AudioCircle
Industry Circles => Daedalus Audio => Topic started by: audiotom on 12 Mar 2015, 06:02 am
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Following is my review of my new Daedalus speakers
I know you have similar experiences but I wanted to reinforce that and give unabashed enthusiastic positive and informative insight for those considering purchasing Daedalus speakers
Oscar Wilde said - "forgive me for the long letter, I didn't have time to write a short one"
So excuse my lack of brevity
I was able to acquire a second hand pair of Ulysses from Jason (Jriggy) who downsized in the Daedalus lineup to suit his room size. He saw my request for a Daedalus demo on this board and contacted me. There is a big reason you don't see Daedalus listed for sale. He was great walking me through everything with pics galore. Thank you!!
Jason sent these off to Lou for the V2 and trim ring upgrades and Lou was even kind enough to touch the finish up to new status
I received the speakers a couple months ago and was also evaluating and breaking in cable - a few hours at a time. I demo'd Lou's older Daedalus / Wywire speaker cables and went with the current version. Very revealing.
The speakers have been a real revelation for me.
I live in New Orleans - play a little upright bass and see a wide range of music constantly. My son is a music student and plays in several symphonic groups, acoustic guitar, piano and rock bands.
I always am looking first for very natural and neutral tonality. Sometimes that comes at the expense of resolution. Not with the Ulysses.
My room is 14 1/2 deep by 27 wide - my system is on the long wall (preferred orientation with the flow from room to room and view outside)
My system is listed on Audiogon
I am mostly analog on the front end
http://forum.Audition.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?vevol&994629402&view
The high efficiency of the Ulysses has been a godsend. I was able to use my Atmasphere MA1s without strain on the otl which likes to see a high ohm load.
I was able to get a pair of Doshi tube mono blocks to go with my Doshi pre and at 80 watts it is the perfect synergy with the speakers. Wow.
Now the important part
The sound
The speakers
First and formost - the tonality was dead on. Overtones, space - you could hear the subtle resonance of the stringed instruments. Very natural- seamless drivers top to bottom.
Jazz, classical, acoustic, and rock - all dead on.
You could hear subtleties like slight differences it how loud or soft a drummer used his brushes, the guitarist playing further forward or towards the bridge, the open tones of a sax.
Events came in and faded very naturally. Lots of air around the instruments.
Another great thing was that a lot of speakers that play acoustic music well just don't have the punch for rock music. Not so at all. With the Daedalus The dynamic swings are dramatic and it doesn't take a lot of volume to get to a revealing and natural level of impact. Something a lot of speakers lack.Have your cake and eat it too
I love the concept of flat frequency to 30 hz. I've had speakers that go as low as 20 hertz and you sacrifice a lot to get there for diminishing returns. And it limits you to high powered amps that are generally solid state - not my cup of tea on the tonality end. The speakers were lacking nothing on the bottom end, excellent balance, tight natural and controlled bass from 8" drivers. That said my HT room has a JL Audio F113 that handles those subsonics that movie audio guys throw in for chest tingling impact. The sound you feel more than hear. Did not miss a sub or extra low end at all, in fact regarding my room the bass nodes for it's size wouldn 't like the lowest frequencies anyway. The Ulysses have a well defined and properly balanced low end. Jazz upright music I play around the house and know all too well - it was spot on.
I usually prefer a narrow point source for pinpoint imaging with minimal drivers. That is great but the sweet spot ends up being very narrow. Lou's slightly offset angled tweeter design is incredibly refined giving sharp imaging and placement both from left to right but also with depth and height. And the sweet spot is expanded dramatically. Symphonic and jazz music recorded with the ambiance aspects of the hall and musicians - with properly spaced out mics gave a holographic aspect.
Separation of instruments is also there in spades. The layering really broke out. You could feel the size and resonance of drums, the loudness and impact of various instruments and the intent of multi tracked studio masters. Wow. Take for example Crosby, Stills and Nash. I had a hard time distinguishing Crosby in the mix because his voice blended so well with Nash's. The separation with the Ulysses is so good you can hear the timbre in Crosby's voice and it's resonance very distinctly and it is a real treat.
