That means the binary files output from the EAC and dbpoweramp for the same track are different!?
Apart from listen to the files output to an audio device, is there other ways that we can use to ensure that the rip was indeed bit perfect?
Accurate Rip is an online database of rips from other users to which dbpoweramp compares the CRC result of the ripped file. If it matches everyone elses, likely it is correct. Just one bit wrong would mismatch the CRC. What does CRC stand for anyway?? :scratch:
Steve,
Do you mean that the CRC of two files are the same, the actually bit contents of the two files may be different?
Warning: just because the bits are matching with compare tools like EAC does not mean the two files will sound the same. Try it yourself.
Steve N.
Warning: just because the bits are matching with compare tools like EAC does not mean the two files will sound the same. Try it yourself.
Steve N.
Agreed.I have tried many things in ripping for past few months, i totaly believe in this claim.
Few more things from my experience :
1. Try using Millenium CD Mat while ripping.Best 50 EUR i spent so far.
2. Slower ripping speed is better.I did hear (small) difference in my system using Easy CD-DA extractor - for me,it's worth the extra time.
NOTE:Does dbpoweramp has the option of limiting the ripping speed (to 1x,2x or 4x, for example)?Please someone answer!
3. Why not use dedicated CD ROM drive instead of CD/DVD combo?
The more things a device does,the more compromises the designers have to make.
Similar to CD player vs. CD/DVD player.This is simply logical.
4.External drive should be better,due to noise and vibration in PC. :roll:
I have not tested it sonically though.I wonder,if external drive is used, does the quality of USB cable matter then?
Will Locus Design cable give better results than cheap one?Can anybody please comment on this?
Steve,
Thanks for the answer.But what speed can you set in the options?Can you go as low as 1x or 2x?
For example, Easy CD-DA extractor has 1x, but when i select it, it still goes up to 4x.
Have you tried to rip using better USB cable vs. a cheap one? A/B test?
I would definitely try if i had the better cable.
Here is my test and subjective results. I did a rip drive test and hear a difference. I ripped a track (FIM K2HD Sound--one of the highest quality CDs available, last track Pachelbel Canon in D, all percussion) on my PC using onboard Optiarc DVD/CDRW AD-7203A using DBPoweramp ripper in secure mode. I then ripped same track using outboard Yamaha CRW-F1UX CDRW powered from battery using dbPoweramp secure mode. Both were put in the same file--no upsampling. I am playing them back to back through my SB3 via WiFi. They of course sound very close but I hear a difference. In short, the Yamaha rip sounds like a 16/44 file up sampled to 24/44. It doesn't give you more highs or lows, but allows you to hear into the recording better. I sense I can easily hear the 16 bit noise floor. For those who have never listened to 24 bit vs. 16 bit or don't have a music system with a low enough noise level to hear it, I will try to elaborate. The difference is immediate as soon as the song starts--the recording venue sounds quieter with the Yamaha. The music sounds just a hair more full bodied--midrange is more tangible and natural, while the Optiarc ripped file sounds slightly more hi-fi. There is a little better depth and delineation of space within the depth. This is good and bad as it opens a new can of worms. I offer no speculative explaination for my findings--just know it has changed the way I will rip CDs from now on. I will certainly use the battery powered outboard Yamaha CDRW for my rips, I will not however go back and rerip my entire CD catalog (well, maybe a few favorites). Anyone care to do their version of my test and report the findings?
Chris H.
...
thanks Chris. I also have this same outboard drive, so I'll give it a try and report back on any difference with the TEAC.
I have an experiement going with Tony Lauck on Audio Asylum. I am transferring files ripped with EAC and with dbpoweramp so he can do compares. I already see a difference. The dbpoweramp file is larger.
Steve N.
...
thanks Chris. I also have this same outboard drive, so I'll give it a try and report back on any difference with the TEAC.
I have an experiement going with Tony Lauck on Audio Asylum. I am transferring files ripped with EAC and with dbpoweramp so he can do compares. I already see a difference. The dbpoweramp file is larger.
Steve N.
That's strange. For a sound sample with the same duration, the number of bits should be the same in the WAV format because there is no compression at all.
Does it suggest that EAC is dropping some of the bits contained in the original track?
