[Kw6]

Are the 8" & 10" Nenufar speakers the real deal or they still have the same comprises of a single driver?

[FullRangeMan]

The real deal is a personal choice my favorite are the Lii F15.
If you post a link I may verify these C ubes. However if you want hi spl you would use a pro áudio FR as Beyma.

[Bemopti123]

Are the 8" & 10" Nenufar speakers the real deal or they still have the same comprises of a single driver?

I was also very curious about these drivers and I browsed through some forums, DIYAudio and the like.  Some people in Europe seem to have played with them... and the results of what I read where very similar to the drawbacks that we very much read about from Lowthers at a more prohibitive price. 

But then I was thinking, hey for a pair of used decent monitors, you can purchase a pair of these drivers but after reading the results.  I knew it was not to be.  The one word that caught me was sibilance.  Then they mixed the words extremely revealing.  It is interesting to read from people who have had experience with them rather than reviewers. 

https://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full-range/350355-cube-audio-f8-neo-driver-cabinet-designs-4.html

[SET Man]

Hey!

   That measurement on that link is pretty scary! Anyway, look like I've been out of a loop and haven't been following much news in audiophile world. I didn't know there is a company called Cube Audio selling raw full range drivers! So I checked it out and look at their least expensive drivers

https://www.cubeaudio.eu/cube-audio-fc8

   There is a lift in the high even on they own site. I guess if you don't toed them in directly at you then it doesn't look too bad. But for that price?

    Anyway, there's one full range driver company that I've heard at the show more than once with their own speaker and in other companies speakers, the Voxativ. Although I can't find any raw driver measurement on their site but from what I've heard they are very good. And if I had money I would love to get a pair of their driver to try.

Buddy

[FullRangeMan]

Instead Voxativ I suggest AER from Filip Keller both are Lowther standard 9" size and expensives, AER sells raw drivers.

I have learned that in FR size matters, I cant see a better option than the Lii F15 if one have a room tô accommodate a 300L box.

This Nenuphar is a assembled loudspeaker and its driver the 10" F10NEO have no less than 3 whizzer cones along the regular cone, looks as the sibilance source was found.

[opnly bafld]

https://refinedaudio.com/collections/cube-audio

[abd1]

I am sitting listening to my Nenuphar Mini's as I type this. They are absolutely the real deal. I've had, and still have for some of these, speakers from Salk, Omega, Clearwave, GoldenEar, Totem, PSB, Sonus Faber, KEF, and others, plus heard many many more at various dealers. These are the best I've heard overall. However, system matching is important. They seem to prefer low damped, no negative feedback type amps. A lot of people who have Cubes seem to prefer First Watt amps and various tube amps. I'm using mine with a Canary M90 300B pushpull amp. It's the deepest sound stage I've ever had in my space, with amazing imaging and the great tone and texture you get from high efficiency, larger driver speakers. My concern prior to getting these was how would the vocals and higher frequencies be? My favorite speakers up until these are my Salk Song3's with RAAL ribbon tweeter and Clearwave Duet6 with Accuton ceramic tweeter. Both of those tweeters have so much air and detail without harshness, especially the RAAL. And, some other single driver speakers I heard disappointed in this area. Vocals had a good "weight" to them but always seemed too rolled off in regards to extension and air. Not so with the Nenuphars. Voices are the most realistic I've heard. They capture both the weight and tone, but also have amazing extension and detail. I'm going to be trying some different amps this year just to experiment, but these are definitely for real. I did read someone purchased the Nenuphar driver and had Jim Salk make the cabinets. The cabinets seem fairly simple and there is no crossover so if you're good at DYI you could do it yourself or contact Salk. I had thought of doing that as I love Salk's cabinetry, but I was able to get a pair from Cube in walnut and it is a great finish.

[Bemopti123]

I am sitting listening to my Nenuphar Mini's as I type this. They are absolutely the real deal. I've had, and still have for some of these, speakers from Salk, Omega, Clearwave, GoldenEar, Totem, PSB, Sonus Faber, KEF, and others, plus heard many many more at various dealers. These are the best I've heard overall. However, system matching is important. They seem to prefer low damped, no negative feedback type amps. A lot of people who have Cubes seem to prefer First Watt amps and various tube amps. I'm using mine with a Canary M90 300B pushpull amp. It's the deepest sound stage I've ever had in my space, with amazing imaging and the great tone and texture you get from high efficiency, larger driver speakers. My concern prior to getting these was how would the vocals and higher frequencies be? My favorite speakers up until these are my Salk Song3's with RAAL ribbon tweeter and Clearwave Duet6 with Accuton ceramic tweeter. Both of those tweeters have so much air and detail without harshness, especially the RAAL. And, some other single driver speakers I heard disappointed in this area. Vocals had a good "weight" to them but always seemed too rolled off in regards to extension and air. Not so with the Nenuphars. Voices are the most realistic I've heard. They capture both the weight and tone, but also have amazing extension and detail. I'm going to be trying some different amps this year just to experiment, but these are definitely for real. I did read someone purchased the Nenuphar driver and had Jim Salk make the cabinets. The cabinets seem fairly simple and there is no crossover so if you're good at DYI you could do it yourself or contact Salk. I had thought of doing that as I love Salk's cabinetry, but I was able to get a pair from Cube in walnut and it is a great finish.