There are too many recordings I could rave about - all but ones with serious flaws (loudness wars, or ear bleeding sharp high end) are engaging. The speakers are going to resolve everything in the source but without adding any coloration on their end. Too many critically lauded speakers color and distort the sound and I am always baffled audio gurus and audiophiles being enamored with them. Flashy sound that doesn't stand up to long listening sessions. Lou's speakers are preceived as mellow when they are really dead on. Importantly I did not feel any aspect of listening fatigue and I am very sensitive to high frequencies.
The speakers really disappear in the room, except visually for their exquisite woodworking. You can tell Lou's guitar amp cabinet designs have had a nice impact on his 2 channel speaker designs and relevant resulting sound. A labor of love and old world craftsmanship
I am really rediscovering my musical collection, seeking out original UK vinyl releases, etc.
Sleep deprivation and cancelling my direct tv to spend most of my time when I am not seeing a live show, at home listening to music. I am a single parent, a long time divorced and last year my son (i have two children) was the last to leave the nest so I basically have no restrictions on my listening habits.
As nice as a major audio component is a key factor in your system, and it is critical, is whether the manufacturer stands behind it. I have built my system from the ground up using great indiependant direct manufacturers. Word of mouth and stellar designs. As you know Lou is a really incredible person and so concerned about your audio satisfaction. I bought my speakers second hand and he treated me as if I were an original owner. He walked me through the V2 upgrade, kept me informed and made sure things were optimally set up, we discussed synergy with my amp options, break in characteristics (take your time - not 24/7) etc and gave room and positioning suggestions. He is still following up with me. I can't say enough about Lou, he really stands behind his product and is a great guy.
For anyone who wants to evaluate the Ulysses and is able to get down to New Orleans, I would be honored to be your host. I am sure this would be a good experience (based on the house sound) for other speakers in the Daedalus line
If New Orleans isn't in the card - consider one of the big audio shows. I heard Lou's Ulysses at Rocky Mountain Audio Fest in October 2011
I know who i will go to when I am looking for speakers to upgrade my ht setup.
Thank you again Lou, in fact I can't thank you enough
And thank you Jason for making this happen
I know I have found my end all speakers and am very happy
I am raptured by the passion of the music, not equipment
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Tom,
That's awesome that you've found such great speakers.
I kind of know what you're so excited about. AC member, 'aldcol' brought his Pans over to my house about ten days ago. We hooked them up to my amp/preamp/DAC, and we let 'em rip for a few hours. Holy shnikies! They stomped the Harbeth 30.1s and Proac Response D2s. Given that demonstration and musicality, I can only guess how great your Ulysses must sound.
Briefly, I toyed with the idea of buying catastrophe's Ulysses, but there's really no good place for that sized speaker in my house. Well, if WAF weren't an issue, there is one room...(never mind)
I'm still working things out, but the Muse may be my ticket. It may take a while before it happens, but I'm pretty excited.
Congratulations! :thumb:
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audiotom:
Speaking of "wow"....I really loved your review. Sooooo much the work of a music lover and musician--you really get at what makes Daedalus speakers so magical and why so many of us have formed lasting ties with Lou. I, too, bought my first pair of Daedalus speakers--the original DA-1's--used after driving to Maryland (I'm in NJ) for a demo. They ended up in the back of my SUV with the road to sonic bliss dead ahead. Lou treated me exactly the same way you described--I was welcomed into the fold with open arms. Since then I bought a new pair of the revised DA-1.1's and have had Lou perform each and every upgrade as he has perfected his craft. I couldn't be happier with the sound I am getting or the joy one feels after stepping off the "merry go round" and simply playing and enjoying music at home. Best to you and thanks again for sharing your thoughtful insights.
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I always am looking first for very natural and neutral tonality. Sometimes that comes at the expense of resolution. Not with the Ulysses.
