[albireo13]

Still haven't decided on replacement speakers for my Paradigm Studio-20s.  Some major life issues derailed me from hobby stuff.
I want modest size towers that will be a step up in performance from my 20s.  The 1801-TL towers look nice but, I've read little feedback on these.   How would they compare to a ST standard?

Thx,
Rob

[R Swerdlow]

Still haven't decided on replacement speakers for my Paradigm Studio-20s.  Some major life issues derailed me from hobby stuff.
I want modest size towers that will be a step up in performance from my 20s.  The 1801-TL towers look nice but, I've read little feedback on these.   How would they compare to a ST standard?

They sound rather similar, especially the STs and SB.  I've heard the standard 1801s which are stand mount speakers and not the towers.  All three have a similar foot print, but have differing height.

The 1801s do produce a more detailed sound, but overall, I'd go with the standard STs.  The two mid woofers are a big advantage.  They handle more power at less distortion than a single woofer.  I believe that is more of an advantage than the magnesium alloy woofer of the 1801-TL vs. the paper woofers of the ST or SB.

[won ton on]

What amp will you be using. Have you looked at the supercharged ST's or are they out of your price range. I've got the HT-2-TL's and i'm very pleased with them.

[JLM]

The 1801/1801 Tower have always been known as a serious speaker for audio.  Not particularly efficient or dynamic, but the high quality drivers should provide superb detail and tone with much deeper bass, a true step up from the Studio 20s.  Note that it's rated to go a bit deeper than the Songbird or SongTower.

The Songbird is again not particularly efficient/dynamic, but with lower quality of drivers so lesser detail/tone at a significantly lower price.  Other than more bass I'd guess you'd find the sonic qualities of the Songbird to be very similar to your Studio 20s.  The difference in cost is reflected in larger/limited production/customizable/high-end cabinets that will add an octave of bass.

The Songtower is similar to the Songbird but better suited for also serving AV needs, being somewhat more efficient at the mid-price of the three (although action movies would still benefit from a subwoofer).  Personally I'm not a fan of it's MTM design for audio. 

[billmcc]

I have the SongTowers and 1801TLs. Do you use your system for just music or is it also for TV and movies? I had the SongTowers and Song Center in my system for several years and was very happy with them for both music (stereo and 5.1) and TV/movies. Then I bought a pair of 1801TLs from a fellow member here on AC. In my opinion the 1801TLs are better with music than the STs. Better midrange and bass capability compared to the STs. I was surprised at the bass capability as it's one bass driver compared to two with the STs. I had Jim build a matching 1801b center for me that completes the LCR combo for multichannel use .

So if your system is used primarily for music I'd spend the extra money and get the 1801TLs. The Veracity STs are an outstanding speaker but $1500 more than the 1801TLs.

Below is a link to a picture of the 1801TLs that I bought here.

http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?topic=133162.msg1415068#msg1415068

Bill

[albireo13]

This is strictly a 2ch (no sub) system for music only.  I play folk, classical, jazz, new age, some rock ... at modest levels.
I never push my Studio 20s in terms of output levels.  My wife is always turning down the volume on me.  : )

I've listened to a local pair of STs and was impressed so I can use that as a reference.  I like the modest size and price of the SBs but, I now feel the STs or the 1801TLs are a better choice for me.

[albireo13]

I notice on the Salk website that there are Ellis 1801TLs and Ellis 1801f models listed.   They look similar in the pictures, same drivers?
The prices are different though.   Does anyone know the differences between them?

[R Swerdlow]

I notice on the Salk website that there are Ellis 1801TLs and Ellis 1801f models listed.   They look similar in the pictures, same drivers?
The prices are different though.   Does anyone know the differences between them?

Yes, they are the same drivers, probably the same crossovers, but different cabinets.

If I remember correctly, the first Ellis 1801 design was in a ported bookshelf cabinet.  Dave Ellis originally designed it, and he asked Dennis Murphy to "fix" the crossover.  Dennis's crossover became a standard feature of the 1801.

The 1801f is in a ported floor standing cabinet, and the 1801-TL is in a mass-loaded transmission line (MLTL) cabinet.  If you ask Jim, he'll probably recommend the 1801-TL over the 1801f.

Jim Salk's first speaker, a DIY job he built for himself, was the Veracity HT-1.  It was a variation of the 1801.  It uses the same woofer with a ribbon tweeter instead of the dome.  Jim also ran into crossover problems and asked Dennis to "fix" it.  That began their long & successful relationship.

When you asked your original question, you got answers expressing a variety of opinions.  Not surprising.  Honestly, I think you can't go wrong with any of these three speakers.

[billmcc]

This is strictly a 2ch (no sub) system for music only.  I play folk, classical, jazz, new age, some rock ... at modest levels.
I never push my Studio 20s in terms of output levels.  My wife is always turning down the volume on me.  : )

I've listened to a local pair of STs and was impressed so I can use that as a reference.  I like the modest size and price of the SBs but, I now feel the STs or the 1801TLs are a better choice for me.

The SongBirds are I'm sure a very nice speaker. But I would suggest stretching your budget and go with the SongTowers. The 1801TLs would stretch your budget even further. I would suggest looking for a used pair of SongTowers. They are listed occasionally here in the Trading Post and on other A/V classified sites. I was lucky to get the 1801TLs here used at a very fair price and they were in mint condition. The seller was incredible to deal with and packed the 1801TLs in the original boxes as if they came directly from Salk.

Bill

[fsimms]

If you can go with the 1801TL then that is the one I would recommend.  I played some SongTowers and Veracity HT1s in my system.  The Seas Excel made music much more exciting.

Bob

[albireo13]

After giving it much thought, and talking with Jim on the phone, I've decided to go ahead and order SongBirds.
It's a matter of listening style, budget, and also I want a modest size tower (smaller than the STs) for my living room.  I will go for the solid wood baffle option.  I need to decide between a Curly Cherry or Curly Walnut for the veneer.

  Thanks for all the info and I'll update as things progress.

Rob

[abd1]

I'd love to see how the curly walnut come out and look forward to hearing about your impressions of the speakers. I've wanted a pair of walnut or rosewood songbirds so I'm envious - but I'm sure you'll love them. I wonder if Jim could make a songbird with a raal?