AudioCircle
Industry Circles => Daedalus Audio => Topic started by: Daedalus Audio on 17 Apr 2010, 03:57 pm
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Just completed the work on this new option for our systems. here's a link to the page and some of the info:
"With this option we have removed any electrolytic capacitors in our crossovers and replaced them with high voltage poly and teflon capacitors and the highest quality resistors, carefully matching all components for perfect balance. This has been a painstaking process as we didn't just substitute new parts but selected specific capacitors and resistors for optimum synergy."
lhttp://www.daedalusaudio.com/AP-Option.html (http://www.daedalusaudio.com/AP-Option.html)
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Very cool Lou. Congratulations. I know you have been working on this for quite a while. Looks like I am going to have to make a trip to the west side and bring my speakers with me. Maybe when I come over for the U2 concert in June.
Laura
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So glad to see there's an upgrade path for my Ulysses speakers that will take them to an even higher level of performance.
Thanks, Lou, for making continual improvements to your products.
Frank
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I will hopefully, be the proud owner of the first pair, fedex permitting. I have'nt asked again, for obvious reasons, but any idea when they will be making there way over the Atlantic lou, Icelandic volcanos permitting?
I do'nt want any of that pumice dust damaging the wood surface.
David
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Hello Lou,
When we spoke on the phone the other week (getting me lined up for an audition of your speakers), if memory serves, you mentioned how impressed you were with the bass response, w/ the new crossover. Particularly with the DA-RMa's I think...
Could you explain what you feel the major benefits are with this upgrade? More of everything? or does this new crossover shine in any one aspect more than others?
Thanks
Jason
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Jriggy WAIT till you hear the DA-RMa's :drool:
I'm waiting on pair of Ulysses w/new x-over, Never heard them, but the way people describe these well you all know :duh:
This past Monday (a month in the making) had one of nicest hosts (Thx again Jimmy S.) you could imagine, showcase his beautiful DA-RMa's. I told Jimmy flat out, IMO you do not need a sub. It was a 3hr JAM session that went by too quick. I'm not a big classical guy but how these speakers handle the dynamic swings was something to behold. On Live Norah Jones from London I heard the acoustics of that venue like never before. Its touch of warmth probably contributes to the fact you do not wanna stop listening to these speakers.
Lastly, I've seen all the pics of the DA-RMA's online (pro pics) and none of them capture the true beauty of them like they look in person.
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Berto,
If I wasn't excited - witch I most definitely was - I am even more so now!
Actually, I will be auditioning the Ulysses @ Franks house on the 30th but am interested in the 1.1's or the DA-RMa's... I just cant decide what presentation I am most interested in... Your comment on the DA-RMa's regarding bass response is great to hear!
Very much looking forward to our visit Frank!
~J
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Hello Lou,
When we spoke on the phone the other week (getting me lined up for an audition of your speakers), if memory serves, you mentioned how impressed you were with the bass response, w/ the new crossover. Particularly with the DA-RMa's I think...
Could you explain what you feel the major benefits are with this upgrade? More of everything? or does this new crossover shine in any one aspect more than others?
Thanks
Jason
I just had a chance to swap between the AP (all-poly) DA-RMa/ standard DA-RMa/ and AP Ulysses. I hadn't listened to the standard DA-RMa for a while and was pleased at how engaging they are, nice to know I hadn't been 'jaded' by the All-Poly systems.
what struck me most going between the standard and the AP was a sense of three dimensionality and an absolutely effortless performance. (something like the best attributes of the very best single driver systems but with full and accurate response with incredibly precise imaging).
I'm really looking forward to RMAF when we'll have the Galibier turntable etc.
there's more info on the web site as well.
thanks,
lou
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Well, the new Da-RMas with AP upgrade have arrived safely and just to repeat what everyone says, photos do'nt do them justice. I am afraid I can not give a comparison with the the normal version, which I only heard at RMAF, too long ago to remember, but they sound phenomenal. I would have liked to consider the Ulysses, but they are too big for my room.
I am playing one of my favourite CDs through my Modded Resolution Audio Opus 21 through my trusty Viva Solista, an 845, 22 watt SET, Shawn Colvin's "Cover Girl". It just sounds effortless, airy, transparent, fast and soo dynamic. In short, it sounds like music, not HiFi. It struck me at RMAF, how many of the top $ systems had ticked all the right boxes, but still sounded dry and sterile, in comparison.
So I am very happy with the speakers and the Crossover upgrade. As it happened I asked Lou about upgrading the crossover, when I bought them and he was already thinking about it.
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Congrats Dave! Now how do you plan on getting anything done :icon_lol:
Curious how big your room is and are your 22 watts powerful enough?
Also , if you get a chance love to see a pic.
Thx
Rob (aka Berto)
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Rob
you're right about getting anything done. I thought they would be good, but the sound is stunning. As for the amp, well there are watts and the Solista has WATTS. My room is 20 by 20 foot, but the sound is roomfilling. As a matter of fact, an LSA Statement is available second here and I am going to listen to it tomorrow, just to see what 150 watts will do.
The finish is quartersawn oak, which I do'nt think Lou has done before for the monitors. That is the finish my wife wanted, she is an interior designer by training and hard to please. She is very happy with them and particularly how unobtrusive they are. That is why I chose the Da-RMa's, over the Ulysses, which are taller and deeper to of course. The Monitors do seem to have the WAF factor.
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Hey Dave glad you are enjoying them! I can only imagine how beauiful the quartersewn oak is as well. My Ulysses are shipping ,I'm hoping today so sometime next week should be like a holiday for me :drool:
Curious if you got to hear that LSA statement with your DA-RM'as and if so, what differences you noticed compared to your SET?
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David - can you post a photo? These just might be the speakers I am looking for.
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Randy
I will try, but I am no Richard Avedon. Let's see how it goes. At the moment I have Symposium rollerblock Juniors under the maple block and am using Walker Audio HDL links with the Morrow audio SP4 Speaker cable. I have'nt tried any other speaker cable with them yet. Looking at the photos, I realise I have the maple blocks the wrong way round...Dooh
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=30058)
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=30059)
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=30060)
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=30061)
David
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David, thanks for the photos. They are great looking speakers. The new bases are an improvement. I never liked the old ones, they looked so chunky to me. These are an improvement, but I still don't like them very much. Any idea why a good set of steel stands wouldn't work? Lou?
What are your electronics? How's the bass response?
Thanks again,
Randy
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Beautiful Speakers Dave , thx for the pics. Wish I could listen to them through the pics.
IMO the matching stands are beautiful in person. I think the amount of seperation from the rollerblock isolation throws you off a lil bit. Doesn'nt look as seemless. Steel might work but Lous speakers and stands are works of art, so I think Randy just said a curse word :lol:
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Randy
I am still thinking about the amp, but the rest of the system is;
TW Accustic Raven one/Ortofon309D/Koetsu Onyx or Benz Micro LP
GNSC modded Resolution Audio Opus 21
Magnum Dynalab FT 101A
Viva Solista 22watt 845 SET
I do'nt know where I read it, but the speakers certainly show up any deficiencies in the rest of the chain and the Solista seems to be one. It really is a great amp, one of the best I have heard, but the base is a bit loose and I am sure that is the amp, a few more watts would be good.
I went to hear an LSA Statement this week and I was very disappointed, particularly after hearing the reviews. I think I am stuck with all tubes, though I plan to listen to a Pathos TT, another hybrid integrated. I listened to an Ayon Orion at the same dealer as the LSA and that was really nice, plus you have the option of Triode or Pentode operation. Any other ideas would be welcome.
David
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Hi David,
I doubt I will wanna part with my discontinued 50 watt audio aero captiole anytime soon, but I have heard nothing but great things about the atma-sphere M60s. Many describe this as a end of the road amp and one of these days i'm going to have to try them myself.
More importantly I spoke to a dealer who bought a show pair of Ulysses after hearing his M60s with them. He also mentioned a close second to them was his quicksilver monos (probably newest version). I'm sure if you are patient you can get a good deal on either of these in the second hand market as well.
I don't wish to mention names or comparisons to be fair to all but here is a quote of what the nice gentlman/Ulysses owner said:
"The Atma-spheres brought the bass under tight control, while still providing all the harmonics and tone colors you'd expect from good tube gear. There was subtlety and nuance - everything I need and want in a speaker"
So IMO this seems like a grand idea! :thumb:
Rob
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David,
Thanks for the info. I bet the Quad II Classic integrated amp would be a great match for the Daedalus speakers. See the recent review in the May issue of Gramophone. Maybe a bit pricy, however. 4500 UK.
Randy
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David, thanks for the photos. They are great looking speakers. The new bases are an improvement. I never liked the old ones, they looked so chunky to me. These are an improvement, but I still don't like them very much. Any idea why a good set of steel stands wouldn't work? Lou?
Randy, steel stands would work but I would use them with the maple bases under the speakers. the maple bases couple with the cabinet and act as a resonance 'sink', the stands wood, metal, whatever... need to isolate the speakers from the floor and provide a stable foundation.
thanks,
lou
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David,
I agree with Rob, the Atmasphere M-60s are a great match with my speakers, if I were to use all tube amps they would be my choice. what really impressed me about them was the control, dynamics and exceptional clarity. it looks like we'll be doing a bi-amp setup at this years RMAF combining the Modwright 150's with Atmasphere.
thanks,
lou
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David, I started a new thread with this question, so we can get some dialogue about stands etc...
thanks,
lou
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David,
I agree with Rob, the Atmasphere M-60s are a great match with my speakers, if I were to use all tube amps they would be my choice. what really impressed me about them was the control, dynamics and exceptional clarity. it looks like we'll be doing a bi-amp setup at this years RMAF combining the Modwright 150's with Atmasphere.
thanks,
lou
I will be very interested to hear that combination Lou.
