nuprime-2-nuprime-amg-pra-part-2/ I'll admit I got a bit hung up with unrelated issues when looking at the PRA in an all analogue system. The moment we jumped to digital front ends, the performance gain with the PRA was much more obvious and consistent. Although the PRA is by no means NuPrime's most costly model I think it is a real stand out and has applications in a surprisingly wide range of systems and brands.
The is a real improvement in detail and what I'd describe as the open character over time - it's been a little hard to pin down as I keep on changing systems. The worst thing is listening without it - everything goes flat and lifeless by comparison. Monochromatic. Slot it back in and there's an immediate bloom that I'm finding it difficult to live without. Happily we've still got NuPrime shipping so no problems there.
John Ransley.
Thanks John.
I've enjoyed reading the second part of your article and it's quite interesting that you briefly described how it matched with different Nuprime amps.
I'd like to ask you, since you had the change to try different combinations, what amp would you recommend to someone that wants to upgrade from a pair of STA9s and use the amp with and AMG PRA.
I prefer slightly warm to "too clinical". I listen 40% to Jazz (from Bop to Fusion), 30% Funk/Motown, 20% Classic Rock and 10% to Classical.
I use a pair of high end bookshelf speakers (Harbeth P3esr) and a pair of REL subs.
My source is 70% digital and 30% turntable.
Evolution Ones are outside my budget.
ST-10, AMG STA and MCX2 are within my budget.
I value natural sound, vocal and acoustic instruments rendition and bass articulation/speed.
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I'd be in no hurry to change the STA-9s. Assuming you get a PRA I think you'll suddenly find that you are getting far more out of them than you might have thought possible. As the PRA warms up you'll also likely fine tune the response with the bass settings and phase, plus have another look at your sub woofer settings and positioning. With the extra resolution you'll probably also find that if you make any refinements in terms of cables and connections that you get a significant improvement.
Then, and only then, you might want to consider heading up the power amplifier food chain. For what it's worth I think the ST-10 and MCX-2 are both a bit better than a pair of STA-9s but there isn't really enough in it to warrant the change. It would be far less than the gain made with the PRA. You'd really have to go to the next level.
The MX-1's 750 watts will just overwhelm your little Harbeths so I'd not go there. I've not yet listened seriously to the new STA-AMG but given the Evo level specs - 700kHz switching and 1M Ohm input - there is everything to suggest that a pair of these will prove to be convincing. They are, for want of a better description, mini-evos. Obviously you can go stepwise getting a single AMG STA then adding another later but as with the ST10 and MCX 2 I'd not expect to be blown away by the initial change. Adding a second AMG STA would be a completely different story and should be an extension of when you did the same with your second STA-9.
Don't get hung up on stuff like 'warm' or 'clinical' - with both your system (via sub adjustement) and the PRA you can easily adjust to make it sound exactly as you want.
Hope this helps - John Ransley.
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Thanks very much John. Your answer helps a lot and I really appreciate it.
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Hi rusty... Can you compare the Sonic différence between the AMG Preamp and the Nuforce P8s and the Nuforce P9 ... I know this two Preamp very well !!!
Regards
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This is the best comparison and review of PRA: https://totallywired.nz/nuprime-2/nuprime-amg-pra/ (https://totallywired.nz/nuprime-2/nuprime-amg-pra/)
Preamp must do no wrong - it shouldn't change the sound of the system. AMG PRA has a default setting that does that very well. So in that regards, it is equivalent or better than P-9. But it also has other settings (it was badly named as "loudness" but that's not what it does) allow it to better match the speaker and amp.
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Any 3rd party STA review instead?
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Not yet, the amp was just released, and COVID-19 comes along :duh:
But we have been consistent and spot on so far. You guys no need more reviews, just trust us, lol. :thumb:
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Good evening from France,
I have an av8805 marantz, two AMG STA for my fronts (Focal Sopra 2), one STA-9 for my central unit (Focal Sopra Center), one STA_9 (Focal SR1000Be) for my surrounds.
Can I insert an AMG PRA between the Marantz AV8805 and my two AMG STAs?
