My N3 built (Guy 13 style...)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic. Read 4722 times.

Guy 13

My N3 built (Guy 13 style...)
« on: 31 Oct 2012, 10:45 am »

Hi Danny and all Audio Circle members.

About two years ago, I’ve purchased from Danny a N3 kit
that I never installed in an enclosure.

I only did a (Stupid and/or useless) test in a open baffle mode,
that kit was not design for,
the result was deceiving
and I was expecting that,
but I did it anyway to satisfy my curiosity.

Two weeks ago, I said to myself:
I spent 300USD+ for drivers and they are sitting in a corner gathering dust, might as well do something with them!

I ask the Vietnamese cabinet maker that as built my V1 and two V2 to build a small enclosure for the N3 that would sit on top of one of my V2 that was more or less OB subwoofer without a coaxial driver.

The two new N3 enclosures without external finish (Paint/vinyl), without insulation (Acoustic foam),
but with all the cut outs for the drivers made me poorer by 60USD/pair.
Not bad for an acceptable construction quality.

At the bottom, the white foam is to avoid the xover PCB to vibrate,
since it’s not mounted directly on the bottom of the enclosure.



 

The xover PCB installed.

 



The twins are ready for dress-up.

 



Foam installed.
No, it’s not NoRez.
Please no comments, I know NoRez is way better,
but this is an extremely, super, extra low budget project.

 



Cut outs with pre drilled pilot holes.

 



I don’t really like the idea of having a screwable back panel,
but that’s the only way the xover can be install.
I made myself some kind of seal around the back panel.

 




 

N3 (Could also be called: Guy 13 modified version of the N3)


front with vinyl wood imitation.
5USD per square yard. (Total cost less than 15USD).
Of course, this is my first attempt doing that kind of thing
and therefore there are a few ripples.
To anyone that will make negative comments on this project,
I will tell them:
 << It’s a prototype. >>

 

It fits perfectly over the Guy 13 modified version of the V2 subwoofer.

 



Yes, I know, cheap foam again, that does not do anything good to improve the quality of sound.
But, it looks nice, no, yes, maybe ?

 

My set up. 

 



Close up of the electronics.
Rega P3 with Exact mm cartridge.
Bellari VP-129 tube phono stage.
Niteshade Audio NS-10 (10wpc) amplifier.
Rega Apollo CD player.
Interconnects (Audio 13 custom made)
Speaker wires : 12 ga. OFC
                         Unknown make – 30 years old.
 
 



Now the BIG question:
How do they sound ? ? ?

When I had finished building the first one,
I was so anxious to hear it,
that I unplug the left V2 (8” coaxial PAudio w/2X Eminence Acoustinator 12” sub.) and plug in the freshly constructed N3
and for the right side, I left the V2 but without turning on the SA-1 SS plate amplifier that Danny don’t sell anymore (Too bad).
The N3 sounded terrible…
The trebles were weak, no ambiance…
The V2 sounded better, even with the sub turned off.

So, I got back to work and finish building the second N3 and then, when the two N3 were proudly sitting on top of the V2, connected and fed them with some nice music.
(Bass, vocal, disco, classical, etc…)

I just fell of my chair.

Yes, that’s the Chinese style chair you see on the picture.

Good sound stage.
Voice was like the singer was in the room with me.
Instrumentals: Strings, bells, etc… were clear as crystal.
Of course, le level of realism was depending on the quality of the recording.


I was really surprised.
I did not expect such nice sound from little drivers like that.

Of course, not much bass, but with the V2 to help with the lower
notes, the circle is completed.

Of course the N3 could sound better, if my room was acoustically treated, right now I have curtains, thick carpet and that’s about it.
What I would like to see from Danny in the future is small drivers with higher sensivity, let say around 95 to 98db.
My 10wpc amplifier was enough, but with limited reserve of power
depending on the recording and level of listening.

In the days to come, I will complete the building of my V1 and do a side by side comparison (I love comparison) of the V1, V2 and the combo V2+N3 and let you know my findings.

This hobby is fun, especially when the construction is completed, because building with limited resources and tools, is not always enjoyable and sometimes frustrating.

Guy 13
The guy that likes to do things his own way, like it or not.