I know I have found my end all speakers and am very happy
I am raptured by the passion of the music, not equipment
My long (insane?) search for speakers that do justice to the music in a great looking and reasonably sized package has led me to Lou's handiwork. I'm not alone-those who get a pair of his speakers into their homes are very loathe to give them up.
Congratulations. Enjoy your music. Anyone living in NOLA, the most musically rich place I've seen, deserves no less.
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Thanks for taking time to share your thoughts and experiences. I've been following this forum for a few years now but have only recently started posting but I can remember seeing some of your previous speakers so I know you must have found a winner there with the Ulysses.
I've been into audio for a few years now so I'm still learning about how to get great sound and what sound I like and what I don't like. I was wondering if I could pose a question to you and others who have commented here. As of now I really like big dynamic speakers that can play loud and I believe I have found them with the Salk SS8 but I often wonder will my "palate" of audio tastes remain the same for years to come or will they change.
For those of you who are more experienced than I and who have, lets say "been around the block" a few times, does your taste for a certain sounding set of speakers change over time because a) you get older or b) your palate just changes to what you think you really like.
When you mention that Daedalus speakers can sometimes be described as mellow but that in fact they are dead on I first think to myself that I may not be interested in them. Or maybe this will this change over time and a much more mellow speaker is what I actually want. Of course I have yet to hear a pair of Lou's speakers but I am hoping to make a trip this summer to the great Northwest and take some time to visit some Daedalus owners as well as possibly Lou.
One things for sure, it seems a lot of people end up with Daedalus speakers as their destination in this crazy hobby.
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Yeah, mellow/laid back vs. forward/in your face is a big distinction in the speaker world. And finding where your preferences lay on that spectrum is a biggie. Or get one pair of each.
The mellower speakers do have the advantage of likely being less fatiguing. A non-fatiguing forward speaker seems much harder to achieve, tho not impossible. And accompanying gear can Goose things in one direction or the other. Took a lot of steps to get my otherwise fabulous Von Schweikert VR4s to be a smidge less laid back.
Bringing things back to Daedelous speakers, my impression from shows is that accompanying gear can shift the sound a good bit. A good thing in my book. And in my one no-show experience I loved them with Atmasphere gear. Killer combo!
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For those of you who are more experienced than I and who have, lets say "been around the block" a few times, does your taste for a certain sounding set of speakers change over time because a) you get older or b) your palate just changes to what you think you really like.
In my case, I would say that my tastes have not changed over the 47 years in the hobby. My first taste of true high end was the Infinity Servostatic speakers, Infinity's first product, driven by top line Marantz tube gear. It was more "real", more like live music, than anything I'd heard. If that system were around today (and I doubt there are any due to the "flammable" nature of the stats), I believe it would be competitive in the $30K+ bracket today. The illusion was very good indeed.
My 2 favorite speakers of what I've owned are Apogee Diva FR ribbons, and my Daedalus DA-RMa v2s. They are like yin and yang. The Apogees had top to bottom speed and resolution that is as good as I've heard. They put you inside the recording, with the feeling you could walk around the musicians. Almost super-real.
But listening to them for several hours did induce fatigue, and to me, in the live music world, music doesn't really sound that way. I live 8 blocks from Benaroya Hall in dowtown Seattle, home of the Seattle Symphony and one of the clearest, cleanest sounding venues in the world.
http://www.obwilliams.com/benaroya-hall-millwork (http://www.obwilliams.com/benaroya-hall-millwork)
We have some jazz clubs here that are also very fine venues. Listening even from say, row 10, the instruments, while very clear, dynamic and separate, never produce anything like that "type" of fatigue, even when loud.
This presentation is closer to what I hear from my DA-Rma's, and Lou's other models I've heard (Athena,Ulysses). It's ALL there; no loss of detail or spatial information at all compared to any of my very fast ribbons, horns, ceramics, etc., but is presented in an easier (but not laid back), more balanced manner which is more like what I hear from Benaroya and other live venues than many very high end speakers. But when brashness is called for, such as a well recorded trumpet solo or horn ensembles, it has the bite that the instrument has live, but in proper balance. This balance is what is so well handled by the Daedalus. They don't "push" the music so much as they "present" it.
