AudioCircle
Industry Circles => Audio by Van Alstine => Topic started by: Otis on 15 Jan 2010, 08:46 am
-
.
-
So the sound is okay? :)
#3. I'm okay balancing on the high spot, now I want that area between the high spot and the click. LOL
I think one can get around that with a remote, but I don't have one so I'm not sure.
-
The volume pot used with the remote has no detents.
What "amber" LED? All AVA preamps have a red LED power switch.
-
The lighted switch is not an LED. It is a 120 volt neon lamp. If there were to be a LED "on" indicator, it would have to have a new voltage source from the power supply (like 2 volts), a hole and keeper for installation, all just to be a different "color". Extra cost, zero benefit. This is what the modern manufacturing world cost "no value added" mod.
In regards to the detents, I just had a minor episode with the balance control on my older EC Insight+ preamp, that it was leaning to the left. With the detent, knob positioning is much easier as on the newer EC. I have no issues with the volume control.
The Champagne faceplate would be no problem, except that it would double the inventory and increase cost (because of the inventory).
For the iPod connection:
(http://www.audioadvisor.com/images/CAID10.jpg)
Wayner
-
The Champagne faceplate would be no problem, except that it would double the inventory and increase cost (because of the inventory).
Wayner
Thats the whole point - it should increase the cost - the new vision dac could benefit from it as well - how much more would it add to the cost? I would absolutely pay for the champagne faceplate - and my wife would love it!
-
3. A detent-less volume control. It would be nice never to have to try balancing the knob on a high spot again.
People like different things, I suppose. I love the detent-ful volume and balance controls. They make it so easy to get repeatable settings--living in an apartment, I have different volume needs at different times of the day; I just count the clicks to get the volume I know I want in a simple, reliable, precise way. At the urging of a kind, local audio dealer, I auditioned some tube electronics in my home recently, and one of the irritations was the lack of click-stops in the volume control.
Not only did the tube gear not sound as good as my OmegaStar preamp/Insight power amp combination, but I realized the lack of features would drive me crazy (no balance control on one; no means to select left, right, or mixed mono, if there was a mono switch at all; very limited input options, no tone controls, no external processor loop, etc.). I'm very happy to have a full-featured preamplifier with great sound!
-
As someone who made his own aluminum subs as seen here: http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=68426.0 I completeley understand why you want it. I also understand what Frank and AVA is doing. Obviously giving you great sound for a modest price and keeping what counts (in the box) to the highest standards. Is it that much to design / make then produce faceplates? No, not all. BUT for a company the size of AVA's, it will raise the price enough that it gets passed on. Some will like it, some won't. That's another issue....can't have faceplates sitting around.
Not speaking for Frank...just understand both sides
-
Instead of "Special" for an input, how about "PHONO!!!!" in BIG letters with 4 exclamation points after it.
Paul
-
The lighted switch is not an LED. It is a 120 volt neon lamp. If there were to be a LED "on" indicator, it would have to have a new voltage source from the power supply (like 2 volts), a hole and keeper for installation, all just to be a different "color". Extra cost, zero benefit. This is what the modern manufacturing world cost "no value added" mod.
I'd prefer no indicator light, especially on tube equipment which lights up on its own.
-
Anyway, here's what I'd like to see, in order of importance,
1. A front panel i-pod/sound card input. This is the big one. Sources are mostly digital and portable now, so a front panel input jack would be a great convenience.
I picked up the Wadia 170i iPod interface last year, and it's pretty nice. As far as I know, it is the only device licensed to pick the data stream off the iPod dock connector so that you can use an external DAC such as our new Vision DAC. All the other dock devices I have seen and used take the analog signal from the dock, and while it will works, the sound is not as good. The Wadia also grabs the analog signal from the dock, so if you don't yet have a DAC you can still use an iPod as a music server.
Note: I saw this week that Wadia is introducing the 171i that has a better remote and heavier power supply.
Larry
-
Instead of "Special" for an input, how about "PHONO!!!!" in BIG letters with 4 exclamation points after it.
You must have a phono. :lol:
I don't and other than the guys I kinda "know" here in the AVA circle, I don't know anyone that does vinyl. I'd guess, even within the AVA family, and as good as it is, they sell more preamps w/o the phono option. Or I'm wrong. :lol: 8)
-
You must have a phono. :lol:
I don't and other than the guys I kinda "know" here in the AVA circle, I don't know anyone that does vinyl. I'd guess, even within the AVA family, and as good as it is, they sell more preamps w/o the phono option. Or I'm wrong. :lol: 8)
Both of my AVA preamps have phono, and I only own one turntable.
-
The detent feature on the Noble controls can be removed at build time if the customer wishes. Just ask.
Ron
-
Both of my AVA preamps have phono, and I only own one turntable.
Henry, you'd be one of the AVA circle I kind of "know" folks, and Wayne, and DQ10 guy :) (orthobiz).......
I have a turntable BTW and still have the first cartridge I ever bought, a Grace. 8)
-
I like the red/amber light. :D In fact if it was going to be changed I'd prefer an amber light. The amber is nice because it's a soothing color and it matches the glow from my tube amps.
I can't tolerate the bright blue pilot lights that seem to be favored by low end Chinese manufacturers.
-Roy
-
Instead of "Special" for an input, how about "PHONO!!!!" in BIG letters with 4 exclamation points after it.
Paul
Of course, the volume knob has to go up to 11 - for that extra bit of power!
-
Of course, the volume knob has to go up to 11 - for that extra bit of power!
That's the one we need! :lol: 8)
-
How about a home theater bypass switch?
-Roy
-
How about a home theater bypass switch?
That's what the EPL switch is for in the EC chassis preamps.
-
I picked up the Wadia 170i iPod interface last year, and it's pretty nice. As far as I know, it is the only device licensed to pick the data stream off the iPod dock connector so that you can use an external DAC such as our new Vision DAC. All the other dock devices I have seen and used take the analog signal from the dock, and while it will works, the sound is not as good. The Wadia also grabs the analog signal from the dock, so if you don't yet have a DAC you can still use an iPod as a music server.
That is exactly what im doing with the wadia and the vision dac - the ipod sounds wonderful and unmessy - with the bryston - it sounds immaculate.
regards
-
I picked up the Wadia 170i iPod interface last year, and it's pretty nice. As far as I know, it is the only device licensed to pick the data stream off the iPod dock connector so that you can use an external DAC such as our new Vision DAC. All the other dock devices I have seen and used take the analog signal from the dock, and while it will works, the sound is not as good.
Onkyo has a model that is reported to offer bit-perfect output as well:
http://www.engadget.com/2009/07/31/onkyo-nd-s1-ipod-dock-feaures-digital-audio-composite-video-an/
-
At $235 the Onkyo could be a worthy opponent to the Wadia.
-
How about a home theater bypass switch?
-Roy
Agreed. Level matching is a deal-breaker for me.
-
The reason to actually use the AVA preamp in circuit for HT use is that the line output circuits of most HT units can't drive their way through a wet Kleenex. The AVA line circuit actually acts a a line buffer for the anemic HT circuits and with any luck at all will provide much better sound to the front main speakers than if the line circuit is completely bypassed.
Our preamp without remote control have stepped precision volume controls so all you have to do is match levels once and then remember the number of clicks and know how to count.
Regards,
Frank
-
remember the number of clicks and know how to count.
Regards,
Frank
:rotflmao:
-
I like the stepped Nobel pots. I've been using preamps with them for about 25 years now.
I have no problem with the neon lamp power indicators. They're simple, reliable, and effective.
I would prefer a silver or champagne front panel, but Frank has offered these in the past and hardly anybody bought them. (I chose a silver faceplate on a PAT-5 chassis from AVA at one point and really liked the way it looked. Frank was even able to dig up silver pushbuttons for me so everything matched.)
I do think that, if I could do it over again, I would choose an EC chassis preamp instead of the SL I have now. The EC provides useful functionality over the SL.
