Neko Audio to show with AudioKinesis & Atma-Sphere at RMAF 2010

Duke · « **on:** 30 Jun 2010, 12:21 am »

Wesley Miaw of Neko Audio will be showing his very highly praised D100 DAC with Ralph Karsten and me in Room 1102 at the 2010 Rocky Mountain Audio Fest.

Despite being a fairly new high-end audio manufacturer, Neko has earned some very impressive reviews for the D100 - and those from some very critical reviewers. Smooth, relaxed, clean, life-like, vivid, and natural are the words they use. This is probably the most impressive collection of reviews I've ever seen for a small company that has only been out for a short time:

http://www.nekoaudio.com/index.php#reviews

As an example, take a look at Jeff Dorgay's review:

http://www.tonepublications.com/spotlight/the-neko-audio-d-100-dac/

Wesley has his own forum as well; take a look at the customer reviews and FAQs:

http://www.nekoaudio.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=4

Wesley's approach is off the beaten path a bit, for example using output transformers instead of op-amps and therefore getting a smoother and more relaxing presentation. Ralph and I have been known to stray from the beaten path from time to time as well, so we should have a very interesting room.

One thing about my room at audio shows, we let people play what they brought, and try to let everyone who's interested hear at least one cut of their choosing. So pencil in Room 1102, and bring your favorite song.

Duke

jtwrace · « **Reply #1 on:** 30 Jun 2010, 12:28 am »

That's great news Duke!

I like off the beaten path as well...I like DACS without op-amps as well.

NekoAudio · « **Reply #2 on:** 30 Jun 2010, 01:43 am »

Thanks for the introduction, Duke. I'm really looking forward to exhibiting at RMAF with you and Ralph!

satfrat · « **Reply #3 on:** 30 Jun 2010, 03:26 am »

Quote from: jtwrace on 30 Jun 2010, 12:28 am

That's great news Duke!

I like off the beaten path as well...I like DACS without op-amps as well.

Likewise, so do I.

Duke · « **Reply #4 on:** 30 Jun 2010, 07:30 am »

Wesley, it looks to me like there is a kinship of sorts between your design approach and Ralph's. His amps have little or no global negative feedback, and so they do not have high odd-order distortion artifacts. Perceptually, his amps trade off these "loudness cues" (which can make an amp sound more dynamic than it really is) in exchange for naturalness, vividness, and lack of fatigue.

From a couple of his recent internet posts:

"The ear uses naturally-occurring odd-ordered harmonics to figure out how loud the sounds are. They are the 5th, 7th and 9th harmonics and they get enhanced (distorted) by feedback by a small amount. However, because these are loudness cues to the human ear this small amount **is easily audible** and audiophiles use the terms 'hard' 'harsh', 'bright', 'brittle', 'chalky', 'clinical' and so on to describe this distortion."

"A proper stereo should lack [artificial] loudness cues, such that you can approach the same volumes in your room that the real live music could. A typical orchestra can do 115db with ease, yet many audiophiles will not turn up the volume past 95 db because its 'too damn loud' or they get 'turn that @#$% down!' from their S.O. This mostly due to artificial loudness cues which are totally coming from distorted odd ordered harmonics, and by that I mean only 100ths of a percent."

And now quoting from your forum:

"Since the output stage is 100% passive and uses transformers, there are no operational amplifiers or transistors to introduce noise, distortion, or to alter the audio...

"The end result is music with less distortion, greater musical accuracy, and incredible clarity. Individual notes will be more easily distinguished, without smearing together. Transients will be quick and precise. The D100 provides tight, clean bass and detailed highs without fatigue."

As I read the reviews of your DAC, it sounds like your transformer-based output stage isn't generating the distortion-related loudness cues that some other DACs are. What stands out in the reviewer comments is the naturalness, vividness, and freedom from fatigue of your DAC in comparison to others which may be generating (among other things) artificial loudness cues to the detriment of the aforementioned qualities.

Anyway, do you see what I mean about there being a philosophical kinship between your approach and Ralph's?

NekoAudio · « **Reply #5 on:** 1 Jul 2010, 01:11 am »

Yeah. I think we have a lot in common in our design philosophies.

The D100 can sound very different from what a person is used to, and I believe part of that is due to its excellent linearity and low multi-tone distortion (which I happily publish). A DAC with non-linear volume reproduction or distortion during music playback may be perceived as more dynamic or more detailed, but...what Ralph said.

