AudioCircle
Other Stuff => Archived Manufacturer Circles => Vinnie Rossi => Topic started by: matthewpartrick on 15 Apr 2015, 12:03 am
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Actually it showed up about two weeks ago but things have been absolutely nuts in my household lately, business trips, schizophrenic bosses, wife is pregnant, nanny is bipolar, everyone needs lithium :)
I went with black body on light knobs, with the following options:
MOSFET
DAC
Phonostage
RVC
Tubestage
I'm using a Mac running Audirvana and a Cardas USB to the DAC, and a Sumiko Pro-Ject Debut Carbon DC table for the phono. The output goes through Cardas wiring to a pair of Joseph Audio Pulsars.
Anyhoo I thought I'd write a little about my impressions. The background is like a black hole, absolutely no noise. I really like the flavor of the tubestage, and have been briefly fiddling around with the phonostage although with my current time constraints this has been difficult. I'm also fighting with physical setup as carving out a space in my house that's safe from dogs and kids is challenging. Once I dialed it in a little, I found a really wide and warm soundstage, none of that "head in a vise" narrow listening sweet spot shenanigans. The analog chain is particularly nice.
For those of you getting the DAC, I tried a few inputs before settling on the Mac--USB plan. I also have an Airport Express and Apple TV with optical outputs on them. The Apple TV output worked very well but I ran into a problem with the line level output on the Airport Express in that the same level from the Airport wasn't as loud as the same level from the Apple TV. Vinnie and I did some troubleshooting and it's clearly an Apple issue, not a LIO issue, as when I switched the input to either TV or direct USB it solved the problem. Maxing out the volume with the Apple TV or the USB created earsplitting but clear sound. Excellent!
Overall I'm very pleased at how cool a product this is, and particularly happy on the cost savings over individual components and the potential future upgrades. Speaking of those, I definitely plan on getting the headphone module in the near future. In addition, if the tubestage and AVC become compatible in the future I'll likely try that as well.
Kudos to Vinnie for a wonderful product! Thanks so much.
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I also have an Airport Express and Apple TV with optical outputs on them. The Apple TV output worked very well but I ran into a problem with the line level output on the Airport Express in that the same level from the Airport wasn't as loud as the same level from the Apple TV. Vinnie and I did some troubleshooting and it's clearly an Apple issue, not a LIO issue, as when I switched the input to either TV or direct USB it solved the problem. Maxing out the volume with the Apple TV or the USB created earsplitting but clear sound. Excellent!
Just confirming - by line level output, you're referring to the TOSLINK output of APE? How big of a difference are we talking? Considering my streaming options as I may be rearranging things a bit...
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Hi matthewpartrick,
Thank you for posting your initial impressions of your LIO! :)
Just confirming - by line level output, you're referring to the TOSLINK output of APE? How big of a difference are we talking? Considering my streaming options as I may be rearranging things a bit...
Hi brh,
Based on our emails, I am pretty sure that is what he is referring to (toslink out into LIO dac). I'm not sure why they would have different digital output levels, unless there is some hidden setting somewhere.
Vinnie
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Based on our emails, I am pretty sure that is what he is referring to (toslink out into LIO dac).
I'm sure he must be also, as even though the comparison referred to "line levels" between the Airport Express and Apple TV outputs, unlike the Airport Express the Apple TV has no analog output.
The volume of each AirPlay device can be individually controlled from the AirPlay speaker dropdown. Is it possible the Airport Express volume slider is attenuated, which is only visible when the Multiple mode is selected?
Other than that, I don't know if a bad or kinked optical cable can attenuate the digital output volume or not.
Steve
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I'm sure he must be also, as even though the comparison referred to "line levels" between the Airport Express and Apple TV outputs, unlike the Airport Express the Apple TV has no analog output.
Thanks, I should've remembered that there's no analog out from Apple TV. Makes sense. APE probably makes more sense for me anyway, but this is a peculiar issue...