So, I'd say my tastes haven't changed, but there is no one "right" presentation of these recordings, which of course are produced in myriads of ways with hugely different sonic signatures. You can get very satisfying sound in any number of ways, but for me the strong illusion of the sound of live music is a good touchstone. If I get that, I'm there.
For me, the key question is, how enjoyable is the experience, hour after hour, day after day. As we as individuals are different, we will get different answers to that question, hence the disagreements.
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thank you all for your insights
dodgealum - Jersey to Maryland - love it
thank you for the compliments on the review - I was focusing on someone on the "outside" curious about Daedalus as the group here are already initiated. I too am looking forward to replacing the speakers in my other system with Lou's creations.
Jonbee - loved your quote
anyone in NOLA deserves no less
Just caught Elvis Costello solo acoustic last night, opera tonight and a few things next week
I see a lot of classical events so your observations are dead on
Tommy2Tone - Jim makes great speakers and like Lou is one of those great guys who really stands behind things, I have known him since 2006, he is a real master craftsman. I have the Soundscape 10's. The crossover is designed to go too low which hurts the efficiency and I really like the sound, tonality and resolution I just wanted to be able to drive my speakers with a refined modest tube amplifiers. I like Lou's high efficiency approach - it really brings out the dynamics and I really find I'm not missing anything on the low end. The SS8 is a real winner in the Salk line with it's much higher efficiency and merges easier with a wide range of amps. Enjoy the 8s and a trip to the NW. I first heard the Daedalus at RMAF 2011 - I was catching up with Thom Mackris - the manufacturer of my Galibier turntable and was taken with them.
Roscoeii - the "mellow/laid back vs. forward/in your face is a big distinction in the speaker world" indeed
I just cannot understand what people find in brands like Wilson - yet you find they are used the most in rooms at shows.
A lot of people judge by the driver and not the execution. Lou has really looked at the core of the sound and fine tuned it. It's easy to bypass his speakers on a quick hearing for something really flashy. When the finer balance is in what he has perfected. You are not going to find reviews of his speakers in the big audio magazines but the more objective enthusiast groups pick up on their musicality
thanks again
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Great review Tom, and thanks to all for the support! :thumb:
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In reply to Tomy2 and Roscoe,
I would not use the word mellow as that is a descriptive more often used for speakers with a slightly 'veiled' sound. As several have noted in this thread, the Daedalus speakers are not veiled, but are very detailed and revealing.
The comments about live sound vs inside the stage are more accurate, there are differing tastes for how a recording is presented and I will say that these speakers are more for those who want the sound to be closer to a live performance.
Roscoe's comment about associated gear is spot on. A design goal is to make these speakers very revealing of upstream gear and very easy to drive. This allows one to clearly hear the differences in amplifiers, source etc., and makes it easier to tailor a system for the individuals preferences.
thanks again for all the great comments!
lou
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Lou
it's an honor,
I am glad you enjoyed reading the review
too many speakers are too forward and so when one isn't in your face I think that "mellow" part is what people are getting at
When I think of a veiled speaker something like the lower end Vandersteen comes to mind
Those are forgiving and sound okay with low end bright systems. Sludge/murky with something more neutral
My upstream equipment's euphoric aspects are really coming through in spades with the Ulysses.
The synergy is lovely.
Tom
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Lou,
I'd be curious what term you would suggest for the other end of the continuum from "forward"? In my mind a mellow or laid back speaker can still be detailed (my Von Schweikert VR4s I would call laid back yet detailed for example), but this is a challenge for a speaker maker. Just like forward but not too overly bright or fatiguing is a challenge (Vapor does this combo well, in my experience).
And then there are those speakers in the middle between the forward and laid back. Of AC sponsor speakers, I'd say that the Daedelous line and Salk's Exotica 3 fall into that category.
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What a great review audiotom of Lou's Quality and Creative hand work (and those that assist in the shop) :whip: :thumb:
I have also found Lou to be a HUGE support and influence in my voyage into the world of fine audio equipment.
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Lou,
I'd be curious what term you would suggest for the other end of the continuum from "forward"? In my mind a mellow or laid back speaker can still be detailed (my Von Schweikert VR4s I would call laid back yet detailed for example), but this is a challenge for a speaker maker. Just like forward but not too overly bright or fatiguing is a challenge (Vapor does this combo well, in my experience).
And then there are those speakers in the middle between the forward and laid back. Of AC sponsor speakers, I'd say that the Daedelous line and Salk's Exotica 3 fall into that category.
good point!
many have used the term "natural" which I personally find more descriptive of these type of speakers. It's really just semantics and so long as there is context all is good :)
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Tonal balance (bright or warm) is not the same thing as resolution. Lou manages the incredible task of making a slightly warm sounding speaker that is also very high resolution.
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Tonal balance (bright or warm) is not the same thing as resolution. Lou manages the incredible task of making a slightly warm sounding speaker that is also very high resolution.
Well put Tyson.
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Tonal balance (bright or warm) is not the same thing as resolution. Lou manages the incredible task of making a slightly warm sounding speaker that is also very high resolution.
Yes, this gets it very well.
The small warmth does away with the sterility. I think this is part of what I hear in live music that seems to go missing when processed through the recording/playback chain. It is very subtle, and with Lou's speakers happily it does not obfuscate the lower range detail as is usually the case with "warmer" speakers. Lou gets the balance of traits right.
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Per Tyson's remarks, these are my impression as well. I listened to the Athena's extensively at the Capital Audio Fest a couple years ago, they are extremely musical speakers with great tonality. Lou is easy to talk to and very helpful.
NB
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What a great review audiotom of Lou's Quality and Creative hand work (and those that assist in the shop) :whip: :thumb:
I have also found Lou to be a HUGE support and influence in my voyage into the world of fine audio equipment.
Aldcol - we certainly don't want to leave out any of Lou's fellow craftsmen. Thank you for your involvement in the magic. Must be wonderful carving away with Mt Baker as your backdrop and sweet music.
Tonal balance (bright or warm) is not the same thing as resolution. Lou manages the incredible task of making a slightly warm sounding speaker that is also very high resolution.
Indeed!
I hope my review wasn't misleading in that area
Resolution is such a key factor in music. You dont get the separation of instruments, imaging, etc without it
Too many speakers error on the side of resolution at the expense of tonality, body, musicality.
Lou's speakers are very naturally musical with all the resolving qualities
That is a rare feat and oh so enjoyable
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Hi Tom,
You are very welcome but I feel I should be the one expressing gratitude... Thank YOU! You helped my audio path continue during a time of uncertainty and transition. I am so happy The Ulysses are woking well for you. and with a new finnish, I bet they are beautiful all over again...
Happy listening!
this conversation has collectively described Lou's speakers better than I have ever read before... "Natural" ahh yes... Some great quotes on the Daedalus sound guys!
And count me in as another that originally purchased used but was welcomed "into the family" by Lou, and with so much time, help and advice over the past 4 years or so.
I am so happy to be here
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jriggy what are you replacing them with?
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I have the Argos V2 now.
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Jason
The feeling is mutual I'm glad that you were able to find the perfect fit with the Argos
That looks like a great design and going from the older Ulysses to the V2 upgraded Argos, you have been able to lavish in the V2 upgrade.
I didn't mean to misslead anyone with the term "mellow"
It related to people who favor a bright sound
Perhaps the following is more clear
Lou's speakers may be perceived as mellow/ laid back by those who favor an overly forward / bright sound. I found their sonic quality, resolution and engaging character to be natural, accurate and a great listening experience.
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I posted a slightly edited review more appropriate for audiogon
here in the speaker reviews
http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?rspkr&1426366326
I will link it to a thread at some point soon
Feel free to join in and spread the news
Tom
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Tom,
Are you using the MA-1's or the Doshi amps? Wasn't really sure which way you went.
Both are outstanding and you can't really go wrong with either.
I have always loved Lou's speakers and have come close to buying them a few times. The first time I heard them was at the first Rocky Mountain Show. Not only did they sound great playing music, but Lou played his guitar through the speakers and I was simply blown away!!! :bowdown:
Glad it is all working out for you.
George
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Hey George!
I held on to my Atmas (your Atmas)
Even if they went into semi hybernation
Having heard my friend's M60s I knew I had to keep the amps
I recently picked up the Doshi monoblocks - a used pair at that - which are an incredible pairing
The Atma's grain free OTL presentation is spooky
So at this time i like both options and with two preamp outs and a full set of resolving cables i can go from one amp to the other with only a quick changing on the back of the Ulysses.
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I have the Argos V2 now.
Ah OK. So that's up the line; right?
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The Daedalus speakers are quite magical. They don't overwhelm you at first. They are not flashy. They don't grab you by the throat. They aren't "the best" at any specific category. What they are is "great" at every single category in an incredibly balanced way.
After going to RMAF for 10 years and hearing hundreds of speakers, they are 5 brands of speakers I'd personally want to own. Daedalus is one. It wasn't true the first year, I thought they were good but not great. But every year their stature has grown in my judgement. I don't think the speakers themselves necessarily made huge improvements in sound as much as I came to deeply appreciate their evenhanded musicality.
These are speakers that you can grow old with.
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Ah OK. So that's up the line; right?
I consider the Argos and Ulysses to be on the same level of performance, just built for slightly different environments --and of course the Ulysses could handle a bigger space if required. The Argos are voiced just a touch more 'romantic' (to use Lous words) and the offset tweeter gives a slightly different imaging presentation. I did not hear the U's as V2 in my room, so I can not compare them fairly, I just know, for the environment challenges I have, Lou was right, and the Argos work better for me. After a working out a way for me to demo in this space, I knew they were just right for what I needed to achieve.
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I consider the Argos and Ulysses to be on the same level of performance, just built for slightly different environments --and of course the Ulysses could handle a bigger space if required. The Argos are voiced just a touch more 'romantic' (to use Lous words) and the offset tweeter gives a slightly different imaging presentation. I did not hear the U's as V2 in my room, so I can not compare them fairly, I just know, for the environment challenges I have, Lou was right, and the Argos work better for me. After a working out a way for me to demo in this space, I knew they were just right for what I needed to achieve.
Awesome.
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Matching speakers to the room is so key.
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I consider the Argos and Ulysses to be on the same level of performance, just built for slightly different environments --and of course the Ulysses could handle a bigger space if required. The Argos are voiced just a touch more 'romantic' (to use Lous words) and the offset tweeter gives a slightly different imaging presentation. I did not hear the U's as V2 in my room, so I can not compare them fairly, I just know, for the environment challenges I have, Lou was right, and the Argos work better for me. After a working out a way for me to demo in this space, I knew they were just right for what I needed to achieve.
For the most part I do not build to a price point or have an intentional hierarchy of 'quality'. The line is expanding so there are a couple of different approaches but I try to see that every model is built to the highest quality. The major differences in models is to tailor the basic Daedalus design for different applications. I tend to rank them by size and price but as has been noted there are those who prefer the Athena to the Ulysses. The choice for model isn't what is the 'best' we make but what is most suited to one's room and listening style.
I am pleased that Jason found the Argos works for his room, it is not unusual for Daedalus owners to move to different speakers in the line or to return to the line after a brief hiatus, and I take that as a great compliment. Thank You :D
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Tyson, you mentioned "I don't think the speakers themselves necessarily made huge improvements in sound as much as I came to deeply appreciate their evenhanded musicality."
I purchased my Ulysses speakers in 2008 and they subsequently went back to Lou for the all-poly crossover upgrade and then for the V2 upgrade. With each upgrade I heard significant improvements in clarity and detail.