 
 

jparkhur

Re: My N3 built (Guy 13 style...)
« Reply #1 on: 31 Oct 2012, 01:19 pm »
Guy,

Doesn't moving the tweeter above the drivers throw off the phase and or image of the speaker.  With moving it outside of the MTM design i would figure??? it would effect the sound of an original N3?

Looks nice...

richidoo

Re: My N3 built (Guy 13 style...)
« Reply #2 on: 31 Oct 2012, 01:48 pm »
Great job Guy13! Congrats! Enjoy your new speakers!
Rich

persisting1

Re: My N3 built (Guy 13 style...)
« Reply #3 on: 31 Oct 2012, 10:47 pm »
Guy 13,

Did you design the crossovers for this speaker too?

 :thumb:

Guy 13

Re: My N3 built (Guy 13 style...)
« Reply #4 on: 31 Oct 2012, 11:50 pm »
Guy 13,

Did you design the crossovers for this speaker too?

 :thumb:

Hi persisting and all Audio Circle members.

I did not do the (Mechanical) design of the crossover,
a Vietnamese electronic technician did it for me,
(12USD/each)
even if I asked him to do it on a piece of wood.

All the components were purchased from Danny
and he supplied me a diagram.

Look nice and professional, but the larger inductor is sitting flat on a the copper PVB which is not good, but not catastrofic.

I hope that answer your question.

Guy 13

Guy 13

Re: My N3 built (Guy 13 style...)
« Reply #5 on: 31 Oct 2012, 11:52 pm »
Great job Guy13! Congrats! Enjoy your new speakers!
Rich

Hi richidoo and all Audio Circle members.

Thanks, but next time, I will probably do better.

Experience is the sum of your mistakes.

Guy 13

Guy 13

Re: My N3 built (Guy 13 style...)
« Reply #6 on: 1 Nov 2012, 12:01 am »
Guy,

Doesn't moving the tweeter above the drivers throw off the phase and or image of the speaker.  With moving it outside of the MTM design i would figure??? it would effect the sound of an original N3?

Looks nice...

Hi jparkur and all Audio Circle members.

I don't think the tweeter being above the two small drivers
change things a lot
and throw off the phase and or image of the speaker.

If it does, it must be by very little
and anyway, I am pleased with the sound, that's what's important to me.
I did not build those for resale, but for me.

The main reason for this layout,
is that I wanted the enclosure to fit perfectly on top of my V2.
 
Of course the sound of my design it not the same as Danny original design,
but I am sure it's pretty close.

In last thing, is that with this design the tweeter is in line with my ears,
while I am sitting. 

Guy 13

FullRangeMan

  • Volunteer
  • Posts: 20020
  • To whom more was given more will be required.
    • Never go to a psychiatrist, adopt a straycat or dog. On the street they live only two years average.
Re: My N3 built (Guy 13 style...)
« Reply #7 on: 1 Nov 2012, 12:06 am »
Guy13 style... :lol: :lol:
I see a Sheffield LP...nice photos.

Guy 13

Re: My N3 built (Guy 13 style...)
« Reply #8 on: 1 Nov 2012, 12:15 am »
Guy13 style... :lol: :lol:
I see a Sheffield LP...nice photos.

Hi FULLRANGEMAN and all Audio Circle members.

You have sharp eyes.

This is an audiophile reference LP that I have purchase 25 years ago
when I bought my Naim SS system with B&W DM-3000 speakers and Linn Soundek turntable.

That Solid State (Transistor) system is the last one I ever owned,
after I sold it,
I went back the tube way
and it will be like that until I die.

I did not keep the Linn Soundek turntable,
because it was to costly to repair.
(PCB for speed control.)

Guy 13


S Clark

  • Full Member
  • Posts: 7366
  • a riot is the language of the unheard- Dr. King
Re: My N3 built (Guy 13 style...)
« Reply #9 on: 1 Nov 2012, 12:31 am »
I'm just making sure that I've got this right.  You took a well tested and respected product, changed the dimensions of the cabinet radically, built two great big open boxes with no internal bracing, used a crossover for a different box, have no measuring equipment, and like the results.  Hey Guy, it's your money. Do what makes you happy.

persisting1

Re: My N3 built (Guy 13 style...)
« Reply #10 on: 1 Nov 2012, 12:37 am »
I'm sorry Guy 13, I should have been more specific. Did you redesign the crossovers due to the changes you made or are you using the standard crossover design for the N3?