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Hi matthewpartrick,
Thank you for posting your initial impressions of your LIO! :)
Hi brh,
Based on our emails, I am pretty sure that is what he is referring to (toslink out into LIO dac). I'm not sure why they would have different digital output levels, unless there is some hidden setting somewhere.
Vinnie
Yes toslink. I couldn't find why either, just when I switched it to either Apple TV or direct usb the volume ceiling was a lot higher.
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Yes toslink. I couldn't find why either, just when I switched it to either Apple TV or direct usb the volume ceiling was a lot higher.
Hi matthewpartrick,
There has to be a volume setting somewhere (possibly hidden) that is reducing volume level below "Max" of the digital signal with your
APE. Not sure where this is happening, but glad you are able to prove that it does not happen with Apple TV or using a direct USB connection.
Vinnie
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There has to be a volume setting somewhere (possibly hidden) that is reducing volume level below "Max" of the digital signal with your APE.
Matthew, as I had mentioned did you check the AirPlay speaker control which whose volume sliders are hidden in the Single mode?
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=119159)
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=119160)
Steve
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Hi Steve,
Thanks for posting this...
Vinnie
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Matthew, as I had mentioned did you check the AirPlay speaker control which whose volume sliders are hidden in the Single mode?
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=119159)
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=119160)
Steve
When I first talked to Apple about this we went through these exact volume level indicators, and for some weird reason it didn't fix the problem.
I'm not kidding about this, but I've spent so much time dealing with the idiosyncracies of iTunes and its iterations that the problems I've run into cannot be adequately handled by the regular Apple tech advisors on the phone, and I have the direct phone # and email of one of the senior advisors for Apple. He and I have spent literally hours on the phone navigating the different settings of iTunes trying to sort out the issues I've had, and even he gets stumped from time to time, as with this issue.
Anyhoo, the good news is that it's an Apple problem and not a LIO problem. I'm going to fiddle around with Audirvana a little more to see if I can get better results.
Which brings me to my next question: Does anyone have experience with Audirvana importing files from HD tracks?
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Which brings me to my next question: Does anyone have experience with Audirvana importing files from HD tracks?
I use Audirvana+ and have a few albums from HDTracks, but mostly vinyl rips.. what specifically are you asking about?
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I use Audirvana+ and have a few albums from HDTracks, but mostly vinyl rips.. what specifically are you asking about?
Now that I have a few days off work I'm really trying to iron out the Audirvana issues. There are a few:
1) I can't seem to get rid of the icon on the desktop even after I move the program to the applications folder. I'll move it to the trash bin and then when I reopen Audirvana the icon shows back up on the desktop. I've done this about five times just to make sure :)
2) Certain files won't show up presumably due to metadata. For example, I dowloaded Dave Brubeck's Time Out off HDTracks yesterday to compare it to my LP, and I can't seem to get it to show up even after I dump it into the appropriate folder. If it won't show up because of metadata, how would I even edit the data to get it to show up? Frustrating.
3) In the preferences menu, under audio system and preferred audio device, it's possible to select AirPlay or built in output, ie computer speakers. This is also the area where I'm supposed to be able to select my DAC as a direct output from the USB, but when I plug in the USB from the Mac to the DAC, the option of having the DAC doesn't show up.
I'm sure there will be other issues but those are the biggies. Thanks for any suggestions!
Matthew
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When I first talked to Apple about this we went through these exact volume level indicators, and for some weird reason it didn't fix the problem.
I'm not kidding about this, but I've spent so much time dealing with the idiosyncracies of iTunes and its iterations that the problems I've run into cannot be adequately handled by the regular Apple tech advisors on the phone, and I have the direct phone # and email of one of the senior advisors for Apple. He and I have spent literally hours on the phone navigating the different settings of iTunes trying to sort out the issues I've had, and even he gets stumped from time to time, as with this issue.
Anyhoo, the good news is that it's an Apple problem and not a LIO problem. I'm going to fiddle around with Audirvana a little more to see if I can get better results.
Which brings me to my next question: Does anyone have experience with Audirvana importing files from HD tracks?