With an omnia wr-1 on the AMG PRA I could then have a Hifi and HC set without unplugging anything !
You see what I want to do ?
Take care of yourself,
Cheers !
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Good evening from France,
I have an av8805 marantz, two AMG STA for my fronts (Focal Sopra 2), one STA-9 for my central unit (Focal Sopra Center), one STA_9 (Focal SR1000Be) for my surrounds.
Can I insert an AMG PRA between the Marantz AV8805 and my two AMG STAs?
With an omnia wr-1 on the AMG PRA I could then have a Hifi and HC set without unplugging anything !
You see what I want to do ?
Take care of yourself,
Cheers !
You have a nice setup but I had one suggestion if you plan to do serious two channel listening.
I have tried just about every avr and surround preamp out there, including your 8805. These work great for hdmi switching and surround for movies, but when it comes to using them as a dac or streamer. Well this is where things fall apart very quickly and in a very big way.
My first dedicated dac was a smsl su8 v2 It was also used as a pre amp, it was fed by a computer using roon. The improvements for stereo listening was in a whole other league compared to my avr pre.
So IF you are going down the two channel listening rabbit hole. I would suggest a dedicated source, dac and preamp for music.
Right now I only use my surround processor for movies.
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Hi sresener,
That's exactly that i want to do !
AMG PRA + 2 x AMG STA for two channels listening.
The AMG PRA on "By Pass" when i want to see a movie with my family.
And AV8805 off when i want to listen music.
I have to read some news/reviews about Nuprime Omnia WR-1 ot other stuff because i have only a synology NAS and today i'm listening with HEOS app on my Marantz.
Tomorrow i want to connect a good FLAC/DSD player on my AMG PRA.
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Hi sresener,
That's exactly that i want to do !
AMG PRA + 2 x AMG STA for two channels listening.
The AMG PRA on "By Pass" when i want to see a movie with my family.
And AV8805 off when i want to listen music.
I have to read some news/reviews about Nuprime Omnia WR-1 ot other stuff because i have only a synology NAS and today i'm listening with HEOS app on my Marantz.
Tomorrow i want to connect a good FLAC/DSD player on my AMG PRA.
How do you like the amg amps paired with your focals. I am using focal 1038 with a pair of evolutions amps.
The sopra 2's were on my short list but when I heard the two I could not justify the 2.5x cost difference.
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Hi,
Before my SOPRA2 I had 1028be (after ARIA 936), great speakers that made me want to go further.
I change when I can, I try to buy at the best price and to evolve by giving a little money each time, the second-hand market being prosperous ... we manage to move forward !
For the difference in price, I can return the question to you.
If you put two AMG STAs instead of your two EVOs, is it really worth twice ++ the price ?
It is the same on motorsport, the lasts seconds are very difficult and expansive to win ...
The 1028be were well built, very detailed with serious but lacking impact.
When I switched to the SOPRA2 the bass was much fuller with more impact, the sound of the boxes was still far away, the music is in the room and doesn't come out of the speakers, the mid/high range is more integrated and more harmonious.
For my 35 square meters and my listening rarely at a high level, there is the presence of fullness, magnificent voices, jazz that makes you stomp your feet.
I plan to switch to the Scala Evo light walnut if I can afford it ...
But I think it will take some time before I feel the evolution towards the Sopra 2s which are excellent products both visually and in sound quality.
They are magnificent objects, the Scala is even better in the midrange but you have to pass the running-in of the boomer.
For me, the best speakers I've ever listened to are the Stella Utopia EM but it takes money and a very nice room to enjoy them.
For sure, after a lot of amps, the Nuprime have changed my life ! A pair of EVO must calm down a lot of Mcintosh or Accuphase ...
The switch from STA-9 (mono) to STA AMG (mono) brought more bass, dynamics, impact but also more details, more stage width and depth, more nuances in the vocals, a softer and more textured midrange ... I don't have the words, I'm only an amateur.
Good night, here it's time to dream about my future material ^^
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Thats a good question, I would love to compare the amg's directly to my evo amps. Only then I would know where value lies
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There is bound to be a difference, but the higher you go up the range, the less it's big ...
