[2bigears]

 :Dhello all AC peeps. I have a burning question before I spend the loot. I have a Mac mini , older one and been feeding the CDs into iTunes library.an older dac so that's not the best.  I was wondering on just what's best in current tech.  A transport with new dac , a decent CD player -- real simple, I have 750 good CDs outta 1400 I would like to put in the library. I use a Drobo for storage, darn fan. But not to noisy.
             What makes more dollars and sense now a days ? Confused monkey as always.  Thanks for any help once again.. a good CD player with USB out is so simple. I guess a transport has that. But I know my old DB Labs dac is most likely not up to todays standards. What's the smart move ?   

[richidoo]

A DAC with USB input fed by a network streamer with USB output and RoonReady is very popular. USB network streamers like Lumin, Aurender, BlueSound sound great and can stream lossless files from the web. I have the cheapest Aurender and find it sounds better than SOtM streamer or RPi as USB sources. I dislike Roon so I like that Aurender won’t do Roon. But most ppl I know do use Roon, so if you want roon you want player that’s Roon endpoint.

I mostly stream music from Qobuz, but I keep my CDs on NAS and inside the Aurender.  I ripped my CDs using dbpoweramp software which provides bitperfect file. I think they sound a little better than Qobuz, but having instant access to most of the worlds recordings is worth having the streaming service.

Always lots of churn with front end gear, so you can try some different options with low risk.

[2bigears]

  streaming is unreal , a million songs at your fingertips. But if your an old fart with a collection and just want those in a library,  or even just to play one cd , before I spend the dough burning a hole in my pocket ,, ?
     A transport like Jays is 3 grand. A new dac is 4 or 5 large. I bet modern gear is amazing. But on a sonic/dollar chart how better off is my system.  I would think the Mac mini and iTunes are old school now too. Good lord to many options ,, confused monkey in the land of paradox of choice.   

[2bigears]

  hello all,,,, I was on the latest kick of maybe getting an old Oppo player. Is the 205 worth the extra for playing CDs ?  Better dac I would imagine over the 105's ,,,, paradox of choice once again.   

[unfairlane]

   Another way; you could rip your CD`s to a HD and then get a good DAC

[2bigears]

   thanks,  I have the apple to put them into the big Robo. I just want to play CDs now.  I actually want to hear the dif now with a great machine and new tech. The 205 Oppo is looking like a crash to my bank account but might be worth it.  A good BRP is cool to have too.   A 203 is 1000 used here. The big 205 is 3000. Is it true you get 10% better sound ?  I don't know. 

[WGH]

... a good CD player with USB out is so simple. I guess a transport has that. But I know my old DB Labs dac is most likely not up to todays standards. What's the smart move ?   

Listening to physical CD now and it's not as ugly as I thought it would be. Haven't done that for a while.

I'm using an Oppo BDP-103 via Coax into a HoloAudio May KTE DAC. The May is a true old school NOS DAC like your dB Audio Labs DAC except it uses a lot of tiny resistors in a ladder configuration instead of a single chip.

CDs into a NOS DAC are still musical and toe tapping but with a flatter soundstage and less low level information, sibilants are a little sharper than I'm used to too. Keep the dB Audio Labs DAC and get a decent transport.
Using the Oppo BDP-103 as a stand alone CD player is a big disappointment compared to every DAC I have owned. Oppo put the money into video performance not into the DAC chip and analog section. The 203 and 205 is supposed to be better, yea, compared to the 103 but to a good DAC, I doubt it.

I ripped all my CDs and have a lot of digital downloads, built a music server and use HQPlayer to upsample all music (PCM) to DSD256, that is where the magic happens. Noise is -20 dB lower than PCM and digital harshness is non-existent, the soundstage opens up and low level detail like echos emerge because it is no longer hidden by noise. The system complexity is exactly the opposite direction you want to go.

Almost all DACs upsample, so if you want to stay NOS there are only a few choices like HoloAudio Spring, May and the T+A Audio DAC. Border Patrol is just as dated as your dB Labs, LampizatOr and Audio Note are crazy expensive. Even the well regarded Denafrips Pontus II 12th DAC (which might be in your price range) does some hidden oversampling in the background. You may like it, many do but system synergy is the key.

I think any new DAC in your price range would be a sideways move until you get into the big bucks like the HoloAudio Spring KTE ($3098). And spending that much money to play only 44.1kHz CDs is a waste, these new DACs are designed to play hi-res streaming, digital downloads and upsampled ripped CDs.

