Hypex Ncore Amps Announced

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Rclark

Re: Hypex Ncore Amps Announced
« Reply #380 on: 18 Mar 2012, 09:40 pm »
You dont need experience to see the forest for the trees, just brains.

JDUBS

Re: Hypex Ncore Amps Announced
« Reply #381 on: 18 Mar 2012, 09:46 pm »
Someone is still green behind the ears.  But weren't we all at some point!

Jim

Very true - but then again, many (most?) try to learn something before speaking out of school.

-Jim

jackman

Re: Hypex Ncore Amps Announced
« Reply #382 on: 18 Mar 2012, 09:50 pm »
Yes, it was this high distortion that made posters at DIYaudio suggest that the LDR was not a good match IIRC.

Good luck wading into that huge thread Ray. I believe that one of the posts there links to some of the LDR distortion measurements. But I just don't have the time to go searching for it right now.

Hey Roscoe, are you saying the Octomom and other LDR's are not suitable for use in this "miracle" amp because they are distortion machines?  There is a thread on this site with people "gushing" about how they transformed their systems with the LDR.  Apparently they have not seen the distortion comments on DIY.   :lol:

Either way, this thread is LAME.   I don't get excited about things based on manufacturer's claims.  Call me old fashioned but I like to at least wait until I hear something myself or at least have a couple people hear it in person before proclaiming it a "game changer".  There is enough hype in this hobby as it is.  Do we really have a 19 page thread about an amp almost no one has heard or seen in person?  :scratch:

jackman

Re: Hypex Ncore Amps Announced
« Reply #383 on: 18 Mar 2012, 09:52 pm »
Very true - but then again, many (most?) try to learn something before speaking out of school.

-Jim

That would mean actually going out and listening to something before proclaiming it a "game changer" or miracle technology.  It's easier to just read the words of the designer and conclude all existing products are obsolete.   :thumb:

OzarkTom

Re: Hypex Ncore Amps Announced
« Reply #384 on: 18 Mar 2012, 09:52 pm »
Then there's always the software quality.  Music not well-recorded and/or recorded on inferior equipment is "listenable" on my system, but does not satisfy like music well recorded on superb equipment.  Not much you can do about that.   

Yep, the better the system gets, the less software there is worth listening to.

It will become a must of owning two systems, one for your well recorded software and one for the inferior software.

Rclark

Re: Hypex Ncore Amps Announced
« Reply #385 on: 18 Mar 2012, 09:55 pm »
This subject is sure to piss a lot of people off. There are people here who have heard it. Hell go to the for trading post and see what Mgalushsa sold his Atmasphere's for. Guess what? Ncores.

..is that credible enough for you?

 :lol: :green:

It's enough for me!

OzarkTom

Re: Hypex Ncore Amps Announced
« Reply #386 on: 18 Mar 2012, 09:56 pm »
You dont need experience to see the forest for the trees, just brains.

One sad thing rclark. If these Ncores are as good as you think they are, your AC/DC and other such rock music is going to sound like crap. The Ncores are never going to make AC/DC sound any better, only worse.

James Romeyn

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Re: Hypex Ncore Amps Announced
« Reply #387 on: 18 Mar 2012, 10:05 pm »
If they sound as good as they are claimed too, they would be a cool solution for fully active speakers.  You could bolt them to a miniDSP, mount them in the speakers, and have one channel drive the tweeter, the other one the midrange, then just drop a pair of servo subs in there for the bass and you are set!

Two things come to mind.

I can't help but think the resonance inherent inside a speaker cabinet, no matter what is done to minimize it, severely impedes performance.  The best performing audio components take extreme measures to combat air-borne and mechanical resonance.  Resonance inside a speaker cabinet must be 10-100x worse than anywhere else.  There's no worse place for a DAC and amp. 

If I had powered speakers I'd be extremely interested in replacing their amps with Ncore.  The more costly the speaker, the higher would be my interest.  Powered pro studio monitors run to the $50k-$100k/pr range.  Whatever is the OEM amp, it is likely at least one or two clear steps below Ncore.

Completely unrelated to the above, I'm glad the only amp I'll have for sale after my Ncore trio arrives is a mid-priced 3-ch.     

Occam

Re: Hypex Ncore Amps Announced
« Reply #388 on: 18 Mar 2012, 10:14 pm »
@ Scotty:

For me, I understand that these will be far better than the rest of my gear, barring the Octocoupler. Bearing that in mind, I have no problem building my system around them. I think this is the kind of hardware that forces you to look at the rest of your system as has been shown by some user reports.

I like Bruno's philosophy about systems and the whole system merry go round. Says people often buy gear according to a pleasant "sound" they impart to the music. Then they get bored and begin seeking to improve that pleasantness with new gear. With a truly transparent system you can't get bored. At that point you are listening to the music and not your hodgepodge of tweaks.

Paraphrasing. But I dig it.
BINGO!!! We have a winner :lol:
Read below....
Quote
Ray,

Check the huge DIY audio thread. Some there think LDRs aren't a great match with the ncore.
This is true, as those who might not want their system as a 'straight wire with gain' know better than to post their views.

Consider the LDR based attenuators discussed in various threads, both here an AC as well as DIYaudio The subjective comments in both continually describe them as 'transparent'. But to the engineers at DIYaudio, the LDR is anything but a transparent device. Even with a perfect level controlling adjustable power supply, the LDR is an inherently high distortion device. Its immediately eliminated as appropriate for a system representing that 'straight wire with gain' ideal. Sadly, both objectivists and subjectivists use the same terminology, such as 'transparent' referring to system metrics.

Regardsless, the Ncore potentially provides an attractive solution for moderate cost amplification for both the subjectivists and the objectivists. The former can simply provide their subjective preferences via flanking components.

FWIW

Rclark,

You've just made my point. When I talked about the distortion of LDR based attenuators, I should'nt expect you to understand I was referring to your Optocoupler; which is an LDR based attenuator. This is not to say that your subjective evaluation of the Optocoupler as transparent, resolving, etc.... isn't perfectly valid, but if you think it part of a 'straight wire with gain' system, you are sadly mistaken. But without a solid technical foundation, your conclusions as to how assemble your 'Bruno Putzey's Tribute System' is perfectly understandable.
Any switched series, shunt, or ladder resistor attenuator, competently implemented, will show far less measurable distortion than your Optocoupler, as will most potentiometers.

Your plan is to feed the 'straight wire with gain' nCore, with your subjectively pleasing, high distortion, Optocoupler.

Indeed, you may 'dig it', but you've yet to 'get it'.

FWIW,
Paul

macrojack

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Re: Hypex Ncore Amps Announced
« Reply #389 on: 18 Mar 2012, 10:23 pm »
Rclark - It would appear that your exasperating exuberance is being treated kindly and patiently by those you are annoying. That won't last forever.

Comments about you being green behind the ears are hints that you don't know what you are talking about not that you lack experience. You would be wise to put down your pom poms and listen and learn instead of trying to lead the conversation.

jackman

Re: Hypex Ncore Amps Announced
« Reply #390 on: 18 Mar 2012, 10:28 pm »
Occam/Paul,

I hope this doesn't sound strange but you have become my favorite poster on AC.  Your common sense approach is like a cold beer on a blazing hot day in the Sahara.  I mean this with all sincerity.   :thumb: 

Thanks,

J

Rclark

Re: Hypex Ncore Amps Announced
« Reply #391 on: 18 Mar 2012, 10:31 pm »
Way ahead of you guys, like I said, I actually read the thread  :green:. Im not vested in octos, if there s something better, I'll do I. So far it was better than the pot in my integrated and the digital control in my dac. Interested now in Bruno's attenuator. I have no problem dumping gear for something better. We'll see what that ends up being.


@ macrojack
Be exasperated. I couldn't care less what you think.  :lol:
 

OzarkTom

Re: Hypex Ncore Amps Announced
« Reply #392 on: 18 Mar 2012, 10:36 pm »
Way ahead of you guys, like I said, I actually read the thread  :green:. Im not vested in octos, if there s something better, I'll do I. So far it was better than the pot in my integrated and the digital control in my dac. Interested now in Bruno's attenuator. I have no problem dumping gear for something better. We'll see what that ends up being.


Be exasperated. I couldn't care less what you think.  :lol:

You will care when your music sounds like crap.

Rclark

Re: Hypex Ncore Amps Announced
« Reply #393 on: 18 Mar 2012, 10:41 pm »
Btw, no more a distorter than your tube preamplifier apparently. Ooooh.

JDUBS

Re: Hypex Ncore Amps Announced
« Reply #394 on: 18 Mar 2012, 10:45 pm »
Amazing post, Occam!   :thumb:

-Jim

James Romeyn

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Re: Hypex Ncore Amps Announced
« Reply #395 on: 18 Mar 2012, 11:04 pm »
Yep, the better the system gets, the less software there is worth listening to.

It will become a must of owning two systems, one for your well recorded software and one for the inferior software.

That's funny you wrote exactly what I was thinking too!

I'll say this: when listening to the abject dregs of recordings (Sixpence None The Richer comes to mind, dynamic range of barely .5 dB I'd bet), one gets a vision of the musical personalities/proclivities associated with the artists and producers: careless, lazy, naive or worse, disappointing, deaf, being a few choice qualifiers that come to mind. 

golfugh

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Re: Hypex Ncore Amps Announced
« Reply #396 on: 18 Mar 2012, 11:47 pm »
Thanks Paul/Occam and Macrojack, you put into words what I've been trying to say for a while

Occam

Re: Hypex Ncore Amps Announced
« Reply #397 on: 18 Mar 2012, 11:50 pm »
Btw, no more a distorter than your tube preamplifier apparently. Ooooh.

This is absolutely true. :thumb:
But I'm not doctrinaire about it. I very much enjoy my CAT SL-1 preamp (10 tubes including phono stage) as well as my EAR Acute III CD player/Dac (2 tubes, albeit Siemens). But you miss my point. When you weren't aware that your Optocoupler  is a high distortion attenuator, you thought it totally appropriate for your low distortion uber alles paradigm system. I still think a LDR feeding an Ncore amp could be great, and I certainly don't think its distortion should dissuade you from trying that very combination. Its well and good to implement your system by whatever rules you wish to follow, but when all is said and done, it is your subjective perception that determines your musical enjoyment. We are flawed creatures.... YMMV

FWIW,
Paul

Rclark

Re: Hypex Ncore Amps Announced
« Reply #398 on: 18 Mar 2012, 11:53 pm »
You will care when your music sounds like crap.

I'll make adjustments as needed. And hopefully I can get to Rmaf and get a good handle on preamps.

So far, so good. Haven't made any mistakes yet.

And thanks Occam. Hopefully I'll be able to accurately measure all this stuff as it goes down. We'll see.

OzarkTom

Re: Hypex Ncore Amps Announced
« Reply #399 on: 19 Mar 2012, 12:17 am »
I'll make adjustments as needed. And hopefully I can get to Rmaf and get a good handle on preamps.

So far, so good. Haven't made any mistakes yet.

And thanks Occam. Hopefully I'll be able to accurately measure all this stuff as it goes down. We'll see.

I have been a rocker all my life, since the 50's. But unfortunately, very few rock recordings ever made are worthy of high-end audio systems. What I thought was great soumding back in the 60's, 70's, and 80's turned to mediocrity as my system advanced. I love the Beatles, Doors, Led Zeppelin, Stones, Fleetwood Mac, Boston etc. I still listen to rock on the radio, but never on my audiophile system.

So I have turned to Diana Krall, Melody Gardot, Judith Owen, Boz Scaggs, Norah Jones, and the like to listen and enjoy my audiophile system. I would need at least a highly distorted equalizer to be able to listen to my old rock groups.

If you ever go to RMAF, very rarely, will you ever hear any systems playing the 70's-80's rock. They are just not recorded well enough.