George
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Randy, steel stands would work but I would use them with the maple bases under the speakers. the maple bases couple with the cabinet and act as a resonance 'sink', the stands wood, metal, whatever... need to isolate the speakers from the floor and provide a stable foundation.
thanks,
lou
Lou, thanks for the info. I came within an eyelash of buying a pair of DA-RMas in Denver a few years ago. They were in maple. You were going to give me a good deal, but in the end I declined. I had an extensive listen to both that model and the Ulysses which were just new at the time and was pretty much blown away, with those sparkling tweeters, in particular. Four years later, I think its been, I am still looking and still very interested in Daedalus. (I move at a slow pace.)
Randy
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Lou, thanks for the info. I came within an eyelash of buying a pair of DA-RMas in Denver a few years ago. They were in maple. You were going to give me a good deal, but in the end I declined. I had an extensive listen to both that model and the Ulysses which were just new at the time and was pretty much blown away, with those sparkling tweeters, in particular. Four years later, I think its been, I am still looking and still very interested in Daedalus. (I move at a slow pace.)
Randy
Randy, glad you're still looking at these! as you can see there have been some changes since you heard them. I'll have a pair of ebonized walnut DA-RMa with the AP option in Dan Wrights room at the RMAF and will have the Ulysses with the new bass modules in my large room there (1030).
if anyone knows of a really good tube amp manufacturer looking for a speaker to mate with I'd like to get a pair in another room as well? particularly if it were with an SET amp.
thanks,
lou
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Randy, glad you're still looking at these! as you can see there have been some changes since you heard them. I'll have a pair of ebonized walnut DA-RMa with the AP option in Dan Wrights room at the RMAF and will have the Ulysses with the new bass modules in my large room there (1030).
if anyone knows of a really good tube amp manufacturer looking for a speaker to mate with I'd like to get a pair in another room as well? particularly if it were with an SET amp.
thanks,
lou
Thanks, Lou. I plan to be there. One of your rooms will be my first stop.
Regards,
Randy
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you're right about getting anything done. I thought they would be good, but the sound is stunning. As for the amp, well there are watts and the Solista has WATTS. My room is 20 by 20 foot, but the sound is roomfilling. As a matter of fact, an LSA Statement is available second here and I am going to listen to it tomorrow, just to see what 150 watts will do.
Hey david12,
Are you just loving your new speakers?
Was curious of your placement in a 20 x 20 room... How far apart are they and how far do you sit from them? Hard to tell from your photos, but they look about 2 feet or so from the front wall?
Jason
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Jason
you are right, they are about 2 feet from the front wall. I am pretty limited about placement. The room may be 20 by 20, but it is pretty crowded. They are about 7 feet apart and need to be further into the room. That has to be in very small increments, so my wife does'nt notice. Pathetic is'nt it and she'll notice anyway.
Have you ever noticed, that wives and partners always notice, it must be a female skill we lack.
David
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Yes David, they do always notice... And they are the great finder of lost things too... Fortunately mine seems to enjoy the benefits of this hobby. All I had to do, to get a 58" high pair of towers in the house was to stand next them smiling when she came home. So at least she could see they were a tad shorter than me!
As far distance from the front wall... You could use a set of gliders from Herbie's Audio Lab and scoot them out for critical listening every once in a while...
How far do you sit from them now? (I am considering these and have a 14x20 room)
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I sit about 8ft from the speakers and that seems fine. If you look at the Positive Feedback on line review of the Ulysses, the reviewer says that they were the first large speakers he had used that worked well in the small room he uses for his 2nd system. So i think too, that the speakers work well in small rooms.
Thats a good idea of yours to use Herbiies gliders. I have used some of his accesories before, they really are good value.
David
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Just got my pair of A/P Ulysses. :drool:
To sum it up, just really enjoying them, think there beautiful. On a mere but powerful 50 watt class a tube amp and a BENT passive set at 16 out of 61 steps , my 21x16 room starts to fill with a very engaging full body sound. Hours are goin by quick (7 to be exact). Gonna be hard to go to go to bed early.
Try to follow up with a pic of the setup but my camera is garbage so no closeup would be worth it. In process of major amp upgrade to ma-1s, thinking that will seriously raise the bar along with my electric bill this summer :duh:
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berto
perhaps yours are the first upgraded Ulysses. Just for interest, had you had or heard for a prolonged period, the Ulysses with normal crossover. I was'nt able to compare on my Da-Ra mas. I wonder if you were able to give an opinion on the difference.
I suspect Lou is the only one who has really been able to do an A/B comparison. Perhaps at RMAF, he may bring both to compare. Having said that, it would be too much to bring both all the way from Washington state.
David
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Hi David,
You are goin to have to take Lou's comments and word in regards to the differences.
I heard the non poly DA-RMs about a month ago in a totally different room with a different system. I recall loving them and they surely had same house sound as my Ulysses.
IMO I would have to have a non-poly pair of Ulysses in my room to swap for a true A/B, and then tell David (Author of DA-MA Stereo times review) that I have some hot models at my pad , so he can come over and put it into the proper words. :thumb:
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berto
perhaps yours are the first upgraded Ulysses. Just for interest, had you had or heard for a prolonged period, the Ulysses with normal crossover. I was'nt able to compare on my Da-Ra mas. I wonder if you were able to give an opinion on the difference.