Hi MP,
I hate to say it - but you might want to consider scrubbing the drive and reloading OSX. I am not a guru with computer problems, but after we talk over the phone tomorrow, I should have a good understanding if there is some glitch going on there and if it makes sense to
scrub and reload new version of OSX.
At any time you can also send me your MBP and I'll play with it, but hopefully I can help you over the phone..
I do have Audirvana Plus on one of my MBP's, but am not the expert in it. Those guys might be able to help if I can't help you with it.
Hang on - you'll get there!
Vinnie
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Hi MP,
I hate to say it - but you might want to consider scrubbing the drive and reloading OSX. I am not a guru with computer problems, but after we talk over the phone tomorrow, I should have a good understanding if there is some glitch going on there and if it makes sense to
scrub and reload new version of OSX.
At any time you can also send me your MBP and I'll play with it, but hopefully I can help you over the phone..
I do have Audirvana Plus on one of my MBP's, but am not the expert in it. Those guys might be able to help if I can't help you with it.
Hang on - you'll get there!
Vinnie
Honestly I wouldn't mind starting from scratch, because I have all the ALAC files on a separate hard drive anyway. We'll talk tomorrow.
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1) I can't seem to get rid of the icon on the desktop even after I move the program to the applications folder. I'll move it to the trash bin and then when I reopen Audirvana the icon shows back up on the desktop. I've done this about five times just to make sure :)
Try deleting it from the ~/Desktop folder.
2) Certain files won't show up presumably due to metadata. For example, I dowloaded Dave Brubeck's Time Out off HDTracks yesterday to compare it to my LP, and I can't seem to get it to show up even after I dump it into the appropriate folder. If it won't show up because of metadata, how would I even edit the data to get it to show up? Frustrating.
That's odd that HDTracks doesn't come pretagged... I would think they would have all the info. If not, you can use something like Yate to set the id3 tags, or get fancy with Winebottler and download tag&rename for windows.. but this is a bit challenging to pull off.
3) In the preferences menu, under audio system and preferred audio device, it's possible to select AirPlay or built in output, ie computer speakers. This is also the area where I'm supposed to be able to select my DAC as a direct output from the USB, but when I plug in the USB from the Mac to the DAC, the option of having the DAC doesn't show up.
You can't send info to two places :) your DAC would have to forward the info off to the air play device, or you'd need to bypass your DAC. Not having the direct out once you plug in your DAC is weird, though. Maybe tearing everything down and building from scratch will help, afterall. How old is your computer?
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I ended up reinstalling osX, and then my Mac up and died. Like, it's got three feet in the grave. I took it to the Apple Store and looks like we're waiting on a new MacBook Air. Argh.
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I ended up reinstalling osX, and then my Mac up and died. Like, it's got three feet in the grave. I took it to the Apple Store and looks like we're waiting on a new MacBook Air. Argh.
Hi matthew,
Glad you'll be getting a new unit - and hopefully you'll be rid of all those issues!
Vinnie
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Is it appropriate to ask a few questions here that aren't directly related to LIO? Specifically floorstanding speaker recommendations less than 10k and ideally <8k that may pair well with LIO; I was looking at Sonus Faber and Focal, maybe Dynaudio.
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Is it appropriate to ask a few questions here that aren't directly related to LIO? Specifically floorstanding speaker recommendations less than 10k and ideally <8k that may pair well with LIO; I was looking at Sonus Faber and Focal, maybe Dynaudio.
Hi mp,
Because LIO is comfortable driving down to 2-ohms, you should be fine with a wide variety of speakers. Speaker choice is a matter of taste, but unless you like to play at fairly loud listening levels, don't be afraid to try as many as you can listen to and see what you like.
Case in point:
I am currently at ALO Audio in Portland, OR and we are playing LIO on their Gamut RS9's:
http://www.gamutaudio.com/en-GB/Products/Speakers/RS-Superior/The-Superior--RS9.aspx
It's a 89dB, 4-ohm speaker (but dips down to 3.2 ohms), and Ken at ALO is floored with the LIO, swapping to it from
a McIntosh C500 / MC452. I'm not talking about LIO being "more powerful" - but in many other aspects, he said LIO excels,
and still plays them as loud as he needs in his large office room. AWESOME SOUND! You-are-there realism and sense of scale! :drool:
(Not an inexpensive speaker, though!)
Have fun!
Vinnie
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I wanted to revive my walking dead thread and give you guys feedback at my one year anniversary.
The LIO has exceeded expectations beyond any gushing honeymoon period. The sound is so natural and engaging. I've been listening to a LOT of Rush lately, both on ALAC and 180g vinyl, and both are stellar.
Vinnie's genius is modularity. In the old days, people made vacuum cleaners that lasted decades, and the company gained a very loyal customer. That changed sometime in the 80s, to disposable products and declining customer service. Vinnie's idea of unparalleled customer service, individual attention, and ultimately the coup de gras of modularity means that he's gained a customer for life in me. I'm a LIO acolyte. I will spread its praises to anyone who listens.
Are there things I'd change? Sure there are. Let me complain.
Wait, you mean I can just change them? Well, what do I Complain about then!??!?!? :)
Seriously, budgetary constraints aside, I'll eventually upgrade to the standalone amp and the autoformer volume control. I want to be able to annoy the shoot out of my jerk neighbors with some B side Rush or other prog Rock.
Thank you Vinnie for the best product ever!
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:thumb:
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I wanted to revive my walking dead thread and give you guys feedback at my one year anniversary.
The LIO has exceeded expectations beyond any gushing honeymoon period. The sound is so natural and engaging. I've been listening to a LOT of Rush lately, both on ALAC and 180g vinyl, and both are stellar.
Vinnie's genius is modularity. In the old days, people made vacuum cleaners that lasted decades, and the company gained a very loyal customer. That changed sometime in the 80s, to disposable products and declining customer service. Vinnie's idea of unparalleled customer service, individual attention, and ultimately the coup de gras of modularity means that he's gained a customer for life in me. I'm a LIO acolyte. I will spread its praises to anyone who listens.
Are there things I'd change? Sure there are. Let me complain.
Wait, you mean I can just change them? Well, what do I Complain about then!??!?!? :)
Seriously, budgetary constraints aside, I'll eventually upgrade to the standalone amp and the autoformer volume control. I want to be able to annoy the shoot out of my jerk neighbors with some B side Rush or other prog Rock.
Thank you Vinnie for the best product ever!
Just the fact that you are a Rush fan made your credibility go through the roof with me! :thumb:
If I didn't already have a Devialet, I'd get a LIO.
(Fellow Rush Fan)
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If I didn't already have a Devialet, I'd get a LIO.
Maybe buy a LIO and compare the two and see what you think. :wink: There are some new modules coming down the road too. :o 8) :green: :wink: :oops: :thumb:
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Just the fact that you are a Rush fan made your credibility go through the roof with me! :thumb:
If I didn't already have a Devialet, I'd get a LIO.
(Fellow Rush Fan)
When the AVC and standalone amp show up, my plan is to play 2112 at "scare the children" levels at my jerk neighbors. Once they get to Geddy's chorus on "Circumstances"' they'll probably start bleeding from their ears. Can you tell I don't like them? :)
Glad to hear there's another Rush-ite around :)
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"2112" in hi-Rez through the LIO at loud levels is SWEET!!!
:drums: :guitar: :dance:
George
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Once they get to Geddy's chorus on "Circumstances"' they'll probably start bleeding from their ears.
Plus ça change , plus c'est la même chose!
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Plus ça change , plus c'est la même chose!
Unnaturally high vocals :)
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After having somehow screwed up the DHT PRE installation, the LIO is en route back to me, and is now -totally- pimped out. While it was out for a tune-up we not only correctly installed the DHT PRE, we upgraded the DAC to the microrendu power supply and added the headphone amp. Optioned out to the max! I didn't add the new quiet switching power supply, had to draw the line somewhere! Will post pix when it arrives.
