[2bigears]

  Jeff in NY mentioned 1/2 hour to set up the Raven.The P9 looks easy to set up also.For a starter tt guy,what are the tools you need to set up your own deck.My 1210 was way easy to set up,but not checked by a pro,how do you know.The only reasons why i bought the P9 is first,i got it at 60% off,and second,it looks very basic to rig up,and Jeff D highly spoke of it along with the fact it is Regas top deck,in Canada it is ten times the price of the 1210,it's gotta be better.But,some of you guys say all tt's need perfect set up,how is this done and what does it involve beyond the 1210 set up guide.???? do you actually need some geo tools to properly set the gear ?? some people say it's too easy,some say you need to be perfect.again.what needs to be in your tool box for a great set up ???? thks for the input

[TONEPUB]

TONEPUB,

My commet wasn't directed at you (or about you). To make myself even further clearerererer, I think there are plenty of big ego guys that will lay down big bucks for these exotic tables, and have them set up horribly. I betting this is the case all over. I'm sure you have your table(s) set up properly, I just don't think there are many that truely understand the geometry involved and really have things where they should.

Wayner 

No offense taken at all.  I've seen a LOT of this with guys with big bucks setups! 
I've seen guys with super expensive tables that aren't even level!!!!

I guess what I'm trying to say also, is that before you think about a new table,
make sure the one you have is as dialed in as you can get it, because if it isn't,
I'll bet there's some more performance lurking in what you already own.

It drives me nuts sometimes...

[TheChairGuy]

2BE, if you want near perfect execution...Rega sells cartridges too that mount in a three point pattern right into the Rega headshell on the P9.  It's as easy and perfect a set up as you will find in vinyl.

The downside, however, is that most vinylphools don't like the sound of many/most of them...even in the Rega arms 

The infrequent 'free lunch' is rather rare in vinyl, sad to say 

John

[Wayner]

2BE,

Puttin' the stylus where it needs to be is 3/4ths the battle. The technics is fairly easy 'cause they give you a tool to align the stylus tip on the head shell. All you have to do is keep the front edge of the cartridge parallel with the front edge of the headshell, align the stylus with the tool and your done. The Sl-1200 is very well engineered in this regard.

The other things would be VTA, simply put adjusting the back of the arm, at the pivot, so that the arm is parallel with the record. To do that, put an old record on the table, set the stylus on it (table not running) and measure the arm at various points to see if it's parallel. Adjust as needed. The other thing is azimuth of the cartridge. Is it cockeyed in the tone arm head (the head could be crooked) and then it may require a shim. To check this, place a small flat mirror on the old record and set the stylus on the mirror. Everything should look parallel between cartridge and image on the mirror.

The 3rd thing to do is set the anti-skating. I use a blank disc to do this. I had one made out of acrylic and it works very well.

I know I didn't explain the ins and outs of the stylus location very well and it's a dark and murky subject. I will have a couple of beers while I bar-b-Que and try come up with a good across the board explanation.


Wayner

[TONEPUB]

That's true, all of the Rega MM carts are a bit on the dark side for
my taste, but their new Apheta Moving coil is quite nice.  You will
need a phono preamp with a 50ohm load setting to get the most
out of it though.

The other thing to keep in mind with VTA on the P9 (or any rega
for that matter) is that it is not adjustable like it is on many other
tables, where it is just a height adjustment.

How you keep this fairly straight is by measuring the length of the
stylus tip to the top of the cartridge.  On Rega carts, this is 14mm.

Most of the MC carts I've tested are all around 17-20mm, so what
you will need to do is order some tonearm spacers (made by Rega)
from Music Direct or a local rega dealer.  Once you know what cart
you are getting, you can figure that out and make the necc adjustment.

In the meantime your cartridge will probably sound a touch thin.

Or, you can just get the Rega Elyse (the 550 dollar one) which is
probably the best sounding of the lot and have easy setup.

[doug s.]

...along with the fact it is Regas top deck,in Canada it is ten times the price of the 1210, it's gotta be better...

extremely poor reasoning, imo.     ideas like this can get you in big trouble, in audio, & in other aspects of life as well...  while it it is true that many times expensive stuff performs better, it's not always true.  for an example, (where you don't need to trust my opinion about a piece of gear, but for opinions from industry-types - both rewiewer and mfr), check out srajan ebaen's rewiew of the almarro a318b, & wlm speaker mfr hannes frick's comments about it...

http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/almarro5/318.html

doug s.

[lcrim]

Hmmm-Psychic Animal preceeded me by a few years but its strange to hear the stuff I've been preaching for years coming from other people.
I do disagree of course about taking the dust cover off for listening.  It makes no difference in the sound at all and it keeps the records clean so mine stays on.  A really good MC cartridge and phono section do help immensely but the Technics 1200 MKII w/ all the KAB mods is all the TT I need .

[mcrespo71]

Can I ask who here has heard a Rega P9 with RB1000 arm?  The reason I'm asking is because IMO it represents quite a leap in sound quality from Rega decks that most people would be exposed to (P3 or lower).  I haven't even heard the new P3 24, so I can't comment on that deck.  The last P3 I heard was a P3 2000 and I owned an earlier iteration of the P3 I used in the late 90s.

[doug s.]

Can I ask who here has heard a Rega P9 with RB1000 arm?  The reason I'm asking is because IMO it represents quite a leap in sound quality from Rega decks that most people would be exposed to (P3 or lower).  I haven't even heard the new P3 24, so I can't comment on that deck.  The last P3 I heard was a P3 2000 and I owned an earlier iteration of the P3 I used in the late 90s.

this is a good point.  i have not heard rega's latest.  maybe it really is a worthwhile improvement over a technics sl1200.  but, this doesn't prove that just cuz something costs ten time the amount of something else, it is necessarily better.

doug s.

[mcrespo71]

Can I ask who here has heard a Rega P9 with RB1000 arm?  The reason I'm asking is because IMO it represents quite a leap in sound quality from Rega decks that most people would be exposed to (P3 or lower).  I haven't even heard the new P3 24, so I can't comment on that deck.  The last P3 I heard was a P3 2000 and I owned an earlier iteration of the P3 I used in the late 90s.

this is a good point.  i have not heard rega's latest.  maybe it really is a worthwhile improvement over a technics sl1200.  but, this doesn't prove that just cuz something costs ten time the amount of something else, it is necessarily better.

doug s.

I can't say whether it is a worthwhile improvement over the SL1200, as I've never heard the SL1200.  It seems the only people that can do that on this thread are Jeff (TonePub) and the gentleman who initiated this thread, whom I think has a Technics 1210.  All I can say is the P9 is a very large step up from other Rega decks I've heard (old P2, old P3, P3 2000, P25, and P5 with power supply).  I guess my point is don't generalize the performance of, for example, an old P3 to the P9 because that would be a mistake.  The P9 is a totally different deck in sonics and build quality.

[doug s.]

Can I ask who here has heard a Rega P9 with RB1000 arm?  The reason I'm asking is because IMO it represents quite a leap in sound quality from Rega decks that most people would be exposed to (P3 or lower).  I haven't even heard the new P3 24, so I can't comment on that deck.  The last P3 I heard was a P3 2000 and I owned an earlier iteration of the P3 I used in the late 90s.

this is a good point.  i have not heard rega's latest.  maybe it really is a worthwhile improvement over a technics sl1200.  but, this doesn't prove that just cuz something costs ten time the amount of something else, it is necessarily better.

doug s.

I can't say whether it is a worthwhile improvement over the SL1200, as I've never heard the SL1200.  It seems the only people that can do that on this thread are Jeff (TonePub) and the gentleman who initiated this thread, whom I think has a Technics 1210.  All I can say is the P9 is a very large step up from other Rega decks I've heard (old P2, old P3, P3 2000, P25, and P5 with power supply).  I guess my point is don't generalize the performance of, for example, an old P3 to the P9 because that would be a mistake.  The P9 is a totally different deck in sonics and build quality.

that's why i am interested in 2bigears' findings.  then he can also compare them to a mint refurb'd wintage empire, w/an upgraded tonearm, & i will really be a pig-n-poop!   

doug s.

[mcrespo71]

Can I ask who here has heard a Rega P9 with RB1000 arm?  The reason I'm asking is because IMO it represents quite a leap in sound quality from Rega decks that most people would be exposed to (P3 or lower).  I haven't even heard the new P3 24, so I can't comment on that deck.  The last P3 I heard was a P3 2000 and I owned an earlier iteration of the P3 I used in the late 90s.

this is a good point.  i have not heard rega's latest.  maybe it really is a worthwhile improvement over a technics sl1200.  but, this doesn't prove that just cuz something costs ten time the amount of something else, it is necessarily better.

doug s.

I can't say whether it is a worthwhile improvement over the SL1200, as I've never heard the SL1200.  It seems the only people that can do that on this thread are Jeff (TonePub) and the gentleman who initiated this thread, whom I think has a Technics 1210.  All I can say is the P9 is a very large step up from other Rega decks I've heard (old P2, old P3, P3 2000, P25, and P5 with power supply).  I guess my point is don't generalize the performance of, for example, an old P3 to the P9 because that would be a mistake.  The P9 is a totally different deck in sonics and build quality.

that's why i am interested in 2bigears' findings.  then he can also compare them to a mint refurb'd wintage empire, w/an upgraded tonearm, & i will really be a pig-n-poop!   

doug s.

That will be interesting to read about.  Hurry up and do your listening 2bigears!  Maybe you need 3bigears now to handle all these comparisons   

[2bigears]

  not really too happy bout' the Rega shim-shim-man-e on the vta,that's prehistoric stuff.also,i know all to well price means nothing in this hobby,but i paid 700 bucks for the 1210 and the local dealer here sells the P9 at 5750.i really think things should get better.but,i know like all you fine gents are saying,set up is most critical.i quess i can stop in at the big city store to see if the have set up tools if needed.not sure what i will need.what is that tt guru's book called ?? his instuctions are clear and easy i hope...?? still don't have a cart for the 9 ????

[giantsteps]

  not really too happy bout' the Rega shim-shim-man-e on the vta,that's prehistoric stuff.also,i know all to well price means nothing in this hobby,but i paid 700 bucks for the 1210 and the local dealer here sells the P9 at 5750.i really think things should get better.but,i know like all you fine gents are saying,set up is most critical.i quess i can stop in at the big city store to see if the have set up tools if needed.not sure what i will need.what is that tt guru's book called ?? his instuctions are clear and easy i hope...?? still don't have a cart for the 9 ????

 http://www.vtaf.com/


 Frank

[WGH]

what is that tt guru's book called ?? his instuctions are clear and easy i hope...?? still don't have a cart for the 9 ????

Michael Fremer has a practical guide to turntable setup DVD called "21st Century Vinyl". You should get the disk, on it he has a detailed demo on how to set up a Rega P5 which might help.

The DVD also has a discount coupon for 10%-30% off plus free shipping for any Wally Tool.

Wayne

[mcrespo71]

  not really too happy bout' the Rega shim-shim-man-e on the vta,that's prehistoric stuff.also,i know all to well price means nothing in this hobby,but i paid 700 bucks for the 1210 and the local dealer here sells the P9 at 5750.i really think things should get better.but,i know like all you fine gents are saying,set up is most critical.i quess i can stop in at the big city store to see if the have set up tools if needed.not sure what i will need.what is that tt guru's book called ?? his instuctions are clear and easy i hope...?? still don't have a cart for the 9 ????

How much do you want to spend?  What is your phonostage?  Types of music you listen to?

[2bigears]

  thks guys,we will get the 9 up and runnin' in no time flat.that disc should help lots as the 5 in a sister tt.what the heck is a wally tool ????  that vta adjuster looks great,does it work on the 1000 arm ????  thks alot guys.dummy in the sticks,knows squat bout' tt's needs all the help he can get.

[2bigears]

   budget for cart is 1k max,i was hoping that would do it.used is more than fine.old classic r&r is mostly on the tt,with some easy listening stuff too.phono stage is what's in the VAC pre.takes both mm and mc.thks

[WGH]

what the heck is a wally tool ????

http://www.simplyblack.net/WVC/wally_start.html

Never used them but Micheal Fremer likes Wally's stuff.

[mcrespo71]

  budget for cart is 1k max,i was hoping that would do it.used is more than fine.old classic r&r is mostly on the tt,with some easy listening stuff too.phono stage is what's in the VAC pre.takes both mm and mc.thks

I would look for a used Dynavector XX-2 or a Dynavector 17D3, which work great for R&R.  The latter is a little more neutral, which may work well with the VAC, if it has enough gain in MC mode.  The 17D3 has like .3mv of gain or so, so you'll need at least 60db of gain or more in your VAC mc.  If you want to save even more you can get a Dynavector 17D2 used.  Otherwise, a Rega Exact 2 is pretty idiot proof and sounds good.