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Industry Circles => SONORE by Simple Design => Topic started by: Starboard on 6 Jan 2017, 12:27 pm

Title: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: Starboard on 6 Jan 2017, 12:27 pm
Hi...

I recently bought microRendu with iFi adapter and after initial burn-in time, it still sounds very bright and somehow digital, specialy in upper mids and high freq. specrum. Before microRendu I was using Naim ND5xs as a player only connected to NuPrime Dac10h and this was not an issue. Now I have Synology 216j - microRendu - Nuprime dac10h - st10 - Pmc 23. MicroRendu is connected to dac over usb hard adapter. Player I am using is Logitec Media Player on Synology and Sonore via iPeng app. Any idea how to correct this? Tnx
Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: jtwrace on 6 Jan 2017, 01:43 pm
You're probably perceiving more detail as harsh.  Just let it play and listen.   :thumb:
Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: Starboard on 6 Jan 2017, 04:05 pm
No way... It just sound digital, thin and harsh with voices, cymbals and overall. Details are there just as stage and everything is more hifi, but I am missing weight and warm sound I have before.
Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: Phil A on 6 Jan 2017, 04:35 pm
Don't use a microRendu but before I tweaked recently JRiver settings, streaming from the NAS vs. local drives sounded exactly like that (more digital) when comparing to the local hard drives.  I only did a brief comparison (will eventually do more) after tweaking my settings but I clearly could not hear the same difference I did before.
Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: zybar on 6 Jan 2017, 04:55 pm
No way... It just sound digital, thin and harsh with voices, cymbals and overall. Details are there just as stage and everything is more hifi, but I am missing weight and warm sound I have before.

Not debating what you are hearing...it's just very different from what the overwhelming user and reviewer feedback.

I don't ever recall the microRendu sounding that way in my system.

Not saying it is the culprit, but can you try a different USB cable and/or power supply.

When I changed those (TWL USB Cable and LIO power supply) it took something that was very good and made it excellent.

Also try Phil's recommendation to check all your software settings.

Best of luck.

George

Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: vklyushnikov on 6 Jan 2017, 06:02 pm
Hi...

I recently bought microRendu with iFi adapter and after initial burn-in time, it still sounds very bright and somehow digital, specialy in upper mids and high freq. specrum. Before microRendu I was using Naim ND5xs as a player only connected to NuPrime Dac10h and this was not an issue. Now I have Synology 216j - microRendu - Nuprime dac10h - st10 - Pmc 23. MicroRendu is connected to dac over usb hard adapter. Player I am using is Logitec Media Player on Synology and Sonore via iPeng app. Any idea how to correct this? Tnx
I had this problem with microrendu and solved it. First make sure that you have latest Sonicorbiter update - just press Update button in Software Manager. Second please replace your power supply with something better - mine is Teddy Pardo
Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: datman on 6 Jan 2017, 06:52 pm
 I second the Teddy Pardo power supply. It works wonders.
Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: jtwrace on 6 Jan 2017, 07:03 pm
I submit the Vinnie Rossi MINI.


http://www.vinnierossi.com/mini/



Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: glynnw on 6 Jan 2017, 08:18 pm
Another outstanding choice is the Uptone Audio UltraCap™ LPS-1 - for $400 it might be the bargain of the group and certainly improves the sound of the microrendu.
Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: Cappy on 6 Jan 2017, 10:01 pm
The LPS-1 with the microRendu is great - that is what I use.  However, I don't think it is going to solve your tonal balance/harsh sound.

My guess is the more resolving but more tonally neutral sound is uncovering some issues elsewhere in your system.
Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: genjamon on 7 Jan 2017, 12:02 am
I agree first step is an improved power supply on the microrendu. However, I would also suggest power supply on other network devices feeding  the microrendu can have additional important impacts. Even when completely galvanically isolating microrendu from my router and synology NAS using fiber optic Ethernet, I still hear significant benefits in reduced harshness and warmer fuller sound from good linear power supplies on router and NAS.
Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: TomS on 7 Jan 2017, 12:28 am
I started with the $50 iFi supply and never heard anything that could be described as bright or harsh. The LIO supply took it from really good and made it incrementally better, but both are still very satisfying. I suspect something else is going on there.
Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: vklyushnikov on 7 Jan 2017, 07:20 am
I started with the $50 iFi supply and never heard anything that could be described as bright or harsh. The LIO supply took it from really good and made it incrementally better, but both are still very satisfying. I suspect something else is going on there.
Probably this depends on USB input implementation in DAC. Mine Bryson BDA 2 sounded harsh with Microrendu until I changed power supply.
Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: Tubeburner on 7 Jan 2017, 05:20 pm
My Microrendu has sounded better from day one. I am using a laptop/JRiver/usb hard drive on the home network. I have nothing but good things to say about the Microrend and Jesus. I am waiting for my Uptone Audio UltraCap™ LPS-1.

Just a thought: Could your router be the one inducing noise and possibly a poor signal to the Rendu? Or a bad end on an Ethernet cable? I had a problem with internet a couple years ago and it was one end on the network. The noise it produced cut the bandwith so badly the router would pass information, but not enough to have a fast internet. I suspect some noise is defeating your signal to the network along the line. My 2 cents...

Once you find what is causing your issue, you will be more than happy with the Microrendu.
Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: Starboard on 9 Jan 2017, 06:20 pm
Well, I have try to put another usb and ethernet cable in the mix between mR and router and Dac. I have also connected dlink switcher in front of modem to have 100Mbit connection stable and sound improved little bit overall, but sibilants on voices and upper registers are still there. I will see what better LPS brings, but thats last thing I am going to change. After that mR goes ebay!!  :scratch:
Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: Tubeburner on 9 Jan 2017, 06:40 pm
Quote
Hi...

I recently bought microRendu with iFi adapter and after initial burn-in time, it still sounds very bright and somehow digital, specialy in upper mids and high freq. specrum. Before microRendu I was using Naim ND5xs as a player only connected to NuPrime Dac10h and this was not an issue. Now I have Synology 216j - microRendu - Nuprime dac10h - st10 - Pmc 23. MicroRendu is connected to dac over usb hard adapter. Player I am using is Logitec Media Player on Synology and Sonore via iPeng app. Any idea how to correct this? Tnx

Have you emailed Jesus? He is very knowledgable and communicates fast. What format are your files?
Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: Starboard on 9 Jan 2017, 07:05 pm
Just few moments ago I plug in another power supply which is of the dlink swicher and have output power of 7,5v.... and belive it or not I am finally happy as a pig in the mud...  :P It looks like iFi power adapter is really bad choice for microRendu.  :duh:
Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: Tubeburner on 9 Jan 2017, 07:22 pm
Quote
Just few moments ago I plug in another power supply which is of the dlink swicher and have output power of 7,5v.... and belive it or not I am finally happy as a pig in the mud...  :P It looks like iFi power adapter is really bad choice for microRendu.  :duh:

I'm glad you found the noise being introduced into the mR. Enjoy!
Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: paul79 on 9 Jan 2017, 07:26 pm
Steve at Empirical Audio has great wall warts that he uses for his products. Might contact him to see what he uses or if he can get these.
Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: Starboard on 19 Jan 2017, 02:39 pm
Another thing ... after I plugged everything except microrendu to switch and microrendu directly on the router, everything became clear and more musical without any harshness or distortion in the sound.
Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: Phil A on 19 Jan 2017, 02:50 pm
Another thing ... after I plugged everything except microrendu to switch and microrendu directly on the router, everything became clear and more musical without any harshness or distortion in the sound.

Don't know if this will help or not but I have one of these going into the wall jack from the router to the main room (until I changed my settings in my set-up it did not resolve the problem but I'm sure it didn't hurt anything) - https://www.acoustic-revive.com/english/pcaudio/lan_isolator.html
Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: jtwrace on 19 Jan 2017, 02:54 pm
Don't know if this will help or not but I have one of these going into the wall jack from the router to the main room (until I changed my settings in my set-up it did not resolve the problem but I'm sure it didn't hurt anything) - https://www.acoustic-revive.com/english/pcaudio/lan_isolator.html
I use the Emo Systems EN-70HD and have their latest arriving today for trial.  Remember it's important to get something that has measurements as A LOT of this type of stuff is a joke.  Just like Ethernet cables.  Many don't even meet the requirements to be certified. 

http://www.emosystems.com/product/en-70hd-ultra-compact-network-isolator/

Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: Phil A on 19 Jan 2017, 02:59 pm
I use the Emo Systems EN-70HD and have their latest arriving today for trial.  Remember it's important to get something that has measurements as A LOT of this type of stuff is a joke.  Just like Ethernet cables.  Many don't even meet the requirements to be certified. 

http://www.emosystems.com/product/en-70hd-ultra-compact-network-isolator/

I noticed they have a number of LAN isolators like the EN-30 as well.  Can you elaborate on which ones you have used?  Thanks.
Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: jtwrace on 19 Jan 2017, 03:01 pm
I noticed they have a number of LAN isolators like the EN-30 as well.  Can you elaborate on which ones you have used?  Thanks.
I use (2) of what I posted above.  I have the EN-60KDS coming.  Should arrive today but I'm leaving town for the weekend so I'll try it next week.  I could send one to you to try if you wanted.  They're super small and easy to mail. 
Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: Phil A on 19 Jan 2017, 03:05 pm
I use (2) of what I posted above.  I have the EN-60KDS coming.  Should arrive today but I'm leaving town for the weekend so I'll try it next week.  I could send one to you to try if you wanted.  They're super small and easy to mail.

Thanks for the offer.  Right now I'm resolving a couple of minor issues and have some stuff not connected (upgraded something and swapping stuff around between the systems).  But definitely interested in your impressions.  I've had stuff on my Amazon wish list (e.g. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B003AVRLZI/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pC_nS_ttl?_encoding=UTF8&colid=321FECHQA1Z6W&coliid=I3TNNIJR1CZ3HB&psc=1) for a quite bit but just haven't gotten to it.  It's on my agenda for down the road for sure.
Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: jtwrace on 19 Jan 2017, 03:07 pm
Thanks for the offer.  Right now I'm resolving a couple of minor issues and have some stuff not connected (upgraded something and swapping stuff around between the systems).  But definitely interested in your impressions.  I've had stuff on my Amazon wish list (e.g. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B003AVRLZI/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pC_nS_ttl?_encoding=UTF8&colid=321FECHQA1Z6W&coliid=I3TNNIJR1CZ3HB&psc=1) for a quite bit but just haven't gotten to it.  It's on my agenda for down the road for sure.
No worry. I'm going to ask another NC audiophile that lives north of me if he wants to try it for giggles.  I've written about them a bit on CA.  The main reason I use them is for the surge protection of the gear.  These are used in hospitals all over the world not only for protection to the equipment but most importantly to the patient that's hooked up to the heart monitor for instance. 

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f22-networking-networked-audio-and-streaming/emo-systems-discount-code-29018/

http://www.emosystems.com/audio-applications/
Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: Phil A on 19 Jan 2017, 03:20 pm
I have my Acoustic Revive a couple of years.  Initially put in before the music server but it didn't like it (wouldn't work).  I started looking into those type of devices not too long after that.  I have had it on my radar (and I'm getting to the point where I'm almost done with what I'm going to be doing to the various systems for a bit within a couple of months give or take) to look at those things more closely.  I finally got the settings right as I noted earlier where with limited comparisons I don't so far hear a difference between the local hard drive and NAS playback.  I have the NAS almost a year and had it about 7-8 months before I finally got to where I am now.  I was really disappointed when I first put the NAS in and did a comparison (on two of my systems with music servers).  I had two guys who are computer illiterate from the Space Coast Audio Society come over last summer to verify I wasn't crazy with the difference I heard.  It took me a few months to get back into it and look at my settings.
Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: atxkyle on 1 Apr 2017, 12:40 pm
Just few moments ago I plug in another power supply which is of the dlink swicher and have output power of 7,5v.... and belive it or not I am finally happy as a pig in the mud...  :P It looks like iFi power adapter is really bad choice for microRendu.  :duh:

I'm having this harshness issue with the microrendu as well.  Unfortunately I don't have another ~7V / 1A power supply on hand to see if it fixes it like it did for you.  I do have an LPS-1 on order though, so hopefully it will be corrected soon.
Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: reelvox on 1 Apr 2017, 06:20 pm
Hi...

I recently bought microRendu with iFi adapter and after initial burn-in time, it still sounds very bright and somehow digital, specialy in upper mids and high freq. specrum. Before microRendu I was using Naim ND5xs as a player only connected to NuPrime Dac10h and this was not an issue. Now I have Synology 216j - microRendu - Nuprime dac10h - st10 - Pmc 23. MicroRendu is connected to dac over usb hard adapter. Player I am using is Logitec Media Player on Synology and Sonore via iPeng app. Any idea how to correct this? Tnx

To be perfectly honest, if the microRendu sounds bright, it is your system. I have heard it in numerous systems and it is as natural, neutral, and musical as I have heard any digital component.

Edit: Not sure if someone else mentioned it but it could def. be a dirty LAN. Consider a LAN isolation device. They really work.
Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: glynnw on 1 Apr 2017, 06:43 pm
I am using a microRendu and Uptone LPS1.  Yesterday I was commenting to myself how absolutely unharsh my system had become.  It is smooth and sweet as can be.
Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: Tubeburner on 1 Apr 2017, 07:18 pm
I posted this earlier. I have absolutely no harshness or brightness. If you are running through your router, this could be your issue. I had an occasional drop with the router, so I installed a network switch Asus GX-D1081 v3 https://www.asus.com/us/Networking/GXD1081_V3/ (https://www.asus.com/us/Networking/GXD1081_V3/) with priority port and I haven't had one issue since. I also replaced both ethernet cables with certified cables. I am using a microRendu and Uptone LPS1.
Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: DavidS on 2 Jan 2018, 12:36 am
I have been experiencing some high end glare when using microrendu - is particularly noticeable in headphone setup.  Have tried lots of alternatives downstream on the microrendu and no difference - I do use the ultracap lps-1 already.  So I am thinking it might be my router or power related to router.  Any new experience with this - from reading the earlier posts I am not sure if the isolation device solved the problem or not?  How about the switch - right now my router acts as a switch - not a particularly high end router.
Title: Re: microRendu harsh sound
Post by: plakey on 14 Jan 2018, 02:27 pm
I agree first step is an improved power supply on the microrendu. However, I would also suggest power supply on other network devices feeding  the microrendu can have additional important impacts. Even when completely galvanically isolating microrendu from my router and synology NAS using fiber optic Ethernet, I still hear significant benefits in reduced harshness and warmer fuller sound from good linear power supplies on router and NAS.

Curious what you use / where to get LPS for router and NAS?