I suspect Lou is the only one who has really been able to do an A/B comparison. Perhaps at RMAF, he may bring both to compare. Having said that, it would be too much to bring both all the way from Washington state.
David
I'll only have the AP @ RMAF but in the next month two customers who have had both DA-1's and DA-1.1's will have their DA-1.1's outfitted with the AP crossovers. since they are very familiar with the standard I'm sure what they write about these will be of interest to all.
one nearby customer stopped in a couple of weeks ago and heard the Ulysses with the AP, he agreed with my description and was amazed at the sound. unfortunately he doesn't tend to post in the forums.
btw, in a couple of months I'll do the swap in Dan Wrights pair of Ulysses and I'm sure he'll have comments to share...
thanks,
lou
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Just popped on to follow recent developments as I am getting ready to box up my DA-1.1's to send them out west. I'm looking forward to the A-P upgrade and am grateful to you Lou for continuing to press the envelope with your designs. Once I get them back and broken in I'll be happy to share my impressions--though with the caveat that I'll be in a new room and with several system changes that will undoubtedly also contribute to the changes I hear. Really excited to see what the upgrades will bring! :eyebrows:
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Last Monday I drove over to Bellingham/Ferndale and dropped my DA-1.1s off to have the crossovers replaced with the all poly corssovers and the binding posts replaced with the Cardas posts.
A little background --I bought my first pair of Daedalus speakers (DA-1) after hearing them at RMAF in 2005 & 06 (I bought the 2006 show speakers). After hearing the DA-1.1s at RMAF in 2007, I ordered a pair and sold the DA-1s to a friend. In the spring of 2009, I had Lou upgrade the internal wiring in the DA-1-1s. Each step up or upgrade has been more than worth the money and has brought increased pleasure from my system. More clarity & detail, greater bass extension & slam and better imaging. So when Lou told me about the AP crossover and what they would do for my DA-1.1s, all I needed to do was find time to drive across the state and have Lou change out the crossovers and posts.
After unloading the speakers at Lou's shop, Lou took me upstairs to listen to Mark D.'s 1.1s which Lou had just finished the crossover upgrade. They had less than 15 hours on them and I was blown away by the clarity, detail, imaging and bass extension & slam. The imaging was especially amazing since the room was filled with 3 pairs of speakers (Ulysses & DA-1.1s) sitting in the middle of the space between Mark's speakers we were listening to and where we were sitting. The sense of space or air around each instrument was not subtle. BTW, Mark's are quartersawn oak and they are absolutely gorgeous. :drool:
Since returning home I have about 90 hours on the new crossovers. The first couple of hours I could tell that the highs were a little harsh and bright. Then I went to bed with a CD playing all night with the volume very low, but not off. Wednesday morning after about 10 hours I could tell that the upper end was starting to smooth out. Definition was good and bass was tight with good extension. The next night I cranked it up and was impressed with the bass slam and the speakers ability to reproduce the lowest note on the Hammond B3 (the Introduction track to The Decemberists The Hazards of Love). The speakers had about 20 hours and I was hearing good separation between the instruments and the imaging is better than I expected after 20 hours. Female vocals are very clean. I played Lindsay Buckingham’s Out of the Cradle and was impressed with the clarity of the guitar and the sense of space around each note. The bass slam was impressive when the percussion kicked in. Also, the bass lines on She & Him’s Vol II was detailed and precise; and Zooey's vocals very clean and natural--When I closed my eyes it was easy to imagine her and M. Ward in my room playing & singing just for me. :D
Today after a round of golf I had a chance to do some serious listening, which for me means vinyl. I listened to a lot of familiar music--Neko Case Middle Cyclone, U2 The Joshua Tree, The Moody Blues Days of Future Passed and Chicago Transit Authority (Rhino remastered reissue on 180g vinyl). I hear very precise imaging, better than I remember before the upgrade. Bass is more extended, tight and controlled. More clarity and detail and the instruments have a greater sense of space surrounding them. This was particularly noticeable on CTA. It was very easy to pick out each horn, Peter Cetera's bass, the percussion and Terry Kath's guitar work. The instruments sound very natural, cymbals are crisp and the vocals are, as Lou describes, full-bodied. Great dynamics too and I can't remember hearing better bass.
Listening to music through the DA-1.1s has always been emotionally engaging and non-fatiguing, and still is--very much so. I believe the AP crossover upgrade has taken the sound of these speakers to a whole new level, a level I would expect to pay a lot more money for compared to what I have invested in the DA-1.1s. As I mentioned above, I have about 90 hours on the AP crossovers and Lou tells me it will get better as the Modwright capacitors fully break in (Dan says about 400 hours). All I can say is WOW! I highly recommend the AP crossover upgrade for anyone with DA-1.1s or Ulyesses. The improvement in clarity, detail, bass extension and slam, imaging, and the sense of space around each instrument is not subtle. :thumb: :thumb:
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This will update yesterday's post re my impressions of the AP crossover.