[2bigears]

  thanks WGH. Great info. Plan k in motion now. I can get a good transport, and a good dac. Then I gotta learn this ripping procedure. Can I do it on my old Mac mini ? Hope I don't have to buy a new computer ?  Good lord ,, transports are easy to find used.  Good dacs a little harder if they are modern and good. A good combo and the dig front end will be reborn.  Kinda neat. My last move for sure. Any help on the combo is greatly appreciated indeed.   

[fado]

I got my Lampizator Amber 3 show special for $2500. It really made a very significant improvement in my system. If I were buying now I would try for the Baltic 3. Used Amber 3:   https://www.hifishark.com/search?q=lampizator+amber

[rollo]

   Transport/DAC combo. Streaming can be VG but not equal to the transport/DAC combo. Using Aqua Acoustic Formula DAC and Aqua La Diva transport. Stream with Innuos Zenith mk3 with USB reclocker.

charles

[2bigears]

  question of the day ,, is the Qutest by Chord a good little musical dac ?  Is it still holding water now a says ?  I have a local fellow here with one for sale ?  I offered 1500 Canadian, he wants 1900 ....   there is a Holo Spring here for 4500,, so many dacs and so little time. the USA dollar is 35% above ,, holy moly.. so kinda gotta stay in Canada.   

[rollo]

question of the day ,, is the Qutest by Chord a good little musical dac ?  Is it still holding water now a says ?  I have a local fellow here with one for sale ?  I offered 1500 Canadian, he wants 1900 ....   there is a Holo Spring here for 4500,, so many dacs and so little time. the USA dollar is 35% above ,, holy moly.. so kinda gotta stay in Canada.   

 For that money look at Merason DAC. Killer for the money.


charles


charles

[WGH]

I can get a good transport, and a good dac. Then I gotta learn this ripping procedure.

Why? You already have a good DAC for what you want to do. I think you are being distracted by the next shiny new thing. Hifi-Shark, Audiogon and The Music Room are filed up with shiny new things that were once somebody's ultimate dream.

Exploring new ways to hear music is fun, our local audio club has meetings at different houses and sometimes loan equipment to each other. That is how I found out the early Ncore NC400 amps and Benchmark DACs were not for me and the most expensive Hapa Audio cables could be my next shiny new thing.

I started ripping CDs because I had a stereo in my home and in my woodshop that was 1/2 mile away. Shuffling CDs back and forth was a pain, usually the music I wanted to listen to was not where I was. Having all the physical CDs at my shop and ripped music at home was a perfect solution. Ripping also solved the problem of the CD player transport dying every few years.

I stayed with digital music, every year it sounds better. But does it sound better than a physical CD? Not necessarily.

I compared to the same songs (ripped and CD) into the Holo DAC without oversampling. I preferred the CD to the ripped, the CD was more immediate and lively, more there there. I used JRiver Media Center on the computer, there was nothing wrong with the sound, it was pleasant. JRiver has a nice little midrange bump and slightly rolls off the highs (less piercing sharpness) that makes everything pleasant. The change in tonality is subtle and hard to hear unless compared to a neutral player like HQPlayer. The tone change is close to what some NOS DACs sound like. The current Border Patrol DAC, old Scott Nixon Tube DAC (my first DAC), and your dB Audio DAC all use the NOS TDA 1543 chip.

The choice of software player will change the sound, some prefer the sound of Audirvāna player, I found it meh. The sound will depend on the algorithm used. PS Audio DirectStream DAC's (one of the best available) are periodically updated with new firmware that changes it's sound.

Our audio group has a meeting on April 15th to listen to the new PS Audio DirectStream DAC playing CDs. The rest of the system is Luxman, Joseph Audio speakers and Rythmik subs so I should get a handle on how another state-of-the-art DAC sounds. The current PS Audio DirectStream DAC upsamples all PCM to 20 times the nominal DSD rate (20 x 64 x 44.1kHz) which is 56.488MHz (as in million)

Each manufacturer of CD players and software players choose the algorithm they like best (this year). There are so many combinations to choose from that every couple of years they can release an "improved" player with a new sound and charge more by simply tweaking the algorithm.

HQPlayer has them all, when I get bored I change the combo. They all sound excellent but slightly different, the DSD upsampling is the most accurate and musical (see PS Audio) but a high powered computer is usually needed (not an old Mac Mini). A CD player, DAC or even the Chord Electronics Hugo M Scaler upsampling digital processor which uses the Xilinx XC7A200T FPGA will never be able to do what HQPlayer does, there too many calculations. Jussi Laako, HQPlayer's developer, wrote:

"Sometimes companies ask what it would take to run my algorithms on FPGA, when I tell them that it would need Xilinx biggest Virtex FPGA's, they quickly forget about it. Such big FPGA's cost way more than CPU/GPU and you are likely not going to find such chips in DACs."

