The OFFICIAL Super-7 thread

ebag4 · « **Reply #580 on:** 8 Mar 2019, 11:52 pm »

Quote from: Rocket_Ronny on 8 Mar 2019, 05:18 pm

Why not get a rock speaker like the JBL M2s or 708s.

Rocket Ronny

Because they are not Open Baffle...

Best,
Ed

Rocket_Ronny · « **Reply #581 on:** 9 Mar 2019, 04:02 am »

Quote

Because they are not Open Baffle...

Ha, but that's the point. Open Baffle speakers don't make the best rock speakers. They are best musical gateway teleporters, but a box speaker with wave guides or horns make the best rock speakers.

Quote

Or just do what I do - have 2 systems!

Exactly, or two speaker pairs. Myself, I had my truck stereo be my rock system as it was very direct and impactful.

Rocket Ronny

ebag4 · « **Reply #582 on:** 9 Mar 2019, 05:34 am »

Quote from: Rocket_Ronny on 9 Mar 2019, 04:02 am

Ha, but that's the point. Open Baffle speakers don't make the best rock speakers. They are best musical gateway teleporters, but a box speaker with wave guides or horns make the best rock speakers.

You are certainly welcome to your opinion.

The OB servo subs along with the NX Otica MTMs are formidable speakers for any genre I have thrown at them with about 75% of that being classic rock. They have left me wanting for little. The V1 was/is an outstanding rock speaker as well, my son is still running those.

Once you get to this caliber of speaker you are not getting night and day differences, you are really getting into individual preferences.

Best,
Ed

pk · « **Reply #583 on:** 9 Mar 2019, 09:48 am »

Hi Jeffreybehr, Mikeeastman, Tyson, Rocket_Ronny, and Ebag4,

Many thanks to all of you for sharing your thoughts and experiences!

Best regards
Peter

SoCalWJS · « **Reply #584 on:** 9 Mar 2019, 08:18 pm »

OK, silly question time.

The Super 7 Cabinet is almost 16" deep (front to back). I am repositioning EVERYTHING again in attempt to solve a few things (cabling being the primary one) and am measuring the distance from the speaker to the front wall (the one behind the speakers as you look from the listening position towards the speakers).

I'm trying some of the various theories on speaker position in rooms and want to make sure I'm starting in the right place.

Since Bass is the main thing on this, I am guessing that the center position between the front and rear firing woofers is the measurement I want to use.

Is that right?

Rocket_Ronny · « **Reply #585 on:** 10 Mar 2019, 01:45 am »

Quote

You are certainly welcome to your opinion.

To clarify. Open baffle speakers such as the Super 7, Electrostats, Super Vs, etc. are the speakers for me. They present a telaport audio experience like no other IF set up right. IE: positioned well into the room - at least 6' but 12' my goal - unless back wall specially treated, with no gear in that space. They add a sense of air and space due to their design that I liken to tubes vrs. solid state.

What they can give up, verses what I would call a rock speaker, like a wave guide or horns with a large woofer, is a sense of direct IMPACT and FORCEFULL character. They better portray the EDGE, or EXCITEMENT, of rock n roll in my opinion. Now the Super Vs offer up tremendous impact and force, of which I am happy with, but not to the same extent of what a large rock speaker would.

Of course, that's just my thoughts, YMMV.

Rocket - Open Baffle - Ronny

jeffreybehr · « **Reply #586 on:** 10 Mar 2019, 07:31 pm »

The '7s have always had a tad more treble energy than I and my tonally-way-off ears liked, especially when the tweeters are pointed at my face.. When I had sited them recently, I had adjusted the rake to about 2-1/2 degrees (top closer to my face).. Last nite I decreased that to about 1-1/2 degrees* and the treble decreased a bit, to the about-just-right amount.. More tweaking will be needed, as the air-conditioning tech moved my couch and I think it ended up about an inch not centered. The speakers' distances are measured to be within about an eighth-inch from my nose, but sitting in the sweetspot, I feel a little uncentered in the room.. We'll see where the furnidents are.

In this pic the speakers' 1-1/2-degree rake is barely visible.

(Still waiting for those new powercords.)

* Measured, but it's still an approximation.

BTW, I use a Bosch DLR130 laser-based Distance Measurer for these measurements.. Its claimed accuracy is, IIRC, to 1/16", and my shaky measurements, when repeated, are within about an eigth-inch. (I measure with the base of the unit against my chin.). Even its successor, the DLR130K, is discontinued, but one can get them on eBay, which I did for my 2nd and 3rd.
https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=bosch+dlr130&ul_noapp=true

AKLegal · « **Reply #587 on:** 10 Mar 2019, 08:42 pm »

I owned the Super Vs for about 2 1/2 years and I thought they were one of the best Rock speakers I have ever heard.

Rocket_Ronny · « **Reply #588 on:** 11 Mar 2019, 04:04 pm »

Quote

I owned the Super Vs for about 2 1/2 years and I thought they were one of the best Rock speakers I have ever heard.

I can see that. No doubt they are great. If a person had them, or Super 7s, etc. closer to the wall than I tend to, you would have less of the air and space that I talked about and would be more immediate sounding, if lacking soundstaging comparatively speaking.

Regarding using my truck for more immediate sounding audio. Here is a hint of what was going on. These are my back fill speakers with sub. Can you say "Shake and Bake". That Pioneer sub was great.

Rocket Ronny

jeffreybehr · « **Reply #589 on:** 16 Mar 2019, 08:27 am »

Got the new powercord installed and the room mostly picked up.. Looks not half bad, huh!?!?

Powercords, 18 and 22 feet long, are a new cable custom designed by Jeff Glowacki of Sonic Craft.. It's composed of six 11g. conductors and can be wired as 8g. times 3 (mine) or c. 6g. times 2, that is, without an earth conductor*.. It's not shielded.. Each conductor is assembled with 6-9s-pure OFHC copper in several different strand sizes, litz insulated; then the bundle is insulated with generic 'teflon'.. It's all wrapped in an attractive black braided cover.. I sent them two pairs of AQ NRG 1000 ends to use; they're made with red copper and are heavily plated with silver.
https://www.audioquest.com/ac-power/ac-power-plugs/nrg-1000-wall-plug

* That's not nearly as weird as it may seem; some of our equipment has only TWO pins in its IEC power inlet.

Captainhemo · « **Reply #590 on:** 18 Mar 2019, 03:43 pm »

Quote from: jeffreybehr on 16 Mar 2019, 08:27 am

Got the new powercord installed and the room mostly picked up.. Looks not half bad, huh!?!?

Bet is sounds great

jay

Tyson · « **Reply #591 on:** 18 Mar 2019, 04:09 pm »

Jeff,
Look a lot neater/cleaner. Very nice! BTW, your toe in matches mine exactly. When the 7s are dialed in, I've never heard another speaker as capable of transporting you to a venue/space as them. Spooky realism. Have you done any upgrades to the crossover components on yours?

jeffreybehr · « **Reply #592 on:** 18 Mar 2019, 09:30 pm »

Quote from: Tyson on 18 Mar 2019, 04:09 pm

Jeff, Look a lot neater/cleaner. Very nice! BTW, your toe in matches mine exactly. When the 7s are dialed in, I've never heard another speaker as capable of transporting you to a venue/space as them. Spooky realism.

Have you done any upgrades to the crossover components on yours?

TYVM.

Yes; details are in prior posts, but it's a LONG thread, huh!?!?!?

Tweeter: 10uf series cap is 9.9uF of Sonic Craft's Platinum (Teflon-alloy-film/tin-foil) caps.. The shunt 0.39mH inductor is original.
MR: series inductor is a 1.0mH Bridgeport copper-foil.. Shunt 15uF cap is a 13uF SoniCap Gen1 (metallized-'propylene) plus 2 1uF Platinums.
Tuning network: resistor is a 12W. noninductive Mills MRA-12.. 54- (or 56)uF cap is now 54uF of SoniCap Gen1s plus a 0.33uF Platinum.. Inductor is original.

Wiring is original. I'm likely to replace the MR wiring with 18g. Mundorf Silver/Gold-in-Teflon and the tweeter wiring with 23g. Neotec UP-OCC silver-in-Teflon.

I have four thick, heavy granite tiles to (hot?)glue the components to.

They'll be isolated from the bassbox with Herbies large BabyBooties.

The hardwired speakercable is AQ's GO-4, a 15g., all-best-copper cable with DBS.

I think the crossover rebuild/speaker-rewire will be a summer project; I need to spend more time this spring SELLING things.
Quad '2905s, anyone? Butler TDB-5150 5-channel, hybrid powamps, anyone?...etc....

jeffreybehr · « **Reply #593 on:** 18 Mar 2019, 09:36 pm »

Quote from: Captainhemo on 18 Mar 2019, 03:43 pm

Bet it sounds great

jay

TYVM.. It's still a project, but I'm getting there...

Captainhemo · « **Reply #594 on:** 18 Mar 2019, 10:43 pm »

Hate to mention this but, I'm afraid it never ends

Tyson · « **Reply #595 on:** 18 Mar 2019, 10:59 pm »

Jeff, if you're going to look at upgrading caps, I'd recommend checking out the Miflex Copper caps from Jeff at Sonic Craft. They are just as good as the Jupiter Copper/Paper caps for a lot less money.

jeffreybehr · « **Reply #596 on:** 18 Mar 2019, 11:12 pm »

Quote from: Tyson on 18 Mar 2019, 10:59 pm

Jeff, if you're going to look at upgrading caps, I'd recommend checking out the Miflex Copper caps from Jeff at Sonic Craft. They are just as good as the Jupiter Copper/Paper caps for a lot less money.

I agree on the KCPU's 5-star quality; I use them as coupling and frontend-hi-Voltage-supply-bypass caps in both pairs of Atma-Spheres I have.. In fact, the trios installed in the MA-1s are the FIRST cap upgrade I could CLEARLY hear the results of upon power-up.. The 'problem' with these 600VDC caps is their relatively large size--they're larger, for instance than the Teflon-film SoniCap Platinums..

The upper is a 0.47/600, while the two smaller ones--notice I didn't use 'small'--are 0.1s.

I might use some as bypasses in the MR filters.

jeffreybehr · « **Reply #597 on:** 3 Apr 2019, 04:34 am »

FINALLY, after more than five years of ownership, I'm getting around to finishing the crossovers.. A couple years ago I found some high-mass granite tiles that I had narrowed to which I added some Dynamat damping material; the x-over parts will lie upon that.

I've already improved all-three caps and one coil, but I imagine more will change, such as fitting some Miflex KPCU copperfoil/'propylene&paper/oil caps where appropriate..

Will likely be using Mundorf Silver/Gold 18g. for wiring the MR drivers and Neotec 23g. UP-OCC-silver-in-Teflon for the tweeter.

jeffreybehr · « **Reply #598 on:** 4 Apr 2019, 10:54 pm »

I'm still blinking and panting...just ordered the replacements-for-the-replacement 10uF tweeter-hi-pass and 15uF (10 + 4.7) MR-lo-pass-shunt caps from Sonic Craft, all Miflex copperfoil/'propylene&paper/oils.. The 10s are almost 4" in diameter!!
http://www.soniccraft.com/index.php/miflex-kpcu-c-301_453_455

Will be keeping at least temporarily the Bridgeport MR-series coil.. Will be replacing the tweeter-shunt coil with a new 20g. Solen (ordered directly from Solen in Canada) in hopes of decreasing slightly the somewhat-too-much treble energy*.. Will also be removing the 0.33uF SoniCap Platinum bypass cap from the MR-network 54uF cap.

Will be using Neotec 23g. UP-OCC-silver-in-Teflon wire to and from the tweeter and Mundorf 18g. Silver/Gold on the MR drivers.. Each pair of MR drivers will get its own 18g. run to and from the x-over components; the paralleling will occur at the connections to the x-over.

I still prefer the sounds of the S7s to those of the Quad '2905s, so the speakers and my further enjoyment of them are worth the money.

* Do keep in mind that these are MY damaged ears and my hearingaids and and not YOURS.

Tyson · « **Reply #599 on:** 4 Apr 2019, 11:04 pm »

Jeff, I agree, stock, the 7's are a bit lit up in the treble. I found that it was really a function of the stock caps more than the drivers. I think if you have any treble sensitivity at all, you are going to be VERY HAPPY with the copper caps in there. If the caps and new inductors don't quite get you there, look at the Jantzen Wax Paper Copper Foil inductors as the final piece to get you to utterly natural sound.

BTW, here's a recent pic of what my upgraded crossovers look like. I have Jupiter Caps but honestly I think the Miflex coppers might be better.