AudioCircle
Audio/Video Gear and Systems => Single Driver, Wide-Bandwidth Speakers => Topic started by: shooter on 14 Mar 2011, 11:45 pm
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My speaker chasing is over.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=44208)
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Looks sexy but their communication via Ebay is beyond terrible. When they were hawking their specialized wares in Ebay, their answers were pretty much nil. Looking at it, it must cost plenty of euros but plunking euros to a company or individuals that are mute, it is a risk.
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Links, price, details?
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Yes, I took the risk, it is the best bet I have every done, they sounded real, I can understand Rullit's attitude on ebay, they are way under valued, the craftmanship and materials are superb, I won't trade them with my friend's Wilson Alexandria.
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They look incredible. Are they supported by a sub?
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How did you get these? Was it via an Ebay listing or direct communication? I do not even see a Rullit specialized site or anything.
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They have full output to the upper 30's, I have Muse 18 right now, but they can't keep up with these horns, I am planning to borrow my friends Seismic sub and give it a try.
They are driven by John Wiesner built Dr. Arthur Loesch designed 300B, 50, 10y convertible amps with Tango Permalloy output transformers.
I bought the drivers only, and have my audiophile master furniture builder friend built from the plan supplied by Oleg Rullit.
Rullit's site
http://www.field-coil.com/
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Hey!
Cooooool!!!!!! 8) Man! They look incredible!
Fit my theory and believe perfectly when is come to Single Driver speaker... Go BIG!!!!
I guess I don't have to ask for the $$$$ because I'm sure I can't afford them :icon_lol:
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i bought them off ebay for a great price for such drivers, they are all hand made including the cellulose for the cones, they have leather surround and phenolic spiders, I am running about 160vdc choke loaded power supply on the field coils.
I have them in open baffle in typical plywood for 9 months and confirm the quality of the sound before commission to have them build, the horns start out with over 500lb of hardwood.
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stunning!
I love threads like this one and there is a nice thread on these over at diyaudio as well with some input from Mr. Rullit.
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My speaker chasing is over.
Those are beautiful. Where are you located? If you're near by, I'd love to give them a listen.
---Gary
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Dallas, Texas.
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Dallas, Texas.
A bit too far away for a quick listen - I'm in California.
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Come to Lone Star Audio Fest, it is in May. You will probably hear Dave Slagle's Field coil Lowther with Jeffrey Jackson's wood horns, which is also superb, I much preferred it to the open baffle with the same driver at RMAF, you can come over for a listen after the show.
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Hello to the community,
the project presented by shooter is the result of at least ten years research for a music reproduction as authentic as possible. The thing has always been music for me - not merely "sound", and I have always avoided to use terms like "sound quality". I'm going to be more explicite on this subject soon.
I apologize for the poor communication during the last years. Developing and building new projects has always taken a lot of time, up to 16 hours a day, and I also have to mention that the field-coil.com website isn't run by me. It wasn't before December 2010 that I received the whole batch of emails that had been addressed to me via this site. But things will change. We are about to enlargen our team and thus improve our communication as well as our presence in internet communities and forums. We won't be online permanently, but at least twice or three times a week.
By the way, the project mentioned above is, so to speak, high-graded "State of the Art", but there are smaller versions to be presented in the U.S., also two-way combinations based on Rullit Aero 8 + Rullit 15 Sandwich.
@JohnR: We will be more elaborate on authentic bass reproduction in another posting.
We are happy that we have found the Audio Circle forum, and we are looking forward to sharing new projects with you.
A new Atelier Rullit website is being build up at the moment.
Best regards,
Atelier Rullit
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Oleg, thanks for posting on this thread.
Some listening impression of the drivers from a friend when they were mounted on open baffles, also there is a picture of my drivers on his blog, he heard the horns a few days ago, I think there will be a follow up.
http://audio.innerurban.com/
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(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=44403)
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=44404)
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All I can say is wow. And wow. And wow some more. They look absolutely gorgeous. They would look incredible in my 100 year old bungalow. However, I can't sacrifice that much stand-off from the back wall.
How low do these play?
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I have not measure them in these horns, when in open baffle they have plenty of output at 40hz, so I think they will do upper 30's.
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what's the $$$ ballpark of this project - drivers, wood, hands?