Would love to see your Youtube account updated with some listening shots of the Cube speakers.  Not that the fidelity will tells us much but Cube, while reviewed, it not well represented or common like other smaller manufacturers. 

 

[abd1]

Would love to see your Youtube account updated with some listening shots of the Cube speakers.  Not that the fidelity will tells us much but Cube, while reviewed, it not well represented or common like other smaller manufacturers. 

 

I just recorded something today. My channel is very LoFi with the iPhone recordings. Even if I put a lot of effort it’s still flawed through YouTube. But don’t we all watch sound demo videos anyway. I’ll check if they came out ok and post them this week if they did.

FWIW my wife was sitting with this afternoon and she said “I didn’t love these at first but I hope you never sell them.” I think the only time I get approval is when I sell things or I’m taking something to goodwill, so this is a compliment.

[Bemopti123]

I just recorded something today. My channel is very LoFi with the iPhone recordings. Even if I put a lot of effort it’s still flawed through YouTube. But don’t we all watch sound demo videos anyway. I’ll check if they came out ok and post them this week if they did.

FWIW my wife was sitting with this afternoon and she said “I didn’t love these at first but I hope you never sell them.” I think the only time I get approval is when I sell things or I’m taking something to goodwill, so this is a compliment.

I guess most significant other's are the same....I still remember sneaking in a pair of 60" speakers and covering them up with towels.  6 months after my wife asked, are these new?  I said, no, they are old.  LOL.

[planet10]

I have learned that in FR size matters...

Indeed. IME the optimim size of a FR is 4-5”. Above that the cone becomes harder to control and there is often a ripple train of resonaces up high. Something i tend to have issues with.

All FRs have compromises. All multi-ways have compromises. One has to choose those that best suiy their needs.

The Cube is not the be all and end all (i haven’t heard one, but have done a few boxes for them).

And it pissed me off a little bit to see the prices triple when they brought distribution into the picture.

If you want to look at an “exotic” European driver have a look at Sonido. They are still “affordable”, the 6x9 in particular looks interesting. But you’ll have to order directly from Poland.

dave

[FullRangeMan]

Hi Dave,
I thought cone control vary according the motor power BL.  My personal taste dont liked the 5 inches FR due unpleasant performance under 300Hz,  I have favored 10/12"" .

[planet10]

That is not the control i was talking about.

The holy grail of FRs is that at low frequencies they are pistonic and as one transitions above that the cone becomes chaotic, the ideal that that is a controlled decoupling of more and more of the outer part of the cone and the effecive cone diameter is decreasing so as to have decent HF dispersion.

No one has reached that goal yet. Big Cones. Hard to keep cones from misbehaving, leading to that ripple train of resonances. Smaller cones suffer too, bu tit is easier to control if done well.

Things get more complicated if one adds a whizzer. We now have a 2-way with a mechanical XO. And the Nenufar with 2 whizzers are 3-ways.

As to bass, a FR with decent excursion can  move more air than larger cones with less excursion. And then there is the box.

dave

[planet10]

...Lii F15...

No xMax specification.

A serious shortcoming in the data. Any idea what it is?

dave

[FullRangeMan]

No xMax specification.

A serious shortcoming in the data. Any idea what it is?

dave

I suppose its the usual 1mm from the oldfashioned recipe from the old school.

What are surprising are the MMS really too light, but as Decware forum are all praises  about the F15 I see it as less important.

In one closeup photo I see the Nenuphar driver have 3 whizzers not 2.

[planet10]

If so.

Lii Audio F15, about 146 cm³

Mark Audio Alpair 10.3, about 133 cm³

Not much difference in swept volume.

dave

[FullRangeMan]

The Xlim dont count ?

[planet10]

It could.

dave

[artur9]

Do Manger or BMR count as full range drivers?

[planet10]

Usually used as midTweeters both tend to be weak at the bottom.

dave