-
The reason to actually use the AVA preamp in circuit for HT use is that the line output circuits of most HT units can't drive their way through a wet Kleenex. The AVA line circuit actually acts a a line buffer for the anemic HT circuits and with any luck at all will provide much better sound to the front main speakers than if the line circuit is completely bypassed.
Our preamp without remote control have stepped precision volume controls so all you have to do is match levels once and then remember the number of clicks and know how to count.
Regards,
Frank
I understand how it works, but thanks for the refresher. While it may be easy to adjust the volume to the correct level, it is an added step. For those of us who need to share a system with a significant other, each added complication produces an exponential amount of annoyance. That is why I will continue to prefer a home theater bypass that requires only a single step to switch.
-
I understand how it works, but thanks for the refresher. While it may be easy to adjust the volume to the correct level, it is an added step. For those of us who need to share a system with a significant other, each added complication produces an exponential amount of annoyance. That is why I will continue to prefer a home theater bypass that requires only a single step to switch.
Agreed.
Perhaps a trim level for the HT bypass inputs to help with the line buffering.
-
What I'd like to see is an LFE passthrough that is switched with the second pair of outputs. I'm not exactly sure how the EPL switch works, but it'd be nice if that when the EPL switch was activated, the LFE channel would be routed to the second pair of outputs, instead of the normal signal. This would allow me to use my subwoofer with both 2 channel music and in my HT configuration.
-
Both of my AVA preamps have phono, and I only own one turntable.
Phono section in my current T7 and will be in which ever one of the new pres I intent on upgrading to. A phono section is a must have for many of us who own AVA pre's.
Ric
-
It would seem that an alternative color or two for the faceplate could be handled on a special order basis, versus having to be stocked. I'm sure a supplier could handle a custom order job at an equitable price. It might just delay delivery of a custom order a little longer. Kind of like how Salk handles custom speaker orders.
From the AVA website: "Our equipment is custom built to your order in Minnesota by our skilled technicians who still remember what "high fidelity" means."
The Champagne faceplate would be no problem, except that it would double the inventory and increase cost (because of the inventory).
Wayner
-
The reason to actually use the AVA preamp in circuit for HT use is that the line output circuits of most HT units can't drive their way through a wet Kleenex. The AVA line circuit actually acts a a line buffer for the anemic HT circuits and with any luck at all will provide much better sound to the front main speakers than if the line circuit is completely bypassed.
Our preamp without remote control have stepped precision volume controls so all you have to do is match levels once and then remember the number of clicks and know how to count.
Regards,
Frank
So, if I was to order an Insight EC preamp with remote control, then there would be no stepped volume control?
-
Instead of "Special" for an input, how about "PHONO!!!!" in BIG letters with 4 exclamation points after it.
Paul
But some of us may think that "Special" is THE perfect description of how we feel about our vinyl and phono? :D :)
-
So, if I was to order an Insight EC preamp with remote control, then there would be no stepped volume control?
Correct. It uses a different pot that is motorized, and it is not stepped.
-
It would seem that an alternative color or two for the faceplate could be handled on a special order basis, versus having to be stocked. I'm sure a supplier could handle a custom order job at an equitable price. It might just delay delivery of a custom order a little longer. Kind of like how Salk handles custom speaker orders.
From the AVA website: "Our equipment is custom built to your order in Minnesota by our skilled technicians who still remember what "high fidelity" means."
How many industrial vendors do you know that would be more than happy to do 1 special faceplate? Yeh, for about $500 and that probably isn't enough.
Wayner 8)
-
Correct. It uses a different pot that is motorized, and it is not stepped.
But it can be operated manually without any harm to the control?
-
I would like to see a brushed aluminum or brushed Stainless Steel face plate as well as new knobs and a nicer lighted on/off switch with maybe a blue light or smaller red light. I think that it would give the look more appeal. I would be willing to pay a little more for these cosmetic features.
-
I would like to see a brushed aluminum or brushed Stainless Steel face plate as well as new knobs and a nicer lighted on/off switch with maybe a blue light or smaller red light. I think that it would give the look more appeal. I would be willing to pay a little more for these cosmetic features.