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I have not measure them in these horns, when in open baffle they have plenty of output at 40hz, so I think they will do upper 30's.
Awesome. I don't have a use for anything that can't do at least 40 Hz. I don't miss anything under 30 Hz. Man, I wish I had enough room...
And as others have asked, how many $ was it, etc?
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Well, it is a difficult question for me to answer how much $, the speakers were built by a master furniture maker he is also my best friend and tenant, so there was a lot of bartering on the build. I asked him how much if he is going to build another pair, he told me at least $ 15,000 there is a lot of labor in building the horns, you can see the curves are super smooth all done by hand. As for the drivers, what I bought were prototypes off ebay they are serial number 1 and 2, I don't really know if others like this pair exist or how much if you have to buy from Oleg. Then you have to build a very good power supply, preferably with tube and choke loaded, which all the parts were already at hand and I don't have to buy anything for them, all in all not a cheap project, but they do challenge the very best out there.
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Mike, I'm with you on 30/40 Hz comment.
No way around it, horns get huge to go deep.
These prices make my Bob Brines FTA-2000's look really good ($3500/pair including EnABLing and Behringer DEQ, less efficient, but they reach below 30 Hz in room with AlNiCo magnets).
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Hi JLM, your Bob Brine FTA-2000 are really nice, heard them many time at LSAF, my previous speakers were a pair of Lowther DX4 Basszilla diamond edition bi-amped, they are also wonderful, but these horns are in a different league, my system changed from really good hi-fi to almost live.
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Impressive comment, I'm sure much of the sense of "live" comes from improved dynamics, which admittedly is probably the biggest fault of the Fostex F200A. The addition of EnABL helps mid/high resolution and DEQ produced flat frequency response helps "make sense" out of the entire extended midrange. I haven't found any other audiophile that has ever heard this combination of enhancements. And BTW, I have a fully compliant Cardas room/setup that really "locks in" imaging.
Wish I could relate better to your story as I don't know you or any of the vendor's products and have never heard large front loaded full range horns. How much bracing is used? IMO that is a major weak point of most horns. OTOH these don't look as deep/restricting as most, so the high pressures/compression and flexing of the horn walls (that all contribute to "horn sound") would probably not be there.
The speakers appear to be acting as open baffle dipoles with limited front horn loading. My experience with open baffles is that they produce a large/diffused soundstage with non-specific imaging, but that the bass loading of the space is quite effective with improved dynamics. Just not my cup of tea. Besides the cost and required room size is beyond my reach. :oops: (No sour grapes here, we each have our slants.) These are striking to look at and read about, and I'm sure are very impressive.
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JLM, Thanks for your reply, I agree with you on EnABLing, it does lower distortion, in 2008 when it was first debuted at the RMAF at the Lowther room in an after hour comparison between EnABLed and non EnABL lowther drivers, there were 4 person in the audition, I was one of the participants, I immediately heard the difference, you can find my comment about that audition buried somewhere in the long DIYaudio thread. About the Rullit drivers someone at DIYaudio commented these driver came with EnABLing in the cone construction already, interesting stuff!
I also own a DEQ to I try to get more warmth out of the low-mid of my home built ER audio ELS3 electrostatic speaker, also a fascinating speakers, amazing sound staging and detail but limited in low bass response, I never got the most out of those speakers after I discovered low power set amplifiers, I changed direction to high efficiency speakers.
The sense of liveness I mention comes from more that just dynamics, it is the combination dynamics and the massive wave front that it can produce that create the sense of scale that is almost impossible to reproduce in direct radiators, the detail came from the solid structure that no cabinet vibration is allowed to blur the sound reproduction, every detail and nuance is just there.
Please check out the link to audio.innerurban posted earlier in the thread, an audio and music site by an audiophile friend whom I met at Dave Slagle and Jeffrey Jackson's room at last year's LSAF, he has just posted his impressions of the horns. BTW Dave's Lowther field coil and Jeffrey's 160hz wood horns are a wonderful combination, it is from that audition that started my journey to commit to build these big wood horns.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=44422)
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By the way, the project mentioned above is, so to speak, high-graded "State of the Art"
Mr. Rullit, do you consider your 15" field coil speakers http://good-times.webshots.com/album/578337836OyipDm to be better than these ones? What is the difference (in emotional aspect) between them?