...
thanks Chris. I also have this same outboard drive, so I'll give it a try and report back on any difference with the TEAC.
I have an experiement going with Tony Lauck on Audio Asylum. I am transferring files ripped with EAC and with dbpoweramp so he can do compares. I already see a difference. The dbpoweramp file is larger.
Steve N.
That's strange. For a sound sample with the same duration, the number of bits should be the same in the WAV format because there is no compression at all.
Does it suggest that EAC is dropping some of the bits contained in the original track?
This difference in size was tagging and no tagging.
There are differences in headers and offsets. Offset difference can cause audio quality problems.
Steve N.
...
thanks Chris. I also have this same outboard drive, so I'll give it a try and report back on any difference with the TEAC.
I have an experiement going with Tony Lauck on Audio Asylum. I am transferring files ripped with EAC and with dbpoweramp so he can do compares. I already see a difference. The dbpoweramp file is larger.
Steve N.
That's strange. For a sound sample with the same duration, the number of bits should be the same in the WAV format because there is no compression at all.
Does it suggest that EAC is dropping some of the bits contained in the original track?
This difference in size was tagging and no tagging.
There are differences in headers and offsets. Offset difference can cause audio quality problems.
Steve N.
I thought offset just dropped/added extra audio samples at the start or at end or both. Or it can create different offsets between the two channels? May be I need to read audio CD demystified?
Do these offsets somehow cause lag between the two channels?
Do these offsets get carried over into wav files too? Or they get used while ripping and then thrown away?
Sanjay
Very intriguing. May be some kind of recursive filter as part of the delta sigma stage inside the DAC gets affected by the different boundary samples of the song and cause a audible difference. Steve have you tried this A-B only on the OVDRV or other dacs too.
Steve, if you doubt the offsets, then trying different media players or even different USB drivers might make sense. Who knows that one of these elements might change the data packet based on offset.
How about trying MAC.
Steve,
VERY interested on you Amarra take vs Foobar 0.83. One is free, one not (at all), as you know. :wink:
Obviously two different platforms, but I know you know the Foobar sound very very well, so the Amarra eval ought to be quite relevant, regardless.
Steve,
VERY interested on you Amarra take vs Foobar 0.83. One is free, one not (at all), as you know. :wink:
Obviously two different platforms, but I know you know the Foobar sound very very well, so the Amarra eval ought to be quite relevant, regardless.
If it is even as good as Foobar 0.8.3, then I plan to use it at RMAF with Mac controlled by Touch.
Steve N.
Steve,
VERY interested on you Amarra take vs Foobar 0.83. One is free, one not (at all), as you know. :wink:
Obviously two different platforms, but I know you know the Foobar sound very very well, so the Amarra eval ought to be quite relevant, regardless.
If it is even as good as Foobar 0.8.3, then I plan to use it at RMAF with Mac controlled by Touch.
Steve N.
Wow, really? Foobar is freeware, Amarra is $1500. And it only needs to tie?
Steve,
VERY interested on you Amarra take vs Foobar 0.83. One is free, one not (at all), as you know. :wink:
Obviously two different platforms, but I know you know the Foobar sound very very well, so the Amarra eval ought to be quite relevant, regardless.
If it is even as good as Foobar 0.8.3, then I plan to use it at RMAF with Mac controlled by Touch.
Steve N.
Wow, really? Foobar is freeware, Amarra is $1500. And it only needs to tie?
I'm afraid so. It's iTunes and Mac that people want, and that is the best user interface.
Also I'm doing some special things to my Mac Mini, including SS memory and fast interface for a Tune Bank where the music will reside.
Steve N.
SS = solid state, yes.
Amarra is an iTunes plug-in, made by Sonic Studios, a hi-end pro sound company. The idea is to use iTunes as the catalog and user interface, and their Amarra engine as the sound vehicle. Amarra is based on SoundBlade, a pro industry standard. Amarra would bring supposedly better sound, an iTunes interface (iTouch/iPod control, etc.) and automatic sample rate switching, something iTunes can't do today. The downside? Price is $1500 for the software! :o
http://www.sonicstudio.com/amarra/index.html
SS = solid state, yes.
Amarra is an iTunes plug-in, made by Sonic Studios, a hi-end pro sound company. The idea is to use iTunes as the catalog and user interface, and their Amarra engine as the sound vehicle. Amarra is based on SoundBlade, a pro industry standard. Amarra would bring supposedly better sound, an iTunes interface (iTouch/iPod control, etc.) and automatic sample rate switching, something iTunes can't do today. The downside? Price is $1500 for the software! :o
http://www.sonicstudio.com/amarra/index.html
Is it just SW or a Amarra HW also required.
Does it work only with firewire or with USB too.
Does it play apple lossless
Too many questions, too few answers.
SS = solid state, yes.
Amarra is an iTunes plug-in, made by Sonic Studios, a hi-end pro sound company. The idea is to use iTunes as the catalog and user interface, and their Amarra engine as the sound vehicle. Amarra is based on SoundBlade, a pro industry standard. Amarra would bring supposedly better sound, an iTunes interface (iTouch/iPod control, etc.) and automatic sample rate switching, something iTunes can't do today. The downside? Price is $1500 for the software! :o
http://www.sonicstudio.com/amarra/index.html
Is it just SW or a Amarra HW also required.
Does it work only with firewire or with USB too.
Does it play apple lossless
Too many questions, too few answers.
SS = solid state, yes.
Amarra is an iTunes plug-in, made by Sonic Studios, a hi-end pro sound company. The idea is to use iTunes as the catalog and user interface, and their Amarra engine as the sound vehicle. Amarra is based on SoundBlade, a pro industry standard. Amarra would bring supposedly better sound, an iTunes interface (iTouch/iPod control, etc.) and automatic sample rate switching, something iTunes can't do today. The downside? Price is $1500 for the software! :o
http://www.sonicstudio.com/amarra/index.html
Is it just SW or a Amarra HW also required.
Does it work only with firewire or with USB too.
Does it play apple lossless
Too many questions, too few answers.
The $1500 is just software. They have pro dacs that include it, at $8k,etc. Only currently plays WAV and AIFF, so you need some storage space. And only currently approved/certified for a few 3rd party DACs, both fw and USB.
For once, Robin, I've gotta agree with you. :D I've posted on the Amarra forums on CA and elsewhere that this industry (audiophile-level pc audio) is in it's early infancy, with few standards and fundamentals established to-date, and to spend that on what is normally freeware-to-$99 is a paradigm shift that most will not accept without some hard hard evidence. That evidence is currently being sought.
Warning: just because the bits are matching with compare tools like EAC does not mean the two files will sound the same. Try it yourself.
Steve N.
Ted_b, thanks. I actually read the whole CA thread on amarra, pretty long one. I gathered the following....
a) It plays on both firewire and USB. The DAC need to be certified.
b) The benchmark media DAC is certified.
c) The EA usb products use the same USB FW as the benchmark media, but the impression I got was it did not work for some fellows who tried the demo amarra with EA.
d) Demo amarra is available on request. I put on my request for it.
e) Many people found it better sounding than iTunes, keeping the volume control and eq settings off.
This thing never ceases to be intriguing.
f) Some claimed on CA that even the professional Audio editors play better than iTunes.
Steve, I just swapped the 80GB hard drive in my Mac Mini for a 128GB SSD unit. This made a worthwhile audible difference. You know what this implies, hey? Upgrading the Mini power supply will show an improvement. This is my next little task.
I sure can't 'splain it, but I don't think the green pen trick changes the bits, but it does change the sound.
Same for different CD-R media - I'll bet the bits are the same, but they sound different to everyone I've demoed it to.
One could probably line up a bunch of CD transports that provide the same bits, but I'd imagine they won't sound the same (haven't tried, so can't say if this is true).
Same for digital cables, but again I haven't tried so no comment on SQ change.
For me it's even easier to see how the decompression of a FLAC could change the sound, but I have not tried this so I can't say that it does.
-Mike
Chris, FWIW, the best linear off the shelf supplies I have found are the Acopian brand. Their Gold Box A Series come in at 0.25mV RMS ripple with load and line regulation at 0.005%. Acopian publishes the schematic for these supplies (sans values) here:
http://www.acopian.com/pdf/AcopianGoldBoxSeriesA.pdf
Very likely better than Acopian would be a Paul Hynes supply. He publishes extremely low noise specs for his units.