The main thing is the quality/price ratio, but each thing has its price, an evo is more expensive and it's normal there is a lot of material, study and development ... without the EVO there would not have been an AMG I think.
In terms of trade, there are crazy margins on some products and the higher you go up the range, the more margin there is !
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Yes I agree on the margins but fortunately I paid nowhere near retail for any of my equipment :)… so far
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that's cheating ! :o 8)
Please, send to me your pair of EVO for a unlimited free loan, for sure i say to you if they are better my AMG STAs :green:
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Sure, the AMG series are expected to be launched around late October. Please don't ask your dealers or distributors for availability, otherwise they will get "upset" and start chasing me for it :).
We have updated the Amp Comparison and Characteristic article: https://nuprimeaudio.com/guides/amp-comparison/ (https://nuprimeaudio.com/guides/amp-comparison/)
AMG is not included in there but it is good to review this guide if anyone is not familiar with NuPrime.
[...]
It seems that there is no room for AMG series, but obviously there are people who prefer some other brands than NuPrime. So the AMG series have several objectives:
1. High end performance above the 9 series and in parallel with the 10 series.
2. Sonic characteristic appeal to people who currently don't choose NuPrime because they want to have all the good stuff, but a little more relax and warm (but not like STA-9 warm).
[...]
So now that the amp comparison charts has been updated to include the AMG STA it looks like the AMG STA is warmer then the STA-9.
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Good evening,
I don't find the AMG STA warmer than the STA-9.
Faster, more dynamic, powerful without a doubt!
It's less colored in the midrange than the STA-9 at home, on my equipment. That's my feeling, but I'm not a reference in audio ...
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Hello everyone, I hope you're all well.
I have just received my AMG PRA, I'm going to install it tomorrow because it's a public holiday in France.
I'm going to insert it between my AV preamp (Marantz AV8805) and my two AMG STAs on the XLR inputs.
The French importer advised me to set the level to 92 to be at 0dB.
I have a question about the "brick" oops the remote control ...
What is the button next to the mute for ?
Thank you !
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See the Quick Start Guide on the product page download tab: https://nuprimeaudio.com/product/amg-pra/ (https://nuprimeaudio.com/product/amg-pra/)
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Except that the remote is not even mentioned in the Quick Start Guide, or the Manual.
PBN94F the button you mentioned is for cycling through the input sources, so it's a bit redundant since you already can directly access each source by pressing the corresponding source number.
When I saw it first I thought it was to cycle through the "loudness" modes. But unfortunately that is not the case, you have to lift your bum from the couch to do that.
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Thanks glitchesbrew !
rustydoglim : The documents provided are still light...
Another example, on Left Toggle Switch: Output Gain, with 2 AMG STA what do you recommend ? high or low ?
The same for remote control of amplifiers : Should we leave them off or on?
I was also told that PRA remembered the volume by source, I didn't see it written anywhere.
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We will do better on the manual.
By the way, the loudness settings are so incorrectly named, they should be called "SP1, 2, 3" for speaker matching settings.
They are custom tuned, freq specific curve to create warmth and compensation for speakers. They should never have been called "loudness".
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Thanks, Rusty,
it would be good to develop the documentation, you are very competent in your choices and what seems natural to you is not necessarily for amateurs.
I've been looking at the AMG STA for a long time because I was looking for a solution to combine HiFi and HC ...
I didn't think I could fit it between my HC preamp and my STA ! It works great ! So I rediscover my flacks (thanks also to the WR-1)
specifically about SP1, SP2, SP3...
Did you define "targets" at the design stage?
SP1 compact speakers
SP2 medium speaker
SP3 large bowls
I thought I saw curves somewhere, but I can't get my hands on them again...
I think it already sounds very good in flat and for the moment I haven't understood the 3 choices yet ...
I have to say that this is a special time, we are 4, confined at home and I don't have my usual quiet periods for my listening ...
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Rusty, Warm greetings from Korea. I'm very delighted with Onmia WR-1 as a streamer on my music system, Rega int. and Dyne Audio x38 tallboy.