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Can't imagine what size the horns might be, these are already 4' wide and almost 5' tall, I usually sits about 20' away.
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Mr. Rullit, do you consider your 15" field coil speakers http://good-times.webshots.com/album/578337836OyipDm to be better than these ones? What is the difference (in emotional aspect) between them?
Hello RE604,
both, the 12" and the 15" field coils, have been developed for a, so to speak, highly "emotional" music reproduction. Yet I cannot define neither as "better", it's a bit like answering the question whether a rallye car is "better" than a formula 1. The 15" has been created specifically for open baffles, while the 12" is designed for front loaded horns.
The decision for either of them depends on the music you are preferring. There are music enthusiasts that you might call omnivores, for they may be as fond of Kraftwerk and Yello as they are for Schumann and Schubert. These should run front loaded horns. Open baffles, in contrast, have to be tailored to the genre of music they are going to play.
At the moment, I'm working on an 8" full range field coil driver Super Aero 8 in a front loaded horn. For the present, it's the terminal stop for me. They are fantastic, playing any music high resolutive and emotionally at the same time.
Kind regards,
Oleg Rullit
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Thank you for the explanation, Mr. Rullit.
I’m also very curious about your new Super Aero project. How did you choose the size of 8”? I’m asking for that, because the bigger wide range drivers have better sense of scale, making the reproduced music more physical and more life-like. I have never used front horns and I don’t have any idea how does an 8” driver loaded with front horn is going to sound. Most of my listening (let’s say >98%) is to classical music, old time jazz and opera. I’m using a pair of 12” field coil wide band drivers, taken from old (1938) radios, which are mounted on big plywood open baffles, but I’m opened for any alternatives if they are going to provide more musical joy to me. Please keep us posted about you new Super Aero speakers when you finish the prototypes :)
I saw you use special hand made paper in your present Aero speakers: http://field-coil.com/Aero/Aero,%20cones%20&%20coils,%20big.jpg
I suppose you are going to use the same cones for your new Super Aero project , and may be the magnet system will be of your own recipe?
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I love these. I just wanted to add that.
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Hello,
Some time has passed - any updates on the project?
Best,
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I see Atelier Rullit is also making - or has made - compression drivers for horns. I did a search trying to find an active web page (no luck), but did find this large pair of cellulose diaphragm compression drivers currently on sale on eBay for $6900 or $8900; it's not clear.
http://tinyurl.com/bnc6tjr
There seems to be other Rullit action on German eBay - look at some of these drivers!
http://tinyurl.com/cn7xvg6
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I first posted this over 2 years ago, the only change is adding a pair of bullet tweeters from Fostex on top, am still deeply satisfied with its sound, they truly communicate the beauty of music.
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stunning!
I love threads like this one and there is a nice thread on these over at diyaudio as well with some input from Mr. Rullit.
Could you provide a link to the particular thread, please?
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I think this is the thread.
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full-range/162861-i-want-these-12-field-coil-ebay.html
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After more than 5 months of waiting, my patience has been rewarded, just received my pair of field coil Rullit super 8, will need to construct a new power supply for it. Plan to try in open baffle first eventually go into a pair of horns.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=106031)
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Those look beautiful. Would love to hear a pair of his drivers someday.
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Thanks, if you ever comes to Dallas Texas you are welcome for a listen.
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After more than 5 months of waiting, my patience has been rewarded, just received my pair of field coil Rullit super 8, will need to construct a new power supply for it. Plan to try in open baffle first eventually go into a pair of horns.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=106031)
Hi Shooter, what ever became of these drivers and what are your impressions? They sure look the part and BTW the first speakers that you posted are stunning as well!
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I am still waiting on parts for my power supply, those high voltage and high current selenium rectifiers are not easy to find, hopefully they will be up and running in another month or so.
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Thanks, I will be checking back quite often!
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A quick impression while the drivers are still breaking in, these 8" drivers provide even better resolution and imaging than my 12" drivers, no tweeters are needed, the high frequency has more tonality than most ribbon tweeters I have heard, although the Fostex T500mkII super tweeter do have a bit more shimmer on the very top, the bass is quick and has great tone, my friend thought I had subwoofer and was surprised when I told him all that bass came from just a pair of 8" full range drivers, the midrange naturalness is comparable to the Quad 57, the 12"s do sound warmer but the 8" sound more open in comparison, I am very pleased with their performance.