TONEPUB · « **Reply #6 on:** 1 Jul 2010, 01:52 am »

Looking forward to seeing you there....

mgalusha · « **Reply #7 on:** 1 Jul 2010, 02:32 am »

I'm sure this will be a lovely room. I use transformers for the output of my DAC feeding into a pair of M60's and for my tastes 'tis a lovely combination. I am very much looking forward to visiting Duke's room this year.

cryoparts · « **Reply #8 on:** 9 Jul 2010, 02:05 am »

Nice! I'll be stopping into your room for sure!

Peace,

Lee

NekoAudio · « **Reply #9 on:** 12 Oct 2010, 04:09 am »

It's almost time! I hope to see a bunch of you guys there.

lonewolfny42 · « **Reply #10 on:** 13 Oct 2010, 07:35 am »

Good luck at the show Duke....

See you there again in 2011.....

Dave G · « **Reply #11 on:** 16 Oct 2010, 11:56 am »

Some pics:

The Man himself

Neko Audio DAC and Atma-Sphere preamp

Blooze · « **Reply #12 on:** 18 Oct 2010, 12:58 am »

Great to see you again Duke, and the new speakers sound great!!!

If that Stephen Stills CD comes up missing, it wasn't me

Shane

NekoAudio · « **Reply #13 on:** 19 Oct 2010, 12:55 am »

Just want to say Duke is an amazing guy. I couldn't have asked for a better person to partner up with.

jtwrace · « **Reply #14 on:** 19 Oct 2010, 01:03 am »

Quote from: NekoAudio on 19 Oct 2010, 12:55 am

Just want to say Duke is an amazing guy. I couldn't have asked for a better person to partner up with.

Where's your picture with you posing with your DAC?

Is your DAC $1295 or $1395?

srb · « **Reply #15 on:** 19 Oct 2010, 01:19 am »

Quote from: jtwrace on 19 Oct 2010, 01:03 am

Is your DAC $1295 or $1395?

Yes.

http://www.nekoaudio.com/

jtwrace · « **Reply #16 on:** 19 Oct 2010, 01:31 am »

Quote from: srb on 19 Oct 2010, 01:19 am

Yes.

http://www.nekoaudio.com/

Very intriguing piece.

NekoAudio · « **Reply #17 on:** 19 Oct 2010, 04:04 am »

Quote from: jtwrace on 19 Oct 2010, 01:03 am

Where's your picture with you posing with your DAC?

A few people out there have photos of me in the room, or with Duke. But I accidentally forgot my camera.

Tyson · « **Reply #18 on:** 19 Oct 2010, 05:04 am »

I got a chance to stop by the room and I thought it was really great sound, even when compared to the super expensive stuff in other rooms. In fact I thought it was better than most, and achieved without a bunch of super tweeks, specialty racks or even huge amounts of room treatment. Congrats on a great sounding room!

Duke · « **Reply #19 on:** 20 Oct 2010, 03:35 am »

I really appreciate Wes taking that leap of faith to share a room with me. I think this was his first "big" show, and he certainly had all his ducks in a row. My wife and I, and our friends, really enjoyed being with Wes. His little DAC is just killer, and it was an honor to share the room with him and the D100 Mk 2.

And thanks for coming by, and for your kind words, Blooze and DaveC and Tyson. Thanks for the pics, Dave!

A few things were not working as well as they should have in my room, and I didn't figure out what was going on until too late. Specifically, the bass was too thick and the dynamics were disappointing, but it wasn't until after the show that I figured out the cause.

Right after show hours on Sunday, I wheeled my speakers down the hall to room 1130, the big room at the far end of the hall, showcasing the Galibier turntable. There we hooked 'em up to a pair of Atma-Sphere amps, I learned that the speakers I'd brought were much better suited for a big room.

In that big room, the bass balance was correct and the dynamics came back. Here is what I think had been happening back in my room:

First, I had under-estimated the amount of boundary reinforcement that room generated, and/or over-estimated my ablility to deal with it.

Second, in that rather reflective room, the extra reverberant energy from the side-firing array had the effect of raising the in-room noise floor. So dynamic contrast was diminished. In the big room, the extra reverberant energy was more clearly beneficial, as there wasn't a similar negative side effect.

In retrospect, one of my monopolar models (like the Rhythm Prisms or Jazz Modules) would have been a better match for my little room. I was all excited and wanted to showcase my latest & greatest, but in this case I should have listened to my own propaganda about what works well in small rooms (namely, fairly tight radiation pattern control).

So in the future I will try to do a better job of matching speakers to rooms, and save my big bipolars (twisted or otherwise) for big rooms.

Not that the side-firing array was without merit; I had a couple of people remark that the sense of envelopment was like a good surround system. Along the way, several people who had spent a lot of time with horn systems (including manufacturing them) commented that they were not used to horns imaging like mine did, which indicated that the side-firing array was not degrading the imaging.