I like your ideas. I asked Frank about having knobs like the Mark Levinson gear from the 1970's, and he gave me some info about a website that offers those. I wonder what Frank would end up charging for offering all these changes? Might be cost prohibitive, especially if he invests in it and gets no repsonse or orders.
-
It would also be nice if there was a 20 or 24 bit 96K upgrade to the existing line of DAC's for a reasonable price. But I'm sure its limited to the circuitry design.
-
But it can be operated manually without any harm to the control?
Yes.
There's a picture of what they're using here:
http://www.avahifi.com/root/equipment/preamplifier/remote.htm
You can figure they wouldn't build these with a shaft to attach a knob if turning the knob damaged it. :)
-
I like your ideas. I asked Frank about having knobs like the Mark Levinson gear from the 1970's, and he gave me some info about a website that offers those. I wonder what Frank would end up charging for offering all these changes? Might be cost prohibitive, especially if he invests in it and gets no repsonse or orders.
I bet people would much prefer a brushed aluminum or SS face plates and knobs with a more attractive power button or light, especially a blue light since many of todays equipment has gone the blue route. It would be a nice tweak for great equipment. He might sell more. I talk to a lot of people on other forums and when they see I have VA equipment they complain of the 1970's generic look. A lot of people want the eye candy appeal as well as good sound. And they pay for it too!
-
I bet people would much prefer a brushed aluminum or SS face plates and knobs with a more attractive power button or light, especially a blue light since many of todays equipment has go the blue route. It would be a nice tweak for great equipment. He might sell more. I talk to a lot of people on other forums and when they see I have VA equipment they complain of the 1970's generic look. A lot of people want the eye candy appeal as well as good sound. And they pay for it too!
Well I don't think the knobs I was talking about would really make the unit have a generic 1970's look.
-
It would also be nice if there was a 20 or 24 bit 96K upgrade to the existing line of DAC's for a reasonable price. But I'm sure its limited to the circuitry design.
Read - ANNOUNCING THE NEW AVA VISION DAC ! ! ! - first entry.
Or maybe you already saw it, given your "reasonable price" as that is open to interpretation.
-
I bet people would much prefer a brushed aluminum or SS face plates and knobs with a more attractive power button or light, especially a blue light since many of todays equipment has gone the blue route. It would be a nice tweak for great equipment. He might sell more. I talk to a lot of people on other forums and when they see I have VA equipment they complain of the 1970's generic look. A lot of people want the eye candy appeal as well as good sound. And they pay for it too!
Frank tried silver faceplates. I have an older AVA preamp with one, and I prefer it over black. However, hardly anyone bought them. Everyone wanted black. End of story.
As for fancy faceplates or switches, or silly blue lights - I don't want to pay for them. I just want durable, reliable equipment that sounds good and doesn't require that I take out a second mortgage to pay for it.
In addition, the craftsmanship of the faceplates and cases that Frank uses is excellent. Yes, the look is simple and conservative, but there's a beauty to that kind of thing too.
Finally, I don't give a good god damn about the way the things look while I'm using them. I listen to music, not gaze lovingly at the sexy curves of my amplifier that 9 out of 10 slick magazines recommend.
-
Well I don't think the knobs I was talking about would really make the unit have a generic 1970's look.
I like the knobs Frank uses. They're solid hunks of aluminum, machined precisely, and perfectly anodized. They feel good, they look good, and they work.
-
I have to second Turkey's comment. As the former owner of some equipment that had decidedly shoddy controls (a Phase Linear 4000 preamp, and a Sony V-FET amp), switches that work, and keep working are what I want.
So far, the AVA controls are up to the job, and my preamp is going on its second decade. I've been fairly successful at fighting the urge to upgrade constantly, so the matching black is a feature, not a demerit.
-
I bet people would much prefer a brushed aluminum or SS face plates and knobs with a more attractive power button or light, especially a blue light since many of todays equipment has gone the blue route.
I like the black faceplate, but I do think a black, non-glowing, power button along with a small, not too bright, blue power indicator would make it look more modern (yes, I like the look of my Oppo BluRay player). However, I wouldn't want to get too fashionable, since I'm noticing a lot of posts about people keeping their AVA for 20+ years.