I had a friend over for dinner tonight and we listened to lot of music including Natalie Merchant-Leave Your Sleep, Monsters of Folk; She & Him Vol 2; The New Pornographers-Together; Mark Knopfler & Emmylou Harris-All the Roadrunning; M. Ward-Post War and U2 360 at the Rose Bowl DVD. My friend, who is very familiar with my system, commented that the instruments were more defined than she remembered and it was easy to hear each instrument. Imaging was supurb and with this variety of music I really noticed improved dynamics, faster transients and tight bass plus everything I posted yesterday.
The AP crossovers really do take thses speakers to a whole new level of performance.
Laura
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Just a quick word for now, but I wanted to follow up on Laura's comments regarding the AP crossover. I have now taken possession of my second pair of Ulysses speakers, although they are only about 30 hours old here.
I will write again about these incredible speakers, once I have more hours on them, but suffice it to say that my favorite speakers of all time are better and not by a little.
I received my new pair of Maple Ulysses with the AP option yesterday. If you are into natural woods, the look of this particular pair of speakers is stunning with Lou's unique and superlative craftsmanship.
After about 30 hours of breaking in, these loudspeakers, which were the best loudspeaker I had heard before the AP option, have, as Laura said, taken Lou's speakers to a whole new level of performance.
Out of the box, I didn't find them bright, but a little lean and dynamically constrained. They are no longer like that now and this is after only about 30 hours of play.
Compared to the "standard" Ulysses, the AP option allows greater sensitivity, which is now at about 98db, tighter and better defined bass which will have your room growling and your pants or skirts flapping if you listen to the right music loudly enough. They also have a clear and present midrange like I haven't heard since I owned a pair of of Beauhorn's many years ago driven by a Supratek 45/300B amp. Of course, they aren't colored like the horns, but they do have the same clarity, dynamic range and room filling air and presence.
By the way, I use and sell Herron Audio gear, including the VTSP-3A, VTPH-2 and Keith's M1's. TT is a Well tempered Amadeus GTA and Dynavector Te Kaitora Rua, courtesy of Mike Pranka. Digital source is a PS Audio Perfect Wave Transport and DAC. The M1's, with 150 watts a side, sound like 500 watts a side with these speakers. I wish I could be a dealer for Daedalus speakers, but Lou has chosen the correct route for his line, at least for now, and they offer incredible value for what he charges.
The imaging is also more precise, drawing comparisons with the best mini monitors I have ever heard, but with incredible size and scale. Everything I listened to this evening was precise, but with great depth and a wide lateral spread.
Tonality, which is one of the Daedalus calling cards, is still a little on the lean side, but decidedly not lean. Given the great change after just 30 hours and knowing Lou's track record as a speaker builder and guitar player, I am not worried about this. I understand from Lou that the speakers will continue to improve with a lot more hours on them, but if they didn't and stayed right where they are, I would be content with them.
One other thing I want to mention is the incredible beauty of Lou's cabinetry. This is my third pair of Daedalus speakers and I have indeed been taken off of the speaker merry go round, which presents a challenge for someone like myself who sells audio gear. I will try to post pictures soon, but they are so beautiful and each pair is handmade and unique. There are no two Daedalus speakers alike and to me, this and the beautiful, life like sound they produce, makes them a high end audio classic.
More to come later.
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You raise a point of interest to me, figcon. That is, the improved sensitivity with the new All poly crossover. I wonder if Lou has accurately measured that, for the various speakers yet. I know it is only of academic interest, your amp is powerful enough to drive the speakers as you wish, or it is'nt. I would still be interested in the figures though, Lou.
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I have about 300 hours on my new pair of indescribably beautiful Maple Ulysses with the AP crossovers. I marvel at both the sound quality and the look of these loudspeakers.
For those that don't know, I have owned Lou's speakers for several years now beginning with the original DA1's and then a pair of Ulysses in Cherry and now these.
I wrote after about 30 hours on these and now have closer to 300 hours. Surprisingly, there has been no major changes after the initial break in period, but subtle ones, especially with respect to the high frequencies. Instead of trying to describe the changes taking place as the speakers break in, I will just post a few comments about the sound, in general.
The speakers remind me of the transparency of a $100k+ speaker I hear at RMAF last year that have been advertised in major publications as the best speakers on earth. This was on a cut entitled "Morrison" written by David Crosby as a tribute to Jim Morrison, off of the CPR's self titled debut album, which is a great piece of music. There seems to be nothing going on that you can't hear on this cut as it is a pretty well recorded piece of pop. I remember being very impressed with the transparency of the system being used that day, but somehow was left a bit cold by the musical experience. Listening to the same cut in my home system, granted using totally different electronics, the same transparency was there, but with greater dynamics of the micro and macro variety and a more natural tone that makes you feel like you are listening listening to a live musical event. In terms of tonality and dynamics, the Ulysses are so much more realistic to me ears than these very good and very expensive speakers. In terms of soundstaging and imaging Ulysses was at least as good and in saying this, I am perhaps being generous to these best on earth speakers. As a friend said last week, after a few hours listening to Ulysses, the listening experience with these speakers, was goose bump time. He got goose bumps listening to this very cut.