Ted_b, thanks. I actually read the whole CA thread on amarra, pretty long one. I gathered the following....
a) It plays on both firewire and USB. The DAC need to be certified.
b) The benchmark media DAC is certified.
c) The EA usb products use the same USB FW as the benchmark media, but the impression I got was it did not work for some fellows who tried the demo amarra with EA.
d) Demo amarra is available on request. I put on my request for it.
e) Many people found it better sounding than iTunes, keeping the volume control and eq settings off.
This thing never ceases to be intriguing.
f) Some claimed on CA that even the professional Audio editors play better than iTunes.
Ted, I was one who compared Amarra to other players. My impression is Amarra easily bettered iTunes. I also had compared a few professional players and found all to better iTunes.
Tom
I did a quick A/B with iTunes loaded into a ram disk and compared with with Amarra. I think iTunes may have sounded better than what I remember from using it off my HD, which as of yesterday became a SSD. But Amarra sounded better.
The improvement you heard may relate to what Steve says about SS access time etc?
Ted_b, thanks. I actually read the whole CA thread on amarra, pretty long one. I gathered the following....
a) It plays on both firewire and USB. The DAC need to be certified.
b) The benchmark media DAC is certified.
c) The EA usb products use the same USB FW as the benchmark media, but the impression I got was it did not work for some fellows who tried the demo amarra with EA.
d) Demo amarra is available on request. I put on my request for it.
e) Many people found it better sounding than iTunes, keeping the volume control and eq settings off.
This thing never ceases to be intriguing.
f) Some claimed on CA that even the professional Audio editors play better than iTunes.
Ted, I was one who compared Amarra to other players. My impression is Amarra easily bettered iTunes. I also had compared a few professional players and found all to better iTunes.
Tom
Ted_b, thanks. I actually read the whole CA thread on amarra, pretty long one. I gathered the following....
a) It plays on both firewire and USB. The DAC need to be certified.
b) The benchmark media DAC is certified.
c) The EA usb products use the same USB FW as the benchmark media, but the impression I got was it did not work for some fellows who tried the demo amarra with EA.
d) Demo amarra is available on request. I put on my request for it.
e) Many people found it better sounding than iTunes, keeping the volume control and eq settings off.
This thing never ceases to be intriguing.
f) Some claimed on CA that even the professional Audio editors play better than iTunes.
Ted, I was one who compared Amarra to other players. My impression is Amarra easily bettered iTunes. I also had compared a few professional players and found all to better iTunes.
Tom
Tom,
Could you spend a few min explaining what Amarra sounds like; i.e what sonically does it do "easily better" than iTunes? With so many folks doing a/b comparisons few if any have actually described what they heard. Soundstage, imaging, frequency response, bass characteristics, depth, warmth, yadayada. If you wanna post this on the "Amarra" thread here at AC instead of this one, I'll find it. Thx
Ted
Well, I can tell you that the offsets are looking like the smoking gun.
Ted_b, thanks. I actually read the whole CA thread on amarra, pretty long one. I gathered the following....
a) It plays on both firewire and USB. The DAC need to be certified.
b) The benchmark media DAC is certified.
c) The EA usb products use the same USB FW as the benchmark media, but the impression I got was it did not work for some fellows who tried the demo amarra with EA.
d) Demo amarra is available on request. I put on my request for it.
e) Many people found it better sounding than iTunes, keeping the volume control and eq settings off.
This thing never ceases to be intriguing.
f) Some claimed on CA that even the professional Audio editors play better than iTunes.
Ted, I was one who compared Amarra to other players. My impression is Amarra easily bettered iTunes. I also had compared a few professional players and found all to better iTunes.
Tom
Tom,
Could you spend a few min explaining what Amarra sounds like; i.e what sonically does it do "easily better" than iTunes? With so many folks doing a/b comparisons few if any have actually described what they heard. Soundstage, imaging, frequency response, bass characteristics, depth, warmth, yadayada. If you wanna post this on the "Amarra" thread here at AC instead of this one, I'll find it. Thx
Ted
On my 24/96 native downloaded tracks from bluecoastrecords.com, I found that the female vocalist was "smeared" with iTunes, and less smeared using Amarra. With the PC and Foobar0.8.3 unmapped, the vocalist is pinpoint. Absolutely no smearing. More 3-D like. It's like you can get out of the chair and see "around" her. iTunes is more like a flat cardboard image of the vocalist. These are microdynamics. The depth of image is the same in both cases. It's just that at the backwall where she is located, its 2-dimensional with iTunes.
Also, the acoustic guitar is not live. It has all of the harmonics, but they are not coherent, they are jumbled. If you turn your back and listen there is no way that this is a live acoustic guitar. With the PC and Foobar 0.8.3, its in the room with you. Amarra does a pretty good job on the guitar in the foreground, but not as good on the vocalist in the background.
Steve N.
Well, I can tell you that the offsets are looking like the smoking gun.
So there is no difference between CD-ROM drives? TEAC is not necessarily better sound quality than any other drive? It is just that the TEAC offset was calibrated and the other drive was not?
Thanks
Rich
Ted_b, thanks. I actually read the whole CA thread on amarra, pretty long one. I gathered the following....
a) It plays on both firewire and USB. The DAC need to be certified.
b) The benchmark media DAC is certified.
c) The EA usb products use the same USB FW as the benchmark media, but the impression I got was it did not work for some fellows who tried the demo amarra with EA.
d) Demo amarra is available on request. I put on my request for it.
e) Many people found it better sounding than iTunes, keeping the volume control and eq settings off.
This thing never ceases to be intriguing.
f) Some claimed on CA that even the professional Audio editors play better than iTunes.
Ted, I was one who compared Amarra to other players. My impression is Amarra easily bettered iTunes. I also had compared a few professional players and found all to better iTunes.
Tom
Tom,
Could you spend a few min explaining what Amarra sounds like; i.e what sonically does it do "easily better" than iTunes? With so many folks doing a/b comparisons few if any have actually described what they heard. Soundstage, imaging, frequency response, bass characteristics, depth, warmth, yadayada. If you wanna post this on the "Amarra" thread here at AC instead of this one, I'll find it. Thx
Ted
On my 24/96 native downloaded tracks from bluecoastrecords.com, I found that the female vocalist was "smeared" with iTunes, and less smeared using Amarra. With the PC and Foobar0.8.3 unmapped, the vocalist is pinpoint. Absolutely no smearing. More 3-D like. It's like you can get out of the chair and see "around" her. iTunes is more like a flat cardboard image of the vocalist. These are microdynamics. The depth of image is the same in both cases. It's just that at the backwall where she is located, its 2-dimensional with iTunes.
Also, the acoustic guitar is not live. It has all of the harmonics, but they are not coherent, they are jumbled. If you turn your back and listen there is no way that this is a live acoustic guitar. With the PC and Foobar 0.8.3, its in the room with you. Amarra does a pretty good job on the guitar in the foreground, but not as good on the vocalist in the background.
Steve N.
Given these problems and what I recall you stating in the past, wouldn't the best sound quality be achieved by not using USB at all and instead bypass the audio stack of the computer (Mac or PC) by using a squeezebox or similar ethernet/wifi device that is slaved to the DAC. I could easily be overlooking the obvious...
This combination was recommended by Vincent I believe as well as used in this device:
http://www.ripnas.com/
You can get dbpoweramp here for $36 (includes all the goodies):
http://www.dbpoweramp.com/dmc-power-register.htm
and the Teac drive here:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=310134389867#ShippingPayment
Comparisons of the Teac to other drives:
http://forum.dbpoweramp.com/showthread.php?t=17274
After proper set-up to do accurate-rip and setting the C2 pointers, i ripped some Led Zep tracks that I had previously ripped using a good CDROM drive and EAC.
The result: The EAC .wav rips are not even close. I thought they were good, but I was wrong. The dbpoweramp .wav rips are highly focused, with improved depth and imaging.
Well worth the less than $100 investment. Best tweak I have done in years. The Teac rips at 10-12X too, so its fast and accurate.
I have customers doing this on a PC and then moving the .wav files to Mac. Its that much better than any other ripper I have tried.]
Kudos to Vincent and customer Bill for this tip.
Steve N.