Thx!
Matthew
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After having somehow screwed up the DHT PRE installation
Creating content for your website maybe? :lol:
Sorry you lobbed that right over the middle! Seriously, sorry about your issues Matthew! Thank you and rest for all your sharing all your experiences with LIO… it’s a blessing and a curse as I'm LIOless. :evil:
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Creating content for your website maybe? :lol:
Sorry you lobbed that right over the middle! Seriously, sorry about your issues Matthew! Thank you and rest for all your sharing all your experiences with LIO… it’s a blessing and a curse as I'm LIOless. :evil:
LOL! :). For sure it's been a labor of love. I did promise myself that I would post some info on the LIO, but since I'm so biased towards Vinnie I won't be writing any review of the LIO, I just like him and the product too much. I will be posting about my tube rolling experience since that's so subjective to begin with.
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OK, after I screwed up the DHT installation and had my usual microrendu setup harangue, I am -finally- up and running again. Here's a photo of my dream system, the pimped out LIO with the new DHT PRE, phono stage, HPA, and microrendu power output DAC. It's feeding my Joseph Audio Pulsars. Amazing sound and such a compact system! Loving it.
(http://i1285.photobucket.com/albums/a585/matthewpartrick1/IMG_1549_zpsthhdwsgx.jpg) (http://s1285.photobucket.com/user/matthewpartrick1/media/IMG_1549_zpsthhdwsgx.jpg.html)
(http://i1285.photobucket.com/albums/a585/matthewpartrick1/IMG_2235_zpsyfot4acr.jpg) (http://s1285.photobucket.com/user/matthewpartrick1/media/IMG_2235_zpsyfot4acr.jpg.html)
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Looks good, MP!
Thanks for sharing!
:thumb:
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Ditto. Looks good.
Off topic for the VR circle but...you should get something between your speakers and the dressers. Something like the 'Big Fat Dots' from Herbie's Audio Labs should do it. You will gain lots.
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This setup is a temporary but total disaster. I'm waiting to move into my new house that we're closing on this week, but the media room won't be ready for six months at least. I've got a great set of speaker stands and a good cabinet for the LIO and turntable, but it's all in storage.
I'll update you guys with a final photo when it's really done! :)
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Is it appropriate to ask a few questions here that aren't directly related to LIO? Specifically floorstanding speaker recommendations less than 10k and ideally <8k that may pair well with LIO; I was looking at Sonus Faber and Focal, maybe Dynaudio.
Why not a pair of Harbeths? I heard Lio and Harbeths at Axpona in 2015 and it was one of the top 3-4 rooms that I heard. One of my friends felt the same way.
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Why not a pair of Harbeths? I heard Lio and Harbeths at Axpona in 2015 and it was one of the top 3-4 rooms that I heard. One of my friends felt the same way.
I'm sure they'd be killer. For now I'm very satisfied with the Pulsars. If I ever upgrade I would trade them into Jeff and get the Perspective floorstanders.
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Why not a pair of Harbeths? I heard Lio and Harbeths at Axpona in 2015 and it was one of the top 3-4 rooms that I heard. One of my friends felt the same way.
I have heard that combo and it is indeed excellent.
That said, the LIO sounds great with lots of speakers and setups!
My LIO has worked very well with Spatial Audio, Vandersteen, and Salk.
George
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I'm sure they'd be killer. For now I'm very satisfied with the Pulsars. If I ever upgrade I would trade them into Jeff and get the Perspective floorstanders.
Matthew,
You are right. First work on your loudspeaker/room setup which apparently you are with a new media room in a new home. Although the pic you just posted is very beautiful, it's not an ideal setup as you are well aware.
We will wait for your new room and then it will be easier to make recommendations if you are at all interested. But the room/loudspeaker interface is the most important to get right.
Kind regards,
Anand.
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That's the plan. Step 1) gut house. Step 2) convince Kim one entire room needed for my purposes. :) If it makes her feel any better ill be putting the guitars in there too!