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Tyson, you mentioned "I don't think the speakers themselves necessarily made huge improvements in sound as much as I came to deeply appreciate their evenhanded musicality."
I purchased my Ulysses speakers in 2008 and they subsequently went back to Lou for the all-poly crossover upgrade and then for the V2 upgrade. With each upgrade I heard significant improvements in clarity and detail.
Tyson, thanks for the 'appreciation', and Frank thanks for putting up with all the upgrades :icon_lol:
I think what Tyson is getting at is there has been a consistent tonality of the speakers over the years, but Frank is right the evolution has been dramatic, with huge improvements in sonic quality while maintaining the sense of live music tonality. Many have been immediately drawn to these speakers because of that tonality while others wanted more detail etc., I would hope that people who have heard them previously will revisit them, the improvements of the last few years are not subtle. :)
thanks,
lou
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I would hope that people who have heard them previously will revisit them, the improvements of the last few years are not subtle. :)
thanks,
lou
Deal. As long as I can play my music at RMAF I'll be there. :thumb:
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Great thread that really unpacks what makes Daedalus speakers special. Two things--I would just affirm what fwinston pointed out--that the system upgrades Lou has introduced over the years have resulted in a significant improvement in the sound but one that comes without any loss of the critical attributes that make Daedalus speakers unique. I began with an early pair of DA-1.1s which went back for the AP crossovers and then subsequently the V2 upgrades. I have also added the trim rings and outriggers. The original DA-1.1 was a great speaker but the upgrades have taken the sound to a whole different level. Each time I sent the speakers back to Lou I (needlessly) worried that I was going to lose the essential musicality and tonal correctness that caused me to purchase them in the first place. What came back was a speaker that retained all the things I loved and gave me so much more. Also, I think the discussion about "forward" and "laid back" is an interesting one that I have contemplated since becoming a Daedalus owner. To my ears the Daedalus speakers are among the very, very few that I have heard that manage to present the music in a "you are there" kind of way without inducing any listening fatigue. Not sure how Lou pulls this off but it is one of the critical ways in which his designs differ from other speakers that often cost much, much more. Anyway, I'm just repeating what has already been said here but this is one of the few threads I have seen that really gets at what my experience with Daedalus has been all about and why I've been a fan for so long.
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Of course I have yet to hear a pair of Lou's speakers but I am hoping to make a trip this summer to the great Northwest and take some time to visit some Daedalus owners as well as possibly Lou.
One things for sure, it seems a lot of people end up with Daedalus speakers as their destination in this crazy hobby.
Tomy2Tone,
I am in Spokane and more than happy to have you stop in and listen to my Daedalus DA-1.1 v2, both with and without the twin BOWs if you make it to the Northwest. Just send me a PM if you are headed this way.
I must be working way too hard because I haven't checked in on this thread since the 11th and it already is 2 pages. :lol: Tom, thank you for the great review. You did an eloquent job of describing what many of us have come to know as the Daedalus sound. Others who have chimed in express many of the characteristic I fell in love with when I heard my first pair of Daedalus speakers at my first RMAF in 2005. They were the original DA-1s. I had been a B & W girl up until that point, having owned Matrix 2 and 803D Matrix speakers. I was searching for new speakers when I wandered into Lou's room. I immediately was struck by the appearance and craftsmanship even before I heard them. My first listening impression was the tonal accuracy I heard with good detail across the full music spectrum. As those of you who know me, I am all about rock--no jazz, no classical, no opera, no hip hop. Lou graciously allowed me to play selections that ranged from Dylan & Neil Young to U2, Coldplay, The Beatles and String Cheese Incident. My budget was not yet ready for new speakers so I left Denver with Lou's speakers on my short list.