Listening to the Living Stereo reissue of Borodin's Symphony #2 on my Well Tempered Amadeus GTA/Dynavector Te Kaitora Rua/Herron VTH-2 analog system, the transparency, dynamics and especially the imaging on this LP, is music to die for. Absolutely hair raising.
I can't say enough about how good these speakers sound, let alone look. It is a shame that none of the major publications have picked up on these speakers. The combination of looks, which I know is subjective, but in this case unique, the sound quality and the high sensitivity of these speakers is unparalleled in my experience. They can be driven with SET's and can take just about whatever you can throw at them, power wise. They sound great at low levels and even better at high levels.
My speaker search is over.
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Has the slight leanness you initially observed dissipated?
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Yes. It was at about a week of steady use that things filled out beautifully. In fact, a friend who is interested in a pair of Ulysses brought over his Tube Research Lab Samson monoblock's last week and if anything, they produced a very warm and full sound, especially compared to my Herron's, which are what I would describe as a bit more neutral sounding. Both sound great with the speakers.
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I too am strongly considering the Ulysses as my next speaker (in addition to the Aspara HL1). I heard Mark D.'s upgraded 1.1s yesterday and was very impressed by his system.
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LP1. I'm happy to carry this conversation on via AudioCircle, but if you wish to correspond/talk more about the Ulysses, please email me and we can also discuss this in private.
I am not familiar with the Aspara speakers, so I cannot draw any comparison to these speakers, although the one thing I can say with certainty is that they sure do look different than Lou's speakers.
What I can tell you that the midrange of the AP Option Ulysses have the same type of clarity and projection that horns are famous for. I've owned the Beauhorn Virtuoso speaker and I understand the attraction for horn speakers and it is almost always in the midrange. However, Ulysses is a dynamic design, so the other benefits of either design are sure to be different. I think the two full range, midrange drivers of Ulysses are very responsible for this, along with the AP Crossover.
Ulysses images a little different than Mark's DA1.1's and project sound a bit differently, but the same attiributes apply to either model.
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I have heard the Aspara speakers and they are excellent. They work well with low power amplification and I heard excellent results with Tron electronics. I seriously considered purchase of these speakers.
I own the Ulysses and at the risk of repeating previous comments, I'm also done looking for speakers. The Ulysses do everything well and I have yet to find a significant weakness. Every upstream change is readily apparent. Indeed, as I have made upstream improvements, I find greater appreciation of the Ulysses capabilities. They impart less of a sonic 'signature' than any other speaker with which I am familiar and just get out of the way of the music.
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Jazdoc..Have you had your speakers upgraded with the AP crossover yet? If not and if you are able, it is a very worthwhile thing to do.
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Figcon,
I haven't had a chance to upgrade...yet :eyebrows:
I'm tapped out by recent analog and preamplifier upgrades. Hope to get up to Lou's later in the year...Merry Xmas to me!
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Jazdoc...If you think you can easily hear differences in your front end now, wait until Xmas....You will be blown away....I'm Frank...Nice to meet you.
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Frank--Nice to meet you! Can't wait to hear Lou's upgrade!
BTW, are you going to RMAF?
Mark
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Mark,
The all poly upgrade is not subtle and really does take Lou's speakers to a whole new level. I love
Frank's description and is comparison to "the best speakers on earth." Transparency, detail and a sense of air around the insturments. Vocals are full bodied and the highs are clear, clean and crisp. You have a wonderful Christmas present comingto you :thumb:
I have my hotel room booked for RMAF. I hope I'll see you and Frank there. Lou is adding vinyl this year :drool:
Takie care,
Laura
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I envy you guys(and gals), going to RMAF. Getting there from Europe was a once in a lifetime trip for me, which was partly to hear Lou's speakers. It really is a great show, with a good friendly atmosphere. It seemed efficient, but not officious.
If you have'nt done already, take some time looking around Colorado and if you have only time for one trip, make it the Rocky Mountain National park. It is only 90 minutes from Denver and just a wonderful experience, the scenery, wildlife.
If you are a member of Audiogon, then there is usually a meet and greet at the Mexican restaurant over tyhe road, at some point.
Have a Margherita for me, if you are going
David
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David. Sorry you won't be joining us, but I will look forward to seeing, speaking and perhaps having a cocktail with Laura and Mark @ RMAF.
Yes, the Rocky Mountain Park is a beautiful place. Trail Ridge Road, the road that cuts through the park, is breathtaking.
I believe that Lou will have analog, tubes, ss and hopefully the new Bass Modules for our speakers. I've got mine of order.
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Mark,
We have similar tastes. I think the Asparas are really engaging speakers, but I'm not sure how well I'd get along with horn speakers over the long term. Also, I recently owned a Tron Syren Reference and Seven Reference that I had to sell due to a house renovation. It's wonderful gear. I am now building a system again. What did you find to be the difference between the Asparas and the Ulysses?