Guy 13

Re: My N3 built (Guy 13 style...)
« Reply #11 on: 1 Nov 2012, 12:52 am »
I'm sorry Guy 13, I should have been more specific. Did you redesign the crossovers due to the changes you made or are you using the standard crossover design for the N3?

Hi persisting1 and all Audio Circle members.
 
I should have, but I did not.

Am I gona go to prison for that ?

Guy 13

Guy 13

Re: My N3 built (Guy 13 style...)
« Reply #12 on: 1 Nov 2012, 12:59 am »
I'm just making sure that I've got this right.  You took a well tested and respected product, changed the dimensions of the cabinet radically, built two great big open boxes with no internal bracing, used a crossover for a different box, have no measuring equipment, and like the results.  Hey Guy, it's your money. Do what makes you happy.
Hi S Clark and all Audio Circle members.
Did you delete the last post I sent ?

Guy 13

persisting1

Re: My N3 built (Guy 13 style...)
« Reply #13 on: 1 Nov 2012, 01:16 am »
Quote
I should have, but I did not.

Sounds like you're going to have to redesign them.

Rclark

Re: My N3 built (Guy 13 style...)
« Reply #14 on: 1 Nov 2012, 01:26 am »
Guy, in a nice way, they are saying you screwed it up. You can't just make it however you want it to be, it's a specific design, that's the whole point of a crossover/enclosure/driver specificity.

I also don't think you can just put N3 parts over a V2 bottom and call it a day, I might be wrong. You are always up to stuff like this and it's always very amusing  :lol:

Have fun. :thumb:

Guy 13

Re: My N3 built (Guy 13 style...)
« Reply #15 on: 1 Nov 2012, 01:32 am »
Guy, in a nice way, they are saying you screwed it up. You can't just make it however you want it to be, it's a specific design, that's the whole point of a crossover/enclosure/driver specificity.

I also don't think you can just put N3 parts over a V2 bottom and call it a day, I might be wrong. You are always up to stuff like this and it's always very amusing  :lol:

Have fun. :thumb:

Hi Rclark and all Audio Circle members.

Well, it a free country
(I am talking about USA, not Vietnam)
you can say whatever you want and like
and I can do whatever I like and want.

Maybe I am having more fun doing things my way,
than you doing things the way other experts tell you ? ? ?

By the way, in the 70,s all enclosure were built that way,
at that time, nobody was complaining...

Guy 13

Guy 13

Re: My N3 built (Guy 13 style...)
« Reply #16 on: 1 Nov 2012, 01:37 am »
Sounds like you're going to have to redesign them.

Hi persisting1 and all Audio Circle members.

No redesign, I keep the N3 Guy 13 style as is.

I am now working on a dipole project with Danny's V1 drivers,
that should make many Audio Circle members busy criticizing my built.

Guy 13
 

Rclark

Re: My N3 built (Guy 13 style...)
« Reply #17 on: 1 Nov 2012, 01:40 am »
I know but, that speaker from the 70's was designed to be that way, had a crossover designed for that layout, that enclosure, and those drivers.

You just took N3 drivers, and an N3 crossover, which is made for a specific  enclosure and layout, and put them in your own enclosure with your own layout, and then have them paired with V2 subs (which likely further doesn't match up at all, crossover wise).

Does that make sense? You can't just take a design and have it however you want it to be. For example, I couldn't take an N3 kit, and mount it and the crossover in an open baffle to look like a smiley face. I might like how it looks, but it is no longer an N3, and needs probably needs help at that point.

persisting1

Re: My N3 built (Guy 13 style...)
« Reply #18 on: 1 Nov 2012, 01:46 am »
Guy 13,

Trust me, we're not trying to be mean, but this is not how you build a speaker. You can't change the design of the speaker and not redesign the crossovers.

I know you don't like to follow rules, but this isn't the way to "stick it to the man".

Please don't take this is an attack Guy 13. I do enjoy your passion for this hobby.

persisting1

Re: My N3 built (Guy 13 style...)
« Reply #19 on: 1 Nov 2012, 01:57 am »
Now that I think about it Guy 13; I'm hoping you teach yourself how to design crossovers and maybe we'll see you on here selling your kits  :thumb: