RMAF - This was funny!

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zybar

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Re: RMAF - This was funny!
« Reply #20 on: 26 Oct 2006, 07:29 pm »
Thanks John.

I have spent a lot of hours listening and helping my friend tune his 5A's so I am well prepared for the setup.

If I can handle a VMPS setup, anything else isn't too bad.   aa

George



Hi George,

Didn't mean to "imply" that tuning and positioning were "bad" or problematic.  Obviously I "like" being able to achieve sonic preferences through adjustments of a system/room.

I didn't know you had lots of experience with the 5A's in that regard, and I know some have a tendency to discount them as being "high shy".

I found out through some listening experiences, that, that perceived "shyness", can be the result of less than precision listening height, leading to incoherent driver phase relationships in the vertical plane.

John,

I certainly didn't take your original post as anything negative.

One could say that most speakers lose some to most of their magic when not properly setup.

George



George

shokunin

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Re: RMAF - This was funny!
« Reply #21 on: 26 Oct 2006, 07:38 pm »
Great story Tom.

I'll let you know how hard or easy it is to setup the Vandy 5A's in a few weeks when they are at my house.   :o :o :o

George

Hey George

I guess that custom speaker is out of the running?  If you can tune the RM40's I think you can tune just about anything, with the TacT it'll be even easier to dial the bass in.  Looks like this Christmas there will be new speakers for everybody  aa

Glenn

klh

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Re: RMAF - This was funny!
« Reply #22 on: 26 Oct 2006, 08:24 pm »
Hey George... where are the Vandy's going? Are you selling the HT3's?

jermmd

Re: RMAF - This was funny!
« Reply #23 on: 26 Oct 2006, 09:46 pm »
Hey George... where are the Vandy's going? Are you selling the HT3's?

I hope you get a chance to compare the Salk's to the Vandy's side by side. When are you hosting a listening session. With all the various high end amps and speakers you have, it will be a blast.

fajimr

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Re: RMAF - This was funny!
« Reply #24 on: 26 Oct 2006, 11:03 pm »

The best place to start is to use a Radio Shack meter and some simple 1/12 octave test tones to see how your current setup is.  Work on getting as smooth an in-room response as possible by changing speaker and listener positions.  Avoid being in the middle of your room (up/down, left/right, front/back).

george

I, for one, would be interested in that discussion.  Would you guys mind posting it somewhere (acoustics circle?) so others can learn too? 
thanks
jim

warnerwh

Re: RMAF - This was funny!
« Reply #25 on: 27 Oct 2006, 04:17 am »
Being as a couple of people are interested I'll add a couple of things.

No system is operating at it's potential in the average listening room. Good acoustics can have a profound effect on a system that you felt has been lacking somehow or actually in a multiple of ways. Once you hear your system set up in a room with good acoustics you really don't know how it sounds. Please remember the average room has peaks and dips of plus or minus 15db. That's alot :wink: and can turn any system of any cost into crap. Good acoustics can make a system  that's merely decent into a great sounding system. I know this for a fact.

The first thing you need to do is read. Go to realtraps.com and spend some time. The Acoustics circle here is an excellent place to ask questions. George's suggestion of the rat shack meter and 1/12 octave tones is a great place to start. You can get some graph paper for 1/3 octave measurements off of Rives audio site. In either case write time and date down.

Moving speakers including toe in and listening position is the first thing to do however. Moving in about 1" increments. Take your time! This is critical to start with the best position you can. The Tact can make this pretty much moot and if you have the money that's what I'd get. With the Behringer you have much less control but way more than you would normally.

Nearly every average room in existance will benefit from acoustic treatments. This includes bass traps. These can be made inexpensively or purchased ready made. In either case the improvement to the sound considering the money spent is excellent to amazing.

One more item that can be used is the Behringer DEQ 2496. This is a digital equalizer that can do room correction. It has dual 31 band graphic equalizers as well as parametric equalization for each channel. One can be purchased for 300 bucks with the ECM 8000 microphone and get excellent results. The device can be used in the digital domain and output to the dac of your choice.

With any of these dsp engines it takes time to learn to use properly. I am still learning after several months. I'd prefer a Tact but money is an issue and my sound is the best I've ever heard anywhere. The learning curve on even the little Behringer is steep. I've seen people sell them that I know couldn't have possibly learned how to use it properly yet. The Behringer is also good if you have little or no options for room treatments because your listening room is your living room or something and the wifey poo won't allow it :nono:

Another person here I know who recently did his room properly estimates any system of value of 1,500 or more should have good room acoustics. I believe this is a good cutoff point.

With good acoustics bass is amazing, imaging splendid and tonal accuracy much much closer to reality. The biggest problem area, the lows, ruin the midrange to a good degree. Being as all rooms have bass modes, assuming they have walls, it's an area that shouldn't be overlooked if possible. Now that I think of it I should come out with a line of furniture that works as room treatments and bass traps :D

95bcwh

Re: RMAF - This was funny!
« Reply #26 on: 27 Oct 2006, 04:29 am »
Here's a good site to get you started:
http://www.realtraps.com/test-cd.htm
It has very good test tone up to 300 Hz.



I, for one, would be interested in that discussion.  Would you guys mind posting it somewhere (acoustics circle?) so others can learn too? 
thanks
jim

warnerwh

Re: RMAF - This was funny!
« Reply #27 on: 27 Oct 2006, 04:51 am »
While you're at Realtraps you should download the "modecalc" program for Windows. All you have to do is put in the dimensions of your room to the nearest inch and hit enter. The modes will be calculated for all three dimensions for you. The more you know about what is wrong in your room the easier it is to fix it.

95bcwh

Re: RMAF - This was funny!
« Reply #28 on: 27 Oct 2006, 04:53 am »
Some times you cannot fix it unless you change your room, e.g. null..

While you're at Realtraps you should download the "modecalc" program for Windows. All you have to do is put in the dimensions of your room to the nearest inch and hit enter. The modes will be calculated for all three dimensions for you. The more you know about what is wrong in your room the easier it is to fix it.

warnerwh

Re: RMAF - This was funny!
« Reply #29 on: 27 Oct 2006, 05:35 am »
Some times you cannot fix it unless you change your room, e.g. null..

While you're at Realtraps you should download the "modecalc" program for Windows. All you have to do is put in the dimensions of your room to the nearest inch and hit enter. The modes will be calculated for all three dimensions for you. The more you know about what is wrong in your room the easier it is to fix it.

You can make any room better though. :wink: