[RDavidson]

Just remember some of the recommendations out here can kill you too!

Toss some butter and coconut oil into your morning coffee, froth it up and you should be good until lunch. Do a search on bulletproof coffee if you want more details.

BTW if you want protein powder without artificial sweetener, look at he D'Adamo proteins. They are free of crap, I think.

I actually have a half fat (15g fat vs about 30g fat) "accelerator" coffee (with heavy cream and coconut oil) in the morning myself. It is essentially the same thing as bulletproof coffee, but with 10 grams of protein added. The point of either of these coffee recipes is to prolong a fasted state after waking up, while giving the body an energy source that won't spike insulin. Coconut oil is great because its fatty acid profile is primarily of medium chain triglycerides. The body can process these fats quickly for energy. Caffeine is a thermogenic (ie fat burner). The small amount of protein puts some BCAA's in your system and helps thwart catabolism. About 10 grams has been found to be the amount of protein the body can intake without causing a blip in insulin. I really don't know how this would work for a diabetic, so I wouldn't recommend it blindly. But for everyone else, it's great (if you're looking to lose weight, assuming the rest of your diet is aligned and you have about a 12% calorie deficit daily). Just don't eat anything with the coffee or you mess up the point of it. A full fat coffee (about 30g fat) can indeed stave off hunger till lunch time (if not longer for some people). I don't do it because 30g of fat is like 33% of my daily fat intake. I like having a little more diet flexibility, in case I want a big fat hamburger later in the day without worrying about going overboard on fats and calories.

[Early B.]

+1 John!     Thanks again, everyone.  I'm getting the idea that juicing really doesn't fit my needs nutritionally, especially in correlation to my Type2 diabetes.  Maybe a lo-fat, yogurt based smoothie with some sort of lo-carb supplement or protein powder would be better for me...???  I will do some research and ask my Dr. as well.

Don't waste your time asking your doctor. They know nothing about nutrition. And a typical nutritionist knows slightly more about nutrition than doctors, but not much.

A protein drink in the morning made with sugar-free whey isolate protein powder with almond milk and gelatinized maca is great. Add some raw nuts or raw nut butter. If you want to spice it up, add a sliver of raw ginger and cinnamon. Should be no worries about spiking your blood sugar.   

[RDavidson]

Don't waste your time asking your doctor. They know nothing about nutrition. And a typical nutritionist knows slightly more about nutrition than doctors, but not much. 

+1 Doctors and nutritionists have very broad, general, knowledge and know how to address issues from certain angles. A nutritionist is a little better, but likely won't have a focus on your specific caloric or macro nutrient needs nor really know how to assess it. Dietician is best ; One with a lot of experience working with a wide range of people of various levels of health (diabetics, athletes, young, old, etc, etc).

[Folsom]

Yes, that's why I like to specific down to phenotype. And I use information like I posted, that's very specific.

In case no one read the studies (or understood them) basically it's a gurantee that with the proven low IAP with a fat diet like paleo (red meat primarily) will cause metabolic syndrome (Type 2 diabtes related). The only way to know is based on if you have the ABO antigen A, and don't have a FUT2 gene of non-secretor. For reasons unknown to me, this overly clear peer reviewed information isn't being used to help people. It's malpractice in my mind.

[Early B.]

For reasons unknown to me, this overly clear peer reviewed information isn't being used to help people. It's malpractice in my mind.

There's lots of good research out there, but it's not for public consumption. The medical industrial complex has no interest in improving your health. The sicker you are, the wealthier the doctors, pharmaceutical companies, etc. become. In some cases, the medical industry will create an "illness" merely to fuel the demand for addictive drugs -- ritalin/adderall and ADHD is a good example of hooking children on drugs. Kinda makes you wonder where stuff like Ebola really comes from. Hmmm.....   

You gotta learn how to adopt a healthier lifestyle on your own. Begin by seeking insight from the oldest members of your family. Talk to people who have been vegans for like 20 years or more (they've pretty much tried eveything). Also, study the nutritional technology afforded to high performance athletes.

[RDavidson]

Only on AC........While helping another member, we go from talking about juicing to medical malpractice and conspiracy theory.

I think this thread has run its course.

[BobRex]

You gotta learn how to adopt a healthier lifestyle on your own. Begin by seeking insight from the oldest members of your family. Talk to people who have been vegans for like 20 years or more (they've pretty much tried eveything). Also, study the nutritional technology afforded to high performance athletes.

And this is where some of this falls apart.....  If I talk to my oldest family members, I'll be talking to Pennsylvania Dutchmen whose diets were strictly meat (frequently sausages and bacon, with plenty of breads), little vegetables (corn, green beans, peas, salads only with bacon dressing,...) and they all lived, and contributed, into at least their early eighties, sometimes nineties.  Oh, and they also smoked, drank, and didn't exercise, per se.  Not one died from coronary disease.

So if I use that template, everything you guys are discussing is pure BS.  It's the genes!

[Early B.]

And this is where some of this falls apart.....  If I talk to my oldest family members, I'll be talking to Pennsylvania Dutchmen whose diets were strictly meat (frequently sausages and bacon, with plenty of breads), little vegetables (corn, green beans, peas, salads only with bacon dressing,...) and they all lived, and contributed, into at least their early eighties, sometimes nineties.  Oh, and they also smoked, drank, and didn't exercise, per se.  Not one died from coronary disease.

So if I use that template, everything you guys are discussing is pure BS.  It's the genes!

You missed the point. The suggestion is to talk to older people who have knowledge of healthy lifestyles and how to heal using natural remedies, herbs, etc.  It obviously wouldn't make sense to talk to an older person to learn how to screw up your health. You already know how to do that. Oh, and the "it's in the genes" argument doesn't make sense because you have the same genes they do. They gave them to you.

[RDavidson]

And this is where some of this falls apart.....  If I talk to my oldest family members, I'll be talking to Pennsylvania Dutchmen whose diets were strictly meat (frequently sausages and bacon, with plenty of breads), little vegetables (corn, green beans, peas, salads only with bacon dressing,...) and they all lived, and contributed, into at least their early eighties, sometimes nineties.  Oh, and they also smoked, drank, and didn't exercise, per se.  Not one died from coronary disease.

So if I use that template, everything you guys are discussing is pure BS.  It's the genes!

Yes, our genes definitely play a big role in aspects of our health and body composition, etc., but there's no need to exacerbate handed-down problems by also eating bad and taking on unhealthy habits. That's a glass half empty way to look at things. Despite genetics, we are, quite literally what we eat and that's something we have control over. Honestly, eating healthy isn't rocket science. It just takes will power and control to not eat the garbage we're surrounded by every day. It can be very difficult, as eating garbage foods can easily become an addiction. People need to recognize this. There's a reason we tend to crave junk, and not healthy foods. Junk foods tend to be quick energy sources (due to simple carbs). Our bodies are made to be efficient. So if you're always giving your body quick energy sources, guess what the brain does when you're running low. That's right! It signals you to eat this type of food again. Something that also sucks about simple carbs is that they can make us feel good, due to chemicals the brain releases when these foods are eaten. That's why when you're feeling down or depressed and eat "comfort food" they can effectively pick you up (temporarily). You have to break the cycle. It can take as little as 5-10 days to "reprogram" the brain to not rely on getting simple carbs. This can be very difficult, and you will experience withdrawals, but if you push through and continue to eat healthy / whole foods, the cravings for junk don't necessarily go away, but you won't feel like YOU MUST have them all the time. It's mind over matter.

[thunderbrick]

It's mind over matter.

True.  If you don't mind, it doesn't matter.   

We all have genes, and intermarriage (or inbreeding, as in some states) tends to determine what your susceptibility to disease is.  That's why they ask for family history.   Diabetes, heart disease, sickle-cell anemia, etc. can run in a family.  Sure, that family can eat the same way for generations and that can lead to problems, but there are no one-size-fits all answers.  Dietitians don't diagnose; they develop treatment plans based on tests the doctors run.   

The drug firms react to documented problems, such as Ebola and various cancers where the survival rate is constantly improving.  You may have a point (pun intended) on products like Viagra, but that's like plastic surgery; it's more of a "want" than a "need."

Want an industry that "invents" a need?  Look no further than "pop/country/hip-hop" dreck that is mass-produced. It get's trotted out as the next best thing.  And we eat that stuff up and it rots our brains. 

[BobRex]

You missed the point. The suggestion is to talk to older people who have knowledge of healthy lifestyles and how to heal using natural remedies, herbs, etc.  It obviously wouldn't make sense to talk to an older person to learn how to screw up your health. You already know how to do that. Oh, and the "it's in the genes" argument doesn't make sense because you have the same genes they do. They gave them to you.

