[BarkingD]

Hello All.

I am putting together a two channel setup for general listening and entertaining and am thinking of getting a pair of SongTowers but want to make sure they will be enough for my space. The speakers will be in the living room which opens to the kitchen and dining room. The size of the space is about 850 square feet or 7300 cubic feet. I am thinking to run the system with an Outlaw RR2150 Stereo Receiver with 160 watts per channel both channels driven into 4 ohms. Does this sound like a good fit for my needs or should I look for something larger?

Second, what do you think of adding a sub to this setup? We listen to everything from classical to alternative and rock and I want to have strong bass extension. I know the SongTowers are respected for their bass but I have a fairly large space to fill. I am thinking of getting a SongSub because it will be in a visible spot and I would like it to match the speakers. I have read a lot of great things about the SongTower speakers but haven't heard much about the SongSub. Is the Songsub comparable to and will it complement the speakers or would I be as well off going with a different brand sub?

Thanks for any advice.

[Mr_Superstar]

I have both the SongTower's and a SongSub and I absolutely love the SongSub. It delivers deep bass that I found was pretty easy to integrate with the SongTower's.  I would highly recommend it. The SongSub has very good depth and delivers tight, deep bass.

You might also want to consider a Rythmik subwoofer. Jim will build these too. Others have reported good success with them. I haven't heard one, so I can't comment on the sound.

Good luck!

[greenhouseman]

Hello All.

I am putting together a two channel setup for general listening and entertaining and am thinking of getting a pair of SongTowers but want to make sure they will be enough for my space. The speakers will be in the living room which opens to the kitchen and dining room. The size of the space is about 850 square feet or 7300 cubic feet. I am thinking to run the system with an Outlaw RR2150 Stereo Receiver with 160 watts per channel both channels driven into 4 ohms. Does this sound like a good fit for my needs or should I look for something larger?

Second, what do you think of adding a sub to this setup? We listen to everything from classical to alternative and rock and I want to have strong bass extension. I know the SongTowers are respected for their bass but I have a fairly large space to fill. I am thinking of getting a SongSub because it will be in a visible spot and I would like it to match the speakers. I have read a lot of great things about the SongTower speakers but haven't heard much about the SongSub. Is the Songsub comparable to and will it complement the speakers or would I be as well off going with a different brand sub?

Thanks for any advice.
[/quote

The Towers will definitely play loud enough and the Song Sub is indeed a good match especially with the Outlaw receiver and its bass management abilities. However the size of the room could be a bit troublesome. Depending on your placement you might determine that some room treatments might be needed to get your desired results. Overall it should be a workable situation and i think that you have the right pieces to get started-----best of luck in your search

[R Swerdlow]

I also own SongTowers and I agree with Mr_Superstar's recommendation.  For music, you might not need a subwoofer, but you can't go wrong by adding a good sub such as the SongSub.

I have heard SongTowers driven by the Outlaw RR2150 (without a subwoofer) and I think it is quite good.  It will have plenty of power for those speakers in a large room.  SongTowers are relatively easy speakers for most receivers and amps to drive.  Jim Salk says any receiver that delivers an honest 50 wpc at 8 ohms will drive SongTowers.  I've heard them driven by a 30 wpc all tube amp, and even that was plenty powerful.

850 square feet is certainly big.  Does that include all 3 adjoining rooms, or is that the living room alone?  Probably just as important, if not more so, is the distance between listeners and speakers.

[MichiganMike]

I have my SongTowers in my living room which is open to the dining room and kitchen, encompassing a space of over 1000 square feet with a vaulted ceiling.  The SongTowers fill the space with beautiful music when driven by my Parasound A23 amp (125 watts into 8 ohms).  I use this system mostly for background music, so I do not typically drive the SongTowers to concert hall levels, but this combination will play plenty loud for my taste.  I would expect the SongTowers and Outlaw RR2150 would be a good match for your space.