I returned to RMAF the next year ready to purchase new speakers and spent quite a bit of time in Lou's room listening to lots of different music from acoustic to hard rock. I wanted to make sure what I heard the year before was what I wanted in new speakers. Before the show was over, I bought the show demos in Cherry. Once in my system, I knew I had made the right choice. They were superior to the B & Ws in tonal accuracy, detail, dynamics, imaging, and bass. The mid range was comparable. And as many have stated ITT, they are absolutely non-fatiguing.
I was completely satisfied until I heard the DA-1.1s at RMAF in 2007. :) I ordered a pair of DA-1.1s before the show was over. They did everything the DA-1s did, just better, especially in the midrange and low bass extension. I like the offset tweeters that provide a wider sweet spot. I needed to sell my DA-1s and it turned out my golf instructor/coach is an audiophile and a huge Zeppelin fan. He had a Cary tube amp & pre amp and Polk Audio speakers. I talked him into taking the DA-1s and spend some time listening. He did, but told me he couldn't afford them. Then he called me and said he didn't realize how good the DA-1s were until he put the Polks back in his system and we made a deal where he paid me over time and in working on my swing and short game. A win-win solution and I didn't have to ship them. :thumb:
Since then I have faithfully incorporated each upgrade from the all poly crossover (audible improvement) to the v2 upgrade (huge audible improvement) to the Trim Rings (audible improvement). If you have an older pair of Lou's speakers and haven't had them upgraded, especially the v2 upgrade, stop what you are doing and send those speakers back to Lou immediately. Your ears will thank you for the rest of your life.
A couple of years ago, I added a pair of BOWs. They really are foundational and not only add to the excellent low end extension of the DA-1.1s, they allow the highs and midrange to come into focus even better than before with improved clarity and detail. They also deliver when the music contains the low note on a Hammond B-3.
I have heard every model in the Daedalus line and they all bear the trademark of tonal accuracy, great dynamics, easy to drive, exceptional detail and clarity. They give you a "you are there" live music presentation. They are speakers for life.
Over the course of the last 10 years, Lou and I have become good friends (despite being polar opposites politically :green: :lol:). He is a great human being, a great craftsman and a great friend. He stands behind his product and really appreciates his customers.
Great thread!
Laura
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The Daedalus speakers are quite magical. They don't overwhelm you at first. They are not flashy. They don't grab you by the throat. They aren't "the best" at any specific category. What they are is "great" at every single category in an incredibly balanced way.
After going to RMAF for 10 years and hearing hundreds of speakers, they are 5 brands of speakers I'd personally want to own. Daedalus is one. It wasn't true the first year, I thought they were good but not great. But every year their stature has grown in my judgement. I don't think the speakers themselves necessarily made huge improvements in sound as much as I came to deeply appreciate their evenhanded musicality.
These are speakers that you can grow old with.
I got several PM's that asked me what my other top 5 RMAF speaker favorites are after hitting the show for 10 years, so I thought I'd post them here - the Daedalus Athena, TAD Reference One, Serenity Acoustics Super 7, Mockingbird Audio LSX and the Vapor Nimbus. I know that's tilted heavily to AC vendors, but IMO the vendors here on AC really are a step up over the rest.
There are a few others that are also quite good but not at the very top level of the above speakers that I wouldn't mind owning that I've heard - the Focal Grand Utopia, the Sonus Faber Amati Stradivari Homage, the Estelon X-Diamond, the Odyssey Kismet, the King Sound King III, Emerald Physics EP-X, and the Zellaton Studio Reference One are all outstanding. But not as good as the Daedalus Athenas, IMO. Add to the fact that most of those other brands are veneered or painted MDF and the Daedalus speakers are solid hardwood and it's clear which would be my top choice if I ever went back to a box speaker.
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Vinyl lady
Thanks for the compliments and great audio progression. I enjoy your postings here. I bet your golf pro is looking to give a few more lessons. Tee two for V2 anyone?
As nice as rock is to test a speaker in all it's various splendor, well recorded minimally mic'd spatial performances in jazz and classical can bring a scary sense of tonality and imaging. Some older than 65 years
I appreciate everyone's comments and enthusiasm in this thread
Tom.