I'd like to go to Rocky Mountain, but I'd rather spend the airfare/hotel/food money on new speakers!
Evan
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I believe that Lou will have analog, tubes, ss and hopefully the new Bass Modules for our speakers. I've got mine of order.
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I would be really interested in feedback on the Base modules, figcom. I believe the current ones are huge and can house a small family. I would only be interested in the smaller units Lou is working on. Assuming they are a bit less huge.
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thanks everyone for all the kind words!!
I've noticed some mention about my preference for SS amps and high current so I'll take a moment to talk about that.
the early DA-1 really did need a bit of current to come alive, but all the models since 2007 are not as much dependent on current as that they can take advantage of it, and the new AP models drive almost like horns. very, very easy load... also when talking about 'high' current, at this point anything over 30 amps is good.
I've always had a personal preference for SS amps because I do like to crank it sometimes and I listen for realistic dynamics (drums) which require a huge amount of headroom, also SS usually has the advantage for bass extension.
part of my work on the new bi-amp systems is to get the best of both worlds and do it seamlessly. hence at this years RMAF we will run the Atma-sphere for the mains (above 55hz) and the Modwright KWA150's for the low bass. btw I plan to also at times just do the Ulysses w/o the subs using either the tube or SS amps.
anyhow I feel that at this time all my speakers work well with a very wide variety of amplifiers, I don't really see any limitation in that regard.
thanks,
lou
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I wanted to take a few moments to share some thoughts about my DA-1.1’s now that they have had the AP crossover upgrade. First, a few caveats in order to put my comments in proper context. We recently moved and my system now resides in a somewhat smaller listening room. My old room was 14 X 22 X 9 and opened into the lower level of the house in several places. I had the system set up on the short wall with my entertainment center between the speakers, which were 8 feet apart and 2’ from the front wall. My listening chair was 11 feet from the speakers. The new room is 13 X 17 X 8 and I’ve got the speakers set up on the long wall about 15” from the front wall 8 feet apart and with about 9 feet from the listening chair. I’ve ditched the big entertainment center and have an open rack for my gear between the speakers. So, different room and different configuration to be sure. I’ve also changed my electronics from an Audio Research LS26 and SD135 to a Modwright LS36.5 and KWA150. And instead of complete Empirical Design cabling I’m now using a mix of Empirical Design, Stringcable and Dynamic Design cables (as well as stock power cords) while I figure out what is going to work best in my new system. Finally, since my DA-1.1’s were from the first production run Lou kindly swapped out the internal wiring and installed the Cardas binding posts to bring everything up to current spec. So obviously what follows is not going to be an honest comparison of the DA-1.1’s before and after the AP crossover upgrade as it is quite difficult to attribute the sonic differences I am hearing (and they are HUGE) to the AP crossovers alone. Having said all that let me say at the outset that with only about 80-100 hours on the system I am absolutely stunned by what I am hearing. In fact, I would have to say that the sound I am getting in my listening room is some of the best, if not THE best I’ve ever heard…PERIOD, regardless of cost, and I’ve been at this for 25 years.
What I find difficult is to translate what I am hearing into words that will adequately do justice to what Lou has done with these speaker systems. In a nutshell, the new system is simply more organic and musically involving and the listening experience has been brought infinitely closer to the most breathtaking live performance. The new system retains the tonal accuracy and realistic warmth of real instruments but adds a layer of dynamic contrast and detail that simply makes things sound more real and alive. Acoustic instruments possess proper vibrancy and decay. The interplay between musicians is brought to light in a way that allows the listener to have a greater appreciation and understanding of the players’ virtuosity and the musical intelligence of the composition and arrangements. Though it sounds cliché, what I am finding is a renewed appreciation for my entire music collection and when I’m listening to my system I am fully transported by the experience.
What follow is some observations of the typical audiophile criteria but I hope to have made it clear that each of these performance gains are really part of a larger something (an essential musicality) that is present in the new design in a way that simply makes the AP crossover version of Lou’s speakers something extraordinarily special.
First, the new design pushes the boundaries in terms of frequency extremes—particularly in the bass. In fact, what becomes most apparent with the new crossover is just how powerful, effortless and precise the bass has become. I’ve been having some fun with favorite recordings that feature well recorded drums and let me tell you I am absolutely floored with the power and accuracy of the bass. It is like I added a sub without having to contend with the potential downsides (i.e. loss of seamless coherence in the bass). The improvement in the bass response is worth the price of admission alone for those who are considering the AP crossover option. I mean it—I’m no bass freak but you have simply got to hear these speakers reproduce the lowest octaves with the new crossovers. The ability to pressurize the room (without bloat) is simply awesome!
There is also a completely effortless quality to the presentation. Dynamics, which were always a strong suit with Lou’s designs, are vastly improved. The music simply leaps from the speakers. This has the effect of adding greatly to the realism of the entire system. The other day I was listening to “Just a Little Lovin’” from Shelby’s Lynne’s new CD and the rim shots on the snare were simply “there”. I’d heard her live a few months ago performing the same song and there is simply very little difference in the way the recorded performance is rendered on my home audio system. With the new crossovers the system has a “jump factor” that can startle you and then make you smile from ear to ear.