I have experimented with a Velodyne SPL1200 sub crossed over at 45hz (using a Parasound C2 preamp/processor) with my SongTowers.  With most music the Velodyne sub when level matched to the SongTower makes little audible difference.  I was frankly surprised how little of the music I enjoy has much bass below the low frequency extension of the SongTower speakers.  YMMV     

[BarkingD]

Thanks for the input. I think I will get the SongSub. One of the reasons I like the Outlaw RR2150 is the sub out and base management functions so I think it will integrate well.

[MaxCast]

If you want it for entertaining then you may want to distribute the sound by adding a pair of speakers (the outlaw looks like it has a&b speakers) for the kitchen/dining room.

Any speaker/sub will be too loud in the main room while trying to fill all three rooms with music, IMO.

[MichiganMike]

Any speaker/sub will be too loud in the main room while trying to fill all three rooms with music, IMO.

In my home, the SongTowers have a rare ability to project music at the desired level and with good imaging into the adjoining rooms without becoming excessively loud in the main room.  It may be due in part to the acoustics of my home, but other speakers that I tried in the same space have not done this nearly as well.  A friend observed this and has been considering purchase of a pair of SongTowers as a result. 

[floresjc]

Considering that a SongSub and a pair of SongTowers is south of 3K and and a pair of HT2-TL's is 4K, it makes the choice all the harder. I have a Rythmik sub paired with my SongTowers and the result is just magic. But my HT2-TL's are great too, but there's no way the bottom end on the HT2-TL's will keep up with a dedicated sub for SPL. It really would depend on the sound you are looking for. If you want alot of low end the 2.1 option is probably good for you. If you are looking for a pure 2 channel solution and want the airiness of the ribbon, the HT2-TL is probably more your style. Before I went the custom sub route, Jim was very confident I would love the SongSub-SongTower pairing as well as it is a very low distortion design.

[BarkingD]

I hadn't thought about a second set of speakers but I don't think I could run the wires very easily for a clean install, I'll give it a try with one set and see how it sounds but that is something to keep in mind. Since this won't really be a critical listening setup but more to fill the common areas with music I think the 2.1 will work well for the sound level.

I had thought about going for the next level of speakers but that is a pretty slippery slope for me. I'd figure if I'm spending 3k then 4k really isn't that much more and if I'm spending 4k I might as well go for 6k since I'll have these for a long time and next thing I know I'd be unpacking 10k worth of gear and trying to explain it to my wife. 

[earthbound]

Any speaker/sub will be too loud in the main room while trying to fill all three rooms with music, IMO.

In my home, the SongTowers have a rare ability to project music at the desired level and with good imaging into the adjoining rooms without becoming excessively loud in the main room.  It may be due in part to the acoustics of my home, but other speakers that I tried in the same space have not done this nearly as well.  A friend observed this and has been considering purchase of a pair of SongTowers as a result.

I noticed this in my home as soon as I fired my HT2TLs for the first time. The effect was not subtle and it really surprised me.

[Nuance]

BarkingD,

I think you already made up your mind, but do add a subwoofer; you won't regret it. 

If you do go with a SongSub or one of Jim's twists on the Rythmik subwoofer, can you corner load it?  This will use room gain to increase output and bass extension. 

Only time will tell if the room swallows the SongTower's or not.  I'd guess no, but if you have acoustic problems even the greatest speaker in the world (HT4 anyone?) will sound crappy in said room.  I am with greenhouseman: get some room treatments.  I also recommend EQing the bass below 100Hz if the in-room response is bad.

Enjoy!

[cdorval1]

Just to sort of balance out this thread...

We have a PSB sub with an F3 at 22Hz, and it was great fun.  I used it with several pairs of speakers, including the Songtowers, which we listen to in our TV room.  It was fun attempting to tune it to the room (impossible, but fun).  And it was REALLY fun to listen to movies and TV shows and to rumble along to explosions and dance-music soundtracks.  Then, one day, just for fun, I turned the sub off.  Then, a week later, I remembered the sub was off.  The Songtowers have a realistic, practical and palpable low-bass response.  It's quite startling from such reasonably-sized speakers. 

After another few weeks, I took the sub out of the room to save space.  We haven't missed it.  If I ever get the urge for some serious and extended loud thumpa-thumpa, I'll bring it back in.

Craig