[geowak]

I use to have a Thorens TD320, way back in 1986. I gave it to my cousin when CDs became all the rage. Thinking about coming back to analog. Can anyone out there name a TT that made you CONVERT back to analog? I mean that really, really revealing TT that is just great? Thinking below 10K but really something between 1K to 5K.

Of course, I need to know the tonearm and cartridge that mates well with the TT.

[thorman]

 I pretty much did the same thing and came back buying a nice Thorens TD124/SME 3009 Series 2 ( Paid $1200 ) and pretty much just cleaned/lubed and realigned it, built a better Plinth and found a older Shure Cartridge and purchased a new SAS Jico replacement Stylus and was hooked.....I tend to be less overwhelmed with the Vintage stuff and just love the old Thorens Turntables....Pretty straight forward for an old fart like me ( 68 years old ) . I would love to buy a VPI Classic 3 but for me the extra " Green " just does not make it worth the stretch..........Get something simple, cheap and easy to use, until you know for sure you want to go in that direction. Also allow yourself $500 in a cleaning machine...Cleaning is the biggest issue you will deal with if you plan on buying used Vinyl........Bottom line, try it and have fun.

[timind]

I'll watch this thread with interest.
Maybe someone will recommend a tt that allows me to have every song in my library at the touch of a finger with my iphone. That might make me switch back to vinyl.

[kingdeezie]

IME (recent), I found that the turntable and tonearm are a huge part of the analog chain, but that the cartridge and phono stage can have a bigger impact.

For what it is worth, my digital is a Meitner MA-1.

My analog is a VPI Classic 1, Dynavector 17D3, and Pass Labs XP-15. My analog sounds significantly better to me than the digital. I could go into all of the hyperbole, and nonsense phrases that we audiophiles use to describe the differences, but in the end the analog system just brings an extremely pure representation of the music that my digital system can not come close to approximating.

Back in 2009, I had a JA Michell Gyrodec. That was a solid table. I sold it when I thought I was done with vinyl. I came back to analog last year, and foolishly decided to go with the VPI classic after hearing people rave about it.

I like the classic, but I loved the Gyrodec. The build quality was excellent, and the overall look of the table was great. I had it fitted with a tecnoarm, and the sound was pretty great.

If I had a budget of 5K, and was not in any hurry, I would wait for a used gyrodec to come along. Match that with a SME tonearm like a 309, or if you have the big bucks, a V, and you'll have a solid table that is upgradable (orbe platter/motor), and a tonearm that the gyrodec was voiced for.

With that combo, you could likely use any cartridge/phono stage combination you could ever want and not have the table be completely outclassed.

[jimdgoulding]

I'll watch this thread with interest.
Maybe someone will recommend a tt that allows me to have every song in my library at the touch of a finger with my iphone. That might make me switch back to vinyl.

I think its safe to say, Timind, you rather miss the point.  Nothing will make you invest in vinyl until you don't.

[orthobiz]

I've made some of these points before, in fact, I sound like a broken record.

Vinyl is not just about the sound. It's about the experience, the hunt for records with different covers. For first pressings. Best sounding versions. It's NOT about convenience, pushing a remote, bringing the music with you.

The original vinyl releases are often closest to the way the artist, producer and engineer wanted the record to sound. Subsequent digital releases often do not have access to the original master tapes. Often done with the differing technology of a particular era, different in the late 80's compared to the late 2000's.

And vinyl is not exclusive. I have CD's, too. Not everything is available on vinyl. And maybe some digital stuff is done better. But I don't really care, I'm having a ball and I have the best of both worlds.

Quite frankly, the more people stay OUT of vinyl, the more records I have to choose from!

Oh, I forgot...what was this thread about?

Paul

[Guy 13]

Hi all.
My Rega P3 turntable w/Exact mm cartridge/Bellari VP129 combo
will certainly not make me go back 100% to analog.
My Rega Apollo CD player to my ears sound better than analog,
more details, more dynamics, etc...
That's too bad, because I was born and raise with analog,
I love to cue down the tone arm onto the vinyl, but for now,
digital brings me more music enjoyment. 
Maybe that will change, when I up-grade my Bellari VP129
to a new phono stage,
(Hagerman Bugle 2 or Vista)
and a PDR linear tone arm (That is on the way to Vietna)?
My analog set up is not hi-end, but is not bad either.

Guy 13

[brooklyn]

I never did get out of the vinyl business but around 2007 I bought a VPI Scout. About 2 years ago I installed an Ortofon 2M Black Cartridge and a Graham Slee ERA V phono Preamp and have been very happy. I think all of that would run about $3500.00 today.

Thorman is correct, a record cleaner is a must and should be added to the total cost.

Happy listening.

[Guy 13]

Hi all.
Stay with vinyl or go back to vinyl, you need to keep your vinyl in top shape.
Despite my modest 80 vinyl inventory, I bought a Spin Clean for 80 USD on Amazon and I was very happy with the results. All my vinyl some 45 years old and most 30 years old had never been cleaned/washed.
They were overdue, that's for sure.
Yes, if you already have or want to go with vinyl,
to me a vinyl washing machine is a must
and represent only a small fraction of the investment.

Guy 13 

[audionut44]

I heard this setup yesterday with a variety of speakers, sources and amplification.  I was extremely impressed with the sound.



http://www.needledoctor.com/Clearaudio-Performance-DC-Turntable-w-Verify-Tonearm - Clearaudio Performance DC

http://www.needledoctor.com/Clearaudio-Virtuoso-v2-Ebony-Phono-Cartridge - Clearaudio Virtuoso V2

With the money left over I'd invest in the Nitty Gritty Mini-Pro 1 cleaner (as other have mention a clean record is key to maximizing the enjoyment)

http://www.needledoctor.com/Nitty-Gritty-Mini-Pro-1-Automatic-Record-Cleaning-Machine

That puts you just over the $5K mark.

I've never been all that attracted to the lower end Clearaudio tables because of their IMO boring appearance.  After hearing it I could easily overlook the appearance.  I'd describe the sound as extremely accurate and revealing but still musical and enjoyable.  There were times when I was in awe of the clarity but mostly I just sat and listened to the music which is exactly what I strive for with my own system.  FWIW I'm using a Pro-Ject Debut Carbon that has been modified a bit to isolate the motor with the Ortofon 2m Blue cart.  I use a highly modified Yaquin MS-22b tube phono stage.  So modified that the circuit is nothing like the original aside from the fact that it is still RIAA.  I'm very happy with it especially for the price I paid.  I would never go only vinyl or or only digital though.  I enjoy both formats for different reasons.  I do however get more enjoyment from owning and caring for my vinyl collection, there's a certain romance that makes the hobby feel more like a hobby and less like a mental disorder.   

[Wayner]

Any number of used TTs and an inexpensive cartridge should fit the bill. I have several old tables that sound awesome compared to digital, like my Empire 598mkII, VPI-HW19jr (with AudioQuest PT-6 arm), a Technics SL1200MKII DD and a Sony PS-X7 just to name a few. I have an Audio Technica AT440MLa in all of them. Total cost is way under $1k, leaving you room for a phono preamp. For that I recommend the Emotiva XPS-1 for $150, or if you want to spend more money and not get much more, the iPhono preamp at $399.

[vortrex]

You're not going to get anything decent for $1k, probably barely $5k will do (if you are talking table/arm/cart/pre).  I would not even bother unless you are willing to spend the money to do it right.  It's a huge amount of hassle for mediocre sound.  Go all in or stay with digital.

[Austin08]

You're not going to get anything decent for $1k, probably barely $5k will do (if you are talking table/arm/cart/pre).  I would not even bother unless you are willing to spend the money to do it right.  It's a huge amount of hassle for mediocre sound.  Go all in or stay with digital.

+1.
A decent analog system would cost $4000-$5000. ($1000 phono stage+ $2000 table + $1000 cart + $600 record cleaner)

For a competent digital front end vs analog. It would cost almost the same amount of money. ($3000 dac+ $1500 streamer.)

Back to the question, I would vote for VPI scout 2 or a bit higher quality - Classic line- mate with Soundsmith Zephyr 2 cart and SDS asynchronous power supply. This set up would cost you around $4500-$5000 and it is clearly superior to most of the digital front end I have owned or listened to.

[PDR]

Any number of used TTs and an inexpensive cartridge should fit the bill. I have several old tables that sound awesome compared to digital, like my Empire 598mkII, VPI-HW19jr (with AudioQuest PT-6 arm), a Technics SL1200MKII DD and a Sony PS-X7 just to name a few. I have an Audio Technica AT440MLa in all of them. Total cost is way under $1k, leaving you room for a phono preamp. For that I recommend the Emotiva XPS-1 for $150, or if you want to spend more money and not get much more, the iPhono preamp at $399.

Couldnt agree more  +1

I wonder if the guys that have $15K TT and $3K cart and $5K pre sit around and wonder why the $5K system guys even bother.....

[Ericus Rex]

I haven't heard all the competition in your price range but here goes; one of the contenders that should definitely be on your short list is the new Oracle Delphi (currently in its Mk VI iteration).  It's super musical, reliable and awesome looking.  Setting up these Oracles can be a challenge, as they're sprung, but if you have a local dealer who can do all the setup for you you'll be rewarded with a great, GREAT turntable.

http://www.oracle-audio.com/?action=produit_show&id=1

[srb]

I wonder if the guys that have $15K TT and $3K cart and $5K pre sit around and wonder why the $5K system guys even bother.....

I'm sure they do ..... just like the guys that have $30K TT, $6K cart and $10K pre wonder why the $23K system guys even bother!

For that I recommend the Emotiva XPS-1 for $150, or if you want to spend more money and not get much more, the iPhono preamp at $399.

Would the extra $200 for the $599 AVA Vision Phono pre over the $400 iPhono pre you get you any better sound?

Steve

[Wayner]

Well, I had a prototype of the Vision phono pre, along with the Emotiva and the iPhono. Overall, I liked the Emotiva better, but that is just my opinion.

I would just like to add that in any medium, there is and always will be the point of diminishing returns. There can be huge amounts of money spent with little if any measurable improvements over lesser tables. Right now, my Empire is king of the hill here. It easily dethrones digital easily, with great detail and low level resolution. Cymbals sound like cymbals, and the decay of the cymbal crash sounds correct. While vinyl at high playback levels can reveal its own flaws (pops, clicks), it can be mesmerizing with it's ability to get the listener involved in the music, and forget about the machinery.

There is one statement here that I will make. Any amount of money spent on high buck vinyl playback in the hands of the inexperienced or uneducated, will end up in shambles. Success comes from the knowledge of set up and system synergy. In other words, you simply can't buy turntable set up experience, you have to learn it. That is why my 40 year old Empire could easily trash a very expensive VPI in the hands of a novice.

This thread is a slippery slope and the outcome of buying a new (or used) table does not bring happiness alone. It must be learned............ 

[Elizabeth]

No such TT exists. 

[JackD201]

In my experience with analog you live and die by the LP itself. No amount of money thrown at a table, arm, cart and phonostage can rescue a beat up, or poorly pressed LP. Only after making the commitment to buy wisely and give proper care afterwards should anything over a few hundred bucks be considered. Make the commitment however and man, the rewards can be darned great! The sky is the limit. Unfortunately, these days that applies to prices as well.

[vinyl_lady]

I think there are several options out there in your price range. VPI and Project are worth a look. The Sumiko Blue Point Special or Blackbird are great cartridges for under $1000. Sumiko has a package deal on a Project 10.1 or an Xtension 10 with the Blackbird for under $4,000. Includes tone arm. I had a Project Perspective with the Blackbird before I went all-in with an SME 20/2, IV.Vi arm, Lyra Skala cartridge and the Zesto Andros phono stage. The Perspex and Blue Point Special cartridge can be had for under $2,000. I agree with those who recommend investing in a vacuum record cleaning machine.