DSP Effects & Actions: each time audio is taken from a CD it is run through DSP effects, by default these effects are used:
ReplayGain - calculates a volume loudness which supported players (such as Logitech Duet) can use to level the volume
Just ordered the dbpoweramp-Teac "secure system". In the manual it states:QuoteDSP Effects & Actions: each time audio is taken from a CD it is run through DSP effects, by default these effects are used:
ReplayGain - calculates a volume loudness which supported players (such as Logitech Duet) can use to level the volume
Isn't that something we would want to turn off if we want "bit-perfect" output from the Duet to a PaceCar?
Thanks
Steve and anybody using the external Teac...
Anyone using an external power adapter with the drive? The eBay auction shows a slot for a wall wart but the text states it will operate on USB only. I had a similar straight DVDROM drive from Targus 4 or 5 years ago that required a special USB cable with 2 plugs to the host, one of which was wired just for additional power consumption over a single plug's rated output. I gather newer drives (including burners) are much more power efficient.
- Rand
.
Steve and anybody using the external Teac...
Anyone using an external power adapter with the drive? The eBay auction shows a slot for a wall wart but the text states it will operate on USB only. I had a similar straight DVDROM drive from Targus 4 or 5 years ago that required a special USB cable with 2 plugs to the host, one of which was wired just for additional power consumption over a single plug's rated output. I gather newer drives (including burners) are much more power efficient.
- Rand
.
Rand - I use Mac computers, but for ripping I do it from my MacBook Air booted into Windows with dbpoweramp and the TEAC 224 drive. Knowing battery is always better, I just rip from the notebook with the power cord unplugged. The single USB cord is sufficient to power the drive from the MBAir. I do a few other tweaks that may or may not be helpful - vibrapod feet under the drive to minimize vibration, a Shakti Stone sitting on top (balance, reduce EMI, etc.), and have a Millenium CD mat I'm going to be using shortly once I've swapped out the Teac 224SL (slot load) with the 224E (top load equivalent). I was finding small scratches starting to show up on some discs that I was ripping multiple times for testing/listening purposes (and I'm 99% sure they are scratches from the plastic of the 224SL drive given their direction). FWIW I tried arguably the best CD treatment (Jena Labs Esoteric 3D-X), which didn't make any different in the sound quality when doing comparisons (it's clearly meant for CDP's, get's wonderful praise). however, ripping software and encoding choices did make a difference though!
Steve and anybody using the external Teac...
Anyone using an external power adapter with the drive? The eBay auction shows a slot for a wall wart but the text states it will operate on USB only. I had a similar straight DVDROM drive from Targus 4 or 5 years ago that required a special USB cable with 2 plugs to the host, one of which was wired just for additional power consumption over a single plug's rated output. I gather newer drives (including burners) are much more power efficient.
- Rand
.
Rand - I use Mac computers, but for ripping I do it from my MacBook Air booted into Windows with dbpoweramp and the TEAC 224 drive. Knowing battery is always better, I just rip from the notebook with the power cord unplugged. The single USB cord is sufficient to power the drive from the MBAir. I do a few other tweaks that may or may not be helpful - vibrapod feet under the drive to minimize vibration, a Shakti Stone sitting on top (balance, reduce EMI, etc.), and have a Millenium CD mat I'm going to be using shortly once I've swapped out the Teac 224SL (slot load) with the 224E (top load equivalent). I was finding small scratches starting to show up on some discs that I was ripping multiple times for testing/listening purposes (and I'm 99% sure they are scratches from the plastic of the 224SL drive given their direction). FWIW I tried arguably the best CD treatment (Jena Labs Esoteric 3D-X), which didn't make any different in the sound quality when doing comparisons (it's clearly meant for CDP's, get's wonderful praise). however, ripping software and encoding choices did make a difference though!
Are you going to be using the Teac DW-224E-V drive? I've looked around and there are several variants of the 224E. Also, did you find a good source for it? Prices are all over the map I've found.
Gary
Steve and anybody using the external Teac...
Anyone using an external power adapter with the drive? The eBay auction shows a slot for a wall wart but the text states it will operate on USB only. I had a similar straight DVDROM drive from Targus 4 or 5 years ago that required a special USB cable with 2 plugs to the host, one of which was wired just for additional power consumption over a single plug's rated output. I gather newer drives (including burners) are much more power efficient.