Perhaps you've missed my point.  In many parts of the country, the diet I described IS a healthy lifestye.  And you don't have to heal if there's nothing to heal.  I don't know of any 80 year old vegans in my circle, in fact, I can only think of one 60some vegetarian, and he's been at it for so long that he fefuses to preach his lifestyle.  According to my doctor, my health isn't screwed up, I'm 56, low blood pressure, acceptable cholesterol, he's not worried about my weight, I don't take any pills beyond the occasional ibuprofin.  So how is my health screwed up?

[Early B.]

Perhaps you've missed my point.  In many parts of the country, the diet I described IS a healthy lifestye. 

You're confusing two different things.  A poor diet is never healthy. Just because someone lived to be 90 years old on a poor diet doesn't mean he lived a healthy lifestyle. Also, keep in mind that diet is only one of many factors that comprise a healthy lifestyle.

[RDavidson]

You're confusing two different things.  A poor diet is never healthy. Just because someone lived to be 90 years old on a poor diet doesn't mean he lived a healthy lifestyle. Also, keep in mind that diet is only one of many factors that comprise a healthy lifestyle.

Yup. Anecdotal info/cases shouldn't be used as universal info for all to use. For maybe the 3rd time, I'll reiterate that WE'RE ALL DIFFERENT and have differing caloric / macro nutrient needs. But one thing that certainly holds true, regardless of who you are, is that a healthy diet and exercise is universally beneficial. Indeed, a dietitian cannot diagnose anything, but they can turn a doctor's findings into something actionable (in terms of making lifestyle changes), and not simply relying on drugs to fix all our ailments.

[thunderbrick]

True.  An Amish diet might be fine for a farmer who works his ass off, but not for an office worker.  I've never seen a fat Amish farmer.  Or a fat farmer of any stripe, for that matter.

[thunderbrick]

dietitian cannot diagnose anything, but they can turn a doctor's findings into something actionable (in terms of making lifestyle changes), and not simply relying on drugs to fix all our ailments.

That's exactly right!  That's their function.
It's really up to our own responsibility and choices, but there are tons of pseudo "cures" out there.  Some believe magnets are great at curing ailments.  If you know someone who believes that, ask them what treatment they suggest for hemorrhoids……………...

[RDavidson]

That's exactly right!  That's their function.
It's really up to our own responsibility and choices, but there are tons of pseudo "cures" out there.  Some believe magnets are great at curing ailments.  If you know someone who believes that, ask them what treatment they suggest for hemorrhoids……………...

I just wish people would stop looking for the "magic bullet." It's ridiculous.
It usually takes years for the really harmful affects (cancer etc) of bad choices (smoking, poor diet, being sedentary) to show up, and yet people want a quick fix. There is no quick fix! You worked hard at messing yourself up, so you're going to have to work hard at undoing what you've done. I'm not speaking for everyone, as I know some are born with diseases, conditions, etc or have been in accidents which caused a downward health spiral. But for all other Americans who are just obese and on their way to a life of a lot of hospital visits and tons of daily pills, I have a hard time feeling bad for most them. If they take honest steps toward bettering their situation, even just asking questions about how to better themselves, then I'm 100% supportive.

[Folsom]

Yes, again, not everyone is the same, hence why I use data we all have to differentiate.

I think some of you guys have a clear misunderstanding of "genetics".

First off, yes we have many hard set genes. However what's turned on and off is an entirely different manner. This is the field of "epigentics". Anyone and everyone is as much a product of their ancestors epigenetic choices as they are their own choices. You don't exactly have "good" or "bad" genes outside of mutations. You have more and less favorable thing turned on and off.

Since humans have invented agriculture we've developed all sorts of new problems. Some people have changed to meet agriculture more, others less. IAP and stomach acid levels would be an example.

You can act within your own lifetime to improve your epigenetic expression. The types of food you eat, how you choose to handle stress, and how you exercise are probably the bigger factors.

A lot of "traditional" diets and lifestyles catered largely to more epigenetic profiles than less. However to think any of them are an "answer" is a total misunderstanding of what's happening. The old ways of doing things simply prolonged the adverse effects of choices that are not favorable to the individual. For example when corn was introduced to Native Americans it was also the first record of disease as we know it today. While it was present, it wasn't significant enough to cause the ill effects that would be particularly noticeable to the populations health wise. However inlander people that were more grain based in diet, without fish, were smaller and rounder with overall less muscle. That was only really true of the Inka people. They didn't have the strange diseases found in European royalty. Let's jump forward a significant amount of time to modern day Native Americans, and as you know any of them that drink beer and consume also lots of wheat and cheese now have fell into terrible health and often can't stop drinking alcohol. Their epigenetics didn't slowly progress to show the poor effects of corn like say a somewhat indigenous tribe or longer standing traditional diet tribe, they were absolutely fast tracked into poor expression.