Now I'm so impressed with your stuff, and planning to change my Rega analog int. to AMG PRE&STA combination...
But as you may know that Dyne x38 is 4ohm driving and very difficult to find out well-matched amps. Do you think AMG would be the enough good match with x38?
Thanks in advance for your suggestions~
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AMG has a lot of current and voltage power, so should be no problem driving almost any speakers.
Regarding the "Loudness" (speaker matching) settings, I think users should listen to the standard (ie no setting) for a while, get use to the sound, and then try different settings with your speaker. Speaker's response is dynamic, so you should try all three settings.
We have to strike a balance in keeping some secrets.
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We have to strike a balance in keeping some secrets.
Thanks Rusty,
Your time is precious, but your knowledge are really appreciated when shared 8)
Ok for the secrets !
We want just optimize your products and our listening :wink:
have a nice day.
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About the gain switch in the AMG PRA. What's its intended usage?
Is it for when you have already maxed out you volume knob to 99 and want some extra volume?
Are the low and high gain setting supposed to sound the same? If volume is not an issue shall I prefer one over the other?
Is the high gain more noisy? Is it more dynamic? Does it male the speaker matching (left knob) behave differently?
I have a volume knob on my dac as well and I'm trying to experiment with different settings and hear what I like the most, but some engineering insights might be helpful to guide my experiments.
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I discussed with R&D and decided to keep the naming convention for the "Loudness".
It is an "exotic" concept where old and expensive high-end preamp had this feature to boost the bottom end without changing the sound characteristic (ie not making it boomy) and also make it warmer.
So we came up with our own "Loudness" concept. Normally EQ simply boost a certain freq but our loudness design boost the bass in a way that sounded fuller and warmer. It does it in the analog domain, not through DSP.
If it sounds better to you, perhaps for certain type of music, then use it, otherwise stick to the standard setting.
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Hi Everyone,
I've just got the new AMG PRA's in and have one set up in a nice little all analogue system. We'll be doing a full write up over the next few weeks, but for the moment feel free to ask any questions. We've posted some initial pics on our insta page. Soundwise it's silky smooth straight out of the box and is warming up nicely - very transparent, relaxed and detailed. I've sussed out the front panel controls (the manual needs some additions) and the remote is almost a component in itself. Build quality is excellent. There's something pretty special going on with the power supply that NuPrime aren't saying anything about as yet - I've been inside and had a look and it's unusual to say the least. More soon.
John at www.totallywired.nz
This review in totallywired is very intriguing. It reflects my own experience with nuprime products. So I am thinking about the AMG preamp and amp, and have a few questions;
1) Why is the AMA preamp only have 1 balanced input? I have been thinking about purchasing a preamp, since I have gotten back into records. So I need 2 balanced inputs, one for my DAC and one for phono. I just about decided on getting the Schiit Freya +, but then started reading about this preamp. The only thing holding me back right now is the single balanced input, It seems shortsighted. Will the next version have 2 balanced inputs? You can always combine a balanced input into single ended, but not vice versa.
2) Having gone thru the amp circle (IDA-8, ST10, STA9, and finally MCX-2), I found the MCX-2 having the sound of the IDA-8 but much more dynamic because of the power reserves, and not the edginess of the ST10 on rock and hot recorded pop. When I think of how to improve the MCX-2, I could only think that more transparency without the ST10 edginess. Note that the ST10 is not really edgy, its more faithful to the recording than the others, but that isnt always what is needed, since I dont only want to listen to perfectly recorded music. The MCX-2 takes a sandpaper and smooths out the edges. So my question about the AMA amp - does it still sound like the MCX-2 but more transparent? Is it as dynamic as the ST10? Or is it a different sound more like the STA9, which to me was too candy coated.
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1) Why is the AMA preamp only have 1 balanced input? I have been thinking about purchasing a preamp, since I have gotten back into records. So I need 2 balanced inputs, one for my DAC and one for phono. I just about decided on getting the Schiit Freya +, but then started reading about this preamp. The only thing holding me back right now is the single balanced input, It seems shortsighted. Will the next version have 2 balanced inputs? You can always combine a balanced input into single ended, but not vice versa.
Take a look at the back of AMG PRA, it has limited space. For short distance, and due to the 1M Ohm input impedance of AMG PRA, we don't think there will be any audible difference in performance.
2) Having gone thru the amp circle (IDA-8, ST10, STA9, and finally MCX-2), I found the MCX-2 having the sound of the IDA-8 but much more dynamic because of the power reserves, and not the edginess of the ST10 on rock and hot recorded pop. When I think of how to improve the MCX-2, I could only think that more transparency without the ST10 edginess. Note that the ST10 is not really edgy, its more faithful to the recording than the others, but that isnt always what is needed, since I dont only want to listen to perfectly recorded music. The MCX-2 takes a sandpaper and smooths out the edges. So my question about the AMA amp - does it still sound like the MCX-2 but more transparent? Is it as dynamic as the ST10? Or is it a different sound more like the STA9, which to me was too candy coated.
The AMG is not like ST-10 or STA-9 or any other amps in the family with some changes. Read the listening impression on AMG product page, I repeat below. I think between ST-10, STA-9, MCX-2, Evo One we have covered just about all the sound characteristics, except one. Some people fell in love with old analog sound, and until AMG, it was impossible to create the kind of sound with Class D technology. With AMG, it is has an old soul, yet in a young man's body. But if you are into rock & roll music, you should not get the AMG, it won't work.
Listening Impression
The AMG STA has a flavor of its own, so it is hard to compare it with the Evolution One, which derives some of its design from or the similarly priced ST-10. AMG STA sounded smooth and relaxing. Detail, resolution, dynamics, and speed are in the ST-10 ballpark, yet the sound is quite different.
Drawing comparison with the Evolution One, they shared a trait of ease in reproducing the details of the recording comes afore. However, AMG STA does things differently. While the Evolution One has that inviting warmth, the AMG STA wants to allure the listener. Hence, instead of glitz and glamor, which pulls you in quickly into the performance, the AMG STA has a demeanor that slowly brings you into the music.
Tonal qualities of the AMG STA leans toward being full and rich, so instruments and vocals seem to gain extra body, weight, and harmonic richness. It may not be the most accurate reproduction but does make Jazz and Vocal pieces highly addictive. It may take away the raw edge of Rock and Electronic music and sounds less exciting for some.
The sound stage has an attractive characteristic. A linear presentation is like having floodlights shining on all the performers such that everyone can be seen equally well. The AMG STA, however, has more of a spotlighting effect, where performers are focused on getting your attention.
It is tough to put the sound of the AMG STA into measurable attributes as the presentation is quite different from the other series. You’ll need to try it and hear for yourself.
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Hi everyone - I've got to chip in here. As someone who is massively into rock 'n roll and a lot of the harder genres including metal, I've found the new AMG series awesome in this context. The AMG PRA preamp gives a whole lot of depth and drive. it's almost and extension of the 'live sound' that I like so much with the MCX series. I'm still writing up the AMG STA power amps but my feelings about these are very much the same. You should hear what a bridged pair can do.
I don't think you should tie a particular NuPrime component to a specific genre of music - speakers have far more variability and the AMG PRA deals with this, with the ability to improve bass extension on both stand-mount and smaller floor-standers, especially if the matched power amp is more focused on detail and accuracy.
Likewise don't get hung up on the analogue/digital debate - The AMG PRA deals with inputs from both sources in a completely evenhanded way. What it will show you is just how good your phono stage or DAC actually is and in both cases allow you to properly drive your power amp/s.
We've started to get used to having DACs that double as preamps but I haven't found any that come close to the real world performance of the AMG PRA - the cool thing is that you can simply insert the PRA into any such system, often with a considerably more costly DAC such as the Evolution or Chord products and it will delivery an immediate and compelling improvement. I've got cables that cost more and as much as I think they really do work, the PRA is at a whole different level. Like just about every preamp that NuForce and NuPrime have produced it sounds far better that it has a right to for the price and given what I see on the inside more has gone into this design than just about any other component they have produced. Call me biased but I do get a kick out of what I'm hearing from this new series... John Ransley