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How big is the open baffle you are using for these?
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Thanks for coming back and giving a few words on them. +1 to Russell's question and also ... do you have any pics you can share? :thumb:
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I hope to make my way into Dallas early next year. I'd love to hear these and your 12" drivers. I'm a big fan of fullrange drivers.
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My speaker chasing is over.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=44208)
spectacular speakers
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Stevenz, You are welcome to come for a listen in the spring. FYI I will be out of the country late February through 2nd week in March.
Here is the 8" driver temporary mounted in the 12" horn, loading is not optimum, just for testing.
(http://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=109070)
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Wow, I just never get tired of looking at those beautiful speakers! :thumb:
Are you going to build new horns to accommodate the new drivers or going to modify your current ones for optimum loading?
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An extension is being considered to work with the 8" drivers for better loading, unfortunately it won't be anytime soon.
My original plan was to put them in a 160hz Azura type horns, with 4-15" woofers.
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Any further updates on the 8" drivers? I've been in talks with Oleg lately and am very tempted to give his drivers a try. Still haven't made it up to Dallas though. However maybe next year i'll be able to hook up with you one day and have a listen if you've still got these speakers.
Cheers,
Steven
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The 8" has stayed in the horns, the system sounds amazing. As I stated in the very first post "my speaker chasing is over", after almost 6 years that statement stays true. So far there is nothing I desire to replace them regardless of cost.
BTW there are 2 more pairs of Rullit Lab series open baffle speaker being built in the DFW area. I haven't heard them yet, drivers are still running in and I should be able to hear them soon. Impression from owners are very positive but told the sound is different from my Super Aeros.
I am also hoping to use my 12" field coil to build a simpler design in 2017.
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Shooter, apologies for old thread post...i'm in process of starting this same project and would love to contact you for more info on your experiences...is there a good way you'd prefer to correspond if not through this thread? Thank you! Jay
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Are you using Rullit drivers? If you are which one?
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Yes, I will be...purchase in process. 10" Super Aeros. Two of my buddies have the slightly smaller versions. We're experimenting with cabinets and open baffles. Both of their systems sound amazing. May I assume yours are in full swing still?
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Fantastic! I have my 12" field coil in open baffle first, the horns sound much better though, never try them in a box. An internet friend in Australia has his Aero 8 in a Telefunken style open baffle box and loved it, you may have read about them online. There are two there pairs of 9" Aero horns like mine being build locally at this moment. You can contact me through private message.
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I may not have enough posts to do that...can you PM me?
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Shooter, whereabouts in Dallas? I'm gonna be in Frisco in a week.
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Near Downtown, only in Dallas part time these days.
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Hi, I just bought some Rullit lab8 field coil speakers and they’re coming to me from Germany. Really looking forward to them. I appreciate your comments and might appreciate your help if needed.
Thanks, Gary
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It appears that Rullit drivers are still available:
https://www.ebay.com/sch/atelierrullit/m.html?item=330922802181&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2562
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@ shooter: i have Rullit Aero 9 field coil driver. Appreciate
(https://www.audiocircle.com/image.php?id=209463)
if you can share the open baffle plan
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They sound best in large front loaded horns.
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Two questions: does Rullit have 8" fullrange driver that could work in Open Baffle setup?
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Many I know have used them in open baffles including myself while waiting for the horns.
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Two questions: does Rullit have 8" fullrange driver that could work in Open Baffle setup?
Oleg did a 8'' Field Coil revied here:
http://glowinthedarkaudio.com/rullit-lab8.html
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Oleg did a 8'' Field Coil revied here:
http://glowinthedarkaudio.com/rullit-lab8.html
But he sold them after owning the Zenith 49CZ852's for 18 months. See para 4 here:
http://glowinthedarkaudio.com/zenith-49cz852.html
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That’s Rullit entry level drivers with vintage cones, Khoadda’s have the handmade cone’s and much larger field coil motor.
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Many I know have used them in open baffles including myself while waiting for the horns.
Thank you. I will keep an eye out fo 8".