Interesting facts... The only people on both continents that had the A antigen and therefor different levels of IAP were the Blackfeet. Everyone else was only O. The rest of the world typically has a much higher mix rate. Either way, there's no "traditional diet" to return to because first off it was never 100% healthy, or terribly healthy at all, and aside from some very isolated groups of people there's no consistency of hard coded genes among the people (ABO expression).

What you do now for your health can save not only you from a considerable amount of health problems, but also your children and their children.

*During WWII the Dutch decided to act against Germany by blowing up railways. The Germans responded by blowing up their food supplies. People lived on calorie levels very low, 800-1200 would have been doing decent; and even that person may have been pregnant. Their children didn't show a lot of health issues in particular, but their grand children had an epidemic of diabetes, obesity, etc, compared to anything known in Europe prior. Granted they have less than the USA, to this day, but none the less it illustrates the power of epigenetics. The first offspring where setup for a more thrifty world outlook and when on a high fat high calorie European diet right after things were set in motion. While their slightly better expression and beginning health saved them from a lot of the ills, when they began to express things less favorable - noticeable to them or not - the effects were being expressed in their children earlier and much more severe.

The longer we go on with poor expression, the sooner it will appear in children. I'm sure many of you have seen the uber fat kids that often have diabetes or can't lose weight at all.

[thunderbrick]

True about the Dutch, except that the grandchildren grew up in a radically different culinary world.  Fast food, and more of it………..etc.

[Wayner]

And this is where some of this falls apart.....  If I talk to my oldest family members, I'll be talking to Pennsylvania Dutchmen whose diets were strictly meat (frequently sausages and bacon, with plenty of breads), little vegetables (corn, green beans, peas, salads only with bacon dressing,...) and they all lived, and contributed, into at least their early eighties, sometimes nineties.  Oh, and they also smoked, drank, and didn't exercise, per se.  Not one died from coronary disease.

So if I use that template, everything you guys are discussing is pure BS.  It's the genes!

I like Bob's statement. I was just talking about diet to a couple of friends at the cafe the other morning. Both sets of my grandparents had some interesting eating habits. Breakfast was bacon, fried in the old cast iron fry pan (on a wood burning Monarc stove), then the eggs were fried and basted in the bacon grease. Home made bread (made from lard) was toasted and heavily buttered. Top that all off with Norweign diesel fuel (coffee) that was so strong, you'd get the hibi-jibis till noon, then you'd have some more coffee. Both grandmas lived well into their 90s and both grandpas live into their late 80s.

A horrible diet by many standards, yet these people beat the odds. Why is that? DNA, or real food (no preservatives) or some other factor? Who knows. My wife and I live on the outside isles of the grocery store. Not much for processed foods. I do not like juices, because they are not really natural. They are loaded with sugars, and they are in high concentrations. I like to stick to nature when I can. Rather then orange juice, I eat the orange. Rather then apple juice, I eat the apple.

I just always remember the story about the guy who walked out of the fitness center and got run over by a truck.......

[Tyson]

Salis,

I think you are right on, individual expression of genetic adaption (or maladaption) has a huge influence on optimal diet.  I also think there are a few things in the diet best avoided because they tend to be problematic for almost everyone:

1.  Sugar -  Anything with sugar added is a big no-no.  It's link to diabetes and obesity is very strong.
2.  Grains - Wheat is the worst, but they are all very, very bad.
3.  Dairy - Not quite as bad as grains, but still very problematic for a whole lot of people.

If people can just go for a month avoiding any of these 3 things, I can guarantee they will start feeling a lot better.  That is not a guess.  These food types present a chronic insult to our digestive (and immune) systems.  Getting rid of them is a great first step. 

What do you replace them with?  Vegetables!  Cooking with olive oil or coconut oil is your friend.  I never thought I'd like brussel sprouts, but chopped in half, coated in some oil, salted/seasoned and roasted in the oven for 20 minutes makes them soft, crispy, and delicious.  Same with sweet potatoes - slice them up thin & roast them in the oven for sweet potato french fries.  Learn to make a viniagrette with olive oil, balsamic vinegar, salt and a drop of mustard.  Avoid the iceberg lettuce because it tastes like crap.  There are tons and tons of food out there that is incredibly tasty that isn't in the Sugar/Grains/Dairy category.  Eat them - with gusto!