[Fbczar]

I understand the M series speaker crossovers were redesigned a little bit in January so the tweeter can now handle higher SPL's than they once could. Therefore, I am in the market for an M series speaker once again. I have a 15x16x8 well treated theater/music room. Which speaker would be better in my room, the M3 or the M4? Thanks.

[James Edward]

I guess my advice is worth what you paid for it, but here goes… I’d go for the M3- 92db vs 90db efficiency doesn’t sound like much, but it is. I don’t know what speakers you’re changing from, but OB bass, good as it is, doesn’t seem as ‘slamming’ as a box speaker. The more you can get from OB, the better. OTOH, you mention a theater, so you may already have that covered.
I own the M3 Turbo S, and have them in a 12’x16’x9’ room that opens to a 10’x10’ dining area. I augmented the bottom end with a Hsu ULS-15 MK2 sub and couldn’t be happier.
I’m sure you’ll get some good opinions here; sift through and ask more questions as they come up. Good luck.
Jim

[Daryl Zero]

I've seen many posters say, in response to questions like in the OP, to contact Clayton Shaw for the best answer to those kinds of questions.

[AllanS]

I've seen many posters say, in response to questions like in the OP, to contact Clayton Shaw for the best answer to those kinds of questions.

Absolutely agree.  With guidance from Cloud at Spatial I placed an M4 order yesterday for use in a 13 x 19 x 8 room.  But the choice wasn’t based strictly on room size.  SPL/HT, primary listening distance, sonic preferences, were all discussed as well as amplifier guidance.  Some of the discussion was related to M vs X.

[loki7177]

I have M3's in my 14' x 14' x 8' room and cannot be happier with them. 

[RonN5]

One thing to think about.  If your listening position is in a null relative to the speaker placement, the M3s won't get you any more low end...that will only be resolved with different placement or a sub or two to tame the nulls....assuming you have room for the sub/s. 

So, what speakers do you have now and how do they sound when positioned where you will have the spatials....if all is well, then you will probably prefer the low end of the M3...but if you have a problem and will need a sub, then maybe the M4 and use the extra money for the sub.

As for the crossover/tweeter change for volume?????  I have one year old M3 Sapphires in a very large room and believe me they will play loud enough to make your ears hurt...but for me the ideal is 75-80db...not 100 db.

[Fbczar]

The M3 plays to 30Hz and the M4 plays to 32Hz according to listed specs. Inasmuch as the speakers are designed for different size spaces I have to assume the output level at those frequencies must be markedly different. Do any of you know of a resource that shows the output level for each speaker relative to frequency? I use TDL Reference Standard Transmission line speakers now and they have useful output to 16Hz according to Dirac. My room is not overwhelmed by the bass output of my main speakers or my two Kreisel DXD12012 subs. Obviously, my present subs are monopole sources while the M Sapphires are Dipole sources so any comparison may be of the apple vs oranges variety. It is mu understanding the M3 can be boomy is a too small room. I do not understand why.

[RonN5]

I can't explain the physics but I can give you an inverse.....Take a small speaker in a small room that sounds good and has a good low end output that is satisfying.  Now move that speaker to a large room and the bass gets lost.

Generally, but not always, people seem to find that the inverse is true, large speaker in small room seems to be overly boomy.

But, if you have a lot of flexibility with you speaker position and your listening position, you might get the M3s to sound great, especially nearfield.

For those that say you can't match an OB speaker with a boxed sub, hence you should go for the M3 no matter what, I disagree.  Turn off your speakers and listen to just your sub and tell me what you hear below 55 hz....grunts, groans, booms, bangs and almost no tone....so if you go with the M4s and want to add some dynamic punch to the low end, you can bring your subs in around 50 hz and be amazed by the M4 openness and tone augmented by the MK low end with virtually no detriment to the sound...my opinion of course.

[Fbczar]

RonN5, Thanks for the reply. My ear height, since my theater seats are on a riser, is 44". The M4's would be maybe 8.5' from the MLP. Will 44" be an issue for the M4's given it is only 40" tall overall? If so would stands work?

[James Edward]

I can't explain the physics but I can give you an inverse.....Take a small speaker in a small room that sounds good and has a good low end output that is satisfying.  Now move that speaker to a large room and the bass gets lost.

Generally, but not always, people seem to find that the inverse is true, large speaker in small room seems to be overly boomy.

But, if you have a lot of flexibility with you speaker position and your listening position, you might get the M3s to sound great, especially nearfield.

For those that say you can't match an OB speaker with a boxed sub, hence you should go for the M3 no matter what, I disagree.  Turn off your speakers and listen to just your sub and tell me what you hear below 55 hz....grunts, groans, booms, bangs and almost no tone....so if you go with the M4s and want to add some dynamic punch to the low end, you can bring your subs in around 50 hz and be amazed by the M4 openness and tone augmented by the MK low end with virtually no detriment to the sound...my opinion of course.

My room, because of its opening to the DR, has always been a problem. A couple of 6 or 8 inch woofers didn’t cut it- bass was lacking. Then I went for a speaker with two 12” woofers, and I couldn’t quite control the bass.
Enter the M3 Turbo S- fulsome bass from the 15” woofers, and magically they did not overload the room. They are great, with a full sounding midrange that, to my ears, large woofers (in a two-way speaker) excel at. I had them for two years and decided I wanted a little more low end punch.
The Hsu ULS 15 Mk2 is a sealed box woofer that mates quite nicely with my M3 Turbo S.
I’ll end it there- our systems are like snowflakes- no two alike, with many paths to audio nirvana.

[ElGatoRon]

It is a good sized room so I would go with the M3’s.   I have M3 Sapphires in a 14x24 room and they sound great.   

[newzooreview]

My M3 Sapphires work well in my 18' x 14' room with 8' ceilings. The bass is very well textured and tuneful. The speakers are 3.1' out from the wall.

I can't say if the M4 Sapphires would be better or worse, but the M3s will not be too much speaker for the room in my experience.

[Mr. Big]

The M3 plays to 30Hz and the M4 plays to 32Hz according to listed specs. Inasmuch as the speakers are designed for different size spaces I have to assume the output level at those frequencies must be markedly different. Do any of you know of a resource that shows the output level for each speaker relative to frequency? I use TDL Reference Standard Transmission line speakers now and they have useful output to 16Hz according to Dirac. My room is not overwhelmed by the bass output of my main speakers or my two Kreisel DXD12012 subs. Obviously, my present subs are monopole sources while the M Sapphires are Dipole sources so any comparison may be of the apple vs oranges variety. It is my understanding the M3 can be boomy is a too-small room. I do not understand why.

In-room specs are what counts some rooms really bring out the bass others suck it up. I own the M3's Sapphires and once broken in they go as low as I need on 95% of my recordings and that includes Telarc recordings. Tried 2 subs in room and they ruined the sound/purity of the M3's. El-natural with room accoutics fixed.

[forky]

I have Saphhire M3s and in a medium-small room that is odd sized but they work well. The potential problem is that we are moving in a few months and it is quite likely that the listening room will be smaller. I'll driving my wife (more) nuts with the limitations on homes because the listening room isn't large enough.

If I do have to go to a smaller room I'll evaluate then and if i have to sell and buy smaller I will but hoping I don't have to.