The other thing I’ve noticed is that the music is completely liberated from the speakers themselves. Voices and instruments are suspended in three dimensional space in a way that was not true before. This is simply mesmerizing. I love the way each instrument has it’s own place within the stage and is properly proportioned and balanced with the rest of the mix. There is also much more body, texture and detail—an ability to hear into the mix in a way I couldn’t before, all of which makes for a much more musically compelling experience.
I’m sure there is a lot more I can say—I’ll certainly have to report back after the system has been thoroughly broken in and I’ve got proper cabling throughout. I also have yet to set up my vinyl rig so things could get really interesting! Nonetheless, I have to say I am simply devastated by the improved sound I am getting. I’m sure a lot of this has to do with the synergy between the Modwright gear and Lou’s speakers but the ARC stuff I had was no slouch and, if anything, the room I was in was better than the one I’m in now. So, while it would be foolish to speculate just how much credit to give to the AP crossovers (and new wiring and binding posts) I’ll go out on a limb and say that the revisions to my speakers deserve the lion’s share of the credit. These are simply not the speakers I sent to Lou last month. They look the same for sure and Lou has managed to retain all the strengths that his designs are known for (tonal authenticity, lack of listening fatigue, coherence and dynamics) but has pushed things to a whole other level in terms of resolution, dynamic power, bass response and soundstaging.
Truly remarkable. Lou, I am truly grateful for your efforts!
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Man, I really would like to have the all poly upgrade done on my DA-RMa's, but shipping them back (and doing without them while they are away) is something I don't like to think about!
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Man, I really would like to have the all poly upgrade done on my DA-RMa's, but shipping them back (and doing without them while they are away) is something I don't like to think about!
I have several customers with the same dilemma. all I can say is I will walk you through the repacking and if we schedule it, I will turn them around in about two days. (it's a lot of work to change out all the crossovers and add the extra board, plus I always like to get a fresh coat of finish etc...) btw, we usually need about a month notice to schedule an upgrade. also as an FYI for people who have bought them used I have to charge about $400 labor but I waive that for my customers plus upgrade to the Cardas posts N/C.
thanks,
lou
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Audioclyde:
I hear you but to put things in perspective....my DA-1.1's were the best speakers I've ever owned BEFORE the AP crossover upgrade. It was the fact that we were moving and I'd be without my system for a while that caused me to pack em' up and send em' to Lou. Otherwise I'd probably still be with the "stock" version. But knowing what I know now....
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Hey Mark...I enjoyed reading your description of the sound of your DA1.1's, after AP. You and I have traveled similar pathways to where we are now with respect to our music systems and like you, I thought my original Ulysses were the centerpiece of the best sound I have ever had in my own home and one of the best sounds I have ever heard from any stereo system. Now with the AP, they have gotten so much better in most every way I could describe to the point where I wonder why I am doing the bass modules. Oh yeah, now I remember.
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Mark,
thanks for your posts. Since we have the same speakers now and the same amp, I found myself nodding in agreement and smiling as I read your post. It really is very hard to to find the right words to describe how the AP crossovers take an already great speaker to a whole new level of performance.
Enjoy!
Laura
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Yesterday, I placed my order for a pair of walnut Ulysses with the all-poly crossover. I am very excited. It's going to be a loooong two months before they're delivered.
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Hey Evan.....Congratulations. It will be a long two months to be sure, but well worth the waiting.
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Yes indeed, well worth the wait. I often wonder if I should have gone for the Ulysses, but in truth, I could'nt fit them in. I'll rephrase that, my wife would'nt let me try to fit them in, that's life.
At RMAF, having listened carefully to the Ulysses and Da-RMas, I am not sure there is a lot in it. I did'nt detect any base loss in the monitors. I would think the bigger speakers would fill a large room better, but there really was'nt a lot in it, for me anyway.
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Evan:
Great news...congrats! If you ever want a taste to remind you while you wait just come on by.
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Mark,
I'll take you up on that as well as your offer to help me setup the speakers when they arrive!!!!
Evan
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Lou installed the all-poly crossovers on my DA1.1's in August. They now have over 400 hours on them after the conversion. I was very happy with speakers before, but now they are performing on a much higher level. All important attributes have improved significantly. I have trouble putting into words just how great they are so I won't even try. This note is just to add one more voice to the others who have raved about the speakers.
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Gang,
I finally had Lou install the poly crossover upgrade this week. The change is not subtle and all for the good. The speakers are faster, go deeper and retain the Daedalus 'house sound'. Lou even buffed up the finish for me.
Highly recommended!
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Gang,
I finally had Lou install the poly crossover upgrade this week. The change is not subtle and all for the good. The speakers are faster, go deeper and retain the Daedalus 'house sound'. Lou even buffed up the finish for me.
Highly recommended!
Welcome to the All-Poly club Mark :thumb: I think we all agree that the upgrade is more than worth the cost.
Laura