- Rand
.
Rand - I use Mac computers, but for ripping I do it from my MacBook Air booted into Windows with dbpoweramp and the TEAC 224 drive. Knowing battery is always better, I just rip from the notebook with the power cord unplugged. The single USB cord is sufficient to power the drive from the MBAir. I do a few other tweaks that may or may not be helpful - vibrapod feet under the drive to minimize vibration, a Shakti Stone sitting on top (balance, reduce EMI, etc.), and have a Millenium CD mat I'm going to be using shortly once I've swapped out the Teac 224SL (slot load) with the 224E (top load equivalent). I was finding small scratches starting to show up on some discs that I was ripping multiple times for testing/listening purposes (and I'm 99% sure they are scratches from the plastic of the 224SL drive given their direction). FWIW I tried arguably the best CD treatment (Jena Labs Esoteric 3D-X), which didn't make any different in the sound quality when doing comparisons (it's clearly meant for CDP's, get's wonderful praise). however, ripping software and encoding choices did make a difference though!
Are you going to be using the Teac DW-224E-V drive? I've looked around and there are several variants of the 224E. Also, did you find a good source for it? Prices are all over the map I've found.
Gary
I ordered it the other day from the following website after doing a search. I too noticed that prices were all over the place and this was the cheapest. they sent it out next day and I should be getting it tomorrow. will put it in the USB enclosure the 224SL is in assuming it fits.
http://www.ayagroup.com/product.php?productid=16884&cat=0&page=1
Is there an external version of the Teac that would work via USB?
I couldn't find an easy reference/place to purchase one.
Is there an external version of the Teac that would work via USB?
I couldn't find an easy reference/place to purchase one.
In case anyone is looking for a external Teac drive, Overstock.com has refurb Teac DW224U for $54.
Chris H.
The drive in question is the Teac DW-224DL.
But I've read the model has just gone "end of life", so it will be very hard to find.
Instead of that model what's important is to find a drive that can work with C2 pointers. Then you can use dbpoweramp and accuraterip to get the best rips.
And yes, C2 pointers are somewhat mandatory. I've always made sure my rippers have them (my Atapi in my current Dell minitower does). I've added to Accuraterip more than once in the past few weeks. :) Offsets are nice to know, too.
BTW, how do we know if a device actually deals with C2 pointers? It doesn't seem to be something listed in the specs for most drives.
The Teac DW224SL drive (external case included) is still easily available from China through eBay.
Gotta link to that statement as I'm not easily finding it? Thanks.
Aren't those ebay links sort of suspicious? Several different links with different prices, and all look like they are actually from the same supplier.
Thank you for the link. I just purchased a TEAC drive. :thumb:
Tom
Let us know how the sale goes.
Yeah they are crappy--won't even read/recognize a TDK DVDR disc. Mines going back. Think I'll opt for something more substantial like the Plextor PX-880U.
Yes, the PX-880U. It's big and it's nice--makes those other little externals seem like toys. Because of its substantial build, dedicated power supply and location outside of the computer case, I expect it to perform better than the internal drive of a Mini. I also expect it will have a longer service life as well.
Chris H.
I certainly will. I received a response from the seller that it is the Chinese New Year so the drive will only ship on Feb 21st.
Cheers,
Tom
Yes, the PX-880U. It's big and it's nice--makes those other little externals seem like toys. Because of its substantial build, dedicated power supply and location outside of the computer case, I expect it to perform better than the internal drive of a Mini. I also expect it will have a longer service life as well.
Chris H.
Maybe the difference that the Teac drive makes is in accurately ripping the data in reference to the timing.
If the data is shifted, will it still pass checksum, etc.? ...still be "bit perfect" but out of sync here or there, perhaps a block here or there, in relation to the timing signal, or perhaps even the L/R signal?
This could explain why 2 files that appear to be identical and even same size, can sound different. I understand that there are many other factors that come into play when ripping CDs, but the timing could account for something.
I ordered one on eBay to see and listen for myself.
Bill:
The Plextor works great. Can't say if it is better or not than the Teac.
Chris H.
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If you follow the thread the recommendation is to get whatever "easy to obtain drive from the top part of the list, 5.25" drives are easier to obtain and cheaper."