Which is why HQPlayer sounds better than anything else.
Here is what HQPlayer has:

    28 linear phase
    3 intermediate phase
    11 minimum phase
    3 impulse optimal
    3 closed form
    4 dithers
    5 noise shapers
    14 modulators
    49 oversampling filters (64x - 2048x)
    Direct rate conversions, 3 algorithms
    Convolution engine

Which is why I say stick with what you have and start out with a transport.

But man, that new DAC is so shiny.

[2bigears]

  thank you thank you thank you, ha.  Ok. Well I got it 1/2 right. A transport it will be. But the rest I'm going to have to learn.  I have ZERO idea what you speak of.  Time to look shit up. It's nice you have a group you can share ideas and compare gear with. I'm on a big rock in a little town. The Music Room still has that Jays machine mk3.  Seems to be the hot ticket ..... 

[WGH]

The Music Room still has that Jays machine mk3.  Seems to be the hot ticket ..... 

Maybe someone can figure out how to plug the Jay's MK3 into the dB Labs DAC USB only input. Unless this DAC has coax input too? 

Or even plug the Jay's into a Mac Mini? 

[js1955]

......Almost all DACs upsample, so if you want to stay NOS there are only a few choices like HoloAudio Spring, May and the T+A Audio DAC. Border Patrol is just as dated as your dB Labs......

That may be so but the BP DAC is still very musical and satisfying.  I point to all the Awards and consistent "best sound" comments over the years when BP teams with Volti Audio and TWL at shows.

PS:   I own the BP DAC and find it quite enjoyable.  YMMV.

[WGH]

That may be so but the BP DAC is still very musical and satisfying.

Almost all DACs sound musical, I'm sure yours does too. My point was if you want a NOS DAC for various reasons.

1. If you only play CDs.

2. If you like that sound and hate the idea of oversampling, I know a few audiophiles like that.

3. If you think 16 bit/44.1kHz is the gold standard even if modern music is recorded in DXD256, converted to hi-res PCM for editing, then downsampled to 16bit/44.1kHz throwing away 70% of the music along the way.

4. If you want to oversample using software without worrying about the DAC's internal algorithms.

[js1955]

Almost all DACs sound musical,

I disagree.

As far as your other points....
I have no idea.   Admittedly I am very low tech and don't pay attention to numbers, up and down sampling, etc.  It's all foreign to me.  I stream and listen to cd's, and don't get bogged in minutae.  I just listen, and decide / choose gear off that.

[WGH]

looking into the Bryston cd3 ,  what kills me is the US buck. Holy shit 1.35% add.  Good lord , 3500 goes to 5000 in a blink of your peepers. I've had Bryston before. Good gear.    then,, the question is ,is 5000 to much for a cdp now ?  A transport for 2000 and a 3000 dollar dac better ?  If you can up the budget for the dac to 4000 used or so ,, is this the better ?  So much gear ,, not enough time. 

Well...

If all you want to do is play CDs, got 1000's of disks and don't want to spend a year ripping, tagging and backing up the entire library so you don't have to do it all over again (all drives: hard and solid state eventually die) then the Bryston CD3 is perfect. All the professional reviewers are falling all over themselves praising the CD3.

But...

If you want more format flexibility and the ability to play everything from CDs to SACDs to Blu-rays to streaming to hi-res downloads from studios like 2L, Blue Coast Records, and Sound Liaison then the Bryston BDA-3 DAC would scratch that itch for the next 20 years.

Why not the PS Audio DirectStream? Because the Bryston BDA-3 has a true HDMI input so it will play SACDs (DSD64) using your new Oppo. Used SACDs are cheap these days, the old players are dying, the new players are expensive so people are dumping SACDs. Generally a better master was used to make the SACD layer and will sound cleared with less digititis than the 16bit/44.1kHz layer also included on the disk. The Oppo will only play the SACD layer via HDMI, the coax or optical outouts only play the low-res CD layer because of copyright protection.

No more ripping
Ability to play everything from CDs, SACDs, to the HDMI sound out from your TV for high quality big booms to your stereo.
Excellent music for the next 20 years
What's not to love?

I have waited for years until a piece I want shows up on one of the used equipment sites, then I pounce. Or I think "screw it" and use a 0% interest credit card.

[2bigears]

  well here we go again. One heck of an option. Good lord this place is a treasure for good info. You know , I don't even know what a SACD is ? Is there a big great selection ?  Do you just buy your favs from years past if they don't make them any longer ?  Back to Google for info.  I see the used Bryston dac3's all sell. A good sign. They make good stuff. 🎈🎈