-
How about this one? It just dawned on us that we can do a bit of a have your cake and eat it approach with the AvaStar preamp by simply putting it into an EC chassis (complete with 8 sets of inputs, EPL loop, and even the "filer" and "low gain" functions) for $100 extra. The tone control knobs and pushbutton switch simply would not do anything.
Or how about a 300+ W/Channel Insight power amp (an Insight 650)? I think we could do this with simply a much bigger (and much more expensive) power transformer and upping the ratings of a lot of capacitors and a bit of re-biasing.
Any interest out there for this?
Regards,
Frank
-
Could you put that larger transformer in the FET-Valve Ultimate?
-
As a Non AVA owner looking in, buyers of this gear should understand that they are music machines and not eye candy. They are not ugly. Basic functional design.
Really what benifit sonically is there ? Pretty yes but that wears off if it does not sound right.
Franks rep is quality of design and parts not art work. Mr V. stay put. If you want to "Pimp" the piece check out DIY supply for all those knobs and thingies.
Kinda reminds me of a Toyoya with a vinyl top and spinners on the wheels oh and a hood scoop and a Fox tail on the rear view mirror.
charles
-
Could you put that larger transformer in the FET-Valve Ultimate?
If you mean the FET-Valve Ultra 550, I believe it is already there. The Double 550s put out 300+ wpc already. 8)
-
I was not sure if this is a new transformer or a current one. BTW thanks for your remarks on the Double Ultra. I'm saving up!
Now how about using Two transformers in the Ultra?
-
The power transformer for a much higher power Insight series solid state amplifier would be a completely new one.
It is not interchangeable with that in the Ultra series hybrid amplifiers which have three sets of custom secondary windings: one for the high current high voltage output devices, one for the low current high voltage B+ tube power supplies, and another winding for the high current low voltage tube heater supplies.
The Ultra supply voltages are already running as reasonable close to device limits as is prudent, simply stepping up the high current high voltage supply would not be very useful.
In contrast, there is some voltage headroom to spare in the Insight series solid state amplifiers and appropriate higher voltage necessary parts are available (but expensive of course) so the power could be increased as mentioned in my previous response herein.
Regards,
Frank Van Alstine
P.S. Perhaps we can even make 400w/ch in a really strong Insight amplifier.
-
:eyebrows: How's this for some sexy knobs?
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=26914)
Got them from a buddy. I like the way they pick up the AVA logo line across the bottom.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=26915)
Not exactly audio porn but a nice touch without a complete make over, don't you think?. :D
-
I would be interested in increasing the power in my Insight Double 440H power amp once I have the speaker performance that can benefit (i.e. new speakers) to justify the upgrade.
It was apparent to me that the existing Insight power supply had been optimized, when the Double increased the rms power from 220 (standard 440H) to 225 (Double 440H) wpc, and that improvements gained were more headroom and clarity in the transients. I concluded that the power supply is the limiting factor in the Insight Double 440H.
This is compared with the increased power realized in the Double Ultra 550 (over 300 wpc) versus the standard Ultra 550 (250 wpc).
Or how about a 300+ W/Channel Insight power amp (an Insight 650)? I think we could do this with simply a much bigger (and much more expensive) power transformer and upping the ratings of a lot of capacitors and a bit of re-biasing.
Any interest out there for this?
Regards,
Frank
-
Tone Depth, the power transformers have different applications in the solid state Insight and hybrid Ultra series amplifiers.
In the Ultras, just increasing the raw B+ voltage would not make much difference in output power as there are other circuit parameters that would require substantial changes too. This is not an easy project as the systems interact.
In the solid state units it is much easier, higher transformer voltage provides more power, up to the limitations of the active and passive devices in the circuits, which must be scaled up as the power rating goes up (which scales then up in cost too).
Regards,
Frank Van Alstine
-
Frank, thank you for your enlightening comments, as always!
-
Frank -
I have an OmegaStar 260EX that I was considering for an Insight upgrade. Are you looking for a candidate for the transformer upgrade (i.e., Insight 650)? Let me know how much more